Honestly, it does not make sense to allow people to borrow up to 200k to study nursing. The median salary for an NP is 130k, so there is no circumstance where it is financially responsible for someone with that salary to borrow 200k. Social workers have terrible salaries and the median person with a DSW only makes 80-90k each year. People with studying social work i grad school should not be allowed to borrow money at all.

This is absolutely going to decimate rural hospitals.

Also social workers.

Title 34 Subtitle B Chapter VI Part 668 Subpart A § 668.2

Professional degree: A degree that signifies both completion of the academic requirements for beginning practice in a given profession and a level of professional skill beyond that normally required for a bachelor's degree. Professional licensure is also generally required. Examples of a professional degree include but are not limited to Pharmacy (Pharm.D.), Dentistry (D.D.S. or D.M.D.), Veterinary Medicine (D.V.M.), Chiropractic (D.C. or D.C.M.), Law (L.L.B. or J.D.), Medicine (M.D.), Optometry (O.D.), Osteopathic Medicine (D.O.), Podiatry (D.P.M., D.P., or Pod.D.), and Theology (M.Div., or M.H.L.).

Seems to me the regulatory definition wouldn't allow them to make this change without a rule-making process, unless someone who knows more about policy guidance vs CFR can explain.

This is interesting because there is an ongoing battle between physicians and nurse practitioners over scope creep, with NPs lobbying more and more to be able to work without physician supervision and physicians pushing back and highlighting examples in the training gap between the two and NPs arguing that they have way more clinical hours than an MD (but ignoring board certification training).

I wonder how theology gets in there.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can kind of see nurses since it is a BS degree. But physician assistant and nurse practioner degrees are professional degrees!

Nurse here. The issue isn’t for a BSN, it’s for nurses pursing graduate school in order to become NPs, midwives, or CRNAs. And unless you have a well off family, it’s going to be hard to shell out money for grad school. This isn’t about going after college costs. It’s about limiting who can pursue advanced degrees.

I am actually worried about the 200,000 cap on doctors. Totally limiting who can pursue advanced degrees. why?

I imagine that those who cannot afford the USA university costs will go to the Caribbean and obtain a medical degree. Alternatively, the US will continue imported doctors from India and Bangladesh. Crazy right?

How stupid are you?
The Caribbean school are MORE expensive than US schools.

Here is the main one: St. George's. Tuition is $437K plus living expenses estimated to be $140IK. So you better have $600K for medical school.
Americans who go to the Caribbean are uniformly wealthy.

https://myuniversity.sgu.edu/external/pages/fin-aid-md-student-estimated-cost-of-attendance?_gl=1*1t0v59q*_up*MQ..*_gs*MQ..*_gcl_aw*R0NMLjE3NjM2Nzc2MzEuQ2p3S0NBaUFsZnZJQmhBNkVpd0FjRXJweWFHLS02UXpsSl93blNtbTVydlM1NGl3OXdSSEFxd3d3cnhLalh6d2JnbmNYcWo5SnN5UzN4b0Nsc01RQXZEX0J3RQ..*_gcl_dc*R0NMLjE3NjM2Nzc2MzEuQ2p3S0NBaUFsZnZJQmhBNkVpd0FjRXJweWFHLS02UXpsSl93blNtbTVydlM1NGl3OXdSSEFxd3d3cnhLalh6d2JnbmNYcWo5SnN5UzN4b0Nsc01RQXZEX0J3RQ..*_gcl_au*NjI3NTY0OTE2LjE3NjM2Nzc0Mjc.*FPAU*NjI3NTY0OTE2LjE3NjM2Nzc0Mjc.*_ga*MTA4MDg3NDMxNS4xNzYzNjc3NDIz*_ga_NJTVX0EXEY*czE3NjM2Nzc0MjIkbzEkZzEkdDE3NjM2Nzc1NTAkajYwJGwwJGg4NjgwOTk1Nzg.*_fplc*OTRpM2FvWG1wQ0VNMEMlMkJVNmpuYTU0eHk3MDdjNVElMkJIRVklMkY1VkgwYUlqVnBMVzJ2V2F2MktxV0dMU0FpNzJqYXBGRjhNZzZTS2lLSThIaFA4OGg0dktZM0toTUVQbUlLdVhDeUppZndYSzl2bUtDR1E2JTJGREc3bkZubmh1dWclM0QlM0Q.&gclid=CjwKCAiAlfvIBhA6EiwAcErpyaG--6QzlJ_wnSmm5rvS54iw9wRHAqwwwrxKjXzwbgncXqj9JsyS3xoClsMQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds&gbraid=0AAAAACoykntL9A7T_hAnHZbjY85WZOP7T

Anonymous wrote:But should people be forced to go $200k in debt to become a NP? Maybe we should figure out a better way to fund this.

Why would a highly paid professional have a free or cheap degree?

But should people be forced to go $200k in debt to become a NP? Maybe we should figure out a better way to fund this.

People, this is about graduate degrees to become nurse practitioners. And if that is no longer a pathway open to anyone but the wealthy then fewer people will become nurses period. And most nurses put in 1-5 (or more) years as hospital nurses on their way to becoming NPs so your labor pool of hospital nurses will plummet.

Right now the tuition at Hopkins to go from being an BSN RN to an NP is $60K/year x 3 years or $180K (plus living expenses).

So unless you have $180K cash plus living expenses for 3 years, no becoming an NP.

Anonymous wrote:Hello people, I think you all are doing some faux rage here. The issue is there are two types of nurses, one that requires the 2-year degree which isn't really professional. That's more of a trade like kind of a certificate and then there's the 4-year degree nurse which is a bachelor's that is a professional. So please stop with this woman. This woman that blah blah blah feminism crap that is not what is going on. Thank you

Can you guys stop using “faux rage”? It’s not faux. We are not talking about associate or Bachelor’s level nursing. A BSN doesn’t just cover skills like a trade. There are all the science pre-reqs and then pathophysiology and pharmacology, etc. In any event, this is about graduate level nursing.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No 18-year-old should ever dig themselves a $200k hole to become a nurse, or anything else for that matter.

- dad of ICU nurse

reading comprehension much?

Much? I don’t think people have said that in 25 years.

perhaps we've hit another bad patch of poor readers

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What's interesting is that most white nurses I know are MAGA. Maybe this will shut down the mean MAGA white girl to nurse pipeline I've seen lately.

Where are you located? I’ve never met a MAGA nurse except my one classmate who lives in FL, go figure.

I’m in NoVa. I wish it weren’t true but yes, there are a lot of MAGA nurses. Mostly older, white, and Christian. After Covid, I don’t get it.

Every white nurse and nurse that goes into sales (not just white) is totally maga. It makes sense .

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What's interesting is that most white nurses I know are MAGA. Maybe this will shut down the mean MAGA white girl to nurse pipeline I've seen lately.

Where are you located? I’ve never met a MAGA nurse except my one classmate who lives in FL, go figure.

I’m in NoVa. I wish it weren’t true but yes, there are a lot of MAGA nurses. Mostly older, white, and Christian. After Covid, I don’t get it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No 18-year-old should ever dig themselves a $200k hole to become a nurse, or anything else for that matter.

- dad of ICU nurse

reading comprehension much?

Much? I don’t think people have said that in 25 years.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hello people, I think you all are doing some faux rage here. The issue is there are two types of nurses, one that requires the 2-year degree which isn't really professional. That's more of a trade like kind of a certificate and then there's the 4-year degree nurse which is a bachelor's that is a professional. So please stop with this woman. This woman that blah blah blah feminism crap that is not what is going on. Thank you

Take a look at some of the other occupations on the list. These are professions that are largely populated by women and minorities.

Education
Social work
Public health
Physician assistant
Occupational therapy
Physical therapy
Audiology
Speech language pathology
Counseling & therapy

This is not a coincidence. “Blah blah blah feminism crap” doesn’t change the fact that this is designed to put up financial barriers for women to get continuing education. Not to mention making the current staffing shortages in healthcare and education much worse.

Do you have a link to this list? Or did I miss it up thread?