Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't get the bit about St. Mary's. Seems to me that it admits most applicants and needs boys, and that 75% of the students have test scores that are below a level that the OP's son might well attain. So why not recommend it to the OP. Seems like a good place to learn.

I'll confess that I've looked at Twitter and Facebook pages recently for kids at my son's school (he's going to one of the flagship out-of-state public universities; U. Va was never in the cards). The kids all congratulate each other on their admissions, even though some schools clearly are very selective and others admit most applicants, and are enthusiastic about their futures. If only the parents were this gracious.

I really wasn't opining about St. Mary's specifically so my apologies for hijacking the thread. More than anything I guess I'm singing a cautionary tale. The process has so changed since any parent who peruses this site went to college and the statistics are tricky sirens and most parents have no idea at all how to navigate through this journey. It's good to know the game so one can play the game. Sorry for the mixed metaphors. Some college counselors, for whatever reason, appear to be reluctant to really talk brass tacks with parents and students about some of the strategies that the "private" counselors and experts at sites such as the NYT's The Choice Blog espouse. I think maybe I understand why now that I see how all of my comments are viewed as somehow negative and an attempt to promote fear. Oh well. No good deed goes unpunished.

I think this was a response to the pp who said it was more or less similar to Montgomery College, rather than being discouraging OP, per se. It's fair to say that it has different admissions standards (and different levels of rigor, once you're there) than MC. And also offers more benefits to OP's kid, which was probably why it was suggested in the first place.

Anonymous wrote:I don't get the bit about St. Mary's. Seems to me that it admits most applicants and needs boys, and that 75% of the students have test scores that are below a level that the OP's son might well attain. So why not recommend it to the OP. Seems like a good place to learn.

I'll confess that I've looked at Twitter and Facebook pages recently for kids at my son's school (he's going to one of the flagship out-of-state public universities; U. Va was never in the cards). The kids all congratulate each other on their admissions, even though some schools clearly are very selective and others admit most applicants, and are enthusiastic about their futures. If only the parents were this gracious.

I really wasn't opining about St. Mary's specifically so my apologies for hijacking the thread. More than anything I guess I'm singing a cautionary tale. The process has so changed since any parent who peruses this site went to college and the statistics are tricky sirens and most parents have no idea at all how to navigate through this journey. It's good to know the game so one can play the game. Sorry for the mixed metaphors. Some college counselors, for whatever reason, appear to be reluctant to really talk brass tacks with parents and students about some of the strategies that the "private" counselors and experts at sites such as the NYT's The Choice Blog espouse. I think maybe I understand why now that I see how all of my comments are viewed as somehow negative and an attempt to promote fear. Oh well. No good deed goes unpunished.

I don't get the bit about St. Mary's. Seems to me that it admits most applicants and needs boys, and that 75% of the students have test scores that are below a level that the OP's son might well attain. So why not recommend it to the OP. Seems like a good place to learn.

I'll confess that I've looked at Twitter and Facebook pages recently for kids at my son's school (he's going to one of the flagship out-of-state public universities; U. Va was never in the cards). The kids all congratulate each other on their admissions, even though some schools clearly are very selective and others admit most applicants, and are enthusiastic about their futures. If only the parents were this gracious.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For an average student, I wouldn't pay the big bucks for him to go anywhere out of state. Let him perform well in his first year at a state school and if he can improve -- great...he might want to transfer. Otherwise, UMBC or St. Marys College (public in MD) or Montgomery College are his likely tickets.

Unless you have a "hook" or are a recruited athlete or apply early decision/action, you usually need to have scores somewhere near the 75 %ile to gain admission. The 75 %ile for the class entering St. Mary's during the fall of 2011 had the following scores - 680 Critical Reading, 650 Math and 670 Writing.

OP here, so you're saying that 75% of the admitted students have a "hook" or are a recruited athlete? I have trouble believing that. Can you give me an example of the kinds of "hooks" you're talking about?

What I said was "Unless you have a "hook" or are a recruited athlete or apply early decision/action, you usually need to have scores somewhere near the 75 %ile to gain admission."

Many colleges (not all and I'm really not sure about the big universities) now take close to 50% of their incoming classes during the early action/early decision process. These students, at many schools, don't have to have quite the same credentials as students admitted regular decision (so they might be the kids that aren't quite at the 75%ile). Other kids might have hooks (they are first generation college students, or under-represented minorities, have some fantastic talent or achievement or are recruited athletes.

The net is that kids applying regular decision who don't have a hook need to be at the upper end of the 25%ile to 75%ile band listed in books such as the Princeton Review.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For an average student, I wouldn't pay the big bucks for him to go anywhere out of state. Let him perform well in his first year at a state school and if he can improve -- great...he might want to transfer. Otherwise, UMBC or St. Marys College (public in MD) or Montgomery College are his likely tickets.

Unless you have a "hook" or are a recruited athlete or apply early decision/action, you usually need to have scores somewhere near the 75 %ile to gain admission. The 75 %ile for the class entering St. Mary's during the fall of 2011 had the following scores - 680 Critical Reading, 650 Math and 670 Writing.

OP here, so you're saying that 75% of the admitted students have a "hook" or are a recruited athlete? I have trouble believing that. Can you give me an example of the kinds of "hooks" you're talking about?

Not to hijack the thread, but in response to the post above suggesting that Reed and University of Chicago are in the same category w/re to selectivity -- per NYT Reed's acceptance rate this year was 34% while Chicago's was 13%. Both are great schools and I see your point about an applicant pool being more or less self-selective, but these schools are very different in terms of admissions stats.