Anonymous wrote:I have seen a generational shift in this attitude. It seems like having a long term SAH princess wife was a huge goal and status symbol in the older generations, but Gen X and especially Millennial men resent it. Not saying every man under about 50 feels this way, but significantly more do than Boomers and up.

The other thing is that younger women have changed. They are realising it is rewarding to have a successful career. Also older women who have made it professionally often have a lot more free time but are also paid a lot. So are able to take on things like going on boards and networking with other successful women. The SAHMs that haven’t worked for 30 years by this point can’t access this world

The truth is once a man earns a certain amount, a wife who works is doing so entirely for her own fulfillment, even if she contributes financially. So if the wife would find equal or greater fulfillment in a life of leisure, I don’t think it would matter to the high earner.

I SAH, used to make mid 6 figures. DH makes well over 3M, and keeps increasing annually. I always thought I’d go back to work but the truth is he’d rather have me be doing something low-stress (and handle household logistics, though we have childcare and a daily housekeeper so it’s not like I’m a maid) than be employed.

That said, I know he’d support me no matter what I do - I’d resent staying home if he didn’t!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have several good friends who stay at home. One has forever, one recently left their job. Both have kids in school full time, and one has a nanny as well. They both have cleaning help.

Both of them live very leisurely lives. Manicures, gym, lunches, beauty appointments, watching tv, going to the pool by themselves during the summer while kids are in day camp, etc.

My friend without the nanny is however, constantly shuttling her kids around, cooking full dinners etc - so a slightly less leisurely life. The one with a nanny truly seems to relax most of the time, nanny does the kids activities etc.

My husband would be okay if stayed home with our kids, but would absolutely resent it if I stayed home and relaxed all day while outsourcing all childcare and not contributing to our finances. And I’d probably resent him in the reverse scenario. How does this dynamic play out in marriages? Even if the spouses are relatively high earners, do they care?

I am not asking about stay at home parents of young kids or stay at home parents who don’t have full time nannies - their life is a grind, too. I am talking about stay at home parents who focus on themselves most of the day.

You are not a good friend. It's too bad your friends don't know how you feel because they'd drop you in a heartbeat. Nobody knows what goes on in another person's marriage and family life.

Why? I’m sure there are things my friends wonder about with me as well. I would feel strange lounging by a pool or working out daily knowing my husband is bankrolling all of it. My husband makes more money than I do, and I still have elements of this feeling - but I am the default parent and manage a ton around the house. I would legitimately feel weird just hanging by a pool all day while someone else takes care of my kids and my spouse works. The only exceptions would be if I was retired or had some huge trust fund and I had contributed/wasn’t entirely financially dependent on my spouse (and even then I’d still want to do some stimulating project.)

What many people seem to forget, is that the DH is only able to "bankroll" anything because the DW is taking care of everything else, thereby giving him the time and mental energy to do his job really well.

People who get their fulfillment from an office job are sad AF.
-mom who has stayed home, worked full=time, and is now part-time.

So is the high earning spouse whose career is possible due to the stay at home spouse “sad” because they get fulfillment from their career? Or is it only sad for women to get fulfillment?

Anyway this isn’t about fulfillment from an office job. It’s about fulfillment from not doing much of anything productive. That’s kind of sad too. Raising kids as a highly involved stay at home parent is productive and we’re not talking about that either.

But you have no idea what the average working spouse is “producing”, other than income. I’d much rather my husband be a kept man lounging by the pool all day than a corporate lobbyist or some political shill, for example. At least he’s not actively harming society sitting by the pool, and I can think of many worse outcomes than coming home every day to an energetic spouse in a great mood…

I have one friend in this scenario (where there is a nanny also involved). The reality is, her husband is very image focused. So part of the reason he's ok with her having a "leisurely life" is because she keeps up with her physical appearance. She's still involved with the kids, but they are expected to keep up a certain image too and she wouldn't be able to do it all without the help of the nanny. I wouldn't say her life is full of leisure. At least for me, I would find having to keep up that imagine exhausting. However, she knew that this was the kind of lifestyle he wanted before they got married and it works for them.

Anonymous wrote:I think that if the man makes enough money, he doesn’t care what his wife is doing, as long as the kids and house are taken care of. If they lack money then he’ll get resentful.

You think people who make a ton of money don't have stress and don't secretly wish to retire? Of course, they do. They only keep on going because they really do not like to deal with running a household (even if some functions are outsourced), managing workers, repair people, decorating, and the main thing: child rearing. Some people prefer not to deal with this and have the leisure spouse manage school admissions circus, college "resume building" for the kids, wrangling them to be good at school/activities, managing social life calendar for the family, hosting parties, etc. Ladies of leisure can be quite busy if they want to do all of the above to near perfection. There are literally shows made about it, fiction and reality TV.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have several good friends who stay at home. One has forever, one recently left their job. Both have kids in school full time, and one has a nanny as well. They both have cleaning help.

Both of them live very leisurely lives. Manicures, gym, lunches, beauty appointments, watching tv, going to the pool by themselves during the summer while kids are in day camp, etc.

My friend without the nanny is however, constantly shuttling her kids around, cooking full dinners etc - so a slightly less leisurely life. The one with a nanny truly seems to relax most of the time, nanny does the kids activities etc.

My husband would be okay if stayed home with our kids, but would absolutely resent it if I stayed home and relaxed all day while outsourcing all childcare and not contributing to our finances. And I’d probably resent him in the reverse scenario. How does this dynamic play out in marriages? Even if the spouses are relatively high earners, do they care?

I am not asking about stay at home parents of young kids or stay at home parents who don’t have full time nannies - their life is a grind, too. I am talking about stay at home parents who focus on themselves most of the day.

You are not a good friend. It's too bad your friends don't know how you feel because they'd drop you in a heartbeat. Nobody knows what goes on in another person's marriage and family life.

Why? I’m sure there are things my friends wonder about with me as well. I would feel strange lounging by a pool or working out daily knowing my husband is bankrolling all of it. My husband makes more money than I do, and I still have elements of this feeling - but I am the default parent and manage a ton around the house. I would legitimately feel weird just hanging by a pool all day while someone else takes care of my kids and my spouse works. The only exceptions would be if I was retired or had some huge trust fund and I had contributed/wasn’t entirely financially dependent on my spouse (and even then I’d still want to do some stimulating project.)

What many people seem to forget, is that the DH is only able to "bankroll" anything because the DW is taking care of everything else, thereby giving him the time and mental energy to do his job really well.

People who get their fulfillment from an office job are sad AF.
-mom who has stayed home, worked full=time, and is now part-time.

So is the high earning spouse whose career is possible due to the stay at home spouse “sad” because they get fulfillment from their career? Or is it only sad for women to get fulfillment?

Anyway this isn’t about fulfillment from an office job. It’s about fulfillment from not doing much of anything productive. That’s kind of sad too. Raising kids as a highly involved stay at home parent is productive and we’re not talking about that either.

Granted there will always be lazy people in the world, but the examples provided seem rare. Lots of times there’s way more going on behind the scenes. I was a SAHM. Now I work PT. My hat is off to every parent who works full-time with kids and has no outside help (aside from basic childcare). PT work with only 1 kid still at home is kicking my butt. If i quit my job tomorrow, I wouldn’t feel guilty. Sure occasionally I meet someone who is lazy and outsources but these are rare in my circles. Even my cousin’s wife who lives what appears to be a life of luxury has a lot to contribute to her children and marriage. My cousin doesn’t resent her in the least. He adores her. She’s a fabulous mom and human. She also has health issues which are invisible to outsiders. When I was home, I loved it, but it wasn’t like I sat around. I never had anybody clean my house and had no nanny or even babysitters. It was just me 100% of the time. DH’s only household responsibilities were along gender lines - car, yard, fixing something. When young, DH never got up in the night for feedings, diaper changes or sick kids. He never attended a school meeting and only went to BTSN because the other dads showed up. He never attended a doctors visit. My kids had various therapies. I did 100% of the grocery shopping, errand running, etc. I got the kids to after school and evening activities. He did volunteer coach for a while but I was the team manager. We had more kids than adults so I still did the schlepping to the majority of practices and games as our kids played on multiple teams and he had work or was tired. He was happy I was home because it made his life easier. When the kids were in school, I volunteered in the classroom, library, PTA and for scouts in multiple roles. My schedule did allow for me to do things like meet friends for lunch or go to the gym (not a fancy gym but $10/mo Planet Fitness). As my kids hit HS, I found my days more open but I was running my kids around late into the night and there are no weekends/holidays so I didn’t feel guilty for that quiet time. Without me at home freeing DH for work, his career wouldn’t be where it is. DH works hard and I am grateful he supported me but he only had to work a basic 8-9 hour day, 5 days a week so he came home and relaxed on the sofa while I cooked, clean and schlepped and then got to bed at a reasonable time. I did the math and my work hours were no shorter. Don’t meddle in other people’s relationships. Maybe these spouses are happy with the arrangements and things aren’t as easy for the SAHP as it appears.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DH doesn’t seem to care what I do so long as I am happy.

Would you be happy as long as he is happy? So if he was happy not working, you would be fine with that?

I have no idea. He is super in to his work, so he would be a totally different person. But if he wanted to work as a professor or something and make a lot less, that would be fine. I would go back to being a lawyer. But he would have to do a lot more of the kids wrangling.

Deliberately obtuse. Haven’t y’all ever heard of the golden rule? What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. Just admit it: none of you would ever be happy with a role reversal.

He would be so unhappy. He loves his job.

Most stay at home spouses do not live leisurely lives.
Each partner knows this. They know the reality.
The decision to have one stay one was a joint decision.
The decision was made because it was a win-win for both.

The answer is yes, unless money comes easy to the working spouse or there are other "benefits" they are getting from having a "leisure" spouse, e.g. having someone raise kids for them and also do whatever they please when they are away on frequent business trips..

A working spouse for whom the life is grind and money isn't abundant having a leisure spouse will soon turn family life into a toxic dump. It won't work, there will be resentment and if divorce were to ever happen, it will be bitter and prolonged and both parties will come out broke and broken. I've seen this.

You will have to lean into your homemaker role and be good at it, it's a job like all others. The rich can do what they please as they always did and their problems are of a different kind.

I think that if the man makes enough money, he doesn’t care what his wife is doing, as long as the kids and house are taken care of. If they lack money then he’ll get resentful.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have several good friends who stay at home. One has forever, one recently left their job. Both have kids in school full time, and one has a nanny as well. They both have cleaning help.

Both of them live very leisurely lives. Manicures, gym, lunches, beauty appointments, watching tv, going to the pool by themselves during the summer while kids are in day camp, etc.

My friend without the nanny is however, constantly shuttling her kids around, cooking full dinners etc - so a slightly less leisurely life. The one with a nanny truly seems to relax most of the time, nanny does the kids activities etc.

My husband would be okay if stayed home with our kids, but would absolutely resent it if I stayed home and relaxed all day while outsourcing all childcare and not contributing to our finances. And I’d probably resent him in the reverse scenario. How does this dynamic play out in marriages? Even if the spouses are relatively high earners, do they care?

I am not asking about stay at home parents of young kids or stay at home parents who don’t have full time nannies - their life is a grind, too. I am talking about stay at home parents who focus on themselves most of the day.

You are not a good friend. It's too bad your friends don't know how you feel because they'd drop you in a heartbeat. Nobody knows what goes on in another person's marriage and family life.

Why? I’m sure there are things my friends wonder about with me as well. I would feel strange lounging by a pool or working out daily knowing my husband is bankrolling all of it. My husband makes more money than I do, and I still have elements of this feeling - but I am the default parent and manage a ton around the house. I would legitimately feel weird just hanging by a pool all day while someone else takes care of my kids and my spouse works. The only exceptions would be if I was retired or had some huge trust fund and I had contributed/wasn’t entirely financially dependent on my spouse (and even then I’d still want to do some stimulating project.)

What many people seem to forget, is that the DH is only able to "bankroll" anything because the DW is taking care of everything else, thereby giving him the time and mental energy to do his job really well.

People who get their fulfillment from an office job are sad AF.
-mom who has stayed home, worked full=time, and is now part-time.

Anonymous wrote:My friend's husband stopped working in his late 30s and they never had kids. They're in the late 60s now. She was very resentful but eventually decided to accept the situation. She hadn't agreed to this arrangement and she didn't earn so much money that his income wouldn't have made a meaningful difference in their quality of life and their retirement savings.

I asked whether she believed he'd have stayed married to her if she'd lost her job or ability to work, and she said no. Nonetheless, she chose to stay with him. I don't get it.

She doesn’t want to be alone.

Anonymous wrote:My ex wife used that time to have an affair during my work day, kids’ school day. So, YES.

Gotta get fulfillment somehow.

DH doesn't seem to care and it's also his fault because I am a trailing spouse and had to give up my job. I do the kids stuff before and after school and am always trying to do whatever low paid online jobs I can get, so I guess I don't totally focus on my leisure.