Anonymous
09/11/2023 23:57
Subject: SAT for highly selective colleges
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:NP- OP you are wasting time to get a perfect score. Once you hit 750 on each part you are good to go. BTW. My 2020 hs graduate got a 1580 first time sitting but did not get into every school. High test scores are not everything in college admissions.
I disagree. A 1500 does not make you "good to go". Example: last year's incoming UVA class had a 1520 at the 75th percentile. That means 25% had higher.
So?
It doesn't matter that 25% have higher scores. It matters if the admit rate of 1500-1550 applicants is lower than the admit rate of 1550-1600.
Once you are above 75% ile, a higher score isn't needed to boost the CDS metric.
Top 25% of the admit group is rank-boosting "merit scholarship" territory, not "stretch admit" territory.
This is especially true since the "true" percentile of that score is even higher under test-optional.
This doesn't mean that 75%ile score is guaranteed admit, but it means that scoring even higher isn't necessary meaningful.
Anyone in the 1500+ SAT range should be expected to make measurable academic achievements that far exceed SAT, like many high AP scores or math contests or published writing.
Agree with the last paragraph except the "anyone in the 1500+ range"... the cutoff for this group of high achievers vary by college. At UVA, it's probably 1500ish, which means a 1550 applicant should worry about retaking the SAT. At Harvard, an unspiked 1550 applicant should try probably try again. But I agree with PPs that say that 1580 is the same tier as 1600.
many of the 50%tile and under applicants are hooked or spiked, so they don't need the same quantifiables as the general applicant pool.
I know people have trouble believing this…but Harvard is not accepting student X over student Y because of a 1580 vs a 1550 score.
The fact of the matter is there tends to be a ton of correlation that a kid scoring a 1580 also is a debate champ or a Regeneron science winner.
As per CDS, Harvard SAT 25-75 was 730 - 780 for EBRW and 750-800 for Math. So this is in the range of 1480 to 1580 for the 25-75%.
Minor quibble..but, no, you cannot add the 75th for Math and the 75th for EBRW to get to the 75th for the composite which will likely be a bit lower (say 1560).
Anonymous
09/11/2023 15:36
Subject: SAT for highly selective colleges
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:NP- OP you are wasting time to get a perfect score. Once you hit 750 on each part you are good to go. BTW. My 2020 hs graduate got a 1580 first time sitting but did not get into every school. High test scores are not everything in college admissions.
I disagree. A 1500 does not make you "good to go". Example: last year's incoming UVA class had a 1520 at the 75th percentile. That means 25% had higher.
So?
It doesn't matter that 25% have higher scores. It matters if the admit rate of 1500-1550 applicants is lower than the admit rate of 1550-1600.
Once you are above 75% ile, a higher score isn't needed to boost the CDS metric.
Top 25% of the admit group is rank-boosting "merit scholarship" territory, not "stretch admit" territory.
This is especially true since the "true" percentile of that score is even higher under test-optional.
This doesn't mean that 75%ile score is guaranteed admit, but it means that scoring even higher isn't necessary meaningful.
Anyone in the 1500+ SAT range should be expected to make measurable academic achievements that far exceed SAT, like many high AP scores or math contests or published writing.
Agree with the last paragraph except the "anyone in the 1500+ range"... the cutoff for this group of high achievers vary by college. At UVA, it's probably 1500ish, which means a 1550 applicant should worry about retaking the SAT. At Harvard, an unspiked 1550 applicant should try probably try again. But I agree with PPs that say that 1580 is the same tier as 1600.
many of the 50%tile and under applicants are hooked or spiked, so they don't need the same quantifiables as the general applicant pool.
I know people have trouble believing this…but Harvard is not accepting student X over student Y because of a 1580 vs a 1550 score.
The fact of the matter is there tends to be a ton of correlation that a kid scoring a 1580 also is a debate champ or a Regeneron science winner.
As per CDS, Harvard SAT 25-75 was 730 - 780 for EBRW and 750-800 for Math. So this is in the range of 1480 to 1580 for the 25-75%.
Anonymous
09/11/2023 14:48
Subject: SAT for highly selective colleges
There are HYP students that didn't even submit scores. This is documented and not something anyone needs or wants to hide.
https://youtu.be/fmGJwK3dvbY?si=KskCdMF0mdR_-XZc
https://youtu.be/fmGJwK3dvbY?si=KskCdMF0mdR_-XZc
Anonymous
09/11/2023 14:28
Subject: Re:SAT for highly selective colleges
Anonymous wrote:Yes, you are. These schools that you’re looking at are also test optional. That means that the numbers you’re looking at are only from those who chose to submit, NOT from the entire class. There are kids who are admitted that scored lower. But their scores were never figured in the data you’re looking at which means it will appear higher than expected.
My friend’s got into Yale without submitting scores. Scored in the 1400s, which is really good. But kids who are getting into Yale are submitting 1550 and higher. [/quote]
URM?
Anonymous
09/11/2023 14:27
Subject: SAT for highly selective colleges
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:you want to be at 50%. for Princeton that's 1550. it all depends how highly selective you mean.
would I send a 1540 to Princeton? Sure, okay. Would I send a 1500? No, not unless your student is a recruited athlete and even then I'd tell the coach and then probably leave off. 1520 is 25% so I wouldn't send anything below that.
This is terrible advice. Absolutely send a 1500 to Princeton…recruited athletes are fine with a 1400 depending on the sport (yes, you can be lower for football vs squash).
Again, Princeton is not accepting a kid with a 1540 vs a 1500 because of the 40 point SAT score. The 1500 absolutely meets a minimum threshold and now all the other aspects of your application are more important. 1500 just reinforces that yes your intellect is more than capable of doing well…now the rest of your application tells us if you have all the other attributes they need in addition to intellect (whatever those may be) to do well.
You think that Princeton is only advancing 1540+ into the further review pile but you are wrong. They are advancing many more into that pile with lower scores, making acceptance decisions and then determine what the mean/median scores are for the accepted group.
It is no surprise that kids with these really high scores are also very accomplished on a whole range of other metrics. In the rare instance of a kid I knew with a 1600 that had little else to show…that kid was rejected everywhere.
We all know this. 1600 and very little else to show will get you rejected everywhere. I think a lot of parents have no idea what these schools require post covid if you're a white suburban unhooked kid. These kids will kill it in the world. They are extremely unlikely to get into HYP ... and it doesn't matter.
Holy shit
Totally agree with this
True. DS SCEA'd to Princeton with a 36 ACT, valedictorian, all APs, Eagle Scout, Boys Nation and on and on and was deferred then waitlisted. Same at Harvard, same at Yale (both of which he had legacy ties but no huge cash gifts) and same at Cornell all on RD.
Anonymous
09/11/2023 14:05
Subject: SAT for highly selective colleges
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:you want to be at 50%. for Princeton that's 1550. it all depends how highly selective you mean.
would I send a 1540 to Princeton? Sure, okay. Would I send a 1500? No, not unless your student is a recruited athlete and even then I'd tell the coach and then probably leave off. 1520 is 25% so I wouldn't send anything below that.
This is terrible advice. Absolutely send a 1500 to Princeton…recruited athletes are fine with a 1400 depending on the sport (yes, you can be lower for football vs squash).
Again, Princeton is not accepting a kid with a 1540 vs a 1500 because of the 40 point SAT score. The 1500 absolutely meets a minimum threshold and now all the other aspects of your application are more important. 1500 just reinforces that yes your intellect is more than capable of doing well…now the rest of your application tells us if you have all the other attributes they need in addition to intellect (whatever those may be) to do well.
You think that Princeton is only advancing 1540+ into the further review pile but you are wrong. They are advancing many more into that pile with lower scores, making acceptance decisions and then determine what the mean/median scores are for the accepted group.
It is no surprise that kids with these really high scores are also very accomplished on a whole range of other metrics. In the rare instance of a kid I knew with a 1600 that had little else to show…that kid was rejected everywhere.
We all know this. 1600 and very little else to show will get you rejected everywhere. I think a lot of parents have no idea what these schools require post covid if you're a white suburban unhooked kid. These kids will kill it in the world. They are extremely unlikely to get into HYP ... and it doesn't matter.
Totally agree with this
True. DS SCEA'd to Princeton with a 36 ACT, valedictorian, all APs, Eagle Scout, Boys Nation and on and on and was deferred then waitlisted. Same at Harvard, same at Yale (both of which he had legacy ties but no huge cash gifts) and same at Cornell all on RD.
Where did your DS ultimately decide to go?
Anonymous
09/11/2023 13:58
Subject: SAT for highly selective colleges
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:you want to be at 50%. for Princeton that's 1550. it all depends how highly selective you mean.
would I send a 1540 to Princeton? Sure, okay. Would I send a 1500? No, not unless your student is a recruited athlete and even then I'd tell the coach and then probably leave off. 1520 is 25% so I wouldn't send anything below that.
This is terrible advice. Absolutely send a 1500 to Princeton…recruited athletes are fine with a 1400 depending on the sport (yes, you can be lower for football vs squash).
Again, Princeton is not accepting a kid with a 1540 vs a 1500 because of the 40 point SAT score. The 1500 absolutely meets a minimum threshold and now all the other aspects of your application are more important. 1500 just reinforces that yes your intellect is more than capable of doing well…now the rest of your application tells us if you have all the other attributes they need in addition to intellect (whatever those may be) to do well.
You think that Princeton is only advancing 1540+ into the further review pile but you are wrong. They are advancing many more into that pile with lower scores, making acceptance decisions and then determine what the mean/median scores are for the accepted group.
It is no surprise that kids with these really high scores are also very accomplished on a whole range of other metrics. In the rare instance of a kid I knew with a 1600 that had little else to show…that kid was rejected everywhere.
We all know this. 1600 and very little else to show will get you rejected everywhere. I think a lot of parents have no idea what these schools require post covid if you're a white suburban unhooked kid. These kids will kill it in the world. They are extremely unlikely to get into HYP ... and it doesn't matter.
Totally agree with this
True. DS SCEA'd to Princeton with a 36 ACT, valedictorian, all APs, Eagle Scout, Boys Nation and on and on and was deferred then waitlisted. Same at Harvard, same at Yale (both of which he had legacy ties but no huge cash gifts) and same at Cornell all on RD.
Anonymous
09/10/2023 14:04
Subject: SAT for highly selective colleges
Anonymous wrote:go ahead, make my day. send out those 1500 scores.
Apologies in advance to any who make prefer more genteel discussion...
PP - You are, at best, a complete idiot. The worst kind of fool.
There are unhooked freshman at the HYPEs this year with 1500s. There are unhooked freshman there that applied test optional. There are even Asian students admitted who applied test optional. If you believed anonymous trolls on DCUM you would think that was impossible... but it happens.
And at worse you are a malignant narcissistic actively trying to harm people.
Either way you are one sad sack
Anonymous
09/10/2023 13:17
Subject: SAT for highly selective colleges
go ahead, make my day. send out those 1500 scores.
Anonymous
09/10/2023 13:10
Subject: SAT for highly selective colleges
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:NP- OP you are wasting time to get a perfect score. Once you hit 750 on each part you are good to go. BTW. My 2020 hs graduate got a 1580 first time sitting but did not get into every school. High test scores are not everything in college admissions.
I disagree. A 1500 does not make you "good to go". Example: last year's incoming UVA class had a 1520 at the 75th percentile. That means 25% had higher.
Of the kids that actually submitted scores. Which is not 75 percent of the class.
+100 Someone keeps posting this statistic without mentioning what percent even submitted test scores. Not that relevant if only 50% submitted scores.
But similarly, you are not allowing for the fact that those are ENROLLED students, meaning some of the accepted ones with even higher scores went elsewhere like an Ivy or top SLAC ergo the accepted student stats are even higher than stats of those that actually showed up
Anonymous
09/10/2023 11:42
Subject: Re:SAT for highly selective colleges
Anonymous wrote:You’ve got it all wrong op. You need to think of grades and test scores as a qualifier, not a clincher. Kids with 1500 plus generally will qualify at every school, but then the schools will consider gpa, rigor, relative rank within class (which they can generally determine even at schools that don’t rank), extracurriculars, essays, and hooks/institutional priorities.
This.
Anonymous
09/10/2023 10:25
Subject: SAT for highly selective colleges
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:you want to be at 50%. for Princeton that's 1550. it all depends how highly selective you mean.
would I send a 1540 to Princeton? Sure, okay. Would I send a 1500? No, not unless your student is a recruited athlete and even then I'd tell the coach and then probably leave off. 1520 is 25% so I wouldn't send anything below that.
This is terrible advice. Absolutely send a 1500 to Princeton…recruited athletes are fine with a 1400 depending on the sport (yes, you can be lower for football vs squash).
Again, Princeton is not accepting a kid with a 1540 vs a 1500 because of the 40 point SAT score. The 1500 absolutely meets a minimum threshold and now all the other aspects of your application are more important. 1500 just reinforces that yes your intellect is more than capable of doing well…now the rest of your application tells us if you have all the other attributes they need in addition to intellect (whatever those may be) to do well.
You think that Princeton is only advancing 1540+ into the further review pile but you are wrong. They are advancing many more into that pile with lower scores, making acceptance decisions and then determine what the mean/median scores are for the accepted group.
It is no surprise that kids with these really high scores are also very accomplished on a whole range of other metrics. In the rare instance of a kid I knew with a 1600 that had little else to show…that kid was rejected everywhere.
We all know this. 1600 and very little else to show will get you rejected everywhere. I think a lot of parents have no idea what these schools require post covid if you're a white suburban unhooked kid. These kids will kill it in the world. They are extremely unlikely to get into HYP ... and it doesn't matter.
Totally agree with this
Anonymous
09/10/2023 10:22
Subject: SAT for highly selective colleges
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:you want to be at 50%. for Princeton that's 1550. it all depends how highly selective you mean.
would I send a 1540 to Princeton? Sure, okay. Would I send a 1500? No, not unless your student is a recruited athlete and even then I'd tell the coach and then probably leave off. 1520 is 25% so I wouldn't send anything below that.
This is terrible advice. Absolutely send a 1500 to Princeton…recruited athletes are fine with a 1400 depending on the sport (yes, you can be lower for football vs squash).
Again, Princeton is not accepting a kid with a 1540 vs a 1500 because of the 40 point SAT score. The 1500 absolutely meets a minimum threshold and now all the other aspects of your application are more important. 1500 just reinforces that yes your intellect is more than capable of doing well…now the rest of your application tells us if you have all the other attributes they need in addition to intellect (whatever those may be) to do well.
You think that Princeton is only advancing 1540+ into the further review pile but you are wrong. They are advancing many more into that pile with lower scores, making acceptance decisions and then determine what the mean/median scores are for the accepted group.
It is no surprise that kids with these really high scores are also very accomplished on a whole range of other metrics. In the rare instance of a kid I knew with a 1600 that had little else to show…that kid was rejected everywhere.
We all know this. 1600 and very little else to show will get you rejected everywhere. I think a lot of parents have no idea what these schools require post covid if you're a white suburban unhooked kid. These kids will kill it in the world. They are extremely unlikely to get into HYP ... and it doesn't matter.