Anonymous
Post 06/22/2013 18:30     Subject: Re:Sidwell college guidance office
Exactly, schools want students who also want them. They do not want students who think of them as a safety and will be gone as quickly as possible.
Anonymous
Post 06/22/2013 18:13     Subject: Re:Sidwell college guidance office
Anonymous wrote:FYI regarding safety schools: some mid level schools do not automaticlly accept students that are way above their typical profile because those students do not usually enroll. If they do, they often transfer out quickly. These mid level schools want to admit students that are likely to attend and stay. If a student is above the normal admissions profile of their safety school, then they should show interest in the school by visiting, calling, or e-mailing and asking about an honors program. If this interest is not demonstrated, then don't be surprised if they are not offered admissions. I know this because DH works in academic administration at a mid level university.


I have studied Naviance for our school and this is definitely true. At one college I looked at the applicants with the highest GPAs/scores were waitlisted/rejected while the kids in the next tier down were accepted. I suspect they were ones who also didn't visit or show much interest in the school because it was a safety.
Anonymous
Post 06/22/2013 17:31     Subject: Sidwell college guidance office
17:01 it is often called Tufts Syndrome.
Anonymous
Post 06/22/2013 17:01     Subject: Re:Sidwell college guidance office
FYI regarding safety schools: some mid level schools do not automaticlly accept students that are way above their typical profile because those students do not usually enroll. If they do, they often transfer out quickly. These mid level schools want to admit students that are likely to attend and stay. If a student is above the normal admissions profile of their safety school, then they should show interest in the school by visiting, calling, or e-mailing and asking about an honors program. If this interest is not demonstrated, then don't be surprised if they are not offered admissions. I know this because DH works in academic administration at a mid level university.
Anonymous
Post 06/22/2013 16:28     Subject: Sidwell college guidance office
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I think it's crazy for a school to limit the number of colleges a student can apply to. Today, getting in is totally random. You may not get into Duke, but happen to get into Harvard. The kids who apply to as many schools as possible (so long as they can put their heart and soul into each of the essays) has the best chance of winning the lottery that is today's college admissions process.


If every kid did this, then the odds of admission would go down even further for every kid. It would be mutually assured self-destruction.



+1 -- The problem at Sidwell is not the limit on the number of applications; the problem is that the counselors pretend that strategic considerations don't exist -- instead of helping kids and parents figure out a strategy, including choosing safeties that kids can live with. The result: one-quarter of the class applies to Michigan and one-quarter to Tufts (with a significant overlap here among students falling in the middle-quarter of the grade). MADness.
Anonymous
Post 06/22/2013 15:34     Subject: Sidwell college guidance office
Anonymous wrote:I think it's crazy for a school to limit the number of colleges a student can apply to. Today, getting in is totally random. You may not get into Duke, but happen to get into Harvard. The kids who apply to as many schools as possible (so long as they can put their heart and soul into each of the essays) has the best chance of winning the lottery that is today's college admissions process.


If every kid did this, then the odds of admission would go down even further for every kid. It would be mutually assured self-destruction.

Anonymous
Post 06/22/2013 13:34     Subject: Sidwell college guidance office
I think it's crazy for a school to limit the number of colleges a student can apply to. Today, getting in is totally random. You may not get into Duke, but happen to get into Harvard. The kids who apply to as many schools as possible (so long as they can put their heart and soul into each of the essays) has the best chance of winning the lottery that is today's college admissions process.
Anonymous
Post 06/22/2013 08:41     Subject: Sidwell college guidance office
Anonymous wrote:Its the parents' job to make guide their child, you just can't farm that out to the GCs. It's too important in terms of learning to develop choices, choosing, being aware of one's own strengths, limits, interests, understanding constraints such as money and all the related matters about going to college.


Yes . . . to a certain extent. the problem is that all of us parents went to college in a prior era. The competitiveness (and excellence) of many colleges has changed. So when kids rely solely on their parents they can have a distorted view of where they should apply. I went to (one of HYP) and there is no way I would get in today. I know that but I see many parents who don't get that things have changed.
Anonymous
Post 06/22/2013 07:24     Subject: Sidwell college guidance office
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:They all apply to safeties, but nothing is a true safety these days. It actually can happen, and does.


There are some true safeties - only the top end of the US News ranking takes less than half of applicants. The problem is more that the kids don't want to apply to a school nobody in Washington has heard of.


I find it hard to believe these are truly multiple students ("every year there are a couple" according to PP) who do not get admitted to any safety school. For all those Bethesda & Chevy Chase students, that can be any of the UMD campuses. For others it might be something like Ole Miss.


UMD has gotten a lot harder to get into. It is no longer necessarily a safety. Some of the campuses, like Baltimore, are a little easier to get into than College Park, but it is not a strong safety. I'm not sure what is really a guaranteed safety. Anyone have ideas about a good safety school?
Anonymous
Post 06/21/2013 22:42     Subject: Sidwell college guidance office
Its the parents' job to make guide their child, you just can't farm that out to the GCs. It's too important in terms of learning to develop choices, choosing, being aware of one's own strengths, limits, interests, understanding constraints such as money and all the related matters about going to college.
Anonymous
Post 06/21/2013 22:16     Subject: Sidwell college guidance office
If a college guidance counselor is doing her job she will tell applicants that a desired school is a long shot and they are unlikely to get in. That is called using your expertise. That doesn't mean the applicant shouldn't apply there. It just means they shouldn't be surprised if they don't get in. Applying to 9 schools should easily allow a range between reaches and safeties and schools in between. Its the counselor's job to make sure at the very least that there are safeties in the mix.
Anonymous
Post 06/21/2013 18:05     Subject: Sidwell college guidance office
Anonymous wrote:I believe Sidwell has the toughest grading standards of private schools in this area so the top GPA coming out of the school might be a 3.8 or something like that. Then you go all the way down to a 2.0 or below with most falling in the B range. Pretty much all of those kids are smart, capable of doing the work at any college, and get top standardized test scores. A few are less motivated but still pretty smart. They don't all belong at HPY, but they should all be going to good schools, and they definitely don't. Quite a few end up at lower tier LACs and state schools, and every year there are a couple who do not get into any college. Sidwell needs to do more to advocate for students as they apply to college and explain the toughness of the grading system to colleges. The office relies way too much on legacies and other hooks to make the difference. I also like Eric Monheim, but I think the office needs to step up its game or it will hurt the school.


Yes, every year there's a kid who doesn't get in anywhere, so the counselors freak out and use this as an example the following year when they tell the kids that they won't get in anywhere. Result: many kids don't apply to their top picks because they're afraid they won't get in . . . . and there's always still one kids who doesn't get in anywhere. So, the counselors freak out and the following year . . . .

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
Anonymous
Post 06/21/2013 17:41     Subject: Sidwell college guidance office
Anonymous wrote:Sidwell kids can only apply to nine schools -- usually a range of reach to safety like everywhere else. There have been kids who did not get in to one of their nine choices. Of course the admissions office called around to other schools later and eventually got them in somewhere, but a true safety is a school that takes 100% not everyone defines safety that way.


The kids don't need to apply to more than 9 schools (and, BTW, the school doesn't enforce that strictly), nor do they need to apply to a school that accepts 100% of the applicants (e.g., a community college), but they do need more guidance than the college counselors have generally provided in coming up with a list. They also need more support on writing essays. Finally, they don't need the "manana" approach that the college counselors have generally espoused. This isn't brain surgery -- other schools do a better job. Survey their programs and institute best practices.
Anonymous
Post 06/21/2013 17:41     Subject: Sidwell college guidance office
Anonymous wrote:
At DC's school, the only kids who don't get in anywhere are those who, like PP, feel they are entitled to go to a top school and aren't realistic with their applications.


This, exactly. The idea that someone doesn't get into a college because they can "only" apply to 9 schools is patently ridiculous. When safety schools are chosen objectively and well, they are true safeties with admission virtually guaranteed for the applicant given his or her grades/scores/ECs. (I would argue that a true safety is also one the family can afford, but since these are Sidwell families perhaps that is less of an issue.)

Assuming a kid doesn't have real problems on their resume (e.g., run-ins with the police, cheating, etc), a kid applying to 9 schools who didn't get into ANY? was either unrealistic in picking "safeties" or didn't apply to enough safeties. (If you are applying to 9 schools, I think at least 2 of them should be "safeties.")
Anonymous
Post 06/21/2013 17:18     Subject: Sidwell college guidance office
Anonymous wrote:Sidwell kids can only apply to nine schools -- usually a range of reach to safety like everywhere else. There have been kids who did not get in to one of their nine choices. Of course the admissions office called around to other schools later and eventually got them in somewhere, but a true safety is a school that takes 100% not everyone defines safety that way.


Then that reflects badly on the college guidance system. A school doesn't have to admit 100% of applicants in order for it to be a pretty sure thing for a particular applicant. I think we all know a safety isn't defined as a school with 100% acceptance.

At DC's school, the only kids who don't get in anywhere are those who, like PP, feel they are entitled to go to a top school and aren't realistic with their applications.