Anonymous
08/27/2014 22:24
Subject: Is FCPS "cheating" my kids out of the minimum instruction required by the state?
What is your pedagogical experience? You are against it because you had a bad experience. You never seem to have any other cogent argument other than that.
Anonymous
08/26/2014 18:43
Subject: Is FCPS "cheating" my kids out of the minimum instruction required by the state?
Anonymous wrote:I don't think we should have Project Based Learning models for math or mathematical aspect of science. Not all subjects should be project based.
However, these models should work for social studies and arts. The traditional teaching passes outdated facts to the students. Students were trained to memorizing bunch of wrong facts. Example - Pluto used to be a planet when I was in elementary school. Most of our college courses, especially upper level ones, are based on Project Based Learning models. The teachers should guide the students how to to do research, how to pick the right source, discard the junk, and how to organize and present the materials.
Yes, there are lazy cheaters in the Project Based Learning models. Do you have such teammates at your work place, too? This is real world learning.
This is not "real world learning" it is lazy instruction. It doesn't matter what you call Pluto, because you were taught it is real and orbits the the sun by an engaged instructor. Without that engaged instructor you would not be able to discuss it or use it as an example today. Quality instructors provide students with multi dementional reasons why and how phenomenon occurs then allow students to solve problems based on a toolbox full of facts. Flipped and PBL teachers flat out refuse to teach their students any FACTS.
It is madness for teachers to be tasked with educating our children and then to require children to learn the most rudimentary concepts of the subject matter themselves. Faced with this zero instruction teaching model some high achieving students will teach themselves, but most cannot.
Solving problems in groups maybe fine for groups of engineers at Google who already have advanced degrees in computer technology from Stanford and MIT, but it is madness to apply this a teaching technique to children who enter math, chemistry, physics, English, history, and government classes with virtually no preexisting knowledge of the subject matter whatsoever.
Stop Flipped Classroom and Project Based Learning in Fairfax Public Schools - NOW!
Anonymous
08/26/2014 17:34
Subject: Is FCPS "cheating" my kids out of the minimum instruction required by the state?
I don't think we should have Project Based Learning models for math or mathematical aspect of science. Not all subjects should be project based.
However, these models should work for social studies and arts. The traditional teaching passes outdated facts to the students. Students were trained to memorizing bunch of wrong facts. Example - Pluto used to be a planet when I was in elementary school. Most of our college courses, especially upper level ones, are based on Project Based Learning models. The teachers should guide the students how to to do research, how to pick the right source, discard the junk, and how to organize and present the materials.
Yes, there are lazy cheaters in the Project Based Learning models. Do you have such teammates at your work place, too? This is real world learning.
However, these models should work for social studies and arts. The traditional teaching passes outdated facts to the students. Students were trained to memorizing bunch of wrong facts. Example - Pluto used to be a planet when I was in elementary school. Most of our college courses, especially upper level ones, are based on Project Based Learning models. The teachers should guide the students how to to do research, how to pick the right source, discard the junk, and how to organize and present the materials.
Yes, there are lazy cheaters in the Project Based Learning models. Do you have such teammates at your work place, too? This is real world learning.
Anonymous
08/26/2014 17:05
Subject: Is FCPS "cheating" my kids out of the minimum instruction required by the state?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I've been teaching in FCPS for 22 years. My DW has 8 years with FCPS. Neither one of us has heard much about or have been trained for either PBL or Flipped Classroom.
Don't feed the troll. He had some bad experience in high school didn't get into Harvard and haunts the nova board batching about fcps pedagogy.
Such ad hominem silliness attempting to divert the dialog away from the question as to are FCPS children being cheated out of a quality education and for thousands of children the answer is clearly an astounding YES!
Flipped Classrooms and Project Based Learning teaching methodologies are disconnecting teachers from their students. Students are expected to learn through independent study or from other equally uninformed students. Teachers assign Final Assessments at the beginning of three week units and then essentially punch out of the teaching process for the next several weeks. The teachers do not do much prep work themselves during those next several weeks and as a result are usually unprepared to answer even rudimentary questions about what the kids are working on. Every kid is working on something different because the only teacher input is a packet of papers and a final assessment date.
Different students are always at different places in the learning process. The students ask questions all over the assignment spectrum and because the teachers have not prepped for any particular lesson they don't have quality answers formulated right off the top of their heads. Rather than answering legitimate valid questions from their students the Teacher's responses are "you should know that answer from your readings" and then they walk away annoyed at the child because they were asked questions in which they were unprepared to answer.
After a while the students stop asking questions and the teachers stop venturing away from their desks and the students stop asking questions.
Dr. Garza is at fault! She is aware that the failed experimental methodologies of Flipped Classrooms and Project Based Learning are being forced on students in FCPS and she has done nothing to stop it. Thousands of students are lost and confused and as individuals are being rejected by their teachers because they are being subjected to pop teaching methodologies like Flipped Classrooms and Project Based Learning.
Is your complaint about one school and one teacher? I can believe regardless of instructional method, that some teachers are disconnected. But your sweeping statements are disingenuous at best. This isn't how flipped classrooms work, nor is it how project based learning works. If either method is utilized correctly, they provide more teacher support as the teacher can and does move from group to group guiding the students and answering questions all along.
Did you talk with the teacher(s) directly? The principal? I have seen your generalized complaints on a few thread, but no specifics, so I can only guess you just don't like the idea of these methods, but haven't truly seen them in action....
Yes ... of course we spoke directly to the teachers and administrators. Their responses were the same. They said this is the future of education across the country and in Fairfax County in particular. Those of you who are buying into Flipped Classrooms and Project Based Learning models are buying into theories and not best teaching practices. They look better in therory than they function in practice. In practice long-term work is assigned and between that point and collection of the assignments the teachers punch out disconnecting from the students because they a no longer required to teach. They essentially show up in the morning and then hang around for several hours waiting for the day to end so they can leave.
People who ascribe to Flipped Classrooms and Project Based Learning are believing in educational theories not educational practices which actually work.
Communism, Laissez Faire Capitalism, Flipped Classrooms, and Project Based Learning all appear pretty good on paper and in therory, but all are horrible in practice because they each fails to take human nature into consideration.
Stop Flipped Classrooms and Project Based Learning NOW!!!
Anonymous
08/26/2014 15:59
Subject: Is FCPS "cheating" my kids out of the minimum instruction required by the state?
I never thought Principals on any level - elementary, middle or HS did enough (heck they didn't do anything) to know what was going on in the classroom. Classrooms had to be in dire crisis before the administration might consider that they needed to pay attention.
Anonymous
08/26/2014 15:55
Subject: Is FCPS "cheating" my kids out of the minimum instruction required by the state?
I heard it from DD at the time 6 yrs ago. The approach didn't have a "label" attached to it - it was teachers being lazy and not teaching. There would always be some kids in the class who were good students, were panicked and taught themselves. DD was one. Between my 2 children through their HS years they had a couple teachers like this. The teacher had basically checked-out. I think the message here is accurate and it is a concern.
Anonymous
08/26/2014 15:40
Subject: Is FCPS "cheating" my kids out of the minimum instruction required by the state?
Anonymous wrote:NP here ~ I did hear some complaints from DD, who's now in college, re: the teacher not doing any teaching and they had to teach themselves -this was math, and I think chemistry too. And I did hear from DD something similar to this:
The students ask questions all over the assignment spectrum and because the teachers have not prepped for any particular lesson they don't have quality answers formulated right off the top of their heads. Rather than answering legitimate valid questions from their students the Teacher's responses are "you should know that answer from your readings" and then they walk away annoyed at the child because they were asked questions in which they were unprepared to answer.
"After a while the students stop asking questions and the teachers stop venturing away from their desks and the students stop asking questions.
I do think it's a concern. I was always most concerned that the Principal was never present in the classroom, ever, never stopped in to see how things were going. Didn't seem to know that "teaching" wasn't going on. If a complaint was brought up to the Principal they would have said it wasn't happening.
Did you hear the complaints when your DD was in HS, or only now as an anecdote? If so, did you talk to the teacher and/or principal?
Anonymous
08/26/2014 15:39
Subject: Is FCPS "cheating" my kids out of the minimum instruction required by the state?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I've been teaching in FCPS for 22 years. My DW has 8 years with FCPS. Neither one of us has heard much about or have been trained for either PBL or Flipped Classroom.
Don't feed the troll. He had some bad experience in high school didn't get into Harvard and haunts the nova board batching about fcps pedagogy.
Such ad hominem silliness attempting to divert the dialog away from the question as to are FCPS children being cheated out of a quality education and for thousands of children the answer is clearly an astounding YES!
Flipped Classrooms and Project Based Learning teaching methodologies are disconnecting teachers from their students. Students are expected to learn through independent study or from other equally uninformed students. Teachers assign Final Assessments at the beginning of three week units and then essentially punch out of the teaching process for the next several weeks. The teachers do not do much prep work themselves during those next several weeks and as a result are usually unprepared to answer even rudimentary questions about what the kids are working on. Every kid is working on something different because the only teacher input is a packet of papers and a final assessment date.
Different students are always at different places in the learning process. The students ask questions all over the assignment spectrum and because the teachers have not prepped for any particular lesson they don't have quality answers formulated right off the top of their heads. Rather than answering legitimate valid questions from their students the Teacher's responses are "you should know that answer from your readings" and then they walk away annoyed at the child because they were asked questions in which they were unprepared to answer.
After a while the students stop asking questions and the teachers stop venturing away from their desks and the students stop asking questions.
Dr. Garza is at fault! She is aware that the failed experimental methodologies of Flipped Classrooms and Project Based Learning are being forced on students in FCPS and she has done nothing to stop it. Thousands of students are lost and confused and as individuals are being rejected by their teachers because they are being subjected to pop teaching methodologies like Flipped Classrooms and Project Based Learning.
Is your complaint about one school and one teacher? I can believe regardless of instructional method, that some teachers are disconnected. But your sweeping statements are disingenuous at best. This isn't how flipped classrooms work, nor is it how project based learning works. If either method is utilized correctly, they provide more teacher support as the teacher can and does move from group to group guiding the students and answering questions all along.
Did you talk with the teacher(s) directly? The principal? I have seen your generalized complaints on a few thread, but no specifics, so I can only guess you just don't like the idea of these methods, but haven't truly seen them in action....
Anonymous
08/26/2014 10:50
Subject: Is FCPS "cheating" my kids out of the minimum instruction required by the state?
NP here ~ I did hear some complaints from DD, who's now in college, re: the teacher not doing any teaching and they had to teach themselves -this was math, and I think chemistry too. And I did hear from DD something similar to this:
The students ask questions all over the assignment spectrum and because the teachers have not prepped for any particular lesson they don't have quality answers formulated right off the top of their heads. Rather than answering legitimate valid questions from their students the Teacher's responses are "you should know that answer from your readings" and then they walk away annoyed at the child because they were asked questions in which they were unprepared to answer.
"After a while the students stop asking questions and the teachers stop venturing away from their desks and the students stop asking questions.
I do think it's a concern. I was always most concerned that the Principal was never present in the classroom, ever, never stopped in to see how things were going. Didn't seem to know that "teaching" wasn't going on. If a complaint was brought up to the Principal they would have said it wasn't happening.
The students ask questions all over the assignment spectrum and because the teachers have not prepped for any particular lesson they don't have quality answers formulated right off the top of their heads. Rather than answering legitimate valid questions from their students the Teacher's responses are "you should know that answer from your readings" and then they walk away annoyed at the child because they were asked questions in which they were unprepared to answer.
"After a while the students stop asking questions and the teachers stop venturing away from their desks and the students stop asking questions.
I do think it's a concern. I was always most concerned that the Principal was never present in the classroom, ever, never stopped in to see how things were going. Didn't seem to know that "teaching" wasn't going on. If a complaint was brought up to the Principal they would have said it wasn't happening.
Anonymous
08/26/2014 10:39
Subject: Is FCPS "cheating" my kids out of the minimum instruction required by the state?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I've been teaching in FCPS for 22 years. My DW has 8 years with FCPS. Neither one of us has heard much about or have been trained for either PBL or Flipped Classroom.
Don't feed the troll. He had some bad experience in high school didn't get into Harvard and haunts the nova board batching about fcps pedagogy.
Such ad hominem silliness attempting to divert the dialog away from the question as to are FCPS children being cheated out of a quality education and for thousands of children the answer is clearly an astounding YES!
Flipped Classrooms and Project Based Learning teaching methodologies are disconnecting teachers from their students. Students are expected to learn through independent study or from other equally uninformed students. Teachers assign Final Assessments at the beginning of three week units and then essentially punch out of the teaching process for the next several weeks. The teachers do not do much prep work themselves during those next several weeks and as a result are usually unprepared to answer even rudimentary questions about what the kids are working on. Every kid is working on something different because the only teacher input is a packet of papers and a final assessment date.
Different students are always at different places in the learning process. The students ask questions all over the assignment spectrum and because the teachers have not prepped for any particular lesson they don't have quality answers formulated right off the top of their heads. Rather than answering legitimate valid questions from their students the Teacher's responses are "you should know that answer from your readings" and then they walk away annoyed at the child because they were asked questions in which they were unprepared to answer.
After a while the students stop asking questions and the teachers stop venturing away from their desks and the students stop asking questions.
Dr. Garza is at fault! She is aware that the failed experimental methodologies of Flipped Classrooms and Project Based Learning are being forced on students in FCPS and she has done nothing to stop it. Thousands of students are lost and confused and as individuals are being rejected by their teachers because they are being subjected to pop teaching methodologies like Flipped Classrooms and Project Based Learning.
Anonymous
08/25/2014 23:14
Subject: Is FCPS "cheating" my kids out of the minimum instruction required by the state?
Anonymous wrote:I've been teaching in FCPS for 22 years. My DW has 8 years with FCPS. Neither one of us has heard much about or have been trained for either PBL or Flipped Classroom.
Don't feed the troll. He had some bad experience in high school didn't get into Harvard and haunts the nova board batching about fcps pedagogy.
Anonymous
08/25/2014 19:56
Subject: Is FCPS "cheating" my kids out of the minimum instruction required by the state?
Anonymous wrote:I've been teaching in FCPS for 22 years. My DW has 8 years with FCPS. Neither one of us has heard much about or have been trained for either PBL or Flipped Classroom.
You are finally getting the point! FCPS built a good reputation over a period of decades using varied instruction to meet the needs of all students and all learning styles. Beginning three years ago they began phasing in the Flipped Classroom and Project Based Learning. Now they have ruined what used to be a decent school system and today thousands of kids are suffering feeling confusion and inadequacy as a result.
Anonymous
08/25/2014 19:47
Subject: Is FCPS "cheating" my kids out of the minimum instruction required by the state?
I've been teaching in FCPS for 22 years. My DW has 8 years with FCPS. Neither one of us has heard much about or have been trained for either PBL or Flipped Classroom.
Anonymous
08/25/2014 19:40
Subject: Is FCPS "cheating" my kids out of the minimum instruction required by the state?
No ... we're not moving anywhere until every parent in FCPS is made aware of the hoax education currently be perpetrated upon their children!
Fairfax parents are currently unaware how their children are being taught. In past years FCPS used a varied instruction approach which at some point appealed to the learning styles of every student. At present FCPS without clearly informing parents about the negative affects of the Flipped Classroom and Project Based Learning are changing system wide which places the vast majority of FCPS students at a great disadvantage.
FCPS has had a good reputation in the past because they used varied instruction which addressed the needs of all students, but unfortunately that has all now changed.
FCPS has now adopted Flipped Classrooms and Project Based Learning teaching methodologies which forces students to teach themselves and which allows classroom teachers to disengage from their students.
They are both lazy teaching methodologies and thousands of students are suffering because they feel confused and inadequate while team-teachers sit at their desks all class period long gossiping and practicing professional CYA.
Fairfax parents are currently unaware how their children are being taught. In past years FCPS used a varied instruction approach which at some point appealed to the learning styles of every student. At present FCPS without clearly informing parents about the negative affects of the Flipped Classroom and Project Based Learning are changing system wide which places the vast majority of FCPS students at a great disadvantage.
FCPS has had a good reputation in the past because they used varied instruction which addressed the needs of all students, but unfortunately that has all now changed.
FCPS has now adopted Flipped Classrooms and Project Based Learning teaching methodologies which forces students to teach themselves and which allows classroom teachers to disengage from their students.
They are both lazy teaching methodologies and thousands of students are suffering because they feel confused and inadequate while team-teachers sit at their desks all class period long gossiping and practicing professional CYA.
Anonymous
08/25/2014 18:50
Subject: Is FCPS "cheating" my kids out of the minimum instruction required by the state?
Anonymous wrote:Dishonesty is exactly the problem in FCPS. Administrators are dishonest about how they meet VA State instructional hours and the types of instruction they are using.
Any number of instructional hours or teaching methodologies are fine for students with IQs over 120. High achieving students will succeed regardless of the quality of instruction they receive. Such students can achieve in spite of poor instruction. Unfortunately, average typical students are penalized when their hours of instruction are dishonestly reduced by counting transit time or by marginalizing students by using failed methodologies like the Flipped Classroom and Project Based Learning.
If there was transparency in FCPS and parents knew how little instruction was taking place in their children's classes they'd be outraged!
Okay Trolly Polly, you've had your chance to share your thoughts. You don't like FCPS. Flipped classrooms and project based learning are bad. Got it.
Now move along.