Anonymous
Post 04/30/2013 15:53     Subject: Does big law get better?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote: DH always hits his numbers for billing and leverage and makes about 1.1m. He is a third year partner.


My DH is a Big Law partner (I am former Big Law myself) and I don't know anyone who makes this kind of money as a third year partner, despite billing in the 2,500 hour range.


LOL that's what he told DW to get her in the sack. Probably runs up the credit cards.
Anonymous
Post 04/30/2013 15:49     Subject: Does big law get better?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote: DH always hits his numbers for billing and leverage and makes about 1.1m. He is a third year partner.


My DH is a Big Law partner (I am former Big Law myself) and I don't know anyone who makes this kind of money as a third year partner, despite billing in the 2,500 hour range.


Yeah, this is pretty surprising. I think the more informative convos about law salaries are found on other sites. But 1.1 mill for a third-year partner? Totally out of the norm.


I'm the PP who posted the original number. Is this really out of the norm? This is definitely what my DH makes. Since we just did our taxes, I know that this is an accurate number for his pre-tax income. I know his firm has strong PPP, but I didn't think they were markedly different from his peers at other firms. I won't say what firm because he was the only person who made partner his year in DC and it would be easy to identify him, but it is a very big international firm. He made partner with his own book of business, which I know is a bit unusual and kind of hard to do, and he has about 3.5 million in business now. He has a very, very specialized practice. I am not sure his number of shares will go up dramatically in the future without him growing his business further. He is always trying to do this, but, as many of the PPs pointed out, it is the biggest challenge at the partner level and takes a huge amount of his time and effort.

I work in a totally different field that is compensated using a very different structure, so I don't have a good sense of what the averages are. It does seem, however, that many law firms make a lot of partners, but the compensation is lower, while some firms make only a few partners and the compensation for those who get over the line is higher. If he was making 300K - 400K and working like he does, I think I would tell him to leave and find a new job right away. At his income, our plan is for him to stay a partner for a few years while we squirrel away money and then we can decide if it is still worth it. We keep our finances in check so that he always feels like he is free to leave if the job gets to be too much. I would never want him to feel trapped in such a high pressure job.





I think 300-400 is on the low end, but 500-750 is more the norm for the equity partners 3-5 years out in DC area firms (that are not NY-based). It then varies significantly after the first few years because if you have your own large book, you can command a much bigger draw than the guy sitting next to you. But it's certainly possible (obviously, if your husband is in that situation) to do considerably better than average if you are in a very specialized practice and have a good book of business. Consider yourself lucky!
Anonymous
Post 04/30/2013 15:46     Subject: Does big law get better?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:It is shoo-in, not shoe-in.

Lucky you SAH...


As a lawyer, this is why people hate lawyers.


Too bad, so sad. People should learn correct language usage.


Lighten up, Francis. It's an anonymous message board, which doesn't have an edit function. It's not a brief. The professor won't call on you today no matter how much you raise your hand.

You probably go around telling people you don't know that they're mispronouncing "err" too.
Anonymous
Post 04/30/2013 15:10     Subject: Does big law get better?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote: DH always hits his numbers for billing and leverage and makes about 1.1m. He is a third year partner.


My DH is a Big Law partner (I am former Big Law myself) and I don't know anyone who makes this kind of money as a third year partner, despite billing in the 2,500 hour range.


Yeah, this is pretty surprising. I think the more informative convos about law salaries are found on other sites. But 1.1 mill for a third-year partner? Totally out of the norm.


I'm the PP who posted the original number. Is this really out of the norm? This is definitely what my DH makes. Since we just did our taxes, I know that this is an accurate number for his pre-tax income. I know his firm has strong PPP, but I didn't think they were markedly different from his peers at other firms. I won't say what firm because he was the only person who made partner his year in DC and it would be easy to identify him, but it is a very big international firm. He made partner with his own book of business, which I know is a bit unusual and kind of hard to do, and he has about 3.5 million in business now. He has a very, very specialized practice. I am not sure his number of shares will go up dramatically in the future without him growing his business further. He is always trying to do this, but, as many of the PPs pointed out, it is the biggest challenge at the partner level and takes a huge amount of his time and effort.

I work in a totally different field that is compensated using a very different structure, so I don't have a good sense of what the averages are. It does seem, however, that many law firms make a lot of partners, but the compensation is lower, while some firms make only a few partners and the compensation for those who get over the line is higher. If he was making 300K - 400K and working like he does, I think I would tell him to leave and find a new job right away. At his income, our plan is for him to stay a partner for a few years while we squirrel away money and then we can decide if it is still worth it. We keep our finances in check so that he always feels like he is free to leave if the job gets to be too much. I would never want him to feel trapped in such a high pressure job.




,
Your DH may earn outside the norm for young partners, but $1.1 million is not unheard of for a young partner with the practice and development skiil talents you have described. I know young partners earning more than that as well.
Anonymous
Post 04/30/2013 14:56     Subject: Does big law get better?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:It is shoo-in, not shoe-in.

Lucky you SAH...


As a lawyer, this is why people hate lawyers.


Too bad, so sad. People should learn correct language usage.
Anonymous
Post 04/30/2013 14:49     Subject: Does big law get better?
FYI, I am no longer immersed in big law, but if I was my guess is I could figure out who your husband is from what you just posted.
Anonymous
Post 04/30/2013 14:14     Subject: Does big law get better?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote: DH always hits his numbers for billing and leverage and makes about 1.1m. He is a third year partner.


My DH is a Big Law partner (I am former Big Law myself) and I don't know anyone who makes this kind of money as a third year partner, despite billing in the 2,500 hour range.


Yeah, this is pretty surprising. I think the more informative convos about law salaries are found on other sites. But 1.1 mill for a third-year partner? Totally out of the norm.


I'm the PP who posted the original number. Is this really out of the norm? This is definitely what my DH makes. Since we just did our taxes, I know that this is an accurate number for his pre-tax income. I know his firm has strong PPP, but I didn't think they were markedly different from his peers at other firms. I won't say what firm because he was the only person who made partner his year in DC and it would be easy to identify him, but it is a very big international firm. He made partner with his own book of business, which I know is a bit unusual and kind of hard to do, and he has about 3.5 million in business now. He has a very, very specialized practice. I am not sure his number of shares will go up dramatically in the future without him growing his business further. He is always trying to do this, but, as many of the PPs pointed out, it is the biggest challenge at the partner level and takes a huge amount of his time and effort.

I work in a totally different field that is compensated using a very different structure, so I don't have a good sense of what the averages are. It does seem, however, that many law firms make a lot of partners, but the compensation is lower, while some firms make only a few partners and the compensation for those who get over the line is higher. If he was making 300K - 400K and working like he does, I think I would tell him to leave and find a new job right away. At his income, our plan is for him to stay a partner for a few years while we squirrel away money and then we can decide if it is still worth it. We keep our finances in check so that he always feels like he is free to leave if the job gets to be too much. I would never want him to feel trapped in such a high pressure job.



Anonymous
Post 04/30/2013 12:41     Subject: Does big law get better?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote: DH always hits his numbers for billing and leverage and makes about 1.1m. He is a third year partner.


My DH is a Big Law partner (I am former Big Law myself) and I don't know anyone who makes this kind of money as a third year partner, despite billing in the 2,500 hour range.


Yeah, this is pretty surprising. I think the more informative convos about law salaries are found on other sites. But 1.1 mill for a third-year partner? Totally out of the norm.
Anonymous
Post 04/30/2013 10:00     Subject: Does big law get better?
It may not get better, but it continues to pay very well. In fact, you are lucky to work in a profession that still, by and large, compensates hard work with a good salary. Those kind of jobs are increasingly difficult to find in this world.
Anonymous
Post 04/29/2013 22:37     Subject: Re:Does big law get better?
Anonymous wrote:For those of you who are trying to save up a big nestegg before leaving Biglaw, what's your target? $500k? $1 million? I realize a lot will depend on if you have children, and how many, but I have been questioning for a while myself whether my savings is enough.


Completely depends on what you want to do after you leave. I got out pretty young (unmarried mid-level associate) so my goals were just to have paid off my student loans and have a downpayment for a house + 6-month emergency fund saved up before I left for a government job. If you were looking to retire or switch careers or SAHM then obviously your needs would differ. You would need to talk to a financial planner about what kind of lump sum will allow you to live off of investments or travel for a year or whatever.

Part of the analysis is looking at your debts/obligations -- house, car, private school, etc. -- and deciding whether you're cutting them or need to save/make enough to cover them.

Anonymous
Post 04/29/2013 22:26     Subject: Does big law get better?
Anonymous wrote:Aren't there plenty of firms where BD/rainmaking are NOT a requirement for partnership?


Not many, and they are not very secure positions. Up until maybe 10 years ago, the economy and law firm culture were such that you could make partner just by being a good lawyer who hit your billables and had rainmaker partner who liked/needed you. (Whether you were an equity or non-equity partner in this capacity varied by firm.) Then the economy got ugly and firms started to oust partners, including equity partners. Those without their own book -- sometimes you hear them called "service partners" -- were very much at risk. Some have held on, whether because they're really needed or the clients like them or the firm doesn't have the chops to fire them, and the fact they exist is why people think it's still a viable model. But I don't think it's at all common for those coming up the ranks to make or stay partner in this capacity. If they need to keep your expertise post-associate, they will make you counsel. Otherwise, you're supposed to build or inherit a book of business and show progress on that in late associate / early partner stages so that the firm can justify keeping you and eventually sharing profits with you.
Anonymous
Post 04/29/2013 21:11     Subject: Re:Does big law get better?
For those of you who are trying to save up a big nestegg before leaving Biglaw, what's your target? $500k? $1 million? I realize a lot will depend on if you have children, and how many, but I have been questioning for a while myself whether my savings is enough.
Anonymous
Post 04/29/2013 21:02     Subject: Does big law get better?
Anonymous wrote: DH always hits his numbers for billing and leverage and makes about 1.1m. He is a third year partner.


My DH is a Big Law partner (I am former Big Law myself) and I don't know anyone who makes this kind of money as a third year partner, despite billing in the 2,500 hour range.
Anonymous
Post 04/29/2013 19:11     Subject: Does big law get better?
It is more work when you make partner because as many PPs have noted you have to generate business; develop, oversee and maintain strong client relationships; and in many cases participate in the internal life of the firm by serving on committees, all in addition to the day-to-day work, deadlines, and obligations of your practice.

In most cases, those successfully working toward partnership are ramping up these additional commitments as a senior associate as well.

My DH absolutely loves the practice of law, warts and all, and thrives in the collegial firm environment. The fact that he makes $2M/yr. also helps.
Anonymous
Post 04/29/2013 17:40     Subject: Does big law get better?
Anonymous wrote:Interesting replies. I know a new partner who confided that he was making less than he did as a senior associate and his hours were horrible. Imagine regular billing + the expectation of business development (successful BD I might add). So he must have been around 300k. Personally, I don't think too many partners are at the 800-1million level, but I can't be sure. I'm just basing that on my observations about their lifestyles and how they complain about money.

Also, unless your DH has a portable book don't assume anything - especially that he is safe once he makes/if he makes partner.



If he is making 300K, he is not full equity at a Big Law firm. Some firms have a "partner" category that is really like a non-equity senior counsel position (Kirkland is like this, I think). But, remember that it is often hard to gauge how much a person is making by their lifestyle. My DH is a full equity partner making about 1.2 million. However, we live in the same house that we bought when he was a second year associate because we like it and we like the neighborhood and our kids are at good public school. We also drive the same cars we've had for years. I always think it is funny when his associates buy their "starter" home and it is bigger and much more expensive than ours. Some people just aren't spenders and we like having a big cushion in case either one of us wants to change jobs or we decide that we want to retire early and do something/live somewhere else. I bet our friends (at least those who aren't in the law so don't know how different firms pay) would guess that we make in the 300K range. I am happy not to disabuse them of this idea because I would rather them not know how much more money we have.