Anonymous
07/28/2023 10:24
Subject: Legacy? Some are worried it would also mean the end Children of Faculty Admissions Boost?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Many of the arguments on this thread could also be applied to legacy admissions.
If Legacy goes, then faculty should start assuming that the perks for their kids are next.
Faculty/staff is very different than legacy to me. It is a part of their "benefits package" and part of the reason many stay around and take lower pay (especially non-faculty)----your office admin could be making way more at any job outside of academia, but likely is staying for the reduced tuition perks. Also, their kids have to be admitted---they get reduced tuition, but they typically do NOT get admission advantages.
The only people talking about reduced tuition are the people trying to deflect the argument. The argument has nothing to do with tuition, it's about admission advantages
Anonymous
07/28/2023 10:23
Subject: Legacy? Some are worried it would also mean the end Children of Faculty Admissions Boost?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Approx 1% of each class at UVa are the children of faculty.
This is not a small number at many schools.
I guess then feel bad for any other kids in Charlottesville who apply!
And professors’ kids are typically going to have a competitive application anyway. They’re often married to another professor and if you’re born and raised in an intellectual household with parents who value education and have natural ability and advanced degrees, chances are you will too. It’s not like their 2.0 kid is taking “your kids spot.” The outrage is silly.
+1 Unless it's an elite university, professor's kids most likely will get in on their own merit. Kids raised in a house where college is just the natural next step after 12th grade are likely at least 3.7+ and taking rigorous courses.
Then it's an unnecessary benefit
Anonymous
07/28/2023 10:22
Subject: Legacy? Some are worried it would also mean the end Children of Faculty Admissions Boost?
Anonymous wrote:Many of the arguments on this thread could also be applied to legacy admissions.
If Legacy goes, then faculty should start assuming that the perks for their kids are next.
Faculty/staff is very different than legacy to me. It is a part of their "benefits package" and part of the reason many stay around and take lower pay (especially non-faculty)----your office admin could be making way more at any job outside of academia, but likely is staying for the reduced tuition perks. Also, their kids have to be admitted---they get reduced tuition, but they typically do NOT get admission advantages.
Anonymous
07/28/2023 10:20
Subject: Legacy? Some are worried it would also mean the end Children of Faculty Admissions Boost?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Approx 1% of each class at UVa are the children of faculty.
This is not a small number at many schools.
I guess then feel bad for any other kids in Charlottesville who apply!
And professors’ kids are typically going to have a competitive application anyway. They’re often married to another professor and if you’re born and raised in an intellectual household with parents who value education and have natural ability and advanced degrees, chances are you will too. It’s not like their 2.0 kid is taking “your kids spot.” The outrage is silly.
+1 Unless it's an elite university, professor's kids most likely will get in on their own merit. Kids raised in a house where college is just the natural next step after 12th grade are likely at least 3.7+ and taking rigorous courses.
Anonymous
07/28/2023 10:06
Subject: Re:Legacy? Some are worried it would also mean the end Children of Faculty Admissions Boost?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Faculty/staff dependant boost is an employment perk for the parents. This is one of those things that are offered to sweeten the pot like many employees elsewhere who get annual bonuses, travel perks, etc.
Whether or not other hooks go away, this one is very unlikely to go away as it is one perk to help acquire and retain good staff and professors for the institution.
This is silly. The reason to work at an elite institution isn't just to get their kid in. The elite institution is attractive as an employer for the reason is it attractive as a school!
Universities are attractive as employers with the exception that faculty pay is relatively lower than for others with comparable education levels. Many choose to work at universities because the tuition/admissions benefits is an important piece of the overall package. Similarly, many government workers choose public sector jobs--despite lower pay--because they believe in public service, but also because they seek enhanced job security. Take away those benefits and other jobs become more attractive.
There are far more PhDs than there are faculty positions. Schools would be fine without the benefit.
Anonymous
07/28/2023 10:03
Subject: Re:Legacy? Some are worried it would also mean the end Children of Faculty Admissions Boost?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Faculty/staff dependant boost is an employment perk for the parents. This is one of those things that are offered to sweeten the pot like many employees elsewhere who get annual bonuses, travel perks, etc.
Whether or not other hooks go away, this one is very unlikely to go away as it is one perk to help acquire and retain good staff and professors for the institution.
This is silly. The reason to work at an elite institution isn't just to get their kid in. The elite institution is attractive as an employer for the reason is it attractive as a school!
Universities are attractive as employers with the exception that faculty pay is relatively lower than for others with comparable education levels. Many choose to work at universities because the tuition/admissions benefits is an important piece of the overall package. Similarly, many government workers choose public sector jobs--despite lower pay--because they believe in public service, but also because they seek enhanced job security. Take away those benefits and other jobs become more attractive.
Anonymous
07/28/2023 10:00
Subject: Legacy? Some are worried it would also mean the end Children of Faculty Admissions Boost?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Many of the arguments on this thread could also be applied to legacy admissions.
If Legacy goes, then faculty should start assuming that the perks for their kids are next.
These are two completely different things.
Legacy rewards kids for being born to parents who had parents who could afford to send them to an elite college during some pretty sad economic times (and conveniently dodged the draft)
Faculty hook and/or tuition break is an employment benefit - part of a benefits package and a contract. An earned benefit.
Faculty hook rewards kids who were born into the right family just like legacy does. Clearly not equitable.
Why can’t my kid get your employee savings plan?
Anonymous
07/28/2023 09:44
Subject: Legacy? Some are worried it would also mean the end Children of Faculty Admissions Boost?
It’s common in revolutions for subsequent waves of reform to turn on the previous participants because they weren’t extreme enough. Learned faculty should have known that. But they seem completely shocked here that the anti-legacy momentum is now threatening their faculty privilege.
Anonymous
07/28/2023 09:40
Subject: Legacy? Some are worried it would also mean the end Children of Faculty Admissions Boost?
Anonymous wrote:Such blatant hypocrisy. At elite colleges the professors tend to be self-righteous about social justice & helping the downtrodden. Power to the people!! But threaten THEIR privileges and they respond like Thurston Howell III being offered a wine cooler.
Can you name one example of a specific hypocrite?
Anonymous
07/28/2023 09:39
Subject: Legacy? Some are worried it would also mean the end Children of Faculty Admissions Boost?
Anonymous wrote:College professors are disproportionately white so this is just another handout to white kids.
Only white kids of professors.
Anonymous
07/28/2023 09:38
Subject: Re:Legacy? Some are worried it would also mean the end Children of Faculty Admissions Boost?
Anonymous wrote:Faculty/staff dependant boost is an employment perk for the parents. This is one of those things that are offered to sweeten the pot like many employees elsewhere who get annual bonuses, travel perks, etc.
Whether or not other hooks go away, this one is very unlikely to go away as it is one perk to help acquire and retain good staff and professors for the institution.
This is silly. The reason to work at an elite institution isn't just to get their kid in. The elite institution is attractive as an employer for the reason is it attractive as a school!
Anonymous
07/28/2023 09:29
Subject: Legacy? Some are worried it would also mean the end Children of Faculty Admissions Boost?
Do any schools actually state that there’s a faculty admissions preference up front? Or is this just a wink and a nod behind the scenes thing?
Anonymous
07/28/2023 09:25
Subject: Legacy? Some are worried it would also mean the end Children of Faculty Admissions Boost?
College professors are disproportionately white so this is just another handout to white kids.
Anonymous
07/28/2023 09:24
Subject: Legacy? Some are worried it would also mean the end Children of Faculty Admissions Boost?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Many of the arguments on this thread could also be applied to legacy admissions.
If Legacy goes, then faculty should start assuming that the perks for their kids are next.
These are two completely different things.
Legacy rewards kids for being born to parents who had parents who could afford to send them to an elite college during some pretty sad economic times (and conveniently dodged the draft)
Faculty hook and/or tuition break is an employment benefit - part of a benefits package and a contract. An earned benefit.
1. in both situations, it's kids being rewarded for their parent's accomplishment
2. do you think poor kids get on tenure track? Those professors usually have elite and expensive undergrad degrees as their starting point
DP, but tuition breaks aren’t necessarily reserved for tenured faculty. Many universities offer the same benefit to their groundskeepers and custodians.
No one cares about tuition breaks, people care about admissions boosts
Anonymous
07/28/2023 09:23
Subject: Legacy? Some are worried it would also mean the end Children of Faculty Admissions Boost?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Many of the arguments on this thread could also be applied to legacy admissions.
If Legacy goes, then faculty should start assuming that the perks for their kids are next.
These are two completely different things.
Legacy rewards kids for being born to parents who had parents who could afford to send them to an elite college during some pretty sad economic times (and conveniently dodged the draft)
Faculty hook and/or tuition break is an employment benefit - part of a benefits package and a contract. An earned benefit.
Faculty hook rewards kids who were born into the right family just like legacy does. Clearly not equitable.