Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, and it is terrible. We had been going in 2x a week and 1x a week, respectively, so one parent was always home to walk the dog and pick up kids. Now our children are in beforecare as well as aftercare and we have a dog walker so we can be on Zoom or Teams meetings all day in our offices.

So who watched your kids while you were teleworking? You can’t supervise kids who belong in daycare and work at the same time. So you either ripped off the taxpayer with illegal childcare, or neglected your kids.

DP but even little kids don’t need to be constantly minded. They can be trained to entertain themselves for an hour or two between 3:30 and when parents finish working. That is not neglect.

A lot of families were hurt by RTO not because of needing actual childcare, but because of transportation issues.

But that’s their own fault. Nobody is forcing these people to live hours away from the office. Most people bought homes pre-pandemic and have plenty of equity to move closer to work. They’re just too lazy, holding onto that 2% rate when they should realistically move and let somebody else enjoy that house. And that’s what it is, a house. It’s not a HoMe or a “forever home” or some other BS that’s been sold by realtors since 2020 to get people to overpay for housing.

Live near where you work, with an easy commute. This is the #1 rule for finding housing and how to live a life without being stressed out. Too many people moved far away when they were only on a telework agreement (not remote) and now they’re complaining about their own poor decisions.

Ignoring that many people can’t afford to live close to work and don’t have a 100k free a year to throw at private schools for 2 kids….

All of this is likely temporary. You’d be a fool to give up a low rate mortgage in a good school district for this administration. In the coming years telework will likely be reintroduced. Even a day or two a week is a game changer. It’s one thing to commute in 5 days a week and another thing 3 days.

Also consider that not everyone plans to work for their current employer forever. It would be stupid to relocate closer in and then end up changing jobs with a commute the opposite direction or no commute at all.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, but only our bargaining unit because the union won in arbitration.

What agency won in arbitration?

EPA won, although the agency is not recognizing the arbitrators decision because it claimed it dissolved the union.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, and it is terrible. We had been going in 2x a week and 1x a week, respectively, so one parent was always home to walk the dog and pick up kids. Now our children are in beforecare as well as aftercare and we have a dog walker so we can be on Zoom or Teams meetings all day in our offices.

So who watched your kids while you were teleworking? You can’t supervise kids who belong in daycare and work at the same time. So you either ripped off the taxpayer with illegal childcare, or neglected your kids.

DP but even little kids don’t need to be constantly minded. They can be trained to entertain themselves for an hour or two between 3:30 and when parents finish working. That is not neglect.

A lot of families were hurt by RTO not because of needing actual childcare, but because of transportation issues.

But that’s their own fault. Nobody is forcing these people to live hours away from the office. Most people bought homes pre-pandemic and have plenty of equity to move closer to work. They’re just too lazy, holding onto that 2% rate when they should realistically move and let somebody else enjoy that house. And that’s what it is, a house. It’s not a HoMe or a “forever home” or some other BS that’s been sold by realtors since 2020 to get people to overpay for housing.

Live near where you work, with an easy commute. This is the #1 rule for finding housing and how to live a life without being stressed out. Too many people moved far away when they were only on a telework agreement (not remote) and now they’re complaining about their own poor decisions.

Feds can't afford a close-in SFH on even a GS15 salary.

Yes, you absolutely can afford a SFH on a GS 15 salary. Even if you work in DC, you can find a SFH on the red line and not even worry about driving.

People are just dumb, refuse to change, and then sit around and complain while being miserable in traffic.

No sympathy for them.

IDK what you're smoking but the most I'd buy with a 200k salary is 750k. I'm not familiar with Maryland, but in Virginia, you're looking at Manassas or Leesburg, or maybe a dump in Chantilly for that price point.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Split schedule is my dream. My oldest is having trouble at aftercare and is begging to be a walker. If I could just come home and telework 3-5pm that would be life changing. I have been debating quitting over it.

You will not be working between 3-5pm because you will take care of your kids. Split schedule just allows part-time with a full-time pay.

This is an ancient and boring debate. I always assume the people who start it didn't do much actual parenting of their own kids or they'd realize how dumb they sound.

Plenty of kids are old enough to be alone in the house but can't physically get there without a ride (we don't have a bus). Or they are fine to do homework if someone's in the house for accountability (e.g., an adult would hear the TV turn on) but don't need interaction.

"ancient and boring" does not mean it is not true. Your assumption is wrong.

DP and they are not wrong. In elementary school my kids went to aftercare and I picked them up after work. After the pandemic, they were in middle or high school. The middle schooler was at a school with no buses. With flexibility, I could pick them up at 3 to take them home and then go back to work. They just needed the ride, they didn't need me minding them. But I didn't claim to work 3-5, I worked 3:30-5:30 and sometimes later. I can get a lot done in the evening (night owl). I am also lucky that the commute from work to home and from the school to home were all short.

The issue with this is telework needs to be at the benefit of the taxpayer/government. It’s not there as a babysitting service. Too many people abused this and now we’re in the predicament we’re in now. Like you shouldn’t be cancelling childcare because you’re working from home, for instance. They can and will inspect your workplace, and if you have kids running around all day, you’re either neglecting them or neglecting your work, which is fraud.

So telework needs to save the taxpayer money, make work more efficient, etc. If you try to spin it as “well it’s easier for me to watch/pickup my kids” then you’re never going to get that back.

DP. Where is your proof of this?
Like PPs mentioned, there are IT logs. Management is able to tell is someone is not working when they say they are, regardless of the work location.

DP. There has been some abuse since the Covid emergencies ended. When were were all sent home to work, maxi flex, childcare and telework was kind of accepted because there was a severe shortage of childcare (schools were also closed, remember?). That’s not been the case for a while but people seem to think they are still entitled to that kind of schedule. I mean—it kind of worked so I don’t blame them, but it’s not crazy to think we need a little more regularity. I love telework, I love giving people some flexibility in their day, I just need a reasonable minimum amount of predictability to run things. For the most part, what happened this year was a major over correction. That said—there some people who shouldn’t be allowed to telework. Hopefully that’s being addressed so the rest of us can have some flexibility back.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We (mid-size federal regulators) got great news that they will be increasing telework flexibilities starting in the new year. Woo hoo! Not to our pandemic, or even pre-pandemic levels, but it’s something. And who knows if we will still continue to get sh(* on by the current administration in other ways, but this is good news for now, especially for those of us that made it through 2025 (just barely in my case).

Anyone else?

do you have any more detail beyond "increasing flexibilities"? As in, will you get once a week telework? Or just what we have, which is five optional telework days per year for personal reasons, and then additional telework on occasion if you are waiting for a repair person or whatever.

Split schedules to telework in mornings/evenings and limited telework for health appointments.

I would love a split schedule - go in for the morning (I get in early), commute at lunch, and finish at home.

Ugh. If you do this then you also need to use the flexibility to make yourself available for meetings outside your normal work schedule. It’s already hard enough to coordinate with team members who leave at 3pm.

I leave at 3:00 now because there's no telework. I can't join your 4 pm meeting because I'm commuting. If I could commute at lunch I'd be online till 5 or later, just like I was before RTO.

No, now you would be MIA at an even more inconvenient time (presumably 11-12 because you would be commuting home). And then probably honestly not that reachable after 3. At least you would be forced to actually take your lunch 1/2 hour instead of claiming you are working through it.

Why could someone not be available after 3 just because they came into the office in the morning vs if they telework the whole day?

My DH is private sector and mostly works from home. But sometimes he commutes in for some morning meetings / half day conference or whatever. Then drives home at lunch and wraps up his day as usual teleworking. Seems like nbd, no different than popping out for some lunch time errands and coming back home.

But his boss only cares if he shows up for meetings and gets his work done. He makes more than my fed attorney salary and isn’t micromanaged re: his leave use or where he works. He’s a director now but even before that he was given a lot of flexibility.

Many private sector jobs don’t micromanage time the way federal government does. My DH is private sector and no one cares if he works 37 hours one week and 47 hours the next as long as he gets his work done. He also isn’t forced to take a 30 minute lunch.

That’s very different from the feds who work from 6:30-3 and refuse to take meetings after 3. Even if we need to talk to people in different time zones.

Good for them. Draw the line. Why should the Fed employees be flexible when the admin has removed all flexibility that benefits the employee?
In the example above, that private sector worker has flexibility. So sure, he’s willing to be flexible when it benefits his employer and take the later meeting.
I used to be that way too - flexible when needed - when we had telework.

We have Maxiflex and comp. It’s just a d*ck move to have unusual work hours and then not have the courtesy to use the flexibility we actually do still have.

Where do you have maxi flex and comp? Staff at my agency are on fixed schedules—even those that telework part of the day. And all staff are required to work 8 hours between certain time of the day. I do not want or need people to work more than 8 hours a day but I do expect them to actually work during those 8 hours, or at least be available to work! Beyond that is a management issue—deadlines that require overtime aren’t the employee’s problem.

It’s not overtime. It’s maintaining a schedule that allows you to have normal contact with your coworkers and external parties. Which means no, you cannot sign off at 3 and refuse to do anything after that point. most of these 3pm people are also dishonest about their lunch period. I’m fine with people having an early schedule for family or commute reasons but for ffs, if we get telework back, yes I do expect them to get on Maxiflex and be available for calls at 3pm from time to time.

Our agency has core hours when employees must work a minimum number of hours. They end at 3:30 I think. It’s really fine—as long as people are actually working when they’re in the office or at home it isn’t hard to accommodate at all. Keeping most meetings between 9 and 3:30 is totally feesible. Anything after 3:30 can usually be addressed by email or wait.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, and it is terrible. We had been going in 2x a week and 1x a week, respectively, so one parent was always home to walk the dog and pick up kids. Now our children are in beforecare as well as aftercare and we have a dog walker so we can be on Zoom or Teams meetings all day in our offices.

So who watched your kids while you were teleworking? You can’t supervise kids who belong in daycare and work at the same time. So you either ripped off the taxpayer with illegal childcare, or neglected your kids.

DP but even little kids don’t need to be constantly minded. They can be trained to entertain themselves for an hour or two between 3:30 and when parents finish working. That is not neglect.

A lot of families were hurt by RTO not because of needing actual childcare, but because of transportation issues.

But that’s their own fault. Nobody is forcing these people to live hours away from the office. Most people bought homes pre-pandemic and have plenty of equity to move closer to work. They’re just too lazy, holding onto that 2% rate when they should realistically move and let somebody else enjoy that house. And that’s what it is, a house. It’s not a HoMe or a “forever home” or some other BS that’s been sold by realtors since 2020 to get people to overpay for housing.

Live near where you work, with an easy commute. This is the #1 rule for finding housing and how to live a life without being stressed out. Too many people moved far away when they were only on a telework agreement (not remote) and now they’re complaining about their own poor decisions.

And many people started fully-remote jobs, or their agencies were the ones that moved, not them. My (former) agency pushed RTO and MDRs hard for fully remote workers. Now they are failing to accomplish the goals of the political leadership because most people left. Fully remote work let them make hires who otherwise they wouldn't have been able to get.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, and it is terrible. We had been going in 2x a week and 1x a week, respectively, so one parent was always home to walk the dog and pick up kids. Now our children are in beforecare as well as aftercare and we have a dog walker so we can be on Zoom or Teams meetings all day in our offices.

So who watched your kids while you were teleworking? You can’t supervise kids who belong in daycare and work at the same time. So you either ripped off the taxpayer with illegal childcare, or neglected your kids.

DP but even little kids don’t need to be constantly minded. They can be trained to entertain themselves for an hour or two between 3:30 and when parents finish working. That is not neglect.

A lot of families were hurt by RTO not because of needing actual childcare, but because of transportation issues.

But that’s their own fault. Nobody is forcing these people to live hours away from the office. Most people bought homes pre-pandemic and have plenty of equity to move closer to work. They’re just too lazy, holding onto that 2% rate when they should realistically move and let somebody else enjoy that house. And that’s what it is, a house. It’s not a HoMe or a “forever home” or some other BS that’s been sold by realtors since 2020 to get people to overpay for housing.

Live near where you work, with an easy commute. This is the #1 rule for finding housing and how to live a life without being stressed out. Too many people moved far away when they were only on a telework agreement (not remote) and now they’re complaining about their own poor decisions.

Feds can't afford a close-in SFH on even a GS15 salary.

Yes, you absolutely can afford a SFH on a GS 15 salary. Even if you work in DC, you can find a SFH on the red line and not even worry about driving.

People are just dumb, refuse to change, and then sit around and complain while being miserable in traffic.

No sympathy for them.

My kids are in their 20s. Can I telework??? I will save the tps my transit subsidy ($300/month) and the space for my cube. I successfully did it for 14 years before 2025.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, and it is terrible. We had been going in 2x a week and 1x a week, respectively, so one parent was always home to walk the dog and pick up kids. Now our children are in beforecare as well as aftercare and we have a dog walker so we can be on Zoom or Teams meetings all day in our offices.

So who watched your kids while you were teleworking? You can’t supervise kids who belong in daycare and work at the same time. So you either ripped off the taxpayer with illegal childcare, or neglected your kids.

DP but even little kids don’t need to be constantly minded. They can be trained to entertain themselves for an hour or two between 3:30 and when parents finish working. That is not neglect.

A lot of families were hurt by RTO not because of needing actual childcare, but because of transportation issues.

But that’s their own fault. Nobody is forcing these people to live hours away from the office. Most people bought homes pre-pandemic and have plenty of equity to move closer to work. They’re just too lazy, holding onto that 2% rate when they should realistically move and let somebody else enjoy that house. And that’s what it is, a house. It’s not a HoMe or a “forever home” or some other BS that’s been sold by realtors since 2020 to get people to overpay for housing.

Live near where you work, with an easy commute. This is the #1 rule for finding housing and how to live a life without being stressed out. Too many people moved far away when they were only on a telework agreement (not remote) and now they’re complaining about their own poor decisions.

Feds can't afford a close-in SFH on even a GS15 salary.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, and it is terrible. We had been going in 2x a week and 1x a week, respectively, so one parent was always home to walk the dog and pick up kids. Now our children are in beforecare as well as aftercare and we have a dog walker so we can be on Zoom or Teams meetings all day in our offices.

So who watched your kids while you were teleworking? You can’t supervise kids who belong in daycare and work at the same time. So you either ripped off the taxpayer with illegal childcare, or neglected your kids.

DP but even little kids don’t need to be constantly minded. They can be trained to entertain themselves for an hour or two between 3:30 and when parents finish working. That is not neglect.

A lot of families were hurt by RTO not because of needing actual childcare, but because of transportation issues.

Yeah no thanks. Leaving at 2 so you can “work” from 3:30-4:30 while caring for your young kids is not feasible.

Exactly. These people aren’t working. They’re taking the afternoon off, on the clock, to watch their kids. It’s not fair and has effectively ruined telework for everyone else.

Yup. While I think we need to return to rational telework flexibility, people need to remember that childcare has always been something we needed to arrange and pay for.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, and it is terrible. We had been going in 2x a week and 1x a week, respectively, so one parent was always home to walk the dog and pick up kids. Now our children are in beforecare as well as aftercare and we have a dog walker so we can be on Zoom or Teams meetings all day in our offices.

So who watched your kids while you were teleworking? You can’t supervise kids who belong in daycare and work at the same time. So you either ripped off the taxpayer with illegal childcare, or neglected your kids.

DP but even little kids don’t need to be constantly minded. They can be trained to entertain themselves for an hour or two between 3:30 and when parents finish working. That is not neglect.

A lot of families were hurt by RTO not because of needing actual childcare, but because of transportation issues.

Yeah no thanks. Leaving at 2 so you can “work” from 3:30-4:30 while caring for your young kids is not feasible.

Exactly. These people aren’t working. They’re taking the afternoon off, on the clock, to watch their kids. It’s not fair and has effectively ruined telework for everyone else.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, and it is terrible. We had been going in 2x a week and 1x a week, respectively, so one parent was always home to walk the dog and pick up kids. Now our children are in beforecare as well as aftercare and we have a dog walker so we can be on Zoom or Teams meetings all day in our offices.

So who watched your kids while you were teleworking? You can’t supervise kids who belong in daycare and work at the same time. So you either ripped off the taxpayer with illegal childcare, or neglected your kids.

DP but even little kids don’t need to be constantly minded. They can be trained to entertain themselves for an hour or two between 3:30 and when parents finish working. That is not neglect.

A lot of families were hurt by RTO not because of needing actual childcare, but because of transportation issues.

But that’s their own fault. Nobody is forcing these people to live hours away from the office. Most people bought homes pre-pandemic and have plenty of equity to move closer to work. They’re just too lazy, holding onto that 2% rate when they should realistically move and let somebody else enjoy that house. And that’s what it is, a house. It’s not a HoMe or a “forever home” or some other BS that’s been sold by realtors since 2020 to get people to overpay for housing.

Live near where you work, with an easy commute. This is the #1 rule for finding housing and how to live a life without being stressed out. Too many people moved far away when they were only on a telework agreement (not remote) and now they’re complaining about their own poor decisions.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, and it is terrible. We had been going in 2x a week and 1x a week, respectively, so one parent was always home to walk the dog and pick up kids. Now our children are in beforecare as well as aftercare and we have a dog walker so we can be on Zoom or Teams meetings all day in our offices.

So who watched your kids while you were teleworking? You can’t supervise kids who belong in daycare and work at the same time. So you either ripped off the taxpayer with illegal childcare, or neglected your kids.

DP but even little kids don’t need to be constantly minded. They can be trained to entertain themselves for an hour or two between 3:30 and when parents finish working. That is not neglect.

A lot of families were hurt by RTO not because of needing actual childcare, but because of transportation issues.

Yeah no thanks. Leaving at 2 so you can “work” from 3:30-4:30 while caring for your young kids is not feasible.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, and it is terrible. We had been going in 2x a week and 1x a week, respectively, so one parent was always home to walk the dog and pick up kids. Now our children are in beforecare as well as aftercare and we have a dog walker so we can be on Zoom or Teams meetings all day in our offices.

So who watched your kids while you were teleworking? You can’t supervise kids who belong in daycare and work at the same time. So you either ripped off the taxpayer with illegal childcare, or neglected your kids.

DP but even little kids don’t need to be constantly minded. They can be trained to entertain themselves for an hour or two between 3:30 and when parents finish working. That is not neglect.

A lot of families were hurt by RTO not because of needing actual childcare, but because of transportation issues.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Split schedule is my dream. My oldest is having trouble at aftercare and is begging to be a walker. If I could just come home and telework 3-5pm that would be life changing. I have been debating quitting over it.

You will not be working between 3-5pm because you will take care of your kids. Split schedule just allows part-time with a full-time pay.

This is an ancient and boring debate. I always assume the people who start it didn't do much actual parenting of their own kids or they'd realize how dumb they sound.

Plenty of kids are old enough to be alone in the house but can't physically get there without a ride (we don't have a bus). Or they are fine to do homework if someone's in the house for accountability (e.g., an adult would hear the TV turn on) but don't need interaction.

"ancient and boring" does not mean it is not true. Your assumption is wrong.

DP and they are not wrong. In elementary school my kids went to aftercare and I picked them up after work. After the pandemic, they were in middle or high school. The middle schooler was at a school with no buses. With flexibility, I could pick them up at 3 to take them home and then go back to work. They just needed the ride, they didn't need me minding them. But I didn't claim to work 3-5, I worked 3:30-5:30 and sometimes later. I can get a lot done in the evening (night owl). I am also lucky that the commute from work to home and from the school to home were all short.

The issue with this is telework needs to be at the benefit of the taxpayer/government. It’s not there as a babysitting service. Too many people abused this and now we’re in the predicament we’re in now. Like you shouldn’t be cancelling childcare because you’re working from home, for instance. They can and will inspect your workplace, and if you have kids running around all day, you’re either neglecting them or neglecting your work, which is fraud.

So telework needs to save the taxpayer money, make work more efficient, etc. If you try to spin it as “well it’s easier for me to watch/pickup my kids” then you’re never going to get that back.

DP. Where is your proof of this?
Like PPs mentioned, there are IT logs. Management is able to tell is someone is not working when they say they are, regardless of the work location.