Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Muslima, even Ban Ki-Moon said Hamas broke it. You sure lose credibility when you quote Hamas. Not exactly the authorities of truth!

Jeff, the Jeffrey Goldberg piece is actually really good. You should finish reading. Regardless where Hadar was abducted, things are not going to get better. Israel will do anything to get their people back.

This is what Ban Ki Moon said :

" This would constitute a grave violation of the cease-fire, and one that is likely to have very serious consequences for the people of Gaza, Israel and beyond," said. "Such moves call into question the credibility of Hamas' assurances to the United Nations."

Noting that the UN has no independent means to verify what happened on ground, Ban said he is deeply concerned about the resumption of Israeli attacks on Gaza and the killing of over 50 Palestinians this morning. 

"Instead of giving both sides, especially Gazan civilians, a much needed reprieve to let them attend to their injured, bury their dead and repair vital infrastructure, this breach of the ceasefire is now leading to a renewed escalation," Ban's spokesman said. 

"The Secretary-General urges both sides to show maximum restraint and return to the agreed 72-hour humanitarian ceasefire that tragically lasted such a brief period of time," he said. 

Talk about selective quoting. Here is a link to the statement, right from the UN itself:

http://www.un.org/sg/statements/index.asp?nid=7901

The Secretary-General condemns in the strongest terms the reported violation by Hamas of the mutually agreed humanitarian ceasefire which commenced this morning. He is shocked and profoundly disappointed by these developments.

The Secretary-General notes that the UN has no independent means to verify exactly what happened. According to the latest reports, two IDF soldiers were killed and one taken captive after the humanitarian ceasefire came into effect. This would constitute a grave violation of the ceasefire, and one that is likely to have very serious consequences for the people of Gaza, Israel and beyond. Such moves call into question the credibility of Hamas' assurances to the United Nations. The Secretary-General demands the immediate and unconditional release of the captured soldier.

The Secretary-General is deeply concerned about the resumption of Israeli attacks on Gaza and the killing of over 70 Palestinians this morning. Instead of giving both sides, especially Gazan civilians, a much needed reprieve to let them attend to their injured, bury their dead and repair vital infrastructure, this breach of the ceasefire is now leading to a renewed escalation.

The Secretary-General urges both sides to show maximum restraint and return to the agreed 72-hour humanitarian ceasefire that tragically lasted such a brief period of time. He also urges those with influence over the parties to do everything to convince them to observe the humanitarian ceasefire.

Waiting to hear Jeff criticize Muslims for improper use of sources. That is just shameless if you want people to listen to you, you need credibility.

Muslima, not Muslims.

Whatever you're drinking, keep drinking more of it! What exactly is the difference between what I cited and whatever you copied pasted? Wow!

Seriously!? You edited the quote to fit your argument. If you can't see the difference between what was actually said and the fiction that you created than forget credibility, there is no point in even engaging you since it clear that you're not interested in arguing in good faith.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Muslima, even Ban Ki-Moon said Hamas broke it. You sure lose credibility when you quote Hamas. Not exactly the authorities of truth!

Jeff, the Jeffrey Goldberg piece is actually really good. You should finish reading. Regardless where Hadar was abducted, things are not going to get better. Israel will do anything to get their people back.

This is what Ban Ki Moon said :

" This would constitute a grave violation of the cease-fire, and one that is likely to have very serious consequences for the people of Gaza, Israel and beyond," said. "Such moves call into question the credibility of Hamas' assurances to the United Nations."

Noting that the UN has no independent means to verify what happened on ground, Ban said he is deeply concerned about the resumption of Israeli attacks on Gaza and the killing of over 50 Palestinians this morning. 

"Instead of giving both sides, especially Gazan civilians, a much needed reprieve to let them attend to their injured, bury their dead and repair vital infrastructure, this breach of the ceasefire is now leading to a renewed escalation," Ban's spokesman said. 

"The Secretary-General urges both sides to show maximum restraint and return to the agreed 72-hour humanitarian ceasefire that tragically lasted such a brief period of time," he said. 

Talk about selective quoting. Here is a link to the statement, right from the UN itself:

http://www.un.org/sg/statements/index.asp?nid=7901

The Secretary-General condemns in the strongest terms the reported violation by Hamas of the mutually agreed humanitarian ceasefire which commenced this morning. He is shocked and profoundly disappointed by these developments.

The Secretary-General notes that the UN has no independent means to verify exactly what happened. According to the latest reports, two IDF soldiers were killed and one taken captive after the humanitarian ceasefire came into effect. This would constitute a grave violation of the ceasefire, and one that is likely to have very serious consequences for the people of Gaza, Israel and beyond. Such moves call into question the credibility of Hamas' assurances to the United Nations. The Secretary-General demands the immediate and unconditional release of the captured soldier.

The Secretary-General is deeply concerned about the resumption of Israeli attacks on Gaza and the killing of over 70 Palestinians this morning. Instead of giving both sides, especially Gazan civilians, a much needed reprieve to let them attend to their injured, bury their dead and repair vital infrastructure, this breach of the ceasefire is now leading to a renewed escalation.

The Secretary-General urges both sides to show maximum restraint and return to the agreed 72-hour humanitarian ceasefire that tragically lasted such a brief period of time. He also urges those with influence over the parties to do everything to convince them to observe the humanitarian ceasefire.

Waiting to hear Jeff criticize Muslims for improper use of sources. That is just shameless if you want people to listen to you, you need credibility.

Muslima, not Muslims.

Whatever you're drinking, keep drinking more of it! What exactly is the difference between what I cited and whatever you copied pasted? Wow!

Hopefully the IDF can use this ammunition on legitimate targets--e.g., Hamas leadership and combatants--and not civilians. The reputation of the IDF as a highly competent force has been diminished.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is 72 hours the amount of time it will take to rearm the Israelis? I heard we have to send them more ammo.

Cite your source. From what I have heard, funding they need is not for “more ammo” but for their Iron Dome Defense. You do understand the difference, right?

Last week, US Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel sent a letter to congressional leadership requesting $225 million in additional US funding for Israel’s Iron Dome, which is a short-range rocket defense system designed to intercept rockets and artillery shells fired from a range of between four and 70 kilometers.

The money would be in addition to the $351 million that’s already under discussion for Iron Dome in fiscal 2015. It would bring total funding to $576 million, compared with the $176 million requested by the Pentagon for the year that begins on October 1.

http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/07/28/373165/israel-in-urgent-need-of-money-from-us-reid/

What's the difference btw arming the "offense" as opposed to the "defense?"

It's still US money going to Israel. I love working to fund a war I don't believe in.

It's not just Iron Dome.

According to the network, Pentagon officials have confirmed that the US will honor a request from Israel for several types of ammunition, including 120mm mortar rounds and 40mm ammunition for grenade launchers. The exchange will not be an emergency sale, the unnamed officials said, and is coming from a stockpile of weapons maintained by the US in Israel worth more than $1 billion.

Source: CNN

$1billion
That's just plain fucking sick!

Anonymous wrote:Crickets

Probably because it was expected. Not news.

Crickets

And my source is the LA Times.

Well, the Obama Administration blames Hamas for violating the cease fire.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Muslima, even Ban Ki-Moon said Hamas broke it. You sure lose credibility when you quote Hamas. Not exactly the authorities of truth!

Jeff, the Jeffrey Goldberg piece is actually really good. You should finish reading. Regardless where Hadar was abducted, things are not going to get better. Israel will do anything to get their people back.

This is what Ban Ki Moon said :

" This would constitute a grave violation of the cease-fire, and one that is likely to have very serious consequences for the people of Gaza, Israel and beyond," said. "Such moves call into question the credibility of Hamas' assurances to the United Nations."

Noting that the UN has no independent means to verify what happened on ground, Ban said he is deeply concerned about the resumption of Israeli attacks on Gaza and the killing of over 50 Palestinians this morning. 

"Instead of giving both sides, especially Gazan civilians, a much needed reprieve to let them attend to their injured, bury their dead and repair vital infrastructure, this breach of the ceasefire is now leading to a renewed escalation," Ban's spokesman said. 

"The Secretary-General urges both sides to show maximum restraint and return to the agreed 72-hour humanitarian ceasefire that tragically lasted such a brief period of time," he said. 

Talk about selective quoting. Here is a link to the statement, right from the UN itself:

http://www.un.org/sg/statements/index.asp?nid=7901

The Secretary-General condemns in the strongest terms the reported violation by Hamas of the mutually agreed humanitarian ceasefire which commenced this morning. He is shocked and profoundly disappointed by these developments.

The Secretary-General notes that the UN has no independent means to verify exactly what happened. According to the latest reports, two IDF soldiers were killed and one taken captive after the humanitarian ceasefire came into effect. This would constitute a grave violation of the ceasefire, and one that is likely to have very serious consequences for the people of Gaza, Israel and beyond. Such moves call into question the credibility of Hamas' assurances to the United Nations. The Secretary-General demands the immediate and unconditional release of the captured soldier.

The Secretary-General is deeply concerned about the resumption of Israeli attacks on Gaza and the killing of over 70 Palestinians this morning. Instead of giving both sides, especially Gazan civilians, a much needed reprieve to let them attend to their injured, bury their dead and repair vital infrastructure, this breach of the ceasefire is now leading to a renewed escalation.

The Secretary-General urges both sides to show maximum restraint and return to the agreed 72-hour humanitarian ceasefire that tragically lasted such a brief period of time. He also urges those with influence over the parties to do everything to convince them to observe the humanitarian ceasefire.

Waiting to hear Jeff criticize Muslims for improper use of sources. That is just shameless if you want people to listen to you, you need credibility.

Muslima, not Muslims.

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Muslima, even Ban Ki-Moon said Hamas broke it. You sure lose credibility when you quote Hamas. Not exactly the authorities of truth!

Jeff, the Jeffrey Goldberg piece is actually really good. You should finish reading. Regardless where Hadar was abducted, things are not going to get better. Israel will do anything to get their people back.

This is what Ban Ki Moon said :

" This would constitute a grave violation of the cease-fire, and one that is likely to have very serious consequences for the people of Gaza, Israel and beyond," said. "Such moves call into question the credibility of Hamas' assurances to the United Nations."

Noting that the UN has no independent means to verify what happened on ground, Ban said he is deeply concerned about the resumption of Israeli attacks on Gaza and the killing of over 50 Palestinians this morning. 

"Instead of giving both sides, especially Gazan civilians, a much needed reprieve to let them attend to their injured, bury their dead and repair vital infrastructure, this breach of the ceasefire is now leading to a renewed escalation," Ban's spokesman said. 

"The Secretary-General urges both sides to show maximum restraint and return to the agreed 72-hour humanitarian ceasefire that tragically lasted such a brief period of time," he said. 

Talk about selective quoting. Here is a link to the statement, right from the UN itself:

http://www.un.org/sg/statements/index.asp?nid=7901

The Secretary-General condemns in the strongest terms the reported violation by Hamas of the mutually agreed humanitarian ceasefire which commenced this morning. He is shocked and profoundly disappointed by these developments.

The Secretary-General notes that the UN has no independent means to verify exactly what happened. According to the latest reports, two IDF soldiers were killed and one taken captive after the humanitarian ceasefire came into effect. This would constitute a grave violation of the ceasefire, and one that is likely to have very serious consequences for the people of Gaza, Israel and beyond. Such moves call into question the credibility of Hamas' assurances to the United Nations. The Secretary-General demands the immediate and unconditional release of the captured soldier.

The Secretary-General is deeply concerned about the resumption of Israeli attacks on Gaza and the killing of over 70 Palestinians this morning. Instead of giving both sides, especially Gazan civilians, a much needed reprieve to let them attend to their injured, bury their dead and repair vital infrastructure, this breach of the ceasefire is now leading to a renewed escalation.

The Secretary-General urges both sides to show maximum restraint and return to the agreed 72-hour humanitarian ceasefire that tragically lasted such a brief period of time. He also urges those with influence over the parties to do everything to convince them to observe the humanitarian ceasefire.

Waiting to hear Jeff criticize Muslims for improper use of sources. That is just shameless if you want people to listen to you, you need credibility.

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Muslima, even Ban Ki-Moon said Hamas broke it. You sure lose credibility when you quote Hamas. Not exactly the authorities of truth!

Jeff, the Jeffrey Goldberg piece is actually really good. You should finish reading. Regardless where Hadar was abducted, things are not going to get better. Israel will do anything to get their people back.

This is what Ban Ki Moon said :

" This would constitute a grave violation of the cease-fire, and one that is likely to have very serious consequences for the people of Gaza, Israel and beyond," said. "Such moves call into question the credibility of Hamas' assurances to the United Nations."

Noting that the UN has no independent means to verify what happened on ground, Ban said he is deeply concerned about the resumption of Israeli attacks on Gaza and the killing of over 50 Palestinians this morning. 

"Instead of giving both sides, especially Gazan civilians, a much needed reprieve to let them attend to their injured, bury their dead and repair vital infrastructure, this breach of the ceasefire is now leading to a renewed escalation," Ban's spokesman said. 

"The Secretary-General urges both sides to show maximum restraint and return to the agreed 72-hour humanitarian ceasefire that tragically lasted such a brief period of time," he said. 

Talk about selective quoting. Here is a link to the statement, right from the UN itself:

http://www.un.org/sg/statements/index.asp?nid=7901

The Secretary-General condemns in the strongest terms the reported violation by Hamas of the mutually agreed humanitarian ceasefire which commenced this morning. He is shocked and profoundly disappointed by these developments.

The Secretary-General notes that the UN has no independent means to verify exactly what happened. According to the latest reports, two IDF soldiers were killed and one taken captive after the humanitarian ceasefire came into effect. This would constitute a grave violation of the ceasefire, and one that is likely to have very serious consequences for the people of Gaza, Israel and beyond. Such moves call into question the credibility of Hamas' assurances to the United Nations. The Secretary-General demands the immediate and unconditional release of the captured soldier.

The Secretary-General is deeply concerned about the resumption of Israeli attacks on Gaza and the killing of over 70 Palestinians this morning. Instead of giving both sides, especially Gazan civilians, a much needed reprieve to let them attend to their injured, bury their dead and repair vital infrastructure, this breach of the ceasefire is now leading to a renewed escalation.

The Secretary-General urges both sides to show maximum restraint and return to the agreed 72-hour humanitarian ceasefire that tragically lasted such a brief period of time. He also urges those with influence over the parties to do everything to convince them to observe the humanitarian ceasefire.

Anonymous wrote:Muslima, even Ban Ki-Moon said Hamas broke it. You sure lose credibility when you quote Hamas. Not exactly the authorities of truth!

Jeff, the Jeffrey Goldberg piece is actually really good. You should finish reading. Regardless where Hadar was abducted, things are not going to get better. Israel will do anything to get their people back.

This is what Ban Ki Moon said :

" This would constitute a grave violation of the cease-fire, and one that is likely to have very serious consequences for the people of Gaza, Israel and beyond," said. "Such moves call into question the credibility of Hamas' assurances to the United Nations."

Noting that the UN has no independent means to verify what happened on ground, Ban said he is deeply concerned about the resumption of Israeli attacks on Gaza and the killing of over 50 Palestinians this morning. 

"Instead of giving both sides, especially Gazan civilians, a much needed reprieve to let them attend to their injured, bury their dead and repair vital infrastructure, this breach of the ceasefire is now leading to a renewed escalation," Ban's spokesman said. 

"The Secretary-General urges both sides to show maximum restraint and return to the agreed 72-hour humanitarian ceasefire that tragically lasted such a brief period of time," he said. 

Anonymous wrote:then what was it?

I actually wrote a post on that but I believe it was in the wrong thread and Jeff deleted it. I was there when the huge wave of immigration was happening. Number 1, or as an aside, Russian Jews didn't go to Israel because of a great attachment to the Jewish state. Russia at the time was a bad place to be, and Israel presented a form of escape. If it was Italy or Australia, they'd go there, too. Many did move past Israel once they got on their feet.

The primary reason Russian Jews turned hardline and right-wing was because prior to getting on the plane, they were sold - via lectures and outreach at synagogues - the story that Israel was a "land without people and people without land." At no point of time was it mentioned that there is actually another group of people in Palestine/Israel that thinks of this land as their own. The history of Arab/Jewish conflict and its prevarications since 1948 were largely unknown to the Russian Jews headed to Israel. No one understood the issue of occupation, no one understood where these lands came from, no one questioned what should be done with them, no one talked about Palestinians as a people with legitimate grievances. At most, this was mentioned as "these Arabs who all want to kill us." For most, the existence of Palestinians and their aspirations vis-a-vis statehood was an utter and complete discovery they made after they landed in the country. Therefore, the attitude of the Russian Jews toward Palestinians was that of utter bewilderment that "these people" dare to exist at all. Add to this the fact that most of them were poor, and real estate in central Israel is incredibly expensive, and therefore most recent immigrants could only afford housing in far-out suburban communities often in recent settlements. This is the home they know. They feel entitled to that. No Arab is going to take that away. Lack of experience with democracy doesn't come into the picture at all.

And it completely understandable why Israel didn't present them with a complete picture - because Russian Jews were a big part of the solution to Israel's demographic dilemma, and a big source of immigration (let's face it, no one is standing in line for the Israeli passport if they have better options), and Israel wanted more people. How many people do you think would immigrate if Israeli outreach services told them, "yes, please, you are welcome to come, but mind you that half the country is actually taken up by the disputed land we took away from another people (really really recently), and they are still kinda angry about that. And you're most likely going to live right next to them as that's all you'll be able to afford."

Muslima, even Ban Ki-Moon said Hamas broke it. You sure lose credibility when you quote Hamas. Not exactly the authorities of truth!

Jeff, the Jeffrey Goldberg piece is actually really good. You should finish reading. Regardless where Hadar was abducted, things are not going to get better. Israel will do anything to get their people back.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone really think that Israel in it current form is sustainable? The world is changing and so is the technology of war. Who knows what Israel's nieghbors will look like in 10 years. It is one thing to send troops in when you know you will win. If Israel had to take on a really country, all kinds of unforeseen thing can happen. What would the world think if Israel nuked a neighbor? The demographics in the US are going against Israel(Latinos and other minorities are not supporters of Isreal), US is tired of War and has budget concerns. These are just few the external forces working against Israel.

That Economist piece was interesting. Apparently the huge wave of Russian immigration in the 90s tipped Israel's balance from being more liberal to hard liner and hawkish. They'd never known democracy.

The elephant in the room is that Netanyahu continues to break the law with illegal West Bank settlements and has no true interest in negotiating a two state solution. When the much larger, more powerful player in the game refuses to sincerely negotiate, nothing is left but violence.

That's not why. I mean, the huge wave of Russian immigration did take place but the reason they turned hardline is not because they've never known democracy.

then what was it?