PP, thanks for your very thoughtful post re your experience at PSU. Could you elaborate on what you mean when you say you felt like you were drowning at such a large school? My DD is somewhat interested in looking at some of the big state schools (Michigan and Wisconsin), which are very different from the type of schools that our older kids favored, so I'm trying to get a handle on what that experience would be like.

Curious to hear that you think a non-Ivy private college is worth the debt load. Lots of people swinging the other way on that opinion.

Thanks for saying it was a good list. I certainly would have added Penn State but I was anticipating flaming. Before the scandal, there was an article in the WSJ last year saying company recruiters actually preferred Penn State kids to any others. That really shocked me. I don't know what it's like there post-scandal. But, the college kids certainly shouldn't be blamed and shouldn't be collateral damage.

I'm someone who thinks people actually should go to state schools unless they get into a top-20 ranked private school. Otherwise, I don't think private schools are worth it for college. People can spend the money on private for their masters if they want (once they really know what they want to do).

It was a personal decision for me looking back.

To preface, 6 figure debt to me would've been 100-130k back then, not the 160-200k+ that it is these days if you are forced to pay full flight to gtown, hopkins and don't get much aid. (gtown and carnegie mellon gave me pretty crappy aid over a decade ago....i'm not sure if that's changed...both schools have pretty shit endowments for their reputation so don't know how that has affected their aid giving a decade later).

I hated the size of PSU (and land-grand public research schools like Texas and UW are HUGE) and a lack of attention (even with their constituent honors colleges of which i was a part of). I went to a public hs that had 1600 kids and thought 30-40k undergrad campuses would not be a big deal but i HATED being at such a large school (especially in a rural area). Looking back, part of it was being in a rural area, part of it was the size(felt like i was drowning with how large psu was).

Also for what I ended up wanting to do and currently work in (IR, country risk finance), recruiting is SO much better at places like Tufts, gtown, cmu etc.

If one is intersted in bulge bracket banking/finance, strat consulting (tech, then CMU naturally) even places like CIA these days (CIA used to come on campus for all directorates at PSU when I was there but the last few years they only send DST (engineering directorate) to PSU but DI and NCS reps go to places like Gtown, Tufts, etc.).....going to a top-20 private (even if it is non-ivy) helps a ton. There are more relationships in terms of recruiting and networking that help a hell of a lot.

I guess to distill my feelings it comes down to size of school (student body), location, recruiting relationships with certain industries in certain fields, type/nature of student body.

I thought that top 25 non-ivy privates were not worth it but after working for 6-7 years and looking through my network, i'm not so sure about that. I think any top 20-25 private that fits your criteria in terms of fit, and would make you happy, would be better than a large public and the difference between say penn CAS/Cornell AS vs. gtown, tufts, hopkins for example is pretty much non-existant.

outside of the top-25 for privates, i agree that public would probably make way more sense.

If you know with virtual certainty though that you are going to med or law school, then I'm not sure it matters also since both those tracks are heavily based on mcat and lsat performance, which is not so dependent on where you go to UG.

It would be a good time to apply to Penn State in the next year or two. Kind of like buying a stock that has fallen but which has good underlying value and is likely to go up.

Anonymous wrote:Regarding PSU, I don't see how the scandal, $600,000,000 fine and 5 yesr Bowl ban won't have an increasingly negative trickle down effect. I'm thinking top faculty, research grantors, applicants and athletic recruits will opt to go to their "other" good choice. and in time PSU's reputation will suffer in non-football circles.

the penn-state fine was 60 million, not 600 million....though i'm not sure what lawsuits will extract out of the school as well.

I don't know, i think penn state from 20-30+ years ago would've been screwed.

However I think penn state now has built up the institution large enough to whether the storm.

A lot of psu's strength came from the ability to leverage its unique position as the largest and highest ranked north-east/mid-atlantic public research school. In the north-east/mid-atlantic population center, psu became an attractive choice and that brought recruiters on campus for jobs as solidify it as a top 50-60 school in the country.

I agree with the opposite of your assertion..i think psu's rep in football circles will be screwed because of the bowl ban and recruiting. I think it'll be ok in academic circles and perhaps even improve since there seems to be a concerted effort by the president to try to focus psu towards academics over football.

Regarding PSU, I don't see how the scandal, $600,000,000 fine and 5 yesr Bowl ban won't have an increasingly negative trickle down effect. I'm thinking top faculty, research grantors, applicants and athletic recruits will opt to go to their "other" good choice. and in time PSU's reputation will suffer in non-football circles.

Thanks for saying it was a good list. I certainly would have added Penn State but I was anticipating flaming. Before the scandal, there was an article in the WSJ last year saying company recruiters actually preferred Penn State kids to any others. That really shocked me. I don't know what it's like there post-scandal. But, the college kids certainly shouldn't be blamed and shouldn't be collateral damage.

I'm someone who thinks people actually should go to state schools unless they get into a top-20 ranked private school. Otherwise, I don't think private schools are worth it for college. People can spend the money on private for their masters if they want (once they really know what they want to do).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ohio State
U of Miami in OH
U of Texas
Berkeley
UNC
UVA
Wm + Mary
U of Cincy (top architecture program and top music program)
UCLA
UC system of CA (sev'l of the schools such as UC -San Diego)

good list.

I'd add Penn State (i know i know shit press, etc) is decent as well and has extremely good recruiting for its reputation. Ridiculous amount of PSU grads in the Bos-Wash area in a lot of industries and On-Campus Recruiting is comparable if not better than many on your list.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Go Dukes!

+1 Duuuuukes!
To the PP, there is more than "JMU cheerleader" on these boards. It's a popular OOS option for Maryland kids, not to mention that there are a lot of alumni in the Metro DC area, especially in Fairfax County.

Sadly, Harrisonburg is the pits, the climate is too yuck, they're purple, too many neighbors go there, the sports are too lame . . . . But the tuition is just right.

Well I wouldn't want to live in Harrisonburg now as an adult. But I went to JMU and absolutely loved it. And when the weather was warm the Blue Ridge area had so much outdoor stuff to do. Couldn't care less about the colors but the sports are great. I would love it if my DD would choose JMU. Some of the best days of my life. Awesome, awesome school. Yes, I'm another JMU cheerleader!

At least it's not a commuter school like mason, your alma mater.

Girls, please stop. The adults on this thread are not talking about JMU or GMU.

For the record have no connection with either. Just poking the person based on an older entertaining thread.

Ah, the Irrational Va Tech booster.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:South Carolina. They give awesome merit aid.

DD is intrigued regarding USC. What can you say about it?

They used to have a sign in their swimming complex "Nothing's faster than a wet 'cock!" LOL!!!!

Our female neighbor came home for the holidays with a sticker on her car referring to the 'Cocks. DH said he'd never let his DD go around with that on her car because of what guys would say to her. Sure enough, the following week, the girl had removed the sticker. I guess she'd heard enough rude comments.

Clemson has a noted autmotive engineering program!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:South Carolina. They give awesome merit aid.

DD is intrigued regarding USC. What can you say about it?

They used to have a sign in their swimming complex "Nothing's faster than a wet 'cock!" LOL!!!!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ohio State
U of Miami in OH
U of Texas
Berkeley
UNC
UVA
Wm + Mary
U of Cincy (top architecture program and top music program)
UCLA
UC system of CA (sev'l of the schools such as UC -San Diego)

good list.
I'd add Penn State (i know i know shit press, etc) is decent as well and has extremely good recruiting for its reputation. Ridiculous amount of PSU grads in the Bos-Wash area in a lot of industries and On-Campus Recruiting is comparable if not better than many on your list.

I wondered what the current crop of kids thought about PSU. I think we'll skip it. There are too many other good choices and I think PSU has a ways to fall before it makes its climb back up the ranks.

I was up at PSU last fall to speak at an alum event, and while there is a general perception problem in terms of public optics, I'm not sure if it has affected large hiring companies.

OCI is still quite strong and tied with J&J, P&G, Big4 accounting, Defense contractor engineering are still quite deep.

I do not think the scandal has affected top students getting offers from companies that come and recruit on campus.

A lot of it has to do with the fact that PSU is the largest public in the mid atlantic/northeast that's rated as highly as it is so your 'middle class' 'upper-middle class' corporate employers from the north east, mid-atlantic, and midwest love going there to recruit.

P.S. Not a shill of the school. I wouldn't go there if i had to do it again, but that's because I would never go to any public college in this country. Public high school is one thing, but public universities i feel are meat markets. I'd take the 6 figure debt and go to carnegie mellon, Hopkins, Georgetown, tufts (I was not ivy caliber, got into schools a tier below but didn't think it was worth the price).

Curious to hear that you think a non-Ivy private college is worth the debt load. Lots of people swinging the other way on that opinion.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Go Dukes!

+1 Duuuuukes!
To the PP, there is more than "JMU cheerleader" on these boards. It's a popular OOS option for Maryland kids, not to mention that there are a lot of alumni in the Metro DC area, especially in Fairfax County.

Sadly, Harrisonburg is the pits, the climate is too yuck, they're purple, too many neighbors go there, the sports are too lame . . . . But the tuition is just right.

Well I wouldn't want to live in Harrisonburg now as an adult. But I went to JMU and absolutely loved it. And when the weather was warm the Blue Ridge area had so much outdoor stuff to do. Couldn't care less about the colors but the sports are great. I would love it if my DD would choose JMU. Some of the best days of my life. Awesome, awesome school. Yes, I'm another JMU cheerleader!

At least it's not a commuter school like mason, your alma mater.

Girls, please stop. The adults on this thread are not talking about JMU or GMU.

For the record have no connection with either. Just poking the person based on an older entertaining thread.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ohio State
U of Miami in OH
U of Texas
Berkeley
UNC
UVA
Wm + Mary
U of Cincy (top architecture program and top music program)
UCLA
UC system of CA (sev'l of the schools such as UC -San Diego)

good list.
I'd add Penn State (i know i know shit press, etc) is decent as well and has extremely good recruiting for its reputation. Ridiculous amount of PSU grads in the Bos-Wash area in a lot of industries and On-Campus Recruiting is comparable if not better than many on your list.

I wondered what the current crop of kids thought about PSU. I think we'll skip it. There are too many other good choices and I think PSU has a ways to fall before it makes its climb back up the ranks.

I was up at PSU last fall to speak at an alum event, and while there is a general perception problem in terms of public optics, I'm not sure if it has affected large hiring companies.

OCI is still quite strong and tied with J&J, P&G, Big4 accounting, Defense contractor engineering are still quite deep.

I do not think the scandal has affected top students getting offers from companies that come and recruit on campus.

A lot of it has to do with the fact that PSU is the largest public in the mid atlantic/northeast that's rated as highly as it is so your 'middle class' 'upper-middle class' corporate employers from the north east, mid-atlantic, and midwest love going there to recruit.

P.S. Not a shill of the school. I wouldn't go there if i had to do it again, but that's because I would never go to any public college in this country. Public high school is one thing, but public universities i feel are meat markets. I'd take the 6 figure debt and go to carnegie mellon, Hopkins, Georgetown, tufts (I was not ivy caliber, got into schools a tier below but didn't think it was worth the price).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ohio State
U of Miami in OH
U of Texas
Berkeley
UNC
UVA
Wm + Mary
U of Cincy (top architecture program and top music program)
UCLA
UC system of CA (sev'l of the schools such as UC -San Diego)

good list.
I'd add Penn State (i know i know shit press, etc) is decent as well and has extremely good recruiting for its reputation. Ridiculous amount of PSU grads in the Bos-Wash area in a lot of industries and On-Campus Recruiting is comparable if not better than many on your list.

I wondered what the current crop of kids thought about PSU. I think we'll skip it. There are too many other good choices and I think PSU has a ways to fall before it makes its climb back up the ranks.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Go Dukes!

+1 Duuuuukes!
To the PP, there is more than "JMU cheerleader" on these boards. It's a popular OOS option for Maryland kids, not to mention that there are a lot of alumni in the Metro DC area, especially in Fairfax County.

Sadly, Harrisonburg is the pits, the climate is too yuck, they're purple, too many neighbors go there, the sports are too lame . . . . But the tuition is just right.

Well I wouldn't want to live in Harrisonburg now as an adult. But I went to JMU and absolutely loved it. And when the weather was warm the Blue Ridge area had so much outdoor stuff to do. Couldn't care less about the colors but the sports are great. I would love it if my DD would choose JMU. Some of the best days of my life. Awesome, awesome school. Yes, I'm another JMU cheerleader!

At least it's not a commuter school like mason, your alma mater.

Girls, please stop. The adults on this thread are not talking about JMU or GMU.