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Anonymous wrote:I love the idea of the age group determination date being August 1st. Whatever age you are by August 1st is the age group you swim in for that summer season.
So if you turn 9 on August 1st or anytime before that, you swim in 9-10s that whole summer. It makes sense.

Most of the girls in the "8&U" age group who made coach's long course and individual all stars this year were already 9 years old or days/weeks away. The fastest "8&U" girl who is breaking a bunch of MCSL records literally had her birthday announced on the individual all star meet day. Before all you keyboard warriors come at me like OMG ARE YOU A STALKER?! HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THEIR AGES?!...this is publicly available information online. If you don't like this, write to you're representative to get legislation in place. It's utterly creepy how publicly available all of our swimmers' info is on MeetMobile etc etc.

Let's not kid ourselves either about "oh this is just for fun!!! It's summer swim you troll!!!! How dare you take this from the children?!?!". I'd say 99% of the 8&U girls who made coach's long course or individual all stars are year-round club swimmers. So they're used to the year-round rule which is....you age up on your birthday. Changing it to August 1st would give ACTUAL 8&Us that aren't club swimmers a chance to make those events.

Changing the date would advantage different kids, but it wouldn’t change the huge advantage that club swimmers have. Why are you confusing those things?

Why even let club swimmers do summer swim at all then?!

I am the PP you quoted. I don’t object to club swimmers swimming, as long as they get that it’s a team rec sport and entirely different from club swimming.

But the PP I quoted seemed to be saying that the advantage that club swimmers have somehow justifies changing the age when the two things are completely separate.

The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others. I have a kid with a late July birthday, he has an advantage in Summer Swim, a disadvantage in his favorite sport which has a August 1 cut off, a bigger disadvantage in lacrosse where they play by age and lots of kids are redshirted, and unclear status in soccer right now because the ages seem to be changing. It just is what it is. But I don’t go demanding that the rules change in any of those sports. Because I am not a poor sport.

"The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others."

Except....in club swim. There is no cut off date. You swim as the age you are. You age up on your birthday. That doesn't advantage or disadvantage any kids. It just is what it is. Everyone knows it and accepts it.

I fully support summer swim kids aging up on their birthdays. Someone picking a random arbitrary date and everyone sticking by it for years and years is ludicrous to me. It's like the people that say, "Oh this is how we've always done it! It's tradition!"
A tradition that makes no sense.

The birthday rule does disadvantage certain kids in club swim because the big championship meets are in March every year. So kids who age up right before that have to swim against kids in the championship meets almost two years older (or almost a year older in their interim year).

Right. But that disadvantage is based on the date of your birth, something that cannot be changed and is totally legitimate.....not a random arbitrary age up date picked by some person 25 years ago.

My DC has a late February birthday and they already know this is a huge disadvantage in club swim. It is what it is.

The fact that the big meets are in march is definitely random and arbitrary.

There are also big meets in December, May and July. If you’re a February birthday kid, the winter champs meets are your focus. Also by the time a club swimmer is in HS the timing of their birthday matters a lot less.

The Long Course ones are an after thought for lots of kids because of summer swim and vacations. Many don’t even go. The winter ones are not LSC wide. What big meets are in May? Zones? Let’s not pretend that short course AGC isn’t the big meet of the year.

The fact that the big winter champs meets are not LSC wide doesn’t make them not important meets. NCI has super fast swimmers from all over the east coast, sometimes it’s faster than SC champs in March. Super sectionals are in May. The fact that your particular kid doesn’t care about LC because of summer swim and vacations is a personal choice. You’re just making a bunch of excuses for why your kid is disadvantaged.

My kid isn’t disadvantaged for the short course AGCs. But i recognize others are.

Swimming your actual age is the most fair way to handle club swim. Otherwise you have absurdities like a kid that turned 13 back on January 2nd dominating the 11-12 age group at a March champs meet, or a kid that turned 13 on May 2nd dominating the 11-12 age group at the July champs meet.

I don’t see how that’s any more fair. Kids don’t magically mature on their birthdays.

It is absolutely the fairest way to do it. There has to be a cutoff, it has to be somewhere, and it’s stupid to have 13 year olds competing in 11-12 events months after they have turned 13. Swim is an individual sport so there are none of the team consistency and chemistry arguments that apply to team sports that use a cutoff date as opposed to the individual athlete’s birthday.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the idea of the age group determination date being August 1st. Whatever age you are by August 1st is the age group you swim in for that summer season.
So if you turn 9 on August 1st or anytime before that, you swim in 9-10s that whole summer. It makes sense.

Most of the girls in the "8&U" age group who made coach's long course and individual all stars this year were already 9 years old or days/weeks away. The fastest "8&U" girl who is breaking a bunch of MCSL records literally had her birthday announced on the individual all star meet day. Before all you keyboard warriors come at me like OMG ARE YOU A STALKER?! HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THEIR AGES?!...this is publicly available information online. If you don't like this, write to you're representative to get legislation in place. It's utterly creepy how publicly available all of our swimmers' info is on MeetMobile etc etc.

Let's not kid ourselves either about "oh this is just for fun!!! It's summer swim you troll!!!! How dare you take this from the children?!?!". I'd say 99% of the 8&U girls who made coach's long course or individual all stars are year-round club swimmers. So they're used to the year-round rule which is....you age up on your birthday. Changing it to August 1st would give ACTUAL 8&Us that aren't club swimmers a chance to make those events.

Changing the date would advantage different kids, but it wouldn’t change the huge advantage that club swimmers have. Why are you confusing those things?

Why even let club swimmers do summer swim at all then?!

I am the PP you quoted. I don’t object to club swimmers swimming, as long as they get that it’s a team rec sport and entirely different from club swimming.

But the PP I quoted seemed to be saying that the advantage that club swimmers have somehow justifies changing the age when the two things are completely separate.

The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others. I have a kid with a late July birthday, he has an advantage in Summer Swim, a disadvantage in his favorite sport which has a August 1 cut off, a bigger disadvantage in lacrosse where they play by age and lots of kids are redshirted, and unclear status in soccer right now because the ages seem to be changing. It just is what it is. But I don’t go demanding that the rules change in any of those sports. Because I am not a poor sport.

"The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others."

Except....in club swim. There is no cut off date. You swim as the age you are. You age up on your birthday. That doesn't advantage or disadvantage any kids. It just is what it is. Everyone knows it and accepts it.

I fully support summer swim kids aging up on their birthdays. Someone picking a random arbitrary date and everyone sticking by it for years and years is ludicrous to me. It's like the people that say, "Oh this is how we've always done it! It's tradition!"
A tradition that makes no sense.

The birthday rule does disadvantage certain kids in club swim because the big championship meets are in March every year. So kids who age up right before that have to swim against kids in the championship meets almost two years older (or almost a year older in their interim year).

Right. But that disadvantage is based on the date of your birth, something that cannot be changed and is totally legitimate.....not a random arbitrary age up date picked by some person 25 years ago.

My DC has a late February birthday and they already know this is a huge disadvantage in club swim. It is what it is.

The fact that the big meets are in march is definitely random and arbitrary.

There are also big meets in December, May and July. If you’re a February birthday kid, the winter champs meets are your focus. Also by the time a club swimmer is in HS the timing of their birthday matters a lot less.

The Long Course ones are an after thought for lots of kids because of summer swim and vacations. Many don’t even go. The winter ones are not LSC wide. What big meets are in May? Zones? Let’s not pretend that short course AGC isn’t the big meet of the year.

The fact that the big winter champs meets are not LSC wide doesn’t make them not important meets. NCI has super fast swimmers from all over the east coast, sometimes it’s faster than SC champs in March. Super sectionals are in May. The fact that your particular kid doesn’t care about LC because of summer swim and vacations is a personal choice. You’re just making a bunch of excuses for why your kid is disadvantaged.

My kid isn’t disadvantaged for the short course AGCs. But i recognize others are.

Swimming your actual age is the most fair way to handle club swim. Otherwise you have absurdities like a kid that turned 13 back on January 2nd dominating the 11-12 age group at a March champs meet, or a kid that turned 13 on May 2nd dominating the 11-12 age group at the July champs meet.

I don’t see how that’s any more fair. Kids don’t magically mature on their birthdays.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the idea of the age group determination date being August 1st. Whatever age you are by August 1st is the age group you swim in for that summer season.
So if you turn 9 on August 1st or anytime before that, you swim in 9-10s that whole summer. It makes sense.

Most of the girls in the "8&U" age group who made coach's long course and individual all stars this year were already 9 years old or days/weeks away. The fastest "8&U" girl who is breaking a bunch of MCSL records literally had her birthday announced on the individual all star meet day. Before all you keyboard warriors come at me like OMG ARE YOU A STALKER?! HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THEIR AGES?!...this is publicly available information online. If you don't like this, write to you're representative to get legislation in place. It's utterly creepy how publicly available all of our swimmers' info is on MeetMobile etc etc.

Let's not kid ourselves either about "oh this is just for fun!!! It's summer swim you troll!!!! How dare you take this from the children?!?!". I'd say 99% of the 8&U girls who made coach's long course or individual all stars are year-round club swimmers. So they're used to the year-round rule which is....you age up on your birthday. Changing it to August 1st would give ACTUAL 8&Us that aren't club swimmers a chance to make those events.

Changing the date would advantage different kids, but it wouldn’t change the huge advantage that club swimmers have. Why are you confusing those things?

Why even let club swimmers do summer swim at all then?!

I am the PP you quoted. I don’t object to club swimmers swimming, as long as they get that it’s a team rec sport and entirely different from club swimming.

But the PP I quoted seemed to be saying that the advantage that club swimmers have somehow justifies changing the age when the two things are completely separate.

The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others. I have a kid with a late July birthday, he has an advantage in Summer Swim, a disadvantage in his favorite sport which has a August 1 cut off, a bigger disadvantage in lacrosse where they play by age and lots of kids are redshirted, and unclear status in soccer right now because the ages seem to be changing. It just is what it is. But I don’t go demanding that the rules change in any of those sports. Because I am not a poor sport.

+1. Summer swim is what? Six weeks? Are we really going to kick freshly minted 9-year olds out of their age groups and relays in mid July and make them start swimming 50s with kids who are nearly two full years older? How is that fair?

I have no problem with the age up rule in club swim. Everyone is going to have a down period as they have birthdays, no one gets singled out. But for summer swim you are really penalizing the summer birthday kids. These kids get penalized enough. June 1 is fine.

I really don’t care about the age up issue, but the people that insist the rule remain age on June 1st are no different than the people arguing it should be age on August 1st. The only difference is which group of kids is being disadvantaged. It’s 2 sides of the same coin.

Well yes and no. Accepting something the way it is, even if it advantages your child is different than accepting when your child is advantaged and throwing a tantrum when someone else's child is advantaged. The latter is what the people trying to change a date that's been used for 25 years are doing, and rewarding their poor sportsmanship would be horrible. It's no difference than buying your kid candy because they throw a fit in the checkout line.

😂 and how do you think the date ended up being changed 25 years ago? Come off your high horse July birthday mom.

Sure. Will you help me down, October mom?

And changing it to August 1 could conceivably lock a number of swimmers out of swimming their senior year. It’s pretty common for people to hold back their summer birthday boys around here.

I have no dog in this fight. My kid has a spring birthday and doesn’t care that much about summer swim. I just can’t comprehend that people on both sides of this debate cannot see that they arguing the same thing, just for a different result. You’re also really reaching with the redshirted summer birthday boy argument, that does not tip the scales to June 1 being more fair. Do we really need 19 year olds being able to swim as 18 year olds in summer rec league swim?

It’s true that a change would advantage or disadvantage a different group of kids. But June 1 is still a very odd date to pick. It’s two weeks before the first meet of the season. Using that date means there are kids who don’t swim their actual age at any meet the entire season. If you are going to pick a date before the season even starts, then why not January 1?

+1
I agree. We know someone who turned 9 on June 2nd. They swam as an 8&U the entire summer.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the idea of the age group determination date being August 1st. Whatever age you are by August 1st is the age group you swim in for that summer season.
So if you turn 9 on August 1st or anytime before that, you swim in 9-10s that whole summer. It makes sense.

Most of the girls in the "8&U" age group who made coach's long course and individual all stars this year were already 9 years old or days/weeks away. The fastest "8&U" girl who is breaking a bunch of MCSL records literally had her birthday announced on the individual all star meet day. Before all you keyboard warriors come at me like OMG ARE YOU A STALKER?! HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THEIR AGES?!...this is publicly available information online. If you don't like this, write to you're representative to get legislation in place. It's utterly creepy how publicly available all of our swimmers' info is on MeetMobile etc etc.

Let's not kid ourselves either about "oh this is just for fun!!! It's summer swim you troll!!!! How dare you take this from the children?!?!". I'd say 99% of the 8&U girls who made coach's long course or individual all stars are year-round club swimmers. So they're used to the year-round rule which is....you age up on your birthday. Changing it to August 1st would give ACTUAL 8&Us that aren't club swimmers a chance to make those events.

Changing the date would advantage different kids, but it wouldn’t change the huge advantage that club swimmers have. Why are you confusing those things?

Why even let club swimmers do summer swim at all then?!

I am the PP you quoted. I don’t object to club swimmers swimming, as long as they get that it’s a team rec sport and entirely different from club swimming.

But the PP I quoted seemed to be saying that the advantage that club swimmers have somehow justifies changing the age when the two things are completely separate.

The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others. I have a kid with a late July birthday, he has an advantage in Summer Swim, a disadvantage in his favorite sport which has a August 1 cut off, a bigger disadvantage in lacrosse where they play by age and lots of kids are redshirted, and unclear status in soccer right now because the ages seem to be changing. It just is what it is. But I don’t go demanding that the rules change in any of those sports. Because I am not a poor sport.

"The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others."

Except....in club swim. There is no cut off date. You swim as the age you are. You age up on your birthday. That doesn't advantage or disadvantage any kids. It just is what it is. Everyone knows it and accepts it.

I fully support summer swim kids aging up on their birthdays. Someone picking a random arbitrary date and everyone sticking by it for years and years is ludicrous to me. It's like the people that say, "Oh this is how we've always done it! It's tradition!"
A tradition that makes no sense.

The birthday rule does disadvantage certain kids in club swim because the big championship meets are in March every year. So kids who age up right before that have to swim against kids in the championship meets almost two years older (or almost a year older in their interim year).

Right. But that disadvantage is based on the date of your birth, something that cannot be changed and is totally legitimate.....not a random arbitrary age up date picked by some person 25 years ago.

My DC has a late February birthday and they already know this is a huge disadvantage in club swim. It is what it is.

The fact that the big meets are in march is definitely random and arbitrary.

There are also big meets in December, May and July. If you’re a February birthday kid, the winter champs meets are your focus. Also by the time a club swimmer is in HS the timing of their birthday matters a lot less.

The Long Course ones are an after thought for lots of kids because of summer swim and vacations. Many don’t even go. The winter ones are not LSC wide. What big meets are in May? Zones? Let’s not pretend that short course AGC isn’t the big meet of the year.

The fact that the big winter champs meets are not LSC wide doesn’t make them not important meets. NCI has super fast swimmers from all over the east coast, sometimes it’s faster than SC champs in March. Super sectionals are in May. The fact that your particular kid doesn’t care about LC because of summer swim and vacations is a personal choice. You’re just making a bunch of excuses for why your kid is disadvantaged.

My kid isn’t disadvantaged for the short course AGCs. But i recognize others are.

Swimming your actual age is the most fair way to handle club swim. Otherwise you have absurdities like a kid that turned 13 back on January 2nd dominating the 11-12 age group at a March champs meet, or a kid that turned 13 on May 2nd dominating the 11-12 age group at the July champs meet.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the idea of the age group determination date being August 1st. Whatever age you are by August 1st is the age group you swim in for that summer season.
So if you turn 9 on August 1st or anytime before that, you swim in 9-10s that whole summer. It makes sense.

Most of the girls in the "8&U" age group who made coach's long course and individual all stars this year were already 9 years old or days/weeks away. The fastest "8&U" girl who is breaking a bunch of MCSL records literally had her birthday announced on the individual all star meet day. Before all you keyboard warriors come at me like OMG ARE YOU A STALKER?! HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THEIR AGES?!...this is publicly available information online. If you don't like this, write to you're representative to get legislation in place. It's utterly creepy how publicly available all of our swimmers' info is on MeetMobile etc etc.

Let's not kid ourselves either about "oh this is just for fun!!! It's summer swim you troll!!!! How dare you take this from the children?!?!". I'd say 99% of the 8&U girls who made coach's long course or individual all stars are year-round club swimmers. So they're used to the year-round rule which is....you age up on your birthday. Changing it to August 1st would give ACTUAL 8&Us that aren't club swimmers a chance to make those events.

Changing the date would advantage different kids, but it wouldn’t change the huge advantage that club swimmers have. Why are you confusing those things?

Why even let club swimmers do summer swim at all then?!

I am the PP you quoted. I don’t object to club swimmers swimming, as long as they get that it’s a team rec sport and entirely different from club swimming.

But the PP I quoted seemed to be saying that the advantage that club swimmers have somehow justifies changing the age when the two things are completely separate.

The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others. I have a kid with a late July birthday, he has an advantage in Summer Swim, a disadvantage in his favorite sport which has a August 1 cut off, a bigger disadvantage in lacrosse where they play by age and lots of kids are redshirted, and unclear status in soccer right now because the ages seem to be changing. It just is what it is. But I don’t go demanding that the rules change in any of those sports. Because I am not a poor sport.

+1. Summer swim is what? Six weeks? Are we really going to kick freshly minted 9-year olds out of their age groups and relays in mid July and make them start swimming 50s with kids who are nearly two full years older? How is that fair?

I have no problem with the age up rule in club swim. Everyone is going to have a down period as they have birthdays, no one gets singled out. But for summer swim you are really penalizing the summer birthday kids. These kids get penalized enough. June 1 is fine.

I really don’t care about the age up issue, but the people that insist the rule remain age on June 1st are no different than the people arguing it should be age on August 1st. The only difference is which group of kids is being disadvantaged. It’s 2 sides of the same coin.

Well yes and no. Accepting something the way it is, even if it advantages your child is different than accepting when your child is advantaged and throwing a tantrum when someone else's child is advantaged. The latter is what the people trying to change a date that's been used for 25 years are doing, and rewarding their poor sportsmanship would be horrible. It's no difference than buying your kid candy because they throw a fit in the checkout line.

😂 and how do you think the date ended up being changed 25 years ago? Come off your high horse July birthday mom.

Sure. Will you help me down, October mom?

And changing it to August 1 could conceivably lock a number of swimmers out of swimming their senior year. It’s pretty common for people to hold back their summer birthday boys around here.

I have no dog in this fight. My kid has a spring birthday and doesn’t care that much about summer swim. I just can’t comprehend that people on both sides of this debate cannot see that they arguing the same thing, just for a different result. You’re also really reaching with the redshirted summer birthday boy argument, that does not tip the scales to June 1 being more fair. Do we really need 19 year olds being able to swim as 18 year olds in summer rec league swim?

Totally agree. It is absolutely bonkers that KIDS WHO ARE IN COLLEGE can swim in summer swim as 18 year olds.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the idea of the age group determination date being August 1st. Whatever age you are by August 1st is the age group you swim in for that summer season.
So if you turn 9 on August 1st or anytime before that, you swim in 9-10s that whole summer. It makes sense.

Most of the girls in the "8&U" age group who made coach's long course and individual all stars this year were already 9 years old or days/weeks away. The fastest "8&U" girl who is breaking a bunch of MCSL records literally had her birthday announced on the individual all star meet day. Before all you keyboard warriors come at me like OMG ARE YOU A STALKER?! HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THEIR AGES?!...this is publicly available information online. If you don't like this, write to you're representative to get legislation in place. It's utterly creepy how publicly available all of our swimmers' info is on MeetMobile etc etc.

Let's not kid ourselves either about "oh this is just for fun!!! It's summer swim you troll!!!! How dare you take this from the children?!?!". I'd say 99% of the 8&U girls who made coach's long course or individual all stars are year-round club swimmers. So they're used to the year-round rule which is....you age up on your birthday. Changing it to August 1st would give ACTUAL 8&Us that aren't club swimmers a chance to make those events.

Changing the date would advantage different kids, but it wouldn’t change the huge advantage that club swimmers have. Why are you confusing those things?

Why even let club swimmers do summer swim at all then?!

I am the PP you quoted. I don’t object to club swimmers swimming, as long as they get that it’s a team rec sport and entirely different from club swimming.

But the PP I quoted seemed to be saying that the advantage that club swimmers have somehow justifies changing the age when the two things are completely separate.

The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others. I have a kid with a late July birthday, he has an advantage in Summer Swim, a disadvantage in his favorite sport which has a August 1 cut off, a bigger disadvantage in lacrosse where they play by age and lots of kids are redshirted, and unclear status in soccer right now because the ages seem to be changing. It just is what it is. But I don’t go demanding that the rules change in any of those sports. Because I am not a poor sport.

"The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others."

Except....in club swim. There is no cut off date. You swim as the age you are. You age up on your birthday. That doesn't advantage or disadvantage any kids. It just is what it is. Everyone knows it and accepts it.

I fully support summer swim kids aging up on their birthdays. Someone picking a random arbitrary date and everyone sticking by it for years and years is ludicrous to me. It's like the people that say, "Oh this is how we've always done it! It's tradition!"
A tradition that makes no sense.

The birthday rule does disadvantage certain kids in club swim because the big championship meets are in March every year. So kids who age up right before that have to swim against kids in the championship meets almost two years older (or almost a year older in their interim year).

Right. But that disadvantage is based on the date of your birth, something that cannot be changed and is totally legitimate.....not a random arbitrary age up date picked by some person 25 years ago.

My DC has a late February birthday and they already know this is a huge disadvantage in club swim. It is what it is.

The fact that the big meets are in march is definitely random and arbitrary.

There are also big meets in December, May and July. If you’re a February birthday kid, the winter champs meets are your focus. Also by the time a club swimmer is in HS the timing of their birthday matters a lot less.

The Long Course ones are an after thought for lots of kids because of summer swim and vacations. Many don’t even go. The winter ones are not LSC wide. What big meets are in May? Zones? Let’s not pretend that short course AGC isn’t the big meet of the year.

The fact that the big winter champs meets are not LSC wide doesn’t make them not important meets. NCI has super fast swimmers from all over the east coast, sometimes it’s faster than SC champs in March. Super sectionals are in May. The fact that your particular kid doesn’t care about LC because of summer swim and vacations is a personal choice. You’re just making a bunch of excuses for why your kid is disadvantaged.

My kid isn’t disadvantaged for the short course AGCs. But i recognize others are.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the idea of the age group determination date being August 1st. Whatever age you are by August 1st is the age group you swim in for that summer season.
So if you turn 9 on August 1st or anytime before that, you swim in 9-10s that whole summer. It makes sense.

Most of the girls in the "8&U" age group who made coach's long course and individual all stars this year were already 9 years old or days/weeks away. The fastest "8&U" girl who is breaking a bunch of MCSL records literally had her birthday announced on the individual all star meet day. Before all you keyboard warriors come at me like OMG ARE YOU A STALKER?! HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THEIR AGES?!...this is publicly available information online. If you don't like this, write to you're representative to get legislation in place. It's utterly creepy how publicly available all of our swimmers' info is on MeetMobile etc etc.

Let's not kid ourselves either about "oh this is just for fun!!! It's summer swim you troll!!!! How dare you take this from the children?!?!". I'd say 99% of the 8&U girls who made coach's long course or individual all stars are year-round club swimmers. So they're used to the year-round rule which is....you age up on your birthday. Changing it to August 1st would give ACTUAL 8&Us that aren't club swimmers a chance to make those events.

Changing the date would advantage different kids, but it wouldn’t change the huge advantage that club swimmers have. Why are you confusing those things?

Why even let club swimmers do summer swim at all then?!

I am the PP you quoted. I don’t object to club swimmers swimming, as long as they get that it’s a team rec sport and entirely different from club swimming.

But the PP I quoted seemed to be saying that the advantage that club swimmers have somehow justifies changing the age when the two things are completely separate.

The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others. I have a kid with a late July birthday, he has an advantage in Summer Swim, a disadvantage in his favorite sport which has a August 1 cut off, a bigger disadvantage in lacrosse where they play by age and lots of kids are redshirted, and unclear status in soccer right now because the ages seem to be changing. It just is what it is. But I don’t go demanding that the rules change in any of those sports. Because I am not a poor sport.

"The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others."

Except....in club swim. There is no cut off date. You swim as the age you are. You age up on your birthday. That doesn't advantage or disadvantage any kids. It just is what it is. Everyone knows it and accepts it.

I fully support summer swim kids aging up on their birthdays. Someone picking a random arbitrary date and everyone sticking by it for years and years is ludicrous to me. It's like the people that say, "Oh this is how we've always done it! It's tradition!"
A tradition that makes no sense.

The birthday rule does disadvantage certain kids in club swim because the big championship meets are in March every year. So kids who age up right before that have to swim against kids in the championship meets almost two years older (or almost a year older in their interim year).

Right. But that disadvantage is based on the date of your birth, something that cannot be changed and is totally legitimate.....not a random arbitrary age up date picked by some person 25 years ago.

My DC has a late February birthday and they already know this is a huge disadvantage in club swim. It is what it is.

The fact that the big meets are in march is definitely random and arbitrary.

There are also big meets in December, May and July. If you’re a February birthday kid, the winter champs meets are your focus. Also by the time a club swimmer is in HS the timing of their birthday matters a lot less.

The Long Course ones are an after thought for lots of kids because of summer swim and vacations. Many don’t even go. The winter ones are not LSC wide. What big meets are in May? Zones? Let’s not pretend that short course AGC isn’t the big meet of the year.

The fact that the big winter champs meets are not LSC wide doesn’t make them not important meets. NCI has super fast swimmers from all over the east coast, sometimes it’s faster than SC champs in March. Super sectionals are in May. The fact that your particular kid doesn’t care about LC because of summer swim and vacations is a personal choice. You’re just making a bunch of excuses for why your kid is disadvantaged.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the idea of the age group determination date being August 1st. Whatever age you are by August 1st is the age group you swim in for that summer season.
So if you turn 9 on August 1st or anytime before that, you swim in 9-10s that whole summer. It makes sense.

Most of the girls in the "8&U" age group who made coach's long course and individual all stars this year were already 9 years old or days/weeks away. The fastest "8&U" girl who is breaking a bunch of MCSL records literally had her birthday announced on the individual all star meet day. Before all you keyboard warriors come at me like OMG ARE YOU A STALKER?! HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THEIR AGES?!...this is publicly available information online. If you don't like this, write to you're representative to get legislation in place. It's utterly creepy how publicly available all of our swimmers' info is on MeetMobile etc etc.

Let's not kid ourselves either about "oh this is just for fun!!! It's summer swim you troll!!!! How dare you take this from the children?!?!". I'd say 99% of the 8&U girls who made coach's long course or individual all stars are year-round club swimmers. So they're used to the year-round rule which is....you age up on your birthday. Changing it to August 1st would give ACTUAL 8&Us that aren't club swimmers a chance to make those events.

Changing the date would advantage different kids, but it wouldn’t change the huge advantage that club swimmers have. Why are you confusing those things?

Why even let club swimmers do summer swim at all then?!

I am the PP you quoted. I don’t object to club swimmers swimming, as long as they get that it’s a team rec sport and entirely different from club swimming.

But the PP I quoted seemed to be saying that the advantage that club swimmers have somehow justifies changing the age when the two things are completely separate.

The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others. I have a kid with a late July birthday, he has an advantage in Summer Swim, a disadvantage in his favorite sport which has a August 1 cut off, a bigger disadvantage in lacrosse where they play by age and lots of kids are redshirted, and unclear status in soccer right now because the ages seem to be changing. It just is what it is. But I don’t go demanding that the rules change in any of those sports. Because I am not a poor sport.

"The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others."

Except....in club swim. There is no cut off date. You swim as the age you are. You age up on your birthday. That doesn't advantage or disadvantage any kids. It just is what it is. Everyone knows it and accepts it.

I fully support summer swim kids aging up on their birthdays. Someone picking a random arbitrary date and everyone sticking by it for years and years is ludicrous to me. It's like the people that say, "Oh this is how we've always done it! It's tradition!"
A tradition that makes no sense.

The birthday rule does disadvantage certain kids in club swim because the big championship meets are in March every year. So kids who age up right before that have to swim against kids in the championship meets almost two years older (or almost a year older in their interim year).

Right. But that disadvantage is based on the date of your birth, something that cannot be changed and is totally legitimate.....not a random arbitrary age up date picked by some person 25 years ago.

My DC has a late February birthday and they already know this is a huge disadvantage in club swim. It is what it is.

The fact that the big meets are in march is definitely random and arbitrary.

There are also big meets in December, May and July. If you’re a February birthday kid, the winter champs meets are your focus. Also by the time a club swimmer is in HS the timing of their birthday matters a lot less.

The Long Course ones are an after thought for lots of kids because of summer swim and vacations. Many don’t even go. The winter ones are not LSC wide. What big meets are in May? Zones? Let’s not pretend that short course AGC isn’t the big meet of the year.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the idea of the age group determination date being August 1st. Whatever age you are by August 1st is the age group you swim in for that summer season.
So if you turn 9 on August 1st or anytime before that, you swim in 9-10s that whole summer. It makes sense.

Most of the girls in the "8&U" age group who made coach's long course and individual all stars this year were already 9 years old or days/weeks away. The fastest "8&U" girl who is breaking a bunch of MCSL records literally had her birthday announced on the individual all star meet day. Before all you keyboard warriors come at me like OMG ARE YOU A STALKER?! HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THEIR AGES?!...this is publicly available information online. If you don't like this, write to you're representative to get legislation in place. It's utterly creepy how publicly available all of our swimmers' info is on MeetMobile etc etc.

Let's not kid ourselves either about "oh this is just for fun!!! It's summer swim you troll!!!! How dare you take this from the children?!?!". I'd say 99% of the 8&U girls who made coach's long course or individual all stars are year-round club swimmers. So they're used to the year-round rule which is....you age up on your birthday. Changing it to August 1st would give ACTUAL 8&Us that aren't club swimmers a chance to make those events.

Changing the date would advantage different kids, but it wouldn’t change the huge advantage that club swimmers have. Why are you confusing those things?

Why even let club swimmers do summer swim at all then?!

I am the PP you quoted. I don’t object to club swimmers swimming, as long as they get that it’s a team rec sport and entirely different from club swimming.

But the PP I quoted seemed to be saying that the advantage that club swimmers have somehow justifies changing the age when the two things are completely separate.

The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others. I have a kid with a late July birthday, he has an advantage in Summer Swim, a disadvantage in his favorite sport which has a August 1 cut off, a bigger disadvantage in lacrosse where they play by age and lots of kids are redshirted, and unclear status in soccer right now because the ages seem to be changing. It just is what it is. But I don’t go demanding that the rules change in any of those sports. Because I am not a poor sport.

"The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others."

Except....in club swim. There is no cut off date. You swim as the age you are. You age up on your birthday. That doesn't advantage or disadvantage any kids. It just is what it is. Everyone knows it and accepts it.

I fully support summer swim kids aging up on their birthdays. Someone picking a random arbitrary date and everyone sticking by it for years and years is ludicrous to me. It's like the people that say, "Oh this is how we've always done it! It's tradition!"
A tradition that makes no sense.

The birthday rule does disadvantage certain kids in club swim because the big championship meets are in March every year. So kids who age up right before that have to swim against kids in the championship meets almost two years older (or almost a year older in their interim year).

Right. But that disadvantage is based on the date of your birth, something that cannot be changed and is totally legitimate.....not a random arbitrary age up date picked by some person 25 years ago.

My DC has a late February birthday and they already know this is a huge disadvantage in club swim. It is what it is.

The fact that the big meets are in march is definitely random and arbitrary.

There are also big meets in December, May and July. If you’re a February birthday kid, the winter champs meets are your focus. Also by the time a club swimmer is in HS the timing of their birthday matters a lot less.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the idea of the age group determination date being August 1st. Whatever age you are by August 1st is the age group you swim in for that summer season.
So if you turn 9 on August 1st or anytime before that, you swim in 9-10s that whole summer. It makes sense.

Most of the girls in the "8&U" age group who made coach's long course and individual all stars this year were already 9 years old or days/weeks away. The fastest "8&U" girl who is breaking a bunch of MCSL records literally had her birthday announced on the individual all star meet day. Before all you keyboard warriors come at me like OMG ARE YOU A STALKER?! HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THEIR AGES?!...this is publicly available information online. If you don't like this, write to you're representative to get legislation in place. It's utterly creepy how publicly available all of our swimmers' info is on MeetMobile etc etc.

Let's not kid ourselves either about "oh this is just for fun!!! It's summer swim you troll!!!! How dare you take this from the children?!?!". I'd say 99% of the 8&U girls who made coach's long course or individual all stars are year-round club swimmers. So they're used to the year-round rule which is....you age up on your birthday. Changing it to August 1st would give ACTUAL 8&Us that aren't club swimmers a chance to make those events.

Changing the date would advantage different kids, but it wouldn’t change the huge advantage that club swimmers have. Why are you confusing those things?

Why even let club swimmers do summer swim at all then?!

I am the PP you quoted. I don’t object to club swimmers swimming, as long as they get that it’s a team rec sport and entirely different from club swimming.

But the PP I quoted seemed to be saying that the advantage that club swimmers have somehow justifies changing the age when the two things are completely separate.

The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others. I have a kid with a late July birthday, he has an advantage in Summer Swim, a disadvantage in his favorite sport which has a August 1 cut off, a bigger disadvantage in lacrosse where they play by age and lots of kids are redshirted, and unclear status in soccer right now because the ages seem to be changing. It just is what it is. But I don’t go demanding that the rules change in any of those sports. Because I am not a poor sport.

"The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others."

Except....in club swim. There is no cut off date. You swim as the age you are. You age up on your birthday. That doesn't advantage or disadvantage any kids. It just is what it is. Everyone knows it and accepts it.

I fully support summer swim kids aging up on their birthdays. Someone picking a random arbitrary date and everyone sticking by it for years and years is ludicrous to me. It's like the people that say, "Oh this is how we've always done it! It's tradition!"
A tradition that makes no sense.

The birthday rule does disadvantage certain kids in club swim because the big championship meets are in March every year. So kids who age up right before that have to swim against kids in the championship meets almost two years older (or almost a year older in their interim year).

Right. But that disadvantage is based on the date of your birth, something that cannot be changed and is totally legitimate.....not a random arbitrary age up date picked by some person 25 years ago.

My DC has a late February birthday and they already know this is a huge disadvantage in club swim. It is what it is.

The fact that the big meets are in march is definitely random and arbitrary.

Not PP.

You're right. But each child can't complain because they are swimming their actual age. That's what's fair.

A 9 year old swimming as an 8&U the entire summer hardly seems fair. An 8 year old swimming as an 8 year old the entire club swim season and then turning 9 in late February and swimming as a 9 year old at the March championship meet...is fair. They're actually swimming their real age.

Also...moving/changing a meet schedule seems like a lot larger of an undertaking than discussing a possible rule change for age up dates for summer swim though.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the idea of the age group determination date being August 1st. Whatever age you are by August 1st is the age group you swim in for that summer season.
So if you turn 9 on August 1st or anytime before that, you swim in 9-10s that whole summer. It makes sense.

Most of the girls in the "8&U" age group who made coach's long course and individual all stars this year were already 9 years old or days/weeks away. The fastest "8&U" girl who is breaking a bunch of MCSL records literally had her birthday announced on the individual all star meet day. Before all you keyboard warriors come at me like OMG ARE YOU A STALKER?! HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THEIR AGES?!...this is publicly available information online. If you don't like this, write to you're representative to get legislation in place. It's utterly creepy how publicly available all of our swimmers' info is on MeetMobile etc etc.

Let's not kid ourselves either about "oh this is just for fun!!! It's summer swim you troll!!!! How dare you take this from the children?!?!". I'd say 99% of the 8&U girls who made coach's long course or individual all stars are year-round club swimmers. So they're used to the year-round rule which is....you age up on your birthday. Changing it to August 1st would give ACTUAL 8&Us that aren't club swimmers a chance to make those events.

Changing the date would advantage different kids, but it wouldn’t change the huge advantage that club swimmers have. Why are you confusing those things?

Why even let club swimmers do summer swim at all then?!

I am the PP you quoted. I don’t object to club swimmers swimming, as long as they get that it’s a team rec sport and entirely different from club swimming.

But the PP I quoted seemed to be saying that the advantage that club swimmers have somehow justifies changing the age when the two things are completely separate.

The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others. I have a kid with a late July birthday, he has an advantage in Summer Swim, a disadvantage in his favorite sport which has a August 1 cut off, a bigger disadvantage in lacrosse where they play by age and lots of kids are redshirted, and unclear status in soccer right now because the ages seem to be changing. It just is what it is. But I don’t go demanding that the rules change in any of those sports. Because I am not a poor sport.

"The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others."

Except....in club swim. There is no cut off date. You swim as the age you are. You age up on your birthday. That doesn't advantage or disadvantage any kids. It just is what it is. Everyone knows it and accepts it.

I fully support summer swim kids aging up on their birthdays. Someone picking a random arbitrary date and everyone sticking by it for years and years is ludicrous to me. It's like the people that say, "Oh this is how we've always done it! It's tradition!"
A tradition that makes no sense.

The birthday rule does disadvantage certain kids in club swim because the big championship meets are in March every year. So kids who age up right before that have to swim against kids in the championship meets almost two years older (or almost a year older in their interim year).

Right. But that disadvantage is based on the date of your birth, something that cannot be changed and is totally legitimate.....not a random arbitrary age up date picked by some person 25 years ago.

My DC has a late February birthday and they already know this is a huge disadvantage in club swim. It is what it is.

The fact that the big meets are in march is definitely random and arbitrary.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the idea of the age group determination date being August 1st. Whatever age you are by August 1st is the age group you swim in for that summer season.
So if you turn 9 on August 1st or anytime before that, you swim in 9-10s that whole summer. It makes sense.

Most of the girls in the "8&U" age group who made coach's long course and individual all stars this year were already 9 years old or days/weeks away. The fastest "8&U" girl who is breaking a bunch of MCSL records literally had her birthday announced on the individual all star meet day. Before all you keyboard warriors come at me like OMG ARE YOU A STALKER?! HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THEIR AGES?!...this is publicly available information online. If you don't like this, write to you're representative to get legislation in place. It's utterly creepy how publicly available all of our swimmers' info is on MeetMobile etc etc.

Let's not kid ourselves either about "oh this is just for fun!!! It's summer swim you troll!!!! How dare you take this from the children?!?!". I'd say 99% of the 8&U girls who made coach's long course or individual all stars are year-round club swimmers. So they're used to the year-round rule which is....you age up on your birthday. Changing it to August 1st would give ACTUAL 8&Us that aren't club swimmers a chance to make those events.

Changing the date would advantage different kids, but it wouldn’t change the huge advantage that club swimmers have. Why are you confusing those things?

Why even let club swimmers do summer swim at all then?!

I am the PP you quoted. I don’t object to club swimmers swimming, as long as they get that it’s a team rec sport and entirely different from club swimming.

But the PP I quoted seemed to be saying that the advantage that club swimmers have somehow justifies changing the age when the two things are completely separate.

The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others. I have a kid with a late July birthday, he has an advantage in Summer Swim, a disadvantage in his favorite sport which has a August 1 cut off, a bigger disadvantage in lacrosse where they play by age and lots of kids are redshirted, and unclear status in soccer right now because the ages seem to be changing. It just is what it is. But I don’t go demanding that the rules change in any of those sports. Because I am not a poor sport.

"The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others."

Except....in club swim. There is no cut off date. You swim as the age you are. You age up on your birthday. That doesn't advantage or disadvantage any kids. It just is what it is. Everyone knows it and accepts it.

I fully support summer swim kids aging up on their birthdays. Someone picking a random arbitrary date and everyone sticking by it for years and years is ludicrous to me. It's like the people that say, "Oh this is how we've always done it! It's tradition!"
A tradition that makes no sense.

The birthday rule does disadvantage certain kids in club swim because the big championship meets are in March every year. So kids who age up right before that have to swim against kids in the championship meets almost two years older (or almost a year older in their interim year).

Right. But that disadvantage is based on the date of your birth, something that cannot be changed and is totally legitimate.....not a random arbitrary age up date picked by some person 25 years ago.

My DC has a late February birthday and they already know this is a huge disadvantage in club swim. It is what it is.

The fact that the big meets are in march is definitely random and arbitrary.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the idea of the age group determination date being August 1st. Whatever age you are by August 1st is the age group you swim in for that summer season.
So if you turn 9 on August 1st or anytime before that, you swim in 9-10s that whole summer. It makes sense.

Most of the girls in the "8&U" age group who made coach's long course and individual all stars this year were already 9 years old or days/weeks away. The fastest "8&U" girl who is breaking a bunch of MCSL records literally had her birthday announced on the individual all star meet day. Before all you keyboard warriors come at me like OMG ARE YOU A STALKER?! HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THEIR AGES?!...this is publicly available information online. If you don't like this, write to you're representative to get legislation in place. It's utterly creepy how publicly available all of our swimmers' info is on MeetMobile etc etc.

Let's not kid ourselves either about "oh this is just for fun!!! It's summer swim you troll!!!! How dare you take this from the children?!?!". I'd say 99% of the 8&U girls who made coach's long course or individual all stars are year-round club swimmers. So they're used to the year-round rule which is....you age up on your birthday. Changing it to August 1st would give ACTUAL 8&Us that aren't club swimmers a chance to make those events.

Changing the date would advantage different kids, but it wouldn’t change the huge advantage that club swimmers have. Why are you confusing those things?

Why even let club swimmers do summer swim at all then?!

I am the PP you quoted. I don’t object to club swimmers swimming, as long as they get that it’s a team rec sport and entirely different from club swimming.

But the PP I quoted seemed to be saying that the advantage that club swimmers have somehow justifies changing the age when the two things are completely separate.

The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others. I have a kid with a late July birthday, he has an advantage in Summer Swim, a disadvantage in his favorite sport which has a August 1 cut off, a bigger disadvantage in lacrosse where they play by age and lots of kids are redshirted, and unclear status in soccer right now because the ages seem to be changing. It just is what it is. But I don’t go demanding that the rules change in any of those sports. Because I am not a poor sport.

"The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others."

Except....in club swim. There is no cut off date. You swim as the age you are. You age up on your birthday. That doesn't advantage or disadvantage any kids. It just is what it is. Everyone knows it and accepts it.

I fully support summer swim kids aging up on their birthdays. Someone picking a random arbitrary date and everyone sticking by it for years and years is ludicrous to me. It's like the people that say, "Oh this is how we've always done it! It's tradition!"
A tradition that makes no sense.

The birthday rule does disadvantage certain kids in club swim because the big championship meets are in March every year. So kids who age up right before that have to swim against kids in the championship meets almost two years older (or almost a year older in their interim year).

Right. But that disadvantage is based on the date of your birth, something that cannot be changed and is totally legitimate.....not a random arbitrary age up date picked by some person 25 years ago.

My DC has a late February birthday and they already know this is a huge disadvantage in club swim. It is what it is.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the idea of the age group determination date being August 1st. Whatever age you are by August 1st is the age group you swim in for that summer season.
So if you turn 9 on August 1st or anytime before that, you swim in 9-10s that whole summer. It makes sense.

Most of the girls in the "8&U" age group who made coach's long course and individual all stars this year were already 9 years old or days/weeks away. The fastest "8&U" girl who is breaking a bunch of MCSL records literally had her birthday announced on the individual all star meet day. Before all you keyboard warriors come at me like OMG ARE YOU A STALKER?! HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THEIR AGES?!...this is publicly available information online. If you don't like this, write to you're representative to get legislation in place. It's utterly creepy how publicly available all of our swimmers' info is on MeetMobile etc etc.

Let's not kid ourselves either about "oh this is just for fun!!! It's summer swim you troll!!!! How dare you take this from the children?!?!". I'd say 99% of the 8&U girls who made coach's long course or individual all stars are year-round club swimmers. So they're used to the year-round rule which is....you age up on your birthday. Changing it to August 1st would give ACTUAL 8&Us that aren't club swimmers a chance to make those events.

Changing the date would advantage different kids, but it wouldn’t change the huge advantage that club swimmers have. Why are you confusing those things?

Why even let club swimmers do summer swim at all then?!

I am the PP you quoted. I don’t object to club swimmers swimming, as long as they get that it’s a team rec sport and entirely different from club swimming.

But the PP I quoted seemed to be saying that the advantage that club swimmers have somehow justifies changing the age when the two things are completely separate.

The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others. I have a kid with a late July birthday, he has an advantage in Summer Swim, a disadvantage in his favorite sport which has a August 1 cut off, a bigger disadvantage in lacrosse where they play by age and lots of kids are redshirted, and unclear status in soccer right now because the ages seem to be changing. It just is what it is. But I don’t go demanding that the rules change in any of those sports. Because I am not a poor sport.

"The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others."

Except....in club swim. There is no cut off date. You swim as the age you are. You age up on your birthday. That doesn't advantage or disadvantage any kids. It just is what it is. Everyone knows it and accepts it.

I fully support summer swim kids aging up on their birthdays. Someone picking a random arbitrary date and everyone sticking by it for years and years is ludicrous to me. It's like the people that say, "Oh this is how we've always done it! It's tradition!"
A tradition that makes no sense.

The birthday rule does disadvantage certain kids in club swim because the big championship meets are in March every year. So kids who age up right before that have to swim against kids in the championship meets almost two years older (or almost a year older in their interim year).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love the idea of the age group determination date being August 1st. Whatever age you are by August 1st is the age group you swim in for that summer season.
So if you turn 9 on August 1st or anytime before that, you swim in 9-10s that whole summer. It makes sense.

Most of the girls in the "8&U" age group who made coach's long course and individual all stars this year were already 9 years old or days/weeks away. The fastest "8&U" girl who is breaking a bunch of MCSL records literally had her birthday announced on the individual all star meet day. Before all you keyboard warriors come at me like OMG ARE YOU A STALKER?! HOW WOULD YOU KNOW THEIR AGES?!...this is publicly available information online. If you don't like this, write to you're representative to get legislation in place. It's utterly creepy how publicly available all of our swimmers' info is on MeetMobile etc etc.

Let's not kid ourselves either about "oh this is just for fun!!! It's summer swim you troll!!!! How dare you take this from the children?!?!". I'd say 99% of the 8&U girls who made coach's long course or individual all stars are year-round club swimmers. So they're used to the year-round rule which is....you age up on your birthday. Changing it to August 1st would give ACTUAL 8&Us that aren't club swimmers a chance to make those events.

Changing the date would advantage different kids, but it wouldn’t change the huge advantage that club swimmers have. Why are you confusing those things?

Why even let club swimmers do summer swim at all then?!

I am the PP you quoted. I don’t object to club swimmers swimming, as long as they get that it’s a team rec sport and entirely different from club swimming.

But the PP I quoted seemed to be saying that the advantage that club swimmers have somehow justifies changing the age when the two things are completely separate.

The reality is that every team sport has a cut off date that advantages some kids and disadvantages others. I have a kid with a late July birthday, he has an advantage in Summer Swim, a disadvantage in his favorite sport which has a August 1 cut off, a bigger disadvantage in lacrosse where they play by age and lots of kids are redshirted, and unclear status in soccer right now because the ages seem to be changing. It just is what it is. But I don’t go demanding that the rules change in any of those sports. Because I am not a poor sport.

+1. Summer swim is what? Six weeks? Are we really going to kick freshly minted 9-year olds out of their age groups and relays in mid July and make them start swimming 50s with kids who are nearly two full years older? How is that fair?

I have no problem with the age up rule in club swim. Everyone is going to have a down period as they have birthdays, no one gets singled out. But for summer swim you are really penalizing the summer birthday kids. These kids get penalized enough. June 1 is fine.

I really don’t care about the age up issue, but the people that insist the rule remain age on June 1st are no different than the people arguing it should be age on August 1st. The only difference is which group of kids is being disadvantaged. It’s 2 sides of the same coin.

Well yes and no. Accepting something the way it is, even if it advantages your child is different than accepting when your child is advantaged and throwing a tantrum when someone else's child is advantaged. The latter is what the people trying to change a date that's been used for 25 years are doing, and rewarding their poor sportsmanship would be horrible. It's no difference than buying your kid candy because they throw a fit in the checkout line.

😂 and how do you think the date ended up being changed 25 years ago? Come off your high horse July birthday mom.

Sure. Will you help me down, October mom?

And changing it to August 1 could conceivably lock a number of swimmers out of swimming their senior year. It’s pretty common for people to hold back their summer birthday boys around here.

I have no dog in this fight. My kid has a spring birthday and doesn’t care that much about summer swim. I just can’t comprehend that people on both sides of this debate cannot see that they arguing the same thing, just for a different result. You’re also really reaching with the redshirted summer birthday boy argument, that does not tip the scales to June 1 being more fair. Do we really need 19 year olds being able to swim as 18 year olds in summer rec league swim?

It’s true that a change would advantage or disadvantage a different group of kids. But June 1 is still a very odd date to pick. It’s two weeks before the first meet of the season. Using that date means there are kids who don’t swim their actual age at any meet the entire season. If you are going to pick a date before the season even starts, then why not January 1?