Anonymous wrote:they're smarter.

in my day, it was the top 10% of our well-resourced high school with a huge leg up for full pay kids (90% of them). Smart kids with prepped SAT scores and in-school ECs. Competing against a bunch of kids just like them.

There's a map of applicants back in 1990 (so more than 20 years ago) and basically the midwest, mountain, southern, southeast, and most of California didn't even apply. They were, in all regards, regional privates.

now the top 10% of private school class, who is also president of the class, and is full pay has no chance without another, major hook/honor/national award. and applications come from around the world.

the overlooked fact is that once these schools went need blind, the game changed.

Yes. Need blind AND TEST optional changed the game.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The smartest kids these days often want the best deal, meaning tuition and financial aid are a big consideration.

College costs a lot more than it used it.

my oldest. got into Dartmouth and Brown and took a v. v. good deal and a top 30 school. we're full pay. kid will end up with 250 left in (and some out) of 529. for kids who either have grad school plans OR kids who are pursuing interests in areas that aren't traditionally high paying, this can make a lot of sense.

sounds like a smart kid

Anonymous wrote:At my DD's private, the ones who did not get into Ivies (thankfully she did)-- the Ivy rejects went to:

*NE SLACs
*Stanford
*MIT
*Duke
*Northwestern
*U of Chicago
*Georgetown

The bottom of the class went to state flagships:

*U of Mich
*UVA
*UCLA
*UC Berkeley

What a stupid, obnoxious post from some elitist. Gross.

Anonymous wrote:The smartest kids these days often want the best deal, meaning tuition and financial aid are a big consideration.

College costs a lot more than it used it.

my oldest. got into Dartmouth and Brown and took a v. v. good deal and a top 30 school. we're full pay. kid will end up with 250 left in (and some out) of 529. for kids who either have grad school plans OR kids who are pursuing interests in areas that aren't traditionally high paying, this can make a lot of sense.

The smartest kids these days often want the best deal, meaning tuition and financial aid are a big consideration.

College costs a lot more than it used it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At my DD's private, the ones who did not get into Ivies (thankfully she did)-- the Ivy rejects went to:

*NE SLACs
*Stanford
*MIT
*Duke
*Northwestern
*U of Chicago
*Georgetown

The bottom of the class went to state flagships:

*U of Mich
*UVA
*UCLA
*UC Berkeley

Same with ours. Though some of the top students who were VA residents went to UVA over some in your first group due to the GREAT $$ savings--half the cost of those schools.

Lol according to the “OOS flagship” thread nobody stays in state for UVA anymore. They all go to Indiana, Ohio State, Alabama or Colorado instead.

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Anonymous wrote:I went to a public college with low tuition and then a top 3 med school. At the time, I did not think undergrad mattered much. My opinion remains unchanged.

Why do you think anyone would GAF about your completely irrelevant opinion?

NP here. You seem to think we GAF about yours. We don't.

Yeah, I know not to post irrelevant, off-topic opinions.

I think the point was that the obsession with a handful of elite colleges is completely dumb.

Yes, so an irrelevant and off-topic opinion.

That’s only your opinion of that opinion. Others disagree.

Nope, that’s a fact. Here is the actual topic:

“What schools are accepting a high percentage of the population that used to feed the Ivy League back in the 90s? UMC, private prep-school or top suburban public, high SAT/ACT scores”

Public school PP’s opinion is off topic and irrelevant.

So not much going on in your life these days?

Anonymous wrote:ELON is getting Ivy level applicants? Um no.

Northeastern wasn't 10 years ago until they juked their stats.

ELON is getting Ivy level applicants? Um no.

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Anonymous wrote:What schools are accepting a high percentage of the population that used to feed the Ivy League back in the 90s? UMC, private prep-school or top suburban public, high SAT/ACT scores

State flagship honors programs and non-U.S. universities.

St. Andrews in Scotland & McGill in Canada.

I agree that large state flagship university honors colleges are attracting some.

People are more knowledgeable about college options so talented students end up at a much wider variety of schools than they did several decades ago.

McGill is not at Ivy League tier.
Their SAT score distribution is a solid 100 points below Ivy League.

McGill is a great school that has a lot of great students who want to go to school in Canada, especially outside Engineering (Waterloo).

The Canadian schools have always pulled a number of strong students who got good grades but didn't have a lot in the way of extracurriculars because their admissions process looks at grades and coursework much more but emphasizes ECs a lot less. Counselors at my school advised kids with that profile to apply to Canadian schools.

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Anonymous wrote:Schools like Elon and Northeastern have absorbed higher tier applicants in the recent past as compared to their historical past.

Also some of the flagships like Michigan and Wisconsin are much harder to get into today as compared to 15 or 30 years ago.

Is Elon playing the same games with rankings as Northeastern?

Elon is not remotely close to being an ivy academically. Does have some wealthy kids going to school there.

But is Elon gaming the rankings game?

I'm sure they're trying but Elon is actually not a good school.

Ooooh the nasty Elon poster is back!

they're smarter.

in my day, it was the top 10% of our well-resourced high school with a huge leg up for full pay kids (90% of them). Smart kids with prepped SAT scores and in-school ECs. Competing against a bunch of kids just like them.

There's a map of applicants back in 1990 (so more than 20 years ago) and basically the midwest, mountain, southern, southeast, and most of California didn't even apply. They were, in all regards, regional privates.

now the top 10% of private school class, who is also president of the class, and is full pay has no chance without another, major hook/honor/national award. and applications come from around the world.

the overlooked fact is that once these schools went need blind, the game changed.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The kids who got into ivy 20 years ago would largely no longer be competitive today.

Don't you think the Ivy students of 20 years ago would adapt to be competitive in the new landscape?

The admission rates are much lower now. Many more qualified applications. It used to be relatively easy to get into Ivy compared to now.

There is no way, overall, they could just adapt.

There is no evidence today's Ivy kids are smarter or more accomplished than the students of 20 or 30 years ago. Remember that SATs have been changed several times so today's scores are higher, not because kids are smarter.

There are more applicants today and in a sense it's become a case of selecting 5 from 100 equally qualified applicants versus 15 from 100, as was the case in 2000. But making it even more difficult is that the Ivies much more proactively engineer the student body to get the right diversity quotas, plus they all want a good international intake too. On top of that is the Asian "problem" meaning way more Asian American applicants today despite bring a small minority group relative to the other demographics (which is why aiming for proportional representation of black students is considered a worthwhile goal but proportional representation of Asian students is problematic). To fit in the desired quota of blacks and international while squeezing in enough Asians for the sake of avoiding blatant double standards and keeping the spaces for rich legacies and connected means the spaces available for your typical white and unconnected UMC applicant has fallen sharply relative to 20 and 30 years ago.

That is it in a nutshell. The Ivy kids aren't smarter. They're just more socially engineered.

Many of those kids now go to Chicago, Vanderbilt, Carnegie Mellon, the elite LACs, the better flagship, etc. And will end up in the same place in the long run.

Agree with everything that you wrote except for the bolded sentence--which I don't understand. Would you please elaborate ? Thank you in advance.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The kids who got into ivy 20 years ago would largely no longer be competitive today.

Don't you think the Ivy students of 20 years ago would adapt to be competitive in the new landscape?

The admission rates are much lower now. Many more qualified applications. It used to be relatively easy to get into Ivy compared to now.

There is no way, overall, they could just adapt.

There is no evidence today's Ivy kids are smarter or more accomplished than the students of 20 or 30 years ago. Remember that SATs have been changed several times so today's scores are higher, not because kids are smarter.

There are more applicants today and in a sense it's become a case of selecting 5 from 100 equally qualified applicants versus 15 from 100, as was the case in 2000. But making it even more difficult is that the Ivies much more proactively engineer the student body to get the right diversity quotas, plus they all want a good international intake too. On top of that is the Asian "problem" meaning way more Asian American applicants today despite bring a small minority group relative to the other demographics (which is why aiming for proportional representation of black students is considered a worthwhile goal but proportional representation of Asian students is problematic). To fit in the desired quota of blacks and international while squeezing in enough Asians for the sake of avoiding blatant double standards and keeping the spaces for rich legacies and connected means the spaces available for your typical white and unconnected UMC applicant has fallen sharply relative to 20 and 30 years ago.

That is it in a nutshell. The Ivy kids aren't smarter. They're just more socially engineered.

Many of those kids now go to Chicago, Vanderbilt, Carnegie Mellon, the elite LACs, the better flagship, etc. And will end up in the same place in the long run.

Anonymous wrote:At my DD's private, the ones who did not get into Ivies (thankfully she did)-- the Ivy rejects went to:

*NE SLACs
*Stanford
*MIT
*Duke
*Northwestern
*U of Chicago
*Georgetown

The bottom of the class went to state flagships:

*U of Mich
*UVA
*UCLA
*UC Berkeley

Same with ours. Though some of the top students who were VA residents went to UVA over some in your first group due to the GREAT $$ savings--half the cost of those schools.