Does brother think the skeevy SF is acting normally because he was raised in a horrible home full of active molestation? My guess is his radar is way off and he may not fully grasp how families are supposed to interact, what secrets are normal, what are appropriate boundaries at all. All the posters here assume that brother is a rational person who will logically make good parenting choices, but he came out of an abusive and toxic home too

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am so sorry this happened to you.

Is your stepfather your brother’s father?

Were you very clear on what your stepfather did to you and for how long it went on or were you vague?

If you were clear and left no misunderstandings, your brother and his wife either:

1) don’t believe you or
2) believe you and don’t care.

So I think you should stop worrying about how this will affect your relationship with them. They are vile.

The only way you will protect your nieces is to file a police report. Even that may not work, but at least you will have a clear conscious that you tried.

Op here. Stepdad is not my brothers father. Stepdad has no biological kids.

I think my brother and SIL believe me but they aren’t willing to disrupt the family relationships based on the information I gave them because that would be more work/discomfort for them.

To be clear-I actually believe my brother and SIL probably watch their kids like hawks around my mom and stepdad. I just think it would help me to hear the steps they are taking because the thought of my stepdad having access to children just makes me sick. I think if they told me the steps that they take, it would help me feel better.

I did learn today that my SIL’s parents went with my brother, SIL, and nieces for the visit to my mom and stepdad (SIL parents and my parents are friends). I don’t know if that was for purely social reasons or if it was part of a larger plan to have more eyes on my nieces.

I would talk to the other grandparents.

Before she talks to her brother?! OP, please don't do this. Don't feel that you need to disclose this trauma to your SIL's parents. You already got a lot of great language to use when approaching your brother about it, so please consider just doing that.

It's not really clear to me what "steps" you are hoping to hear about. They didn't leave their kids alone with your mother and stepfather, it sounds like. It also sounds like there was additional adult supervision in the form of the other grandparents. What if those are the only answers they have for you about what "steps" they are taking to protect their kids? Would it still be helpful just to know that it's something they're considering?

Op here. It would make me feel better to know that they don’t leave kids alone with mom and stepdad, ever, not even for a minute. It would help to know that the kids sleep in the same room as brother and SIL behind a locked door. It would help to know that they are mindful of things like stepdad and excessive hugging/tickling/snuggling (he can be very weird about this kind of thing and no one ever acknowledges it. For example, my stepdad will give long lingering full body hugs to my SILs, and will just he constantly touching them-massaging their shoulders, rubbing their thighs, etc.). I want to know that they aren’t allowing him to do stuff like that to my nieces (or to my SIL in front of my nieces).

I get that I’m not entitled to this info and I guess it’s none of my business but I feel just beside myself with worry and it would help to hear my brother say that OF COURSE they do the above and that he wouldn’t DREAM of leaving his kids alone with my mother, even.

I honestly have zero information about how they navigate this stuff. I didn’t even learn about the visit from them, I learned about it from my other sibling.

Have a good support system in place for yourself OP when you hear nothing of the above. I am 99.909999999% certain SIL's parents have no idea. These overlapping relationships that have been cultivated are part of what gives the perv social control over a group.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am so sorry this happened to you.

Is your stepfather your brother’s father?

Were you very clear on what your stepfather did to you and for how long it went on or were you vague?

If you were clear and left no misunderstandings, your brother and his wife either:

1) don’t believe you or
2) believe you and don’t care.

So I think you should stop worrying about how this will affect your relationship with them. They are vile.

The only way you will protect your nieces is to file a police report. Even that may not work, but at least you will have a clear conscious that you tried.

Op here. Stepdad is not my brothers father. Stepdad has no biological kids.

I think my brother and SIL believe me but they aren’t willing to disrupt the family relationships based on the information I gave them because that would be more work/discomfort for them.

To be clear-I actually believe my brother and SIL probably watch their kids like hawks around my mom and stepdad. I just think it would help me to hear the steps they are taking because the thought of my stepdad having access to children just makes me sick. I think if they told me the steps that they take, it would help me feel better.

I did learn today that my SIL’s parents went with my brother, SIL, and nieces for the visit to my mom and stepdad (SIL parents and my parents are friends). I don’t know if that was for purely social reasons or if it was part of a larger plan to have more eyes on my nieces.

I would talk to the other grandparents.

Before she talks to her brother?! OP, please don't do this. Don't feel that you need to disclose this trauma to your SIL's parents. You already got a lot of great language to use when approaching your brother about it, so please consider just doing that.

It's not really clear to me what "steps" you are hoping to hear about. They didn't leave their kids alone with your mother and stepfather, it sounds like. It also sounds like there was additional adult supervision in the form of the other grandparents. What if those are the only answers they have for you about what "steps" they are taking to protect their kids? Would it still be helpful just to know that it's something they're considering?

Op here. It would make me feel better to know that they don’t leave kids alone with mom and stepdad, ever, not even for a minute. It would help to know that the kids sleep in the same room as brother and SIL behind a locked door. It would help to know that they are mindful of things like stepdad and excessive hugging/tickling/snuggling (he can be very weird about this kind of thing and no one ever acknowledges it. For example, my stepdad will give long lingering full body hugs to my SILs, and will just he constantly touching them-massaging their shoulders, rubbing their thighs, etc.). I want to know that they aren’t allowing him to do stuff like that to my nieces (or to my SIL in front of my nieces).

I get that I’m not entitled to this info and I guess it’s none of my business but I feel just beside myself with worry and it would help to hear my brother say that OF COURSE they do the above and that he wouldn’t DREAM of leaving his kids alone with my mother, even.

I honestly have zero information about how they navigate this stuff. I didn’t even learn about the visit from them, I learned about it from my other sibling.

Rubbing his daughter-in-laws' thighs? FFS. And these women just let it happen? And their DHs do too? I bet he does all these lingering hugs and touches juuuusst long enough then breaks away and everyone thinks, "Uh, OK, well it's over now so maybe it wasn't as weird as I felt in the moment...."

OP, does he have a reputation as "Oh, that's just ol' granpa Jim, he's a hugger, he's super affectionate with everyone!" That can do a lot to create a wall around an abuser. And before someone says this is an overreaction -- I have a very huggy, affectionate DH but the difference between an man like that and a man like OP's stepfather is clear IF people actually admit to themselves that things like a thigh rub or lingering hugs are pretty clear. People are so afraid to truly admit to themselves when someone's touching is creepy--so much fear of offense or "overreaction." You know it when you see it, or when you feel it happen to you, but we (especially women) are socialized to "Be nice!" and just deal.

The brother and SIL truly need to stop staying nights in that house but I doubt they will. I suspect they want to "be nice" and have been snowed by grandpa's "affectionate" ways.

OP, you have a miniscule to no chance of getting answers you want to hear from B & SIL. He lets his wife be sexually assualted in front of him? I've heard of other families where this happens. If it was just the perv many would distance but the whole family normalizes it, so distancing means losing everyone. The whole group dynamic is SICK and is part of the reason that incest is often multi-generational, boundaries are not taught or enforced or are warped. I'm so sorry.

You can consider legal options against SF but it may be too late and it may not matter re: how your father interacts with him anyway.

Anonymous wrote:I was raped as an adult, and the one thing that I did not expect was how many people 100% believed me, but also did not care and did not change their behavior in any way with respect to the rapist. I suspect it's the same for CSA. I expected to not be believed, but to be believed and then dismissed, well, that was additional trauma.
The reality is, many people don't care until it's them. Even if it's their children.

I am so sorry

Anonymous wrote:I am so sorry this happened to you.

Is your stepfather your brother’s father?

Were you very clear on what your stepfather did to you and for how long it went on or were you vague?

If you were clear and left no misunderstandings, your brother and his wife either:

1) don’t believe you or
2) believe you and don’t care.

So I think you should stop worrying about how this will affect your relationship with them. They are vile.

The only way you will protect your nieces is to file a police report. Even that may not work, but at least you will have a clear conscious that you tried.

It may be past the statute of limitations, OP could check the law where it occurred.

I too wonder if SF is brother's father?

I’m sorry this happened to you, OP. It took a lot of courage and strength for you to tell your brother and SIL this info and it is distressing that they still take their kids there to visit even after you told them. If my sibling told me something similar, my kids would never be around the perpetrator. I think it’s awful that your brother and SIL maintain a relationship with your mom and your stepdad and I agree with a PP that I think it’s likely they either don’t believe you or believe you and yet don’t care.

I think for your nieces’ sake, you reach out to your brother and SIL one more time. If you can, tell them everything that happened—details, how it affected you, how your mom didn’t help you, how worried you are about your nieces’ safety. If your brother and SIL don’t take it more seriously this time, I don’t think there’s anything else you can do, unfortunately. But reach out one more time and just reiterate to them how terrible your abuse was—how your mom was involved. Maybe they have tried to suppress the idea of it and need to be reminded.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am so sorry this happened to you.

Is your stepfather your brother’s father?

Were you very clear on what your stepfather did to you and for how long it went on or were you vague?

If you were clear and left no misunderstandings, your brother and his wife either:

1) don’t believe you or
2) believe you and don’t care.

So I think you should stop worrying about how this will affect your relationship with them. They are vile.

The only way you will protect your nieces is to file a police report. Even that may not work, but at least you will have a clear conscious that you tried.

Op here. Stepdad is not my brothers father. Stepdad has no biological kids.

I think my brother and SIL believe me but they aren’t willing to disrupt the family relationships based on the information I gave them because that would be more work/discomfort for them.

To be clear-I actually believe my brother and SIL probably watch their kids like hawks around my mom and stepdad. I just think it would help me to hear the steps they are taking because the thought of my stepdad having access to children just makes me sick. I think if they told me the steps that they take, it would help me feel better.

I did learn today that my SIL’s parents went with my brother, SIL, and nieces for the visit to my mom and stepdad (SIL parents and my parents are friends). I don’t know if that was for purely social reasons or if it was part of a larger plan to have more eyes on my nieces.

I would talk to the other grandparents.

Before she talks to her brother?! OP, please don't do this. Don't feel that you need to disclose this trauma to your SIL's parents. You already got a lot of great language to use when approaching your brother about it, so please consider just doing that.

It's not really clear to me what "steps" you are hoping to hear about. They didn't leave their kids alone with your mother and stepfather, it sounds like. It also sounds like there was additional adult supervision in the form of the other grandparents. What if those are the only answers they have for you about what "steps" they are taking to protect their kids? Would it still be helpful just to know that it's something they're considering?

this is about protecting the kids and OP assuaging her own conscience. Not about OP protecting herself. talking to the grandparents would absolutely be a reasonable step. these kids should never be around that man, period.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am so sorry this happened to you.

Is your stepfather your brother’s father?

Were you very clear on what your stepfather did to you and for how long it went on or were you vague?

If you were clear and left no misunderstandings, your brother and his wife either:

1) don’t believe you or
2) believe you and don’t care.

So I think you should stop worrying about how this will affect your relationship with them. They are vile.

The only way you will protect your nieces is to file a police report. Even that may not work, but at least you will have a clear conscious that you tried.

Op here. Stepdad is not my brothers father. Stepdad has no biological kids.

I think my brother and SIL believe me but they aren’t willing to disrupt the family relationships based on the information I gave them because that would be more work/discomfort for them.

To be clear-I actually believe my brother and SIL probably watch their kids like hawks around my mom and stepdad. I just think it would help me to hear the steps they are taking because the thought of my stepdad having access to children just makes me sick. I think if they told me the steps that they take, it would help me feel better.

I did learn today that my SIL’s parents went with my brother, SIL, and nieces for the visit to my mom and stepdad (SIL parents and my parents are friends). I don’t know if that was for purely social reasons or if it was part of a larger plan to have more eyes on my nieces.

I would talk to the other grandparents.

Before she talks to her brother?! OP, please don't do this. Don't feel that you need to disclose this trauma to your SIL's parents. You already got a lot of great language to use when approaching your brother about it, so please consider just doing that.

It's not really clear to me what "steps" you are hoping to hear about. They didn't leave their kids alone with your mother and stepfather, it sounds like. It also sounds like there was additional adult supervision in the form of the other grandparents. What if those are the only answers they have for you about what "steps" they are taking to protect their kids? Would it still be helpful just to know that it's something they're considering?

Op here. It would make me feel better to know that they don’t leave kids alone with mom and stepdad, ever, not even for a minute. It would help to know that the kids sleep in the same room as brother and SIL behind a locked door. It would help to know that they are mindful of things like stepdad and excessive hugging/tickling/snuggling (he can be very weird about this kind of thing and no one ever acknowledges it. For example, my stepdad will give long lingering full body hugs to my SILs, and will just he constantly touching them-massaging their shoulders, rubbing their thighs, etc.). I want to know that they aren’t allowing him to do stuff like that to my nieces (or to my SIL in front of my nieces).

I get that I’m not entitled to this info and I guess it’s none of my business but I feel just beside myself with worry and it would help to hear my brother say that OF COURSE they do the above and that he wouldn’t DREAM of leaving his kids alone with my mother, even.

I honestly have zero information about how they navigate this stuff. I didn’t even learn about the visit from them, I learned about it from my other sibling.

Rubbing his daughter-in-laws' thighs? FFS. And these women just let it happen? And their DHs do too? I bet he does all these lingering hugs and touches juuuusst long enough then breaks away and everyone thinks, "Uh, OK, well it's over now so maybe it wasn't as weird as I felt in the moment...."

OP, does he have a reputation as "Oh, that's just ol' granpa Jim, he's a hugger, he's super affectionate with everyone!" That can do a lot to create a wall around an abuser. And before someone says this is an overreaction -- I have a very huggy, affectionate DH but the difference between an man like that and a man like OP's stepfather is clear IF people actually admit to themselves that things like a thigh rub or lingering hugs are pretty clear. People are so afraid to truly admit to themselves when someone's touching is creepy--so much fear of offense or "overreaction." You know it when you see it, or when you feel it happen to you, but we (especially women) are socialized to "Be nice!" and just deal.

The brother and SIL truly need to stop staying nights in that house but I doubt they will. I suspect they want to "be nice" and have been snowed by grandpa's "affectionate" ways.

I want to add that I was routinely molested by my uncles while my family was downstairs playing cards or making dinner....... It only takes a minute or two for a male predator to do something and it escalates from there........ I was molested outside. I was molested in the laundry room and their bedrooms....... It's not like they steal a child for 3 hours..... So please don't take this lightly for the sake of your nieces

As a survivor of child sexual abuse, I cannot encourage strongly enough that you should cut off all contact with anyone who still treats this person as a normal human being and brings her children around them...... I would spread the word wide and loud because sexual predators love it when victims live in darkness and are too scared to say anything

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My stepdad sexually abused me from age 12 to age 17. My brother maintains a relationship with my mother and stepdad. My brother has 3 daughters.

Two years ago, I shared with my brother the details of the sexual abuse committed by my stepdad so he could protect his children.

I recently learned that two weeks ago, my brother and his wife took their kids to visit my parents and spent the weekend there, spending the night in my parent’s house.

I want to ask them what measures they take to keep their kids safe, but I am afraid that even raising the question might alienate them. Is there a way to ask this question without starting a huge kerfuffle?

How did your brother respond when you disclosed the abuse to him? You said that he maintains a relationship with them, which implies that you do not. How old are the daughters in question?

Op here. He was very bothered by what I shared and he said he believed me. His kids range from age 2-9.

I think it is worth sharing with him that you were concerned when you heard that they'd stayed overnight at your parents' house. Maybe he hasn't been concerned thus far because his kids have been younger, but they are now approaching the age you were when the abuse began, which would scare the hell out of me in your shoes. It's also worth considering that if he's maintained a somewhat normal relationship with them for the last 2 years, his guard is down about the threat. It's worth asking if they are doing anything differently now that their oldest daughter is approaching puberty.

NP and asking OP to re-read this PP's post, especially the bold. This is VERY perceptive and should be taken seriously as advice, OP. You cannot know for sure, but it's entirely possible that your brother, as PP so rightly points out, has thought his kids' young age protects them (it won't forever, and besides that, there are molesters who prefer very young children). And your brother might be thinking, "I've been going there for two years with the girls, I've never seen anything odd," so his guard is down.

It's time to take him and SIL aside again, and reiterate that the abuse you endured was real and serious, and began when you were age X, which their girls are now approaching. I would give them resources to read about family sexual abuse, OP. Do it all with a very non-judgmental (toward them) tone and attitude, do NOT sound accusatory toward them, do your best to emphasize you are not judging them as parents. But explain that you have had experiences they have not had, and want to spare their children repeating your horrible, scarring experience and ask them if they have methods for ensuring their kids are never alone with grandpa (and he should of course never be allowed to take them anywhere on his own). I know you fear alienating them. If you get along well with them, I might actually SAY out loud, "I'm afraid that by bringing this up, I'll alienate or anger you, and that is something I don't want to do, because I love you and the kids. But I also am having to set that fear aside to talk to you, which I hope you understand."

Your stepfather may be very charming, kind, sweet to children and that may have sucked brother and SIL in so they want to believe him over you. I'd tell them that if he seems lovely with the little girls, that is how he was with you, too.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am so sorry this happened to you.

Is your stepfather your brother’s father?

Were you very clear on what your stepfather did to you and for how long it went on or were you vague?

If you were clear and left no misunderstandings, your brother and his wife either:

1) don’t believe you or
2) believe you and don’t care.

So I think you should stop worrying about how this will affect your relationship with them. They are vile.

The only way you will protect your nieces is to file a police report. Even that may not work, but at least you will have a clear conscious that you tried.

Op here. Stepdad is not my brothers father. Stepdad has no biological kids.

I think my brother and SIL believe me but they aren’t willing to disrupt the family relationships based on the information I gave them because that would be more work/discomfort for them.

To be clear-I actually believe my brother and SIL probably watch their kids like hawks around my mom and stepdad. I just think it would help me to hear the steps they are taking because the thought of my stepdad having access to children just makes me sick. I think if they told me the steps that they take, it would help me feel better.

I did learn today that my SIL’s parents went with my brother, SIL, and nieces for the visit to my mom and stepdad (SIL parents and my parents are friends). I don’t know if that was for purely social reasons or if it was part of a larger plan to have more eyes on my nieces.

I would talk to the other grandparents.

Before she talks to her brother?! OP, please don't do this. Don't feel that you need to disclose this trauma to your SIL's parents. You already got a lot of great language to use when approaching your brother about it, so please consider just doing that.

It's not really clear to me what "steps" you are hoping to hear about. They didn't leave their kids alone with your mother and stepfather, it sounds like. It also sounds like there was additional adult supervision in the form of the other grandparents. What if those are the only answers they have for you about what "steps" they are taking to protect their kids? Would it still be helpful just to know that it's something they're considering?

Op here. It would make me feel better to know that they don’t leave kids alone with mom and stepdad, ever, not even for a minute. It would help to know that the kids sleep in the same room as brother and SIL behind a locked door. It would help to know that they are mindful of things like stepdad and excessive hugging/tickling/snuggling (he can be very weird about this kind of thing and no one ever acknowledges it. For example, my stepdad will give long lingering full body hugs to my SILs, and will just he constantly touching them-massaging their shoulders, rubbing their thighs, etc.). I want to know that they aren’t allowing him to do stuff like that to my nieces (or to my SIL in front of my nieces).

I get that I’m not entitled to this info and I guess it’s none of my business but I feel just beside myself with worry and it would help to hear my brother say that OF COURSE they do the above and that he wouldn’t DREAM of leaving his kids alone with my mother, even.

I honestly have zero information about how they navigate this stuff. I didn’t even learn about the visit from them, I learned about it from my other sibling.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am so sorry this happened to you.

Is your stepfather your brother’s father?

Were you very clear on what your stepfather did to you and for how long it went on or were you vague?

If you were clear and left no misunderstandings, your brother and his wife either:

1) don’t believe you or
2) believe you and don’t care.

So I think you should stop worrying about how this will affect your relationship with them. They are vile.

The only way you will protect your nieces is to file a police report. Even that may not work, but at least you will have a clear conscious that you tried.

Op here. Stepdad is not my brothers father. Stepdad has no biological kids.

I think my brother and SIL believe me but they aren’t willing to disrupt the family relationships based on the information I gave them because that would be more work/discomfort for them.

To be clear-I actually believe my brother and SIL probably watch their kids like hawks around my mom and stepdad. I just think it would help me to hear the steps they are taking because the thought of my stepdad having access to children just makes me sick. I think if they told me the steps that they take, it would help me feel better.

I did learn today that my SIL’s parents went with my brother, SIL, and nieces for the visit to my mom and stepdad (SIL parents and my parents are friends). I don’t know if that was for purely social reasons or if it was part of a larger plan to have more eyes on my nieces.

I would talk to the other grandparents.

Before she talks to her brother?! OP, please don't do this. Don't feel that you need to disclose this trauma to your SIL's parents. You already got a lot of great language to use when approaching your brother about it, so please consider just doing that.

It's not really clear to me what "steps" you are hoping to hear about. They didn't leave their kids alone with your mother and stepfather, it sounds like. It also sounds like there was additional adult supervision in the form of the other grandparents. What if those are the only answers they have for you about what "steps" they are taking to protect their kids? Would it still be helpful just to know that it's something they're considering?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am so sorry this happened to you.

Is your stepfather your brother’s father?

Were you very clear on what your stepfather did to you and for how long it went on or were you vague?

If you were clear and left no misunderstandings, your brother and his wife either:

1) don’t believe you or
2) believe you and don’t care.

So I think you should stop worrying about how this will affect your relationship with them. They are vile.

The only way you will protect your nieces is to file a police report. Even that may not work, but at least you will have a clear conscious that you tried.

Op here. Stepdad is not my brothers father. Stepdad has no biological kids.

I think my brother and SIL believe me but they aren’t willing to disrupt the family relationships based on the information I gave them because that would be more work/discomfort for them.

To be clear-I actually believe my brother and SIL probably watch their kids like hawks around my mom and stepdad. I just think it would help me to hear the steps they are taking because the thought of my stepdad having access to children just makes me sick. I think if they told me the steps that they take, it would help me feel better.

I did learn today that my SIL’s parents went with my brother, SIL, and nieces for the visit to my mom and stepdad (SIL parents and my parents are friends). I don’t know if that was for purely social reasons or if it was part of a larger plan to have more eyes on my nieces.

I would talk to the other grandparents.

Anonymous wrote:I am so sorry this happened to you.

Is your stepfather your brother’s father?

Were you very clear on what your stepfather did to you and for how long it went on or were you vague?

If you were clear and left no misunderstandings, your brother and his wife either:

1) don’t believe you or
2) believe you and don’t care.

So I think you should stop worrying about how this will affect your relationship with them. They are vile.

The only way you will protect your nieces is to file a police report. Even that may not work, but at least you will have a clear conscious that you tried.

Op here. Stepdad is not my brothers father. Stepdad has no biological kids.

I think my brother and SIL believe me but they aren’t willing to disrupt the family relationships based on the information I gave them because that would be more work/discomfort for them.

To be clear-I actually believe my brother and SIL probably watch their kids like hawks around my mom and stepdad. I just think it would help me to hear the steps they are taking because the thought of my stepdad having access to children just makes me sick. I think if they told me the steps that they take, it would help me feel better.

I did learn today that my SIL’s parents went with my brother, SIL, and nieces for the visit to my mom and stepdad (SIL parents and my parents are friends). I don’t know if that was for purely social reasons or if it was part of a larger plan to have more eyes on my nieces.