Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with this - but I think the problem is both overbearing parents AND parents constantly turning to screen time

Parents are turning to screen time because it’s impossible to do the adult life stuff and be your kids playmate. But you can’t just send them out, even though that’s what’s best for them.

It’s all interrelated

That and the fact that all these over-worked, undersupported parents still insist on having 3 kids in close succession. Of course that’s hard!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Most everyone who is replying here realizes that this would be beneficial for their child yet is coming up with excuses as to why they can't or won't do it. Kinda sad, really.

The first step to making this happen here is to drastically reduce screen time. That isn't easy but it then forces their hand. For our children, they will play some inside but there is only so much of that they will do until they go outside to play. Access to screens just short-circuits this dynamic. Also, we make regular visits to some of the bigger playground parks - there are always kids and they love these trips. Our kids are all under 12 and we've been doing this their whole lives so YMMV.

That's not really fair, and I say that as someone who has put forth a lot of effort into restricting screens, especially for my younger kids.

Self-control is a finite resources. You can look that up in any psychological study. We have limited amounts of willpower. On a population wide scale, you just have millions and millions of people who have absolutely zero spare bandwidth.

And you can see the consequences everywhere.

Making playing outside normal again and encouraging walking to school at an earlier age would both be good places to start. And that would provide a much needed break for parents.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with this - but I think the problem is both overbearing parents AND parents constantly turning to screen time

Parents are turning to screen time because it’s impossible to do the adult life stuff and be your kids playmate. But you can’t just send them out, even though that’s what’s best for them.

It’s all interrelated

We had no cable tv, and my parents did "adult stuff" while we played by ourselves. My parents never played with us. That's a more recent thing, and I think part of the problem. Parents feel like they *have* to play with their kids. Kids won't find other kids to play with if mommy and daddy play with them all the time, or they have structured activities everyday. It becomes a vicious circle.

Just back off and let your kids figure it out. I'm not saying never play with your kids, but other kids should be their main source of playmates, not the parents or activities.

This is a situation where talking about "parents" as a monolith just doesn't work. And also why a tendency to view the past nostalgically, and the present critically, can lead you astray.

It's true that parents today are more likely to feel like they "have" to play with their kids. But why is that? In my case, it's because I was raised by people who actively disliked their children, and that had a negative impact on me both as a kid and as an adult. So I do feel I have an obligation to spend time with my kids, get to know them, take an interest in what they are interested in. But it's not driven by some vague cultural notion or just being a martyr. Is based on my own experience and a recognition that ignoring your kids and telling them, always, to please leave mommy and daddy alone, might have a negative impact on their psyche. I don't want my kids to have to spend two decades in therapy, as I have, building the scaffolding of a sense of self worth, because I am too busy or disinterested to play with them. So yes, I sometimes force myself to play with my kids even when I'm not really in the mood.

Now, I know that not all parents had my experience as a child. But I also no that I am nowhere near alone in it. My parents were the way they were for a few reasons, and they are common: (1) they were raised by Greatest Generation parents who were also alcoholics with untreated mental illness, including PTSD from the war/depression, and (2) they had kids young and out of obligation, and did not really view not having kids as an option. This is an extremely common combination of factors for people who had kids in the 1970s and 80s, and it often resulted in the kind of parental neglect I experienced, which means that a lot of people parenting today are working to correct that pattern with their own kids.

Yes people are sometimes overzealous, and I think parents could stand to be told, more often, "It's okay to take breaks from your kids, and it's okay to let your kids figure stuff out." But parents aren't playing with their kids or focusing on their kids because they are control freaks or because they are subscribing to some crackpot parenting technique they learned on Tik Tok. Most of the time parents are spending time with their kids in an effort to undo generational trauma. That's actually good! Why don't we talk more about how that's actually good?

whoaw.. you have issues that have nothing to do with your kids. You should've taken care of that before you had kids.

If I tell my kids to go play rather than expect me to play with them all the time that doesn't mean I don't love my kids. I'm sorry about your childhood, but you are projecting.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Most everyone who is replying here realizes that this would be beneficial for their child yet is coming up with excuses as to why they can't or won't do it. Kinda sad, really.

The first step to making this happen here is to drastically reduce screen time. That isn't easy but it then forces their hand. For our children, they will play some inside but there is only so much of that they will do until they go outside to play. Access to screens just short-circuits this dynamic. Also, we make regular visits to some of the bigger playground parks - there are always kids and they love these trips. Our kids are all under 12 and we've been doing this their whole lives so YMMV.

Do you work?

Anonymous wrote:We live downtown. My kids cant play outside bc of guns, mentally ill homeless people and drugs, as well as insanely speeding cars, motorcycles and atvs. My older one now takes metro to school across town. It’s a bit of a wasteland for kids. I grew up with a lot of freedom in the 80s in a rural area. I havent over scheduled my kids at all, but it’s still sad. “There are no children here”… and it’s Halloween.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't even think that kids even get the concept if free play anymore. The holidays are here, dh has a large family. 10 nieces and nephew all between the ages of 4-13. I swear when we gather for holidays and things that they don't know what to do or how to entertain themselves anymore. They just wander around looking for adults to find them something to do. It's sad really, hanging with my cousins was so great growing up.

This definitely isn’t universal… there are 10 grandkids on my side, ages 2-14 (my kids & their cousins). At gatherings, they run around outside, play board games together, play hide & seek, just talk, etc. Usually in smaller groups than 10, but they definitely play independently (except the 2 yo still needs an adult around of course).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with this - but I think the problem is both overbearing parents AND parents constantly turning to screen time

Parents are turning to screen time because it’s impossible to do the adult life stuff and be your kids playmate. But you can’t just send them out, even though that’s what’s best for them.

It’s all interrelated

We had no cable tv, and my parents did "adult stuff" while we played by ourselves. My parents never played with us. That's a more recent thing, and I think part of the problem. Parents feel like they *have* to play with their kids. Kids won't find other kids to play with if mommy and daddy play with them all the time, or they have structured activities everyday. It becomes a vicious circle.

Just back off and let your kids figure it out. I'm not saying never play with your kids, but other kids should be their main source of playmates, not the parents or activities.

This is a situation where talking about "parents" as a monolith just doesn't work. And also why a tendency to view the past nostalgically, and the present critically, can lead you astray.

It's true that parents today are more likely to feel like they "have" to play with their kids. But why is that? In my case, it's because I was raised by people who actively disliked their children, and that had a negative impact on me both as a kid and as an adult. So I do feel I have an obligation to spend time with my kids, get to know them, take an interest in what they are interested in. But it's not driven by some vague cultural notion or just being a martyr. Is based on my own experience and a recognition that ignoring your kids and telling them, always, to please leave mommy and daddy alone, might have a negative impact on their psyche. I don't want my kids to have to spend two decades in therapy, as I have, building the scaffolding of a sense of self worth, because I am too busy or disinterested to play with them. So yes, I sometimes force myself to play with my kids even when I'm not really in the mood.

Now, I know that not all parents had my experience as a child. But I also no that I am nowhere near alone in it. My parents were the way they were for a few reasons, and they are common: (1) they were raised by Greatest Generation parents who were also alcoholics with untreated mental illness, including PTSD from the war/depression, and (2) they had kids young and out of obligation, and did not really view not having kids as an option. This is an extremely common combination of factors for people who had kids in the 1970s and 80s, and it often resulted in the kind of parental neglect I experienced, which means that a lot of people parenting today are working to correct that pattern with their own kids.

Yes people are sometimes overzealous, and I think parents could stand to be told, more often, "It's okay to take breaks from your kids, and it's okay to let your kids figure stuff out." But parents aren't playing with their kids or focusing on their kids because they are control freaks or because they are subscribing to some crackpot parenting technique they learned on Tik Tok. Most of the time parents are spending time with their kids in an effort to undo generational trauma. That's actually good! Why don't we talk more about how that's actually good?

Anonymous wrote:We live downtown. My kids cant play outside bc of guns, mentally ill homeless people and drugs, as well as insanely speeding cars, motorcycles and atvs. My older one now takes metro to school across town. It’s a bit of a wasteland for kids. I grew up with a lot of freedom in the 80s in a rural area. I havent over scheduled my kids at all, but it’s still sad. “There are no children here”… and it’s Halloween.

Anonymous wrote:I don't even think that kids even get the concept if free play anymore. The holidays are here, dh has a large family. 10 nieces and nephew all between the ages of 4-13. I swear when we gather for holidays and things that they don't know what to do or how to entertain themselves anymore. They just wander around looking for adults to find them something to do. It's sad really, hanging with my cousins was so great growing up.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As though aftercare isn't a Lord of the Flies free for all...

Yeah, I'm trying to understand why folks think aftercare or summer day camp is part of this particular problem. Both after care and traditional day camps (not talking about academic or specialty camps) are A LOT of unstructured play and a lot of it is outside and active. At my DD's camp last year she had a big free swim every afternoon (no different than going to the pool with friends) and overall I'd say a good 60% of the day was unstructured hanging out with peers -- jumping on trampolines, swinging in hammocks, making friendship bracelets and chatting, stuff like that... Certainly no screens! My kindergarten niece looooooves after care because it's truly just a big playdate. These things are not the problem.

I think a child does suffer for being truly over-scheduled with STRUCTURED activities, so they don't have time for playing with friends(whether its running around with neighborhood kids, playdates, aftercare, at day camp, etc.). You kid doesn't have to free roam though to have unstructured play with peers. And a balance with some structured activities is ok too.

You just imposed a pretty big structure on all that unstructured play you advocate: with other kids. You had to put that qualifier in every chance you got.

Parents who think there is something wrong with a child playing by herself or with siblings are another source of childhood anxiety. Like they can never live up to your expectations of being a social butterfly unless they are always at work socializing. Are you also the kind of parent who also engineers your children's friendships behind the scenes, making sure they only play with the "right" kids? Never being allowed to make friends without parental approval is not good for a child's mental health either.

Parents who overemphasize socializing are not better than parents who overemphasize an instument or sport.

Actually, I think down time and time spent alone are very important too. But did you read the interview? The particular issue being discussed is that kids need time with other kids so they can navigate social situations, deal with "minor bullying" (his words), solve a problem as a group, etc. My point was kind of don't let perfect be the enemy of the good...yes, free roaming the neighborhood with other kids provides a great setting to develop those skills, but so, actually, do play dates, after care, and even certain summer camps.

Also, I'm at a total loss as to what from post gave you the impression that I'm a social engineering parent. Was it just the mere mention of "playdate"? I schedule playdates for my DD with the kids SHE asks me to. Jeez.

My kid had a playdate, and the mom of the playdate felt she needed to run interference when the kids started arguing. When my kids have a playdate, I tell them to go into the basement, and I stay in the kitchen. If they argue, they need to figure it out.

I tell the same to my kids. Unless there is blood or broken bones, you need to solve your own arguments.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with this - but I think the problem is both overbearing parents AND parents constantly turning to screen time

Parents are turning to screen time because it’s impossible to do the adult life stuff and be your kids playmate. But you can’t just send them out, even though that’s what’s best for them.

It’s all interrelated

We had no cable tv, and my parents did "adult stuff" while we played by ourselves. My parents never played with us. That's a more recent thing, and I think part of the problem. Parents feel like they *have* to play with their kids. Kids won't find other kids to play with if mommy and daddy play with them all the time, or they have structured activities everyday. It becomes a vicious circle.

Just back off and let your kids figure it out. I'm not saying never play with your kids, but other kids should be their main source of playmates, not the parents or activities.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So this is just his guess? It’s not very coherent. School has a lot of free play basically unsupervised time built into it, especially aftercare and before care. Basically the same as his ‘grandparent’ suggestion. Also There are lots of kids in Asia and in other parts of the world who have lots of chores or academic duties and who aren’t depressed. I hated free play as a kid. Some kids find their meaning in work/chores/helping the family. This guy is not very convincing and the interview is a word salad. ‘Go outside you will be happier!’ Sometimes that’s true, sometimes not.

But, even if kids and young teens for that matter, say that they don't like or want to go outside and have free play, they need it. It's good for them.

Also, kids need to learn to be bored. Life isn't always fun and exciting. There's a lot of waiting and boredom in life, and if you don't learn to deal with it, you get anxious.

There's too much distraction with phones and electronics.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So this is just his guess? It’s not very coherent. School has a lot of free play basically unsupervised time built into it, especially aftercare and before care. Basically the same as his ‘grandparent’ suggestion. Also There are lots of kids in Asia and in other parts of the world who have lots of chores or academic duties and who aren’t depressed. I hated free play as a kid. Some kids find their meaning in work/chores/helping the family. This guy is not very convincing and the interview is a word salad. ‘Go outside you will be happier!’ Sometimes that’s true, sometimes not.

But, even if kids and young teens for that matter, say that they don't like or want to go outside and have free play, they need it. It's good for them.