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Anonymous wrote:It’s not that MIT doesn’t want them, it’s they are not a great fit. IB is more centered on humanities.

If math and science are done at HL level in IB, that’s still only two stem classes. MIT applicants take AP calculus and statistics and often math dual enrollment classes, plus 3-4 AP science classes. Meanwhile IB students take Theory of knowledge, CAS stuff, and classes that don’t move the needle much at MIT: foreign language, art, social sciences etc.

It’s hard to be competitive from IBDP when AP students take 8-10 stem exams alone, and get their results early to add to the application. Probably the same for Caltech or other competitive stem colleges.

And yet we see questions on here all the time asking if you really need 4 years of foreign languages and the answer is often that you should try. And my DD is an IB DP program and does not need to take an art class. She has enough room in her schedule to take 2 science courses + her math class.

MIT recommends two years of foreign language in high school, so IB is at a disadvantage since it requires four years.

you are implying that taking four years of a language would be a disadvantage applying to MIT?

Check your middle schools, they may teach 1-2 years

I made it clear it’s two years of foreign language in high school.

It’s the opportunity cost, instead of two years of foreign language, one could take stem classes instead.

Plenty of students do both language and stem. What about Humanities at MIT?

Not plenty, a mere handful, as in 50 out of 11000.

Are those 50 typically IBDP students or a mix of AP + dual enrollment?

IBDP is not that special. AP also offers the AP Capstone Diploma and nobody is making a huge deal about it even if they are comparable.

This. Never understood in what way IBDP is better than taking the equivalent AP classes.

It’s not, and you’re so limited on when and what classes you can take, it’s just not worth it.

IB HL sciences are two years, so its common for the first year to be taught together with AP. So the 2nd year of HL is material AP students wouldn't get.

So if a students schedule allows they could take IB Bio HL YR 1, IB Bio HL YR 2 instead of just AP Bio. And then also IB chem YR1 & YR2 INSTEAD of Ap chem. Ib physics is not calculus based so not useful to take that over Physics C

AP Chem and Bio take one year, while IB HL classes take two years, but both AP and IB are equivalent to a two semester introductory course. There’s no extra material covered in IB classes, they just review more basic concepts and are slower paced.

Are you saying that after taking YR1 which is just AP, they are not learning anything in YR2?

No, I’m saying the first year in IB HL is not “just” AP.

Before making these claims at least check a course syllabus.

Let me clarify. At many of the IB schools around here, for science, IB HL YR1 and AP are taught as the same class. IB HL YR2 is then a separate class. So , if IB HL YR1 and AP are taught the same materials, what do you think is taught in IB HL YR2?

I already know the answer but I’m just curious how far you’re willing to embarrass yourself.

IB Chemistry syllabus:
https://www.ibo.org/globalassets/new-structure/recognition/pdfs/dp_sciences_chemistry_subject-brief_jan_2022_e.pdf

AP Chemistry syllabus:
https://apcentral.collegeboard.org/media/pdf/ap-chemistry-course-and-exam-description.pdf

It’s clear as day and night AP Chemistry is more rigorous.

you are confusing SL with HL

Not really, the link is for both SL and HL, same general topics are covered in both, just different number of hours.

So? what is your point?

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Anonymous wrote:It’s not that MIT doesn’t want them, it’s they are not a great fit. IB is more centered on humanities.

If math and science are done at HL level in IB, that’s still only two stem classes. MIT applicants take AP calculus and statistics and often math dual enrollment classes, plus 3-4 AP science classes. Meanwhile IB students take Theory of knowledge, CAS stuff, and classes that don’t move the needle much at MIT: foreign language, art, social sciences etc.

It’s hard to be competitive from IBDP when AP students take 8-10 stem exams alone, and get their results early to add to the application. Probably the same for Caltech or other competitive stem colleges.

And yet we see questions on here all the time asking if you really need 4 years of foreign languages and the answer is often that you should try. And my DD is an IB DP program and does not need to take an art class. She has enough room in her schedule to take 2 science courses + her math class.

MIT recommends two years of foreign language in high school, so IB is at a disadvantage since it requires four years.

you are implying that taking four years of a language would be a disadvantage applying to MIT?

Check your middle schools, they may teach 1-2 years

I made it clear it’s two years of foreign language in high school.

It’s the opportunity cost, instead of two years of foreign language, one could take stem classes instead.

Plenty of students do both language and stem. What about Humanities at MIT?

Not plenty, a mere handful, as in 50 out of 11000.

Are those 50 typically IBDP students or a mix of AP + dual enrollment?

IBDP is not that special. AP also offers the AP Capstone Diploma and nobody is making a huge deal about it even if they are comparable.

This. Never understood in what way IBDP is better than taking the equivalent AP classes.

It’s not, and you’re so limited on when and what classes you can take, it’s just not worth it.

IB HL sciences are two years, so its common for the first year to be taught together with AP. So the 2nd year of HL is material AP students wouldn't get.

So if a students schedule allows they could take IB Bio HL YR 1, IB Bio HL YR 2 instead of just AP Bio. And then also IB chem YR1 & YR2 INSTEAD of Ap chem. Ib physics is not calculus based so not useful to take that over Physics C

AP Chem and Bio take one year, while IB HL classes take two years, but both AP and IB are equivalent to a two semester introductory course. There’s no extra material covered in IB classes, they just review more basic concepts and are slower paced.

Are you saying that after taking YR1 which is just AP, they are not learning anything in YR2?

No, I’m saying the first year in IB HL is not “just” AP.

Before making these claims at least check a course syllabus.

Let me clarify. At many of the IB schools around here, for science, IB HL YR1 and AP are taught as the same class. IB HL YR2 is then a separate class. So , if IB HL YR1 and AP are taught the same materials, what do you think is taught in IB HL YR2?

I already know the answer but I’m just curious how far you’re willing to embarrass yourself.

IB Chemistry syllabus:
https://www.ibo.org/globalassets/new-structure/recognition/pdfs/dp_sciences_chemistry_subject-brief_jan_2022_e.pdf

AP Chemistry syllabus:
https://apcentral.collegeboard.org/media/pdf/ap-chemistry-course-and-exam-description.pdf

It’s clear as day and night AP Chemistry is more rigorous.

you are confusing SL with HL

Not really, the link is for both SL and HL, same general topics are covered in both, just different number of hours.

Anonymous wrote:And Cs and Ds don’t generally pass enough exams to earn the diploma points unless it is a way easier upper level sequence like*** I won’t name it bc then people will start screaming how hard *** is.

It’s moot anyway, bc if you’re focusing on *** you’re not going to MIT.

IB is a rich curriculum that can be delivered like crap. So, as usual, much depends on who is teaching, and to some degree the class cohort.

Anonymous wrote:And Cs and Ds don’t generally pass enough exams to earn the diploma points unless it is a way easier upper level sequence like*** I won’t name it bc then people will start screaming how hard *** is.

It’s moot anyway, bc if you’re focusing on *** you’re not going to MIT.

IB is a rich curriculum that can be delivered like crap. So, as usual, much depends on who is teaching, and to some degree the class cohort.

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Anonymous wrote:It’s not that MIT doesn’t want them, it’s they are not a great fit. IB is more centered on humanities.

If math and science are done at HL level in IB, that’s still only two stem classes. MIT applicants take AP calculus and statistics and often math dual enrollment classes, plus 3-4 AP science classes. Meanwhile IB students take Theory of knowledge, CAS stuff, and classes that don’t move the needle much at MIT: foreign language, art, social sciences etc.

It’s hard to be competitive from IBDP when AP students take 8-10 stem exams alone, and get their results early to add to the application. Probably the same for Caltech or other competitive stem colleges.

And yet we see questions on here all the time asking if you really need 4 years of foreign languages and the answer is often that you should try. And my DD is an IB DP program and does not need to take an art class. She has enough room in her schedule to take 2 science courses + her math class.

MIT recommends two years of foreign language in high school, so IB is at a disadvantage since it requires four years.

you are implying that taking four years of a language would be a disadvantage applying to MIT?

Check your middle schools, they may teach 1-2 years

I made it clear it’s two years of foreign language in high school.

It’s the opportunity cost, instead of two years of foreign language, one could take stem classes instead.

Plenty of students do both language and stem. What about Humanities at MIT?

Not plenty, a mere handful, as in 50 out of 11000.

Are those 50 typically IBDP students or a mix of AP + dual enrollment?

IBDP is not that special. AP also offers the AP Capstone Diploma and nobody is making a huge deal about it even if they are comparable.

This. Never understood in what way IBDP is better than taking the equivalent AP classes.

It’s not, and you’re so limited on when and what classes you can take, it’s just not worth it.

IB HL sciences are two years, so its common for the first year to be taught together with AP. So the 2nd year of HL is material AP students wouldn't get.

So if a students schedule allows they could take IB Bio HL YR 1, IB Bio HL YR 2 instead of just AP Bio. And then also IB chem YR1 & YR2 INSTEAD of Ap chem. Ib physics is not calculus based so not useful to take that over Physics C

AP Chem and Bio take one year, while IB HL classes take two years, but both AP and IB are equivalent to a two semester introductory course. There’s no extra material covered in IB classes, they just review more basic concepts and are slower paced.

Are you saying that after taking YR1 which is just AP, they are not learning anything in YR2?

No, I’m saying the first year in IB HL is not “just” AP.

Before making these claims at least check a course syllabus.

Let me clarify. At many of the IB schools around here, for science, IB HL YR1 and AP are taught as the same class. IB HL YR2 is then a separate class. So , if IB HL YR1 and AP are taught the same materials, what do you think is taught in IB HL YR2?

I already know the answer but I’m just curious how far you’re willing to embarrass yourself.

IB Chemistry syllabus:
https://www.ibo.org/globalassets/new-structure/recognition/pdfs/dp_sciences_chemistry_subject-brief_jan_2022_e.pdf

AP Chemistry syllabus:
https://apcentral.collegeboard.org/media/pdf/ap-chemistry-course-and-exam-description.pdf

It’s clear as day and night AP Chemistry is more rigorous.

you are confusing SL with HL

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Anonymous wrote:It’s not that MIT doesn’t want them, it’s they are not a great fit. IB is more centered on humanities.

If math and science are done at HL level in IB, that’s still only two stem classes. MIT applicants take AP calculus and statistics and often math dual enrollment classes, plus 3-4 AP science classes. Meanwhile IB students take Theory of knowledge, CAS stuff, and classes that don’t move the needle much at MIT: foreign language, art, social sciences etc.

It’s hard to be competitive from IBDP when AP students take 8-10 stem exams alone, and get their results early to add to the application. Probably the same for Caltech or other competitive stem colleges.

And yet we see questions on here all the time asking if you really need 4 years of foreign languages and the answer is often that you should try. And my DD is an IB DP program and does not need to take an art class. She has enough room in her schedule to take 2 science courses + her math class.

MIT recommends two years of foreign language in high school, so IB is at a disadvantage since it requires four years.

you are implying that taking four years of a language would be a disadvantage applying to MIT?

Check your middle schools, they may teach 1-2 years

I made it clear it’s two years of foreign language in high school.

It’s the opportunity cost, instead of two years of foreign language, one could take stem classes instead.

Plenty of students do both language and stem. What about Humanities at MIT?

Not plenty, a mere handful, as in 50 out of 11000.

Are those 50 typically IBDP students or a mix of AP + dual enrollment?

IBDP is not that special. AP also offers the AP Capstone Diploma and nobody is making a huge deal about it even if they are comparable.

This. Never understood in what way IBDP is better than taking the equivalent AP classes.

It’s not, and you’re so limited on when and what classes you can take, it’s just not worth it.

IB HL sciences are two years, so its common for the first year to be taught together with AP. So the 2nd year of HL is material AP students wouldn't get.

So if a students schedule allows they could take IB Bio HL YR 1, IB Bio HL YR 2 instead of just AP Bio. And then also IB chem YR1 & YR2 INSTEAD of Ap chem. Ib physics is not calculus based so not useful to take that over Physics C

AP Chem and Bio take one year, while IB HL classes take two years, but both AP and IB are equivalent to a two semester introductory course. There’s no extra material covered in IB classes, they just review more basic concepts and are slower paced.

Are you saying that after taking YR1 which is just AP, they are not learning anything in YR2?

No, I’m saying the first year in IB HL is not “just” AP.

Before making these claims at least check a course syllabus.

Let me clarify. At many of the IB schools around here, for science, IB HL YR1 and AP are taught as the same class. IB HL YR2 is then a separate class. So , if IB HL YR1 and AP are taught the same materials, what do you think is taught in IB HL YR2?

I already know the answer but I’m just curious how far you’re willing to embarrass yourself.

IB Chemistry syllabus:
https://www.ibo.org/globalassets/new-structure/recognition/pdfs/dp_sciences_chemistry_subject-brief_jan_2022_e.pdf

AP Chemistry syllabus:
https://apcentral.collegeboard.org/media/pdf/ap-chemistry-course-and-exam-description.pdf

It’s clear as day and night AP Chemistry is more rigorous.

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Anonymous wrote:It’s not that MIT doesn’t want them, it’s they are not a great fit. IB is more centered on humanities.

If math and science are done at HL level in IB, that’s still only two stem classes. MIT applicants take AP calculus and statistics and often math dual enrollment classes, plus 3-4 AP science classes. Meanwhile IB students take Theory of knowledge, CAS stuff, and classes that don’t move the needle much at MIT: foreign language, art, social sciences etc.

It’s hard to be competitive from IBDP when AP students take 8-10 stem exams alone, and get their results early to add to the application. Probably the same for Caltech or other competitive stem colleges.

And yet we see questions on here all the time asking if you really need 4 years of foreign languages and the answer is often that you should try. And my DD is an IB DP program and does not need to take an art class. She has enough room in her schedule to take 2 science courses + her math class.

MIT recommends two years of foreign language in high school, so IB is at a disadvantage since it requires four years.

you are implying that taking four years of a language would be a disadvantage applying to MIT?

Check your middle schools, they may teach 1-2 years

I made it clear it’s two years of foreign language in high school.

It’s the opportunity cost, instead of two years of foreign language, one could take stem classes instead.

Plenty of students do both language and stem. What about Humanities at MIT?

Not plenty, a mere handful, as in 50 out of 11000.

Are those 50 typically IBDP students or a mix of AP + dual enrollment?

IBDP is not that special. AP also offers the AP Capstone Diploma and nobody is making a huge deal about it even if they are comparable.

This. Never understood in what way IBDP is better than taking the equivalent AP classes.

It’s not, and you’re so limited on when and what classes you can take, it’s just not worth it.

IB HL sciences are two years, so its common for the first year to be taught together with AP. So the 2nd year of HL is material AP students wouldn't get.

So if a students schedule allows they could take IB Bio HL YR 1, IB Bio HL YR 2 instead of just AP Bio. And then also IB chem YR1 & YR2 INSTEAD of Ap chem. Ib physics is not calculus based so not useful to take that over Physics C

AP Chem and Bio take one year, while IB HL classes take two years, but both AP and IB are equivalent to a two semester introductory course. There’s no extra material covered in IB classes, they just review more basic concepts and are slower paced.

Are you saying that after taking YR1 which is just AP, they are not learning anything in YR2?

No, I’m saying the first year in IB HL is not “just” AP.

Before making these claims at least check a course syllabus.

Let me clarify. At many of the IB schools around here, for science, IB HL YR1 and AP are taught as the same class. IB HL YR2 is then a separate class. So , if IB HL YR1 and AP are taught the same materials, what do you think is taught in IB HL YR2?

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It’s hard to be competitive from IBDP when AP students take 8-10 stem exams alone, and get their results early to add to the application. Probably the same for Caltech or other competitive stem colleges.

There's not 8 stem ap exams, at least not without overlapping significant content

Bio
Chem
Physics C (i am not counting meh and e&m twice...)
Calc bc (i am not counting ab and bc twice!!)
Cs A (again... not counting twice)
Enviro
Stats

That's seven, and two of them are weak, one semester college courses

You theoretically take both bio and chem HL but the problem with IB is that the HL courses take two years while AP takes one.

Who is counting and what do they count? It’s not like if you took AP Physics 1, and follow up with Physics C, the less rigorous course gets discarded from the transcript. It still helps with the GPA and the strength of schedule.

Considering college credit, Calculus BC is equivalent to two semesters, while Statistics is only one. Both CS classes and Environmental are equivalent to one semester, while Chem and Bio are equivalent to two semesters, imo that’s the real measure.

There are 13 AP exams in math and science, it’s not that rare for MIT aspirants to take 8-10, and many enroll in dual enrollment classes in addition to those.

The point is that for AP students there are numerous opportunities to take rigorous classes early and challenge themselves. So what if there’s some overlap and some are easier than others? They still are better than honors or the SL versions that the IB kid takes.

MIT doesn't care what other kids at other schools did. They care about This is what MIT cares about a kid taking the most difficult courses available to them at any given time and excelling in them. This is for the 5 main areas. Read "Applying Sideways", they really do operate as they say.

https://mitadmissions.org/blogs/entry/applying_sideways/

Anonymous wrote:IB has been introduced in low-performing public schools where enrollment in AP courses was either low or nonexistent, at least in FCPS. To earn an IB diploma, a student only needs a C+ grade in six subjects, only two Ds are allowed. However, MIT may be looking for more than just an IB diploma.

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Anonymous wrote:It’s not that MIT doesn’t want them, it’s they are not a great fit. IB is more centered on humanities.

If math and science are done at HL level in IB, that’s still only two stem classes. MIT applicants take AP calculus and statistics and often math dual enrollment classes, plus 3-4 AP science classes. Meanwhile IB students take Theory of knowledge, CAS stuff, and classes that don’t move the needle much at MIT: foreign language, art, social sciences etc.

It’s hard to be competitive from IBDP when AP students take 8-10 stem exams alone, and get their results early to add to the application. Probably the same for Caltech or other competitive stem colleges.

And yet we see questions on here all the time asking if you really need 4 years of foreign languages and the answer is often that you should try. And my DD is an IB DP program and does not need to take an art class. She has enough room in her schedule to take 2 science courses + her math class.

MIT recommends two years of foreign language in high school, so IB is at a disadvantage since it requires four years.

you are implying that taking four years of a language would be a disadvantage applying to MIT?

Check your middle schools, they may teach 1-2 years

I made it clear it’s two years of foreign language in high school.

It’s the opportunity cost, instead of two years of foreign language, one could take stem classes instead.

Plenty of students do both language and stem. What about Humanities at MIT?

Not plenty, a mere handful, as in 50 out of 11000.

Are those 50 typically IBDP students or a mix of AP + dual enrollment?

IBDP is not that special. AP also offers the AP Capstone Diploma and nobody is making a huge deal about it even if they are comparable.

This. Never understood in what way IBDP is better than taking the equivalent AP classes.

It’s not, and you’re so limited on when and what classes you can take, it’s just not worth it.

IB HL sciences are two years, so its common for the first year to be taught together with AP. So the 2nd year of HL is material AP students wouldn't get.

So if a students schedule allows they could take IB Bio HL YR 1, IB Bio HL YR 2 instead of just AP Bio. And then also IB chem YR1 & YR2 INSTEAD of Ap chem. Ib physics is not calculus based so not useful to take that over Physics C

AP Chem and Bio take one year, while IB HL classes take two years, but both AP and IB are equivalent to a two semester introductory course. There’s no extra material covered in IB classes, they just review more basic concepts and are slower paced.

Are you saying that after taking YR1 which is just AP, they are not learning anything in YR2?

No, I’m saying the first year in IB HL is not “just” AP.

Before making these claims at least check a course syllabus.

Let me clarify. At many of the IB schools around here, for science, IB HL YR1 and AP are taught as the same class. IB HL YR2 is then a separate class. So , if IB HL YR1 and AP are taught the same materials, what do you think is taught in IB HL YR2?

You’re misinformed. Name the school from “around there” that has the first year of the IB science class teaching the same material as the AP class. Why do you present these as fact when it’s clearly not true?

okay

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Anonymous wrote:It’s not that MIT doesn’t want them, it’s they are not a great fit. IB is more centered on humanities.

If math and science are done at HL level in IB, that’s still only two stem classes. MIT applicants take AP calculus and statistics and often math dual enrollment classes, plus 3-4 AP science classes. Meanwhile IB students take Theory of knowledge, CAS stuff, and classes that don’t move the needle much at MIT: foreign language, art, social sciences etc.

It’s hard to be competitive from IBDP when AP students take 8-10 stem exams alone, and get their results early to add to the application. Probably the same for Caltech or other competitive stem colleges.

MIT does not give credit for a lot of AP exams. IBDP students are very competitive because they take the most rigorous classes provided in the school.

That’s not even remotely close to making them competitive for MIT.

There are more high school valedictorians than seats at MIT.

? IB students take the most rigorous courses that the school offers. Same for any non IB school where kids take a load of AP classes. Any student who takes the most rigorous classes, has super high stats, makes them competitive for elite schools. Unfortunately, stats alone won't get you in because yes, there are too many kids with very high stats who took the most rigorous courses and not enough seats.

That doesn't mean IBDP students with high stats aren't competitive for MIT. It just means MIT doesn't have enough seats for all the competitive students.

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Anonymous wrote:It’s not that MIT doesn’t want them, it’s they are not a great fit. IB is more centered on humanities.

If math and science are done at HL level in IB, that’s still only two stem classes. MIT applicants take AP calculus and statistics and often math dual enrollment classes, plus 3-4 AP science classes. Meanwhile IB students take Theory of knowledge, CAS stuff, and classes that don’t move the needle much at MIT: foreign language, art, social sciences etc.

It’s hard to be competitive from IBDP when AP students take 8-10 stem exams alone, and get their results early to add to the application. Probably the same for Caltech or other competitive stem colleges.

MIT does not give credit for a lot of AP exams. IBDP students are very competitive because they take the most rigorous classes provided in the school.

That’s not even remotely close to making them competitive for MIT.

There are more high school valedictorians than seats at MIT.

I was not a valedictorian and went to MIT...

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Anonymous wrote:My kid’s friend did IB and was accepted to MIT and will be attending in the Fall. He was also top of the class.

I’m sure he was accepted, after all IB is so rigorous that MIT is easy by comparison.

Snark aside, sorry, couldn’t help, it may happen, but the odds are not that good and IB is not a good preparation for MIT, not enough stem classes. One math and one science at high level won’t cut it.

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It’s hard to be competitive from IBDP when AP students take 8-10 stem exams alone, and get their results early to add to the application. Probably the same for Caltech or other competitive stem colleges.

There's not 8 stem ap exams, at least not without overlapping significant content

Bio
Chem
Physics C (i am not counting meh and e&m twice...)
Calc bc (i am not counting ab and bc twice!!)
Cs A (again... not counting twice)
Enviro
Stats

That's seven, and two of them are weak, one semester college courses

You theoretically take both bio and chem HL but the problem with IB is that the HL courses take two years while AP takes one.

Who is counting and what do they count? It’s not like if you took AP Physics 1, and follow up with Physics C, the less rigorous course gets discarded from the transcript. It still helps with the GPA and the strength of schedule.

Considering college credit, Calculus BC is equivalent to two semesters, while Statistics is only one. Both CS classes and Environmental are equivalent to one semester, while Chem and Bio are equivalent to two semesters, imo that’s the real measure.

There are 13 AP exams in math and science, it’s not that rare for MIT aspirants to take 8-10, and many enroll in dual enrollment classes in addition to those.

The point is that for AP students there are numerous opportunities to take rigorous classes early and challenge themselves. So what if there’s some overlap and some are easier than others? They still are better than honors or the SL versions that the IB kid takes.