Anonymous
Post 08/31/2023 22:26     Subject: What is this ES math??
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:It took me a while to come around to Eureka, but I did eventually. Eureka devotes 5 lessons to a concept before finally, on lesson 6, teaching the way we learned. It arms kids with methods. Great for critical thinking skills too.


Or it confuses and overwhelms kids who really just needed to learn one method...


Who just needs to learn one method? We have one method that works for everything. It's called a calculator.


WOW - I guess you've never tried to teach high school students who have no idea what to do if the problem deviates from the process they learned for their calculator. Sure, why get education at all, we can just ask AI to do the work for us.


Try again with reading comprehension.


DP and you didn’t say anything past “we have one method that works for everything. It’s called a calculator.” You’re the one that didn’t fully flesh out an answer. No reading comprehension required for such a moronic remark.
Anonymous
Post 08/31/2023 21:40     Subject: What is this ES math??
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:It took me a while to come around to Eureka, but I did eventually. Eureka devotes 5 lessons to a concept before finally, on lesson 6, teaching the way we learned. It arms kids with methods. Great for critical thinking skills too.


Or it confuses and overwhelms kids who really just needed to learn one method...


Who just needs to learn one method? We have one method that works for everything. It's called a calculator.


WOW - I guess you've never tried to teach high school students who have no idea what to do if the problem deviates from the process they learned for their calculator. Sure, why get education at all, we can just ask AI to do the work for us.


Try again with reading comprehension.
Anonymous
Post 08/31/2023 18:42     Subject: What is this ES math??
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:It took me a while to come around to Eureka, but I did eventually. Eureka devotes 5 lessons to a concept before finally, on lesson 6, teaching the way we learned. It arms kids with methods. Great for critical thinking skills too.


Or it confuses and overwhelms kids who really just needed to learn one method...


Who just needs to learn one method? We have one method that works for everything. It's called a calculator.


WOW - I guess you've never tried to teach high school students who have no idea what to do if the problem deviates from the process they learned for their calculator. Sure, why get education at all, we can just ask AI to do the work for us.
Anonymous
Post 08/31/2023 16:37     Subject: Re:What is this ES math??
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

If you feel this is a relevant issue for your child, I highly recommend you directly ask the teacher if they will require your students to memorize the basic facts.


Or, you know, simply work on math facts with your child. At worst, it will reinforce what they're learning in class.


I think it’s great to work on math facts at home. There are many effective ways to do so, but personally I think computer games are ideally suited for this purpose. They motivate a child to drill and provide instant feedback.

A parent might still want to know, however, whether it is being taught in class, so they will know if other instruction assumes the children have mastery of their facts, or if it is paced for children who are still using strategies to do the calculations for their problems.


Any suggested games?


DP. Mine learned through the program "time for math facts."
Anonymous
Post 08/31/2023 16:34     Subject: What is this ES math??
Anonymous wrote:Wait, as someone who does not have a kid old enough for this stuff yet: do kids not memorize math facts anymore?

Seems like the goal should be to teach kids the concepts behind the math AND have them memorize math facts, so they can do more advanced math more easily.


At our ES all kids in 3rd-5th have to practice all math facts each year until they have them memorized. They are retested each year even if they previously memorized them, because kids can definitely forget.
Anonymous
Post 08/31/2023 14:26     Subject: Re:What is this ES math??
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

If you feel this is a relevant issue for your child, I highly recommend you directly ask the teacher if they will require your students to memorize the basic facts.


Or, you know, simply work on math facts with your child. At worst, it will reinforce what they're learning in class.


I think it’s great to work on math facts at home. There are many effective ways to do so, but personally I think computer games are ideally suited for this purpose. They motivate a child to drill and provide instant feedback.

A parent might still want to know, however, whether it is being taught in class, so they will know if other instruction assumes the children have mastery of their facts, or if it is paced for children who are still using strategies to do the calculations for their problems.


Any suggested games?


My kids are now grown and I’m sure they’ve got new ones. (As I recall, my kids had a dog flying a rocket and blowing up asteroids). Just let your child pick one they want to play.
Anonymous
Post 08/31/2023 13:52     Subject: Re:What is this ES math??
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

If you feel this is a relevant issue for your child, I highly recommend you directly ask the teacher if they will require your students to memorize the basic facts.


Or, you know, simply work on math facts with your child. At worst, it will reinforce what they're learning in class.


I think it’s great to work on math facts at home. There are many effective ways to do so, but personally I think computer games are ideally suited for this purpose. They motivate a child to drill and provide instant feedback.

A parent might still want to know, however, whether it is being taught in class, so they will know if other instruction assumes the children have mastery of their facts, or if it is paced for children who are still using strategies to do the calculations for their problems.


Any suggested games?
Anonymous
Post 08/31/2023 13:49     Subject: What is this ES math??
Eek this thread is making me nervous. My 7yo is doing fine with eureka math so far but I’m sure there will come a time when they (or younger sibling) struggle. I was a good math student (took through calculus in HS) but my memories of how we were taught to do these things in ES is pretty poor. And now it’s all different anyway. Guess I need to start studying!
Anonymous
Post 08/31/2023 13:17     Subject: What is this ES math??
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:It took me a while to come around to Eureka, but I did eventually. Eureka devotes 5 lessons to a concept before finally, on lesson 6, teaching the way we learned. It arms kids with methods. Great for critical thinking skills too.


Or it confuses and overwhelms kids who really just needed to learn one method...


Who just needs to learn one method? We have one method that works for everything. It's called a calculator.
Anonymous
Post 08/31/2023 13:15     Subject: What is this ES math??
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:If you like Chinese method, just do kumon and have your kids never be able to have math reasoning skills(they gonna suffer in algebra and beyond).

I attended primary and secondary school in China, I tell my kids never to memorize times table, if they understand 5x6 is 5 6s added together that is good enough for me. Who cares it takes them 3 seconds or 30 mins to answer? You will never beat calculation by a machine. What they should do is to have proficiency in order of operation, because as the arithmetic gets complicated, a mistake in a step will cost you.


Not being able to do instantaneous mental calculations really slows down kids in higher math classes. Each step of a long problem takes additional time, and yes, this matters.


Yes, but you get plenty of practice in the basics by doing problems that stretch your ability.
Anonymous
Post 08/31/2023 12:30     Subject: What is this ES math??
Anonymous wrote:If you like Chinese method, just do kumon and have your kids never be able to have math reasoning skills(they gonna suffer in algebra and beyond).

I attended primary and secondary school in China, I tell my kids never to memorize times table, if they understand 5x6 is 5 6s added together that is good enough for me. Who cares it takes them 3 seconds or 30 mins to answer? You will never beat calculation by a machine. What they should do is to have proficiency in order of operation, because as the arithmetic gets complicated, a mistake in a step will cost you.


Not being able to do instantaneous mental calculations really slows down kids in higher math classes. Each step of a long problem takes additional time, and yes, this matters.
Anonymous
Post 08/31/2023 12:27     Subject: What is this ES math??
Anonymous wrote:It took me a while to come around to Eureka, but I did eventually. Eureka devotes 5 lessons to a concept before finally, on lesson 6, teaching the way we learned. It arms kids with methods. Great for critical thinking skills too.


Or it confuses and overwhelms kids who really just needed to learn one method...
Anonymous
Post 08/31/2023 12:17     Subject: What is this ES math??
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I think the discussion of the "facts"/quick way vs. concept had to do with the chosen elementary curriculum, Eureka, which emphasizes concept via multiple methodologies. Not all parents/guardians/caregivers learned all of the different approaches, so it can be difficult to support at home without a textbook or teaching guide, which the parent tip sheets decidedly are not (the GreatMinds link currently has no content, while the NY Engage link requires a NY State Microsoft login).

MCPS has chosen this curriculum, and with good reasoning; the curriculum office folks, to my experience, have both subject matter and pedagogical expertise. The multi-faceted understanding should serve students well as they progress, and appropriate, if not super-robust, enrichments/accelerations are available to help meet the needs of kids who "get it" quickly.

What MCPS needs to do is:

1) ensure better identification of, and fidelity to, need for enrichment/acceleration,

2) ensure teacher support to allow consistent application/management of the enrichment differentiation, especially in classrooms with students of highly heterogeneous capability, and

3) make teaching materials available to families to allow them to provide support, as NY has.

Otherwise, they are not only limiting the potential of the curriculum, but exacerbating the gap between haves (more homogeneous-capability classrooms, more routine access to costly outside enrichment employed when family-guided support is difficult) and have-nots.


Which is why it was suggested to get the family/parent sheets sent home. If someone can’t follow those for ES math, then that individual does not understand the underlying math concept themself. At which point it would be better to inform the school teacher/math specialist about the kids struggles. No teacher or district is expecting parents to have to learn and teach a subject.


I'd say this is not so. The language surrounding Eureka instruction might be foreign, without the concept being so. The tip sheets present the language, though ("tape diagram", anyone?), leaving caregivers at a loss without the instructional material that would let them quickly understand, provided any reasonable mastery from their own elementary math experience. They would not have to duplicate the teacher's job, only be able to fill in where their child needed support.

Why keep this material from them? Do we really want to add to teacher burden by turning to them/the math specialist for every struggle that might be resolved at home? Or is it some vain hope that families will simply give up in the face of such artificial barriers? To what end, if so?

It's not like pedagogical change in Math is a new phenomenon. (See "New Math", and https://youtu.be/W6OaYPVueW4 for a laugh.) What we learned as a society back then about the need for robust resources, communication, engagement, etc., needs better to be appplied in MCPS today.
Anonymous
Post 08/31/2023 11:55     Subject: What is this ES math??
If you like Chinese method, just do kumon and have your kids never be able to have math reasoning skills(they gonna suffer in algebra and beyond).

I attended primary and secondary school in China, I tell my kids never to memorize times table, if they understand 5x6 is 5 6s added together that is good enough for me. Who cares it takes them 3 seconds or 30 mins to answer? You will never beat calculation by a machine. What they should do is to have proficiency in order of operation, because as the arithmetic gets complicated, a mistake in a step will cost you.
Anonymous
Post 08/31/2023 11:24     Subject: Re:What is this ES math??
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

If you feel this is a relevant issue for your child, I highly recommend you directly ask the teacher if they will require your students to memorize the basic facts.


Or, you know, simply work on math facts with your child. At worst, it will reinforce what they're learning in class.


I think it’s great to work on math facts at home. There are many effective ways to do so, but personally I think computer games are ideally suited for this purpose. They motivate a child to drill and provide instant feedback.

A parent might still want to know, however, whether it is being taught in class, so they will know if other instruction assumes the children have mastery of their facts, or if it is paced for children who are still using strategies to do the calculations for their problems.