Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I took a different approach, buying an expensive home locally with all the amenities I want, and just going elsewhere from time to time when I want a change of scenery. I can't imagine spending hours each way to go to a second home, paying for maintenance and insurance on it, tying money up in a more vulnerable RE market as are rural and vacation area, and being always tied to a specific location. You're signing up for financial and administrative commitments, and for a lack of flexibility. But, each to their own.

LOL. If you don't buy "an expensive home locally" then you can buy another that isn't local and together they can provide "all the amenities I want" and you can still "go elsewhere from time to time when I want a change of scenery." What this thread is all about is how many "hours each way" to do this makes sense.

Because two lower end homes instead of one high end property with all your desired amenities also avoids all the financial and management costs associated with keeping a second house, and many people consider hours driving to and from a second home to be unproductive. Time in a really nice primary property is not wasted, time on the road going back and forth is. Not to mention the opportunity costs - with one home and the money you save by not paying for insurance and maintenance and taxes on a second one, you can vacation wherever you like whenever you want, without feeling that you should be using that same old second home because you're paying to keep it.

But, if paying and commuting to a second home floats your boat, more power to you.

I know I shouldn't waste my time debating this silly issue with you. But what the hell, I will . . .

First, it all depends on one's definition of "expensive" versus "lower end," which is entirely location specific. Our city house is worth $2 million and our country $1 million -- but our country house is "high end" regardless of where you might find it and is definitely "expensive" for the local area. Our city house is hardly "lower end," but those who know DC wouldn't consider it "expensive" either. It's a comfortable place in a superb location.

Which brings me to your definition of "all the nice amenities." Clearly it's different than mine. To me, the "nice amenities" of a house is more than things like a big kitchen with high end appliances -- it's WHERE the house is located and the "amenities" that surround it. From that standpoint, it's impossible to buy a single house with "all the nice amenities" when you want amenities that both the country and the city offer. We didn't buy a second home to spend our time just sitting in it . . .

Yes, every time anyone is on the road you are "wasting time." That's precisely why we limited our search for a second home to less than two hours away. Also, we don't work so we don't spend a lot of time driving anywhere else.

Finally, what you call "opportunity costs." Again, yes -- if you're not living below your means this is something you need to worry about. But that isn't us. Having to pay for "insurance and maintenance and taxes" on two places isn't a burden, and we can do that and still afford to -- and do -- travel extensively to other places regardless because we're not overextended. We're not even close to house poor.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I took a different approach, buying an expensive home locally with all the amenities I want, and just going elsewhere from time to time when I want a change of scenery. I can't imagine spending hours each way to go to a second home, paying for maintenance and insurance on it, tying money up in a more vulnerable RE market as are rural and vacation area, and being always tied to a specific location. You're signing up for financial and administrative commitments, and for a lack of flexibility. But, each to their own.

LOL. If you don't buy "an expensive home locally" then you can buy another that isn't local and together they can provide "all the amenities I want" and you can still "go elsewhere from time to time when I want a change of scenery." What this thread is all about is how many "hours each way" to do this makes sense.

Because two lower end homes instead of one high end property with all your desired amenities also avoids all the financial and management costs associated with keeping a second house, and many people consider hours driving to and from a second home to be unproductive. Time in a really nice primary property is not wasted, time on the road going back and forth is. Not to mention the opportunity costs - with one home and the money you save by not paying for insurance and maintenance and taxes on a second one, you can vacation wherever you like whenever you want, without feeling that you should be using that same old second home because you're paying to keep it.

But, if paying and commuting to a second home floats your boat, more power to you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The Delaware beach fan club just will never acknowledge that they’re not in a high end destination for 2nd homes - they’re the equivalent of the upper segment of the middle tier of NJ shore.. maybe they get up to being nearly like Stone Harbor...

You’ve got GIC, certain eastern shore enclaves, and VA horse country. Those are renowned destinations that attract part time residents from an expansive area. The only people buying in Rebobeth are from Philly, Baltimore, and DC.

I have literally never heard of any DMV family that has considered or bought a home in Virginia horse country, but I know several objectively wealthy families with homes in Bethany and Lewes. There are many homes in my Bethany neighborhood that range from $6-9 million so I'm confused that you would believe that portions of the DE beaches are not a high end destination for second homes.

I guess I don’t think of the DE beaches as being particularly elite areas because you don’t see 10,000 square foot homes on 3 acres like will happen on the Hamptons and sell for $100MM.

That said, I agree with you…I don’t hear anyone talking about elite VA horse country except Middleburg and don’t hear anyone mentioning elite Eastern shore areas.

It’s more like I bought on the Eastern shore because I could get a bigger house and land on the water for the same price of a Bethany beach house.

NP here. That's because you don't know enough people, and that's ok. If you don't know elite ESMD areas then you're just not in the know. And plenty of people have zero interest in the Hamptons or a 10,000 square foot house (anywhere). Or Bethany.

Nailed it.

Nothing captures the provincialism (ironically) of DC like the contingent who drive right past Talbot County and think they’re going to the Hamptons when they’re headed to Rehobeth. “We’re just like the UES because we live in Palisades and go “summer” in Rehobeth”. Yeah ok.

Um, it's RehobOth. And you misspelled it twice. Which means it wasn't a typo -- you just don't know what you're talking about.

Interesting. People don’t seem to have trouble spelling Siasconset.

IMO, two hours or less would be fantastic. Three is starting to push it.

I'm not in the DMV, Richmond area. The drive to the North End of VA Beach or even to Sandbridge is about 2 and ideal.

OBX is more like 3 plus hours in order to get back up to Corolla. If the new northern bridge would ever get built, that might make OBX more desirable.

DC area relative of mine had a place in The Plains. They would head out there every weekend.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The Delaware beach fan club just will never acknowledge that they’re not in a high end destination for 2nd homes - they’re the equivalent of the upper segment of the middle tier of NJ shore.. maybe they get up to being nearly like Stone Harbor...

You’ve got GIC, certain eastern shore enclaves, and VA horse country. Those are renowned destinations that attract part time residents from an expansive area. The only people buying in Rebobeth are from Philly, Baltimore, and DC.

I have literally never heard of any DMV family that has considered or bought a home in Virginia horse country, but I know several objectively wealthy families with homes in Bethany and Lewes. There are many homes in my Bethany neighborhood that range from $6-9 million so I'm confused that you would believe that portions of the DE beaches are not a high end destination for second homes.

I guess I don’t think of the DE beaches as being particularly elite areas because you don’t see 10,000 square foot homes on 3 acres like will happen on the Hamptons and sell for $100MM.

That said, I agree with you…I don’t hear anyone talking about elite VA horse country except Middleburg and don’t hear anyone mentioning elite Eastern shore areas.

It’s more like I bought on the Eastern shore because I could get a bigger house and land on the water for the same price of a Bethany beach house.

NP here. That's because you don't know enough people, and that's ok. If you don't know elite ESMD areas then you're just not in the know. And plenty of people have zero interest in the Hamptons or a 10,000 square foot house (anywhere). Or Bethany.

Nailed it.

Nothing captures the provincialism (ironically) of DC like the contingent who drive right past Talbot County and think they’re going to the Hamptons when they’re headed to Rehobeth. “We’re just like the UES because we live in Palisades and go “summer” in Rehobeth”. Yeah ok.

Um, it's RehobOth. And you misspelled it twice. Which means it wasn't a typo -- you just don't know what you're talking about.

Anonymous wrote:I think anything under 3 hours would be best. We have never had a second home because we like to frequently travel to new destinations and I don't want to deal with maintaining a second home. I don't mind the driving when we go somewhere local for a weekend. The part I don't like is packing up a million things to bring and then hauling it all back home. Having your own place would take that hassle out of the equation so a 3 hour drive to arrive in your own house, with toiletries, some food in the pantry, clothes in the closet, your own clean bedding etc, wouldn't be a big deal.

+1 I’m a PP with a 3-hour drive and all we pack is food that might spoil before we get back.

I think anything under 3 hours would be best. We have never had a second home because we like to frequently travel to new destinations and I don't want to deal with maintaining a second home. I don't mind the driving when we go somewhere local for a weekend. The part I don't like is packing up a million things to bring and then hauling it all back home. Having your own place would take that hassle out of the equation so a 3 hour drive to arrive in your own house, with toiletries, some food in the pantry, clothes in the closet, your own clean bedding etc, wouldn't be a big deal.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would never do 3 hrs

I grew up going to a ski house that was just over 3 hours away. It was a slog, especially on the way home on Sunday after skiing.

Depends on the skiing. Vail? Breck? Even the good ones in New England? Probably worth it. Wisp? Hard pass.

Anonymous wrote:I would never do 3 hrs

I grew up going to a ski house that was just over 3 hours away. It was a slog, especially on the way home on Sunday after skiing.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The Delaware beach fan club just will never acknowledge that they’re not in a high end destination for 2nd homes - they’re the equivalent of the upper segment of the middle tier of NJ shore.. maybe they get up to being nearly like Stone Harbor...

You’ve got GIC, certain eastern shore enclaves, and VA horse country. Those are renowned destinations that attract part time residents from an expansive area. The only people buying in Rebobeth are from Philly, Baltimore, and DC.

I have literally never heard of any DMV family that has considered or bought a home in Virginia horse country, but I know several objectively wealthy families with homes in Bethany and Lewes. There are many homes in my Bethany neighborhood that range from $6-9 million so I'm confused that you would believe that portions of the DE beaches are not a high end destination for second homes.

I guess I don’t think of the DE beaches as being particularly elite areas because you don’t see 10,000 square foot homes on 3 acres like will happen on the Hamptons and sell for $100MM.

That said, I agree with you…I don’t hear anyone talking about elite VA horse country except Middleburg and don’t hear anyone mentioning elite Eastern shore areas.

It’s more like I bought on the Eastern shore because I could get a bigger house and land on the water for the same price of a Bethany beach house.

NP here. That's because you don't know enough people, and that's ok. If you don't know elite ESMD areas then you're just not in the know. And plenty of people have zero interest in the Hamptons or a 10,000 square foot house (anywhere). Or Bethany.

Nailed it.

Nothing captures the provincialism (ironically) of DC like the contingent who drive right past Talbot County and think they’re going to the Hamptons when they’re headed to Rehobeth. “We’re just like the UES because we live in Palisades and go “summer” in Rehobeth”. Yeah ok.

Two hours is better than three hours by a magnitude of more than 50%.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From DC there are two centers of gravity for high end magazine quality weekend houses and quaint towns. We don’t really have a high end ocean front area, though Lewes maybe is the closest thing.

The two are Virginia hunt country inside 90 minutes and Maryland Eastern shore inside 90 minutes. That’s where the premium properties are.

As you get outside 90 minutes the desirability and prices go down. This tells me that 90 minutes or less is easy. As you get further it gets harder. Going west, 3 hours has you at places like Lost River or Shenandoah Valley… lovely area but much lower cost. If Lost River were within 90 minutes I expect it would be much pricier. Locations in the Valley are lower priced than their counterparts to the east of the blue ridge… Even Orange and Keswick east of the blue ridge are lower priced than Middleburg.

So it boils down to what you can afford… the travel time is real and people are willing to pay a lot to shorten the distance and that should tell you something as you think of more vs less time to get to the property.

That's not accurate. Bethany, Lewes, and Rehoboth are generally more desirable second home locations than some that you mentioned. There's limited interest in homes in hunting and fishing rural areas. There was a spike during the pandemic but that demand has waned.

The Delaware beach fan club just will never acknowledge that they’re not in a high end destination for 2nd homes - they’re the equivalent of the upper segment of the middle tier of NJ shore.. maybe they get up to being nearly like Stone Harbor...

You’ve got GIC, certain eastern shore enclaves, and VA horse country. Those are renowned destinations that attract part time residents from an expansive area. The only people buying in Rebobeth are from Philly, Baltimore, and DC.

I’m in the Delaware Beach Fan Club! Why are we talking about whether a second home location is “high end” or not? A destination can be very desirable regardless of whether it’s a hotspot for socialites or celebrities. We and several of our friends have vacation homes in Bethany+other locations, can afford whatever vacations we want, and like to go to Bethany frequently because it’s a pretty and relaxing place to be and relatively easy to get to.

I personally wouldn’t do the drive there for a one-night stay, but plenty of our friends do. I think OP’s question is a bit of a silly one to crowdsource, because tolerance for driving time is a very personal thing, as are the things any family values in a vacation spot. I’d gladly drive 3 hours to be near the ocean vs. 2 hours, 1 hour, or a half hour to be at a home on a river, for example.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The Delaware beach fan club just will never acknowledge that they’re not in a high end destination for 2nd homes - they’re the equivalent of the upper segment of the middle tier of NJ shore.. maybe they get up to being nearly like Stone Harbor...

You’ve got GIC, certain eastern shore enclaves, and VA horse country. Those are renowned destinations that attract part time residents from an expansive area. The only people buying in Rebobeth are from Philly, Baltimore, and DC.

I have literally never heard of any DMV family that has considered or bought a home in Virginia horse country, but I know several objectively wealthy families with homes in Bethany and Lewes. There are many homes in my Bethany neighborhood that range from $6-9 million so I'm confused that you would believe that portions of the DE beaches are not a high end destination for second homes.

I guess I don’t think of the DE beaches as being particularly elite areas because you don’t see 10,000 square foot homes on 3 acres like will happen on the Hamptons and sell for $100MM.

That said, I agree with you…I don’t hear anyone talking about elite VA horse country except Middleburg and don’t hear anyone mentioning elite Eastern shore areas.

It’s more like I bought on the Eastern shore because I could get a bigger house and land on the water for the same price of a Bethany beach house.

NP here. That's because you don't know enough people, and that's ok. If you don't know elite ESMD areas then you're just not in the know. And plenty of people have zero interest in the Hamptons or a 10,000 square foot house (anywhere). Or Bethany.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not gonna lie -- we would have preferred a house on the beach, sure, but the hassle involved just wasn't worth it to us. The closest beaches to the DMV are just too far and difficult to get to for a carefree summer weekend, and outside of the summer season they're dead and you can't swim anyway.

We ended up looking west, and landed on a place that we love. On a bad day it's just under 2 hours; most of the time barely more than 90 minutes. Saving an hour to 90 minutes each way is a game changer.

That's great that you found a place that you love. But I never understand when people just feel like they want a vacation home without a strong desire for a specific type of location, such as the beach or mountains.

Because in our case it's not a "vacation" home. It's a second home outside of the city. We "vacation" elsewhere. We "live" in our first and second homes.

Not that complicated.

I think we are still all confused, but I guess you need to name the city.

I suppose I understand a one BR in NYC and then a house in Scarsdale.

Outside of NYC, it’s hard to understand doing the equivalent in any other city…maybe Chicago but the nice suburbs are much closer in for Chicago.

This is a DMV centered website. Also, in my first post, I said that the closest beaches to the DMV were a hassle to get to. So it should be pretty clear what city I'm talking about.

I said we're 90 minutes to 2 hours tops west of the city. That far out of DC is a whole new world. Our second home is not in the suburbs. It's in a rural area just outside of a charming small town with plenty of amenities.

This is why it's frustrating sometimes when non-DMV folks take over this website. You don't really understand our geography.

I know the DMV…why would you buy a second home in a random rural town that isn’t your vacation home that’s 90 minutes away…but it’s not your vacation home it’s just some random home.

That's the part that I can't figure out about this poster. They just looked within a certain radius around the DMV and bought a house somewhere in such an obscure location that none of us can figure out where it is.

Because it’s a great little town that I don’t want you to know about. But others know it. Believe me.

Anonymous wrote:

The Delaware beach fan club just will never acknowledge that they’re not in a high end destination for 2nd homes - they’re the equivalent of the upper segment of the middle tier of NJ shore.. maybe they get up to being nearly like Stone Harbor...

You’ve got GIC, certain eastern shore enclaves, and VA horse country. Those are renowned destinations that attract part time residents from an expansive area. The only people buying in Rebobeth are from Philly, Baltimore, and DC.

I have literally never heard of any DMV family that has considered or bought a home in Virginia horse country, but I know several objectively wealthy families with homes in Bethany and Lewes. There are many homes in my Bethany neighborhood that range from $6-9 million so I'm confused that you would believe that portions of the DE beaches are not a high end destination for second homes.

I guess I don’t think of the DE beaches as being particularly elite areas because you don’t see 10,000 square foot homes on 3 acres like will happen on the Hamptons and sell for $100MM.

That said, I agree with you…I don’t hear anyone talking about elite VA horse country except Middleburg and don’t hear anyone mentioning elite Eastern shore areas.

It’s more like I bought on the Eastern shore because I could get a bigger house and land on the water for the same price of a Bethany beach house.