Anonymous wrote:People won’t say it but it proximity to wealthy people which is why legacy admits will never go away.

I read that all the time here, but nobody has convincingly explained yet why socially elite ultra rich people want to hang out with a GS-12’s kids from Reston.

Like if there was a poor person version of this board and everyone was posting there the main reason to go to a T20 that was you could meet all these UMC kids, like big Washington lawyers kids, all of you would be going ick I don’t want those kids around and you wouldn’t be giving them jobs and internships. You give those to the other UMC kids whose parents can do something for you.

You’re the poor people to legitimately wealthy folks. Wow, you can pay cash for Amherst, who cares. That’s a rounding error for them.

They don’t want their daughter anywhere near your math nerd with no social value and zero business connections that can help them.

They already have 100 people just like you working for them and they don’t need you to get face time with a cabinet secretary or a Senator.

Anonymous wrote:I actually think that the elite colleges give the biggest boost to low income or first Gen students who have the academic chops for the college and get a free ride. For the wealthy and connected, the same colleges are sort of just another gate or rite of passage. They are there to rub elbows with other wealthy students some of whom they pRobably already know depending on their family circles. I think the kids who fare the worst are MC kids like OP who might take on debt for the opportunity, but they lack the social awareness or connections to do anything meaningful with the experience simply bc they just don’t have the context for what’s at play. They think it’s for a college degree.

For the record, OP did not take on any debt (ROTC). Low class, I know.

Your typical suburban DCUMer with a mere above average to good student but having a desire to send kids to 2nd rate privates rather than 1st rate publics for some delusional bragging rights.

I actually think that the elite colleges give the biggest boost to low income or first Gen students who have the academic chops for the college and get a free ride. For the wealthy and connected, the same colleges are sort of just another gate or rite of passage. They are there to rub elbows with other wealthy students some of whom they pRobably already know depending on their family circles. I think the kids who fare the worst are MC kids like OP who might take on debt for the opportunity, but they lack the social awareness or connections to do anything meaningful with the experience simply bc they just don’t have the context for what’s at play. They think it’s for a college degree.

I grew up in New England in the 1970s. Historically, state schools were viewed as 2nd rate. There were (and are) many private schools to choose from, compared to the rest of the country. And there had been a lack of investment in state universities. I think that has changed. UConn is a much better school now than it was 30 years ago. So, when I was applying to college, if you were a good student, you aimed for a selective, private school.

Also for certain professions, namely management consulting and investment banking, entry was much easier out of a selective private school versus the average state university.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To me the question isn’t what’s the allure of selective colleges - it’s what’s the allure of expensive ones. The better state flagships - most of the Big Ten, the SEC, the ACC, the UC schools etc - are all selective, fun, and very good. Why pay more for silly second tier privates like Tulane, Wake, etc?

I always wonder this. I'd rather go to a school where it's obvious I was looking for something other than prestige over an obvious consolation prize. Just me?

People who are chasing prestige usually lie to themselves. They tell themselves that they want a mid-size university and really like the city of Boston. It’s easier to decide that Tufts is the strategic ED play than to admit you’re lying to yourself.

Anonymous wrote:You get to be around rich people. I went to a selective college as a middle class kid. I got a good education, but I could have gotten that at my state school. The biggest thing I got was marrying into money.

The most selective colleges have a substantial percent of students on FA. If you're coming from an MC background, it's more likely I'd say that you'll marry another MC person.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think you can study with "the best and the brightest" at any top 50 schools or beyond. The only thing is prestige (most everyone knows Harvard). In terms of diversity, probably not true at HYP esp socioeconomic diversity. These schools continue to hugely favor the wealthy. In terms of making money in the future, that really is much more dependent on the student and his/her major.

I lost all respect for Harvard etc. since I learned that 50-70% (sometimes more) of the entering freshmen class consists of legacies, recruited athletes, URMs, donors, VIPs, celebrities' offsprings, Faculty & staff's children etc. etc. You no longer have the best and the brightest

..when I hear adults on DCUM claiming to be alumni or parents of current students. NO THANK YOU. State flagship will treat us just fine.

Anonymous wrote:To me the question isn’t what’s the allure of selective colleges - it’s what’s the allure of expensive ones. The better state flagships - most of the Big Ten, the SEC, the ACC, the UC schools etc - are all selective, fun, and very good. Why pay more for silly second tier privates like Tulane, Wake, etc?

I always wonder this. I'd rather go to a school where it's obvious I was looking for something other than prestige over an obvious consolation prize. Just me?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To compete with the best & brightest & most highly motivated.

To get a shot at the best jobs & internships.

Prestige.

Money.

Exposure to a more diverse group of peers.

To broaden one's knowledge & experience beyond that available at the in-state flagship.

To expand one's thinking & appreciation of differences.

No. Just the prestige. You can get there rest at a hundred other colleges too.

Bingo. And only the prestige around people who actually care.

To me the question isn’t what’s the allure of selective colleges - it’s what’s the allure of expensive ones. The better state flagships - most of the Big Ten, the SEC, the ACC, the UC schools etc - are all selective, fun, and very good. Why pay more for silly second tier privates like Tulane, Wake, etc?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:You get to be around rich people. I went to a selective college as a middle class kid. I got a good education, but I could have gotten that at my state school. The biggest thing I got was marrying into money.

Is this that attractive, though? We're not wealthy ($250k HHI), but upper middle class is good enough to let us do the things we want. Are there that many people honestly wanting more? Seems stressful.

You’re showing your Midwest roots. Most on this board do not regard 250k as UMC, at all.

What you think doesn't matter.

It does actually. All our opinions count. Mostly bc you’re too gosh darn Midwest naive to figure out the merits of an elite education. Bless you.

Please tell the IRS how $250K is struggling, okay?

The IRS is irrelevant. You would not be able to cash flow 85k per year for any of the elite colleges. That is a fact. You’re not UMC in DC you’re MC.

Literally not how that works.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You get to be around rich people. I went to a selective college as a middle class kid. I got a good education, but I could have gotten that at my state school. The biggest thing I got was marrying into money.

Is this that attractive, though? We're not wealthy ($250k HHI), but upper middle class is good enough to let us do the things we want. Are there that many people honestly wanting more? Seems stressful.

You’re showing your Midwest roots. Most on this board do not regard 250k as UMC, at all.

What you think doesn't matter.

It does actually. All our opinions count. Mostly bc you’re too gosh darn Midwest naive to figure out the merits of an elite education. Bless you.

Please tell the IRS how $250K is struggling, okay?

The IRS is irrelevant. You would not be able to cash flow 85k per year for any of the elite colleges. That is a fact. You’re not UMC in DC you’re MC.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think you can study with "the best and the brightest" at any top 50 schools or beyond. The only thing is prestige (most everyone knows Harvard). In terms of diversity, probably not true at HYP esp socioeconomic diversity. These schools continue to hugely favor the wealthy. In terms of making money in the future, that really is much more dependent on the student and his/her major.

I lost all respect for Harvard etc. since I learned that 50-70% (sometimes more) of the entering freshmen class consists of legacies, recruited athletes, URMs, donors, VIPs, celebrities' offsprings, Faculty & staff's children etc. etc. You no longer have the best and the brightest there.

Certainly there would be some stars and the average quality would be good but I would much choose a school that selects most (70-90%) of the students on merit basis.

I think everyone understands this at this point. Harvard, Yale, and Stanford are not where the best and brightest go in 2023.

It's a tier lower.

Duke, Brown, Vanderbilt, Rice, Michigan, Dartmouth. Obviously MIT and CalTech.

Harvard and Yale are jokes these days. At least Princeton tries.

Princeton has Eating Clubs so not sure how it's trying. I do agree with much of what you say but would also include other great colleges such as Carnegie Mellon, Emory, WashU, Johns, Hopkins, Williams, Amherst, Bowdoin, etc. that smart kids go to.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You get to be around rich people. I went to a selective college as a middle class kid. I got a good education, but I could have gotten that at my state school. The biggest thing I got was marrying into money.

Is this that attractive, though? We're not wealthy ($250k HHI), but upper middle class is good enough to let us do the things we want. Are there that many people honestly wanting more? Seems stressful.

You’re showing your Midwest roots. Most on this board do not regard 250k as UMC, at all.

What you think doesn't matter.

It does actually. All our opinions count. Mostly bc you’re too gosh darn Midwest naive to figure out the merits of an elite education. Bless you.

Please tell the IRS how $250K is struggling, okay?