are parents concerned about sending their kids to Einstein eventually?

Here's the thing: I actually know people with kids at OT, Flora, a couple title 1s in Silver Spring, as well as more upscale schools (for lack of a better descriptor) in Bethesda, Potomac, Kensington, olney and brookeville. I know teachers and principals in mcps at the best and worst schools as well. And I have kids in mcps. I'm not making this stuff up. I'm not saying working parents aren't active in schools. I am saying farms parents typically do not volunteer in the classroom to assist with math and reading twice a week...but that does happen in more affluent schools with lots of SAHMs. And ESOL parents definitely do not volunteer in the classroom on a regular basis either. To be clear (since the pp seems a bit confused), I'm not saying these parents don't care about their kids and don't show up at school events (although any mcps teacher at a title I or focus school will tell you who does and does not show up for back to school night and class parties). And my other point about social and childcare issues is spot on as well. The simple fact is that it is rather easy to set up playdates and carpools at schools with lots of SAHMs (or nannies who drive). There was another thread about these sorts of observations recently...I think it centered on a school in Rockville...and a poster explained all of this much more eloquently than I can (haven't slept all week thanks to multiple sick kids).

Anonymous wrote:Hey 13:36 - it's not a dumb assumption. ESOL kids have parents who don't speak English, and they typically are not active in the PTA, volunteering in class, etc. FARMS kids typically have parents who work and can't be active either. There's another thread where a mom talks about how parents are volunteering constantly in her Bethesda school in order to supplement the teacher (since kids aren't switched for math anymore, etc)....that sort of regular volunteering simply does not happen in a school with really high farms or ESOL....but it might be happening in schools with more moderate levels. And I can assure it does happen in schools with very low ESOL and farms bc there are many more parents who are SAHMs. That's just an obvious observation. Having said all of this, I don't know what the stats are for flora singer (no one does), but I do know that Oakland terrace has always had a very active PTA and volunteers (and I also know those parents aren't ESOL or farms). It is what it is.

so only SAH parents are active in the school?
so you gave assumptions about working parents AND FARMS families.
An equal opportunity IDIOT.

Nope. Flora pulled exclusively from OT. And OT was/is a great school in terms of test scores given the demographics.

I thought flora singer pulled from all of the schools in silver spring that had overflow. Not just Oakland Terrace (which is better than some of the others).

Hey 13:36 - it's not a dumb assumption. ESOL kids have parents who don't speak English, and they typically are not active in the PTA, volunteering in class, etc. FARMS kids typically have parents who work and can't be active either. There's another thread where a mom talks about how parents are volunteering constantly in her Bethesda school in order to supplement the teacher (since kids aren't switched for math anymore, etc)....that sort of regular volunteering simply does not happen in a school with really high farms or ESOL....but it might be happening in schools with more moderate levels. And I can assure it does happen in schools with very low ESOL and farms bc there are many more parents who are SAHMs. That's just an obvious observation. Having said all of this, I don't know what the stats are for flora singer (no one does), but I do know that Oakland terrace has always had a very active PTA and volunteers (and I also know those parents aren't ESOL or farms). It is what it is.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why can't people just ask
what is the learning environment like at a school ?
what is the class size?
how responsive is the administration?
how do teachers implement the curriculum?
What is the neighborhood community like...parent involvement?
Are these not the things that give you specific and helpful information about the school experience?
Asking about ESOL and FARMS gets you stats...that lead to assumptions...that well...basically may or may not be true and doesn't give you a window into what the real experience of the place may be.
It really is sad...

The reality is that FARMS and ESOL have a lot to do with it. Looking at the data here http://mdreportcard.org/ it is clear that more students at certain schools are scoring at advanced levels than at others. Try the elementary school comparison tool and you will see.

What I am saying is that stats do not give you the whole story...
You need to find out what is happening on the ground...
How are the teachers...
How do they implement the curriculum
A school may have kids testing into Harvard, but the reality is that all the parents are supplementing with Kumon.
But go ahead...keep being afraid of folks who don't make a $200,00 HHI
A family of 4 (2 parents, 2 kids I would assume) making $42,000 qualifies...
You do realize that is about the average HHI in money parts of the country...
That only makes them "poor" in here...and for a lot of people assumed to be ignorant and not supporting their kids in school
Still I say...sad

It is very sad but it is reality. 200K household income is not what it used to be. People with that income still have to make sacrifices when it comes to their homes, cars, vacations, schools, college, extra curricular activities. That is the unfortunate reality for this area.

PLEASE TELL ME THIS IS SARCASM......

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why can't people just ask
what is the learning environment like at a school ?
what is the class size?
how responsive is the administration?
how do teachers implement the curriculum?
What is the neighborhood community like...parent involvement?
Are these not the things that give you specific and helpful information about the school experience?
Asking about ESOL and FARMS gets you stats...that lead to assumptions...that well...basically may or may not be true and doesn't give you a window into what the real experience of the place may be.
It really is sad...

The reality is that FARMS and ESOL have a lot to do with it. Looking at the data here http://mdreportcard.org/ it is clear that more students at certain schools are scoring at advanced levels than at others. Try the elementary school comparison tool and you will see.

What I am saying is that stats do not give you the whole story...
You need to find out what is happening on the ground...
How are the teachers...
How do they implement the curriculum
A school may have kids testing into Harvard, but the reality is that all the parents are supplementing with Kumon.
But go ahead...keep being afraid of folks who don't make a $200,00 HHI
A family of 4 (2 parents, 2 kids I would assume) making $42,000 qualifies...
You do realize that is about the average HHI in money parts of the country...
That only makes them "poor" in here...and for a lot of people assumed to be ignorant and not supporting their kids in school
Still I say...sad

It is very sad but it is reality. 200K household income is not what it used to be. People with that income still have to make sacrifices when it comes to their homes, cars, vacations, schools, college, extra curricular activities. That is the unfortunate reality for this area.

PLEASE TELL ME THIS IS SARCASM......

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why can't people just ask
what is the learning environment like at a school ?
what is the class size?
how responsive is the administration?
how do teachers implement the curriculum?
What is the neighborhood community like...parent involvement?
Are these not the things that give you specific and helpful information about the school experience?
Asking about ESOL and FARMS gets you stats...that lead to assumptions...that well...basically may or may not be true and doesn't give you a window into what the real experience of the place may be.
It really is sad...

Because most people are not interested in being as PC as you.

what dies being PC have to do with it?
The questions I asked yield the info parents want know...correct?

Anonymous wrote:Farms and ESOL rates give you an idea of how involved parents are in terms of PTA, volunteering in classrooms on a regular basis (ie at our school there are tons of sahms who volunteer once or twice a week, but that doesn't happen at the title I school where my friends kids go), and other things like "will there be a bunch of SAHMs that I can reach out to fir back up child care?" or "will there be lots of classmates for playdates or carpool to sports practice?" etc. I know I will get flamed here for saying that, but it's true. I have friends and family at title I schools who regret that they don't have that at their schools (but they are otherwise pleased with the basic education thus far).

this has to be one of the dumbest ass things I have read.
you know the parents are not involved because that is jnfo you got from people at tbe school not because you can ASSUME it from stats.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why can't people just ask
what is the learning environment like at a school ?
what is the class size?
how responsive is the administration?
how do teachers implement the curriculum?
What is the neighborhood community like...parent involvement?
Are these not the things that give you specific and helpful information about the school experience?
Asking about ESOL and FARMS gets you stats...that lead to assumptions...that well...basically may or may not be true and doesn't give you a window into what the real experience of the place may be.
It really is sad...

The reality is that FARMS and ESOL have a lot to do with it. Looking at the data here http://mdreportcard.org/ it is clear that more students at certain schools are scoring at advanced levels than at others. Try the elementary school comparison tool and you will see.

What I am saying is that stats do not give you the whole story...
You need to find out what is happening on the ground...
How are the teachers...
How do they implement the curriculum
A school may have kids testing into Harvard, but the reality is that all the parents are supplementing with Kumon.
But go ahead...keep being afraid of folks who don't make a $200,00 HHI
A family of 4 (2 parents, 2 kids I would assume) making $42,000 qualifies...
You do realize that is about the average HHI in money parts of the country...
That only makes them "poor" in here...and for a lot of people assumed to be ignorant and not supporting their kids in school
Still I say...sad

It is very sad but it is reality. 200K household income is not what it used to be. People with that income still have to make sacrifices when it comes to their homes, cars, vacations, schools, college, extra curricular activities. That is the unfortunate reality for this area.

PP here - I didn't grow up rich either, I lived in an apartment with my single mom in Bethesda but I know I benefited from the environment.

FARMS and ESOL doesn't necessarily mean that the kids are not going to thrive and become successful. I just know that as someone who grew up in Bethesda the expectations were higher for me and my peers. It wasn't ok to just pass through school, we were encouraged to learn other languages, take honors classes, and AP courses in high school. Because so many others in my classes were trying to do the same, it made things easier in a way and made it a natural expectation. Everyone was going to go to college, there was no doubt about it. Looking at the graduate rates at Einstein, Blair and other high schools, they just aren't as high as BCC, Whitman, etc.

Some in my neighborhood send their kids to private school. I am just debating whether it is worth it to throw that private school money onto a mortgage and live in Bethesda or Chevy Chase rather than remain in the same neighborhood but possibly not send my child to the local school.

I know a child's success has a lot to do with the child, the time parents put in, support, etc. but being surrounded by peers that also want to achieve is important too. Especially in high school.

I don't know the exact percentages but it is perfectly diverse in my opinion. Best environment for kids to learn about diversity. I wouldn't want my kid to go to a school without ESOL students. They learn so much from each other at a young age and make friends with people of lots of different nationalities!!!

About FARMS and ESOL kids:
My son was a FARMS and ESOL kid when he was at school. Honestly, I just cannot afford to leave my work to volunteer at his school. Also, I didn’t have any money to send him to extracurricular activities at that time.
My son graduated from state university two year ago and now is a software engineer at Silicon Valley. His first year salary is over 100K.
He cannot represent all FARMS and ESOL kids, but he is one of them.