Anonymous
Post 07/05/2023 11:30     Subject: WFH and taking advantage? (Children)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I have young kids and I agree OP. My kids are in full day camps, extended care after school. I have babysitters, use camps, or use PTO on snow days and planned school closure days. I’m still saving money WFH because we don’t need before school care to have time to commute. Both of my kids were born prior to the pandemic, but not school age during the pandemic. We lived through daycare closures,
preschools only open until 3:30pm, and Covid exposure quarantines - but those days are largely over.

I understood kids being home in 2020-2021, but now there is no reason to have a child home during working hours unless it’s an occasional sick day or another caregiver is supervising them.


There is a micro generation of parents whose kids are currently three and under, and who never had to find daycare. While you and I understand that working with kids at home was unusual, for those parents, sending their children to daycare would be unusual.

This isn’t a defense of the failure to attend to child care, just an explanation. I can understand why parents of very young kids would think what they did up to now will work forever.

I also suspect that some employers don’t appreciate that they can only afford their current workforce if that workforce does not have to pay for childcare. Obviously inflation and childcare costs have outpaced salary increases. That’s fine as long as employers don’t require workers to get full-time childcare. But if they plan to require that, their cost of labor is going to go up.


I have a preschooler (and therefore only experienced childcare post-pandemic) and this is just not accurate. All the working moms of my kid's age have had to find childcare. We have had more hardship with childcare being *closed* or quarantines being enforced, but we have always had to have daycare or a nanny.


If you can afford a nanny (clearly that’s what you mean since as you point out you’re talking about a period of time when daycares were closed) you are in a rarified sphere. The rich exception, not the rule.
Anonymous
Post 07/05/2023 11:26     Subject: WFH and taking advantage? (Children)
Most workplaces now do have some sort of thing in their handbook that says you need childcare. Emergencies are one thing (like I'm WFH with a kid today because our nanny had an emergency with her elderly parent) but everyone on my team has some sort of regular childcare.
Anonymous
Post 07/05/2023 11:23     Subject: WFH and taking advantage? (Children)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:During and immediately after the pandemic, I was fine with whatever people needed to do to get by. But as someone who pays a ton for good child care, yes, I am beyond annoyed to see someone’s kid in a meeting. It’s not 2020 or 2021. There is no excuse.


HFM went around my daycare a few weeks back, my daughter was out of daycare for a week. Would you rather I call out unexpectedly for the week or have my toddler occasionally making a peep during our call?


Well if you have the ability to call out for a week, why wouldn’t you??


I’m sure you would complain about that, too! “How dare Larla call out sick for a week for her child without advance warning, leaving us to cover her calls and pick up the slack.”


I personally would not since I have kids and understand what it’s like. However, I would not really care what others thought about me if I was doing what I needed to care for my kids and I was doing my equal share at work.
Anonymous
Post 07/05/2023 11:07     Subject: WFH and taking advantage? (Children)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I have young kids and I agree OP. My kids are in full day camps, extended care after school. I have babysitters, use camps, or use PTO on snow days and planned school closure days. I’m still saving money WFH because we don’t need before school care to have time to commute. Both of my kids were born prior to the pandemic, but not school age during the pandemic. We lived through daycare closures,
preschools only open until 3:30pm, and Covid exposure quarantines - but those days are largely over.

I understood kids being home in 2020-2021, but now there is no reason to have a child home during working hours unless it’s an occasional sick day or another caregiver is supervising them.


There is a micro generation of parents whose kids are currently three and under, and who never had to find daycare. While you and I understand that working with kids at home was unusual, for those parents, sending their children to daycare would be unusual.

This isn’t a defense of the failure to attend to child care, just an explanation. I can understand why parents of very young kids would think what they did up to now will work forever.

I also suspect that some employers don’t appreciate that they can only afford their current workforce if that workforce does not have to pay for childcare. Obviously inflation and childcare costs have outpaced salary increases. That’s fine as long as employers don’t require workers to get full-time childcare. But if they plan to require that, their cost of labor is going to go up.


I have a preschooler (and therefore only experienced childcare post-pandemic) and this is just not accurate. All the working moms of my kid's age have had to find childcare. We have had more hardship with childcare being *closed* or quarantines being enforced, but we have always had to have daycare or a nanny.
Anonymous
Post 07/05/2023 11:07     Subject: WFH and taking advantage? (Children)
Anonymous wrote:I know zero parents who WFH without childcare. Zero. Even parents of older kids (10+) have childcare. If one of their kids is home while they’re working, it 100% was not intentional.

Most parents of kids ages 2+ don’t want their kids home. They want socialization and enrichment. I would feel guilty as heck keeping my kids home all day so I could ignore them and sit on my computer, just to save $.

In the summers, I pay more than I earn to put my 3 kids in high quality camps. They love it and it makes me feel good knowing they’re having fun with friends and learning new things while I’m working.


Strange. We have an older kid and never paid for child care. Your issue is three kids. Much easier with fewer kids.
Anonymous
Post 07/05/2023 11:05     Subject: WFH and taking advantage? (Children)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP, wake up and smell the coffee. This isn’t 2020.


Right. Nowadays women can openly fleece their employers and the taxpayer.

Men don’t have children? Your misogyny is showing, in addition to your lack of intelligence.


Sadly, the burden of child rearing is on women in most countries including the US. Remember when you took maternity leave and your husband took a few weeks max? That was your own misogyny showing when you went along with that.

My husband took 4 months of paternity leave with each of our kids. Troll harder next time.


I don’t know a single man who did that and I’m a millennial.


Millennial parent here. 4 months is on the high side (although great!) but I know dads who have taken 2-3 months paid. I work in an industry that is forward-leaning on paid leave. In addition, feds get 12 weeks paid so that's about 3 months.


That’s not normal. My husband got a few days.
Anonymous
Post 07/05/2023 11:01     Subject: WFH and taking advantage? (Children)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I WFH sometimes and believe me, I never WANT my toddler to be home from daycare.

Agree the norm should be to have childcare coverage during working hours.

When there are multiple young children in daycare just please be aware that sick days are frequent, especially if one kid is an infant getting illnesses for the first time. So the employee in question may not have much choice, and you may actually be getting more work out of them if the choice is WFH day vs. sick day with no work.

I’d rather they take a sick day.


Yeah, you say that until you have a time sensitive project with an inflexible deadline that they're supposed to be on.

OP you sound like a jerk. And I'm someone who doesn't generally like kids or have patience for kids.


This. If I take a sick day you had better not call or text or expect a response to your email. If I telework I’ll be on calls and meetings and work once the baby is asleep. Employers want it both ways now that WFH has become a thing.
Anonymous
Post 07/05/2023 10:48     Subject: WFH and taking advantage? (Children)
Anonymous wrote:I have young kids and I agree OP. My kids are in full day camps, extended care after school. I have babysitters, use camps, or use PTO on snow days and planned school closure days. I’m still saving money WFH because we don’t need before school care to have time to commute. Both of my kids were born prior to the pandemic, but not school age during the pandemic. We lived through daycare closures,
preschools only open until 3:30pm, and Covid exposure quarantines - but those days are largely over.

I understood kids being home in 2020-2021, but now there is no reason to have a child home during working hours unless it’s an occasional sick day or another caregiver is supervising them.


There is a micro generation of parents whose kids are currently three and under, and who never had to find daycare. While you and I understand that working with kids at home was unusual, for those parents, sending their children to daycare would be unusual.

This isn’t a defense of the failure to attend to child care, just an explanation. I can understand why parents of very young kids would think what they did up to now will work forever.

I also suspect that some employers don’t appreciate that they can only afford their current workforce if that workforce does not have to pay for childcare. Obviously inflation and childcare costs have outpaced salary increases. That’s fine as long as employers don’t require workers to get full-time childcare. But if they plan to require that, their cost of labor is going to go up.
Anonymous
Post 07/05/2023 10:41     Subject: WFH and taking advantage? (Children)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP, wake up and smell the coffee. This isn’t 2020.


Right. Nowadays women can openly fleece their employers and the taxpayer.

Men don’t have children? Your misogyny is showing, in addition to your lack of intelligence.


Sadly, the burden of child rearing is on women in most countries including the US. Remember when you took maternity leave and your husband took a few weeks max? That was your own misogyny showing when you went along with that.

My husband took 4 months of paternity leave with each of our kids. Troll harder next time.


I don’t know a single man who did that and I’m a millennial.


Millennial parent here. 4 months is on the high side (although great!) but I know dads who have taken 2-3 months paid. I work in an industry that is forward-leaning on paid leave. In addition, feds get 12 weeks paid so that's about 3 months.


I work in an industry where it is offered but beware the man who actually takes the whole thing.


How will anything change if people don’t take the leave they are entitled to?

I’m on maternity leave now, my husband’s company offers 6 weeks fully paid, and I told him to take all of it to set a good example for his team. He is high up in his organization and the younger cohort needs to see there isn’t any blowback for taking the leave.
Anonymous
Post 07/05/2023 10:37     Subject: WFH and taking advantage? (Children)
I have young kids and I agree OP. My kids are in full day camps, extended care after school. I have babysitters, use camps, or use PTO on snow days and planned school closure days. I’m still saving money WFH because we don’t need before school care to have time to commute. Both of my kids were born prior to the pandemic, but not school age during the pandemic. We lived through daycare closures,
preschools only open until 3:30pm, and Covid exposure quarantines - but those days are largely over.

I understood kids being home in 2020-2021, but now there is no reason to have a child home during working hours unless it’s an occasional sick day or another caregiver is supervising them.
Anonymous
Post 07/05/2023 10:29     Subject: WFH and taking advantage? (Children)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP, wake up and smell the coffee. This isn’t 2020.


Right. Nowadays women can openly fleece their employers and the taxpayer.

Men don’t have children? Your misogyny is showing, in addition to your lack of intelligence.


Sadly, the burden of child rearing is on women in most countries including the US. Remember when you took maternity leave and your husband took a few weeks max? That was your own misogyny showing when you went along with that.

My husband took 4 months of paternity leave with each of our kids. Troll harder next time.


I don’t know a single man who did that and I’m a millennial.


Millennial parent here. 4 months is on the high side (although great!) but I know dads who have taken 2-3 months paid. I work in an industry that is forward-leaning on paid leave. In addition, feds get 12 weeks paid so that's about 3 months.


I work in an industry where it is offered but beware the man who actually takes the whole thing.
Anonymous
Post 07/05/2023 10:27     Subject: WFH and taking advantage? (Children)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP, wake up and smell the coffee. This isn’t 2020.


Right. Nowadays women can openly fleece their employers and the taxpayer.

Men don’t have children? Your misogyny is showing, in addition to your lack of intelligence.


Sadly, the burden of child rearing is on women in most countries including the US. Remember when you took maternity leave and your husband took a few weeks max? That was your own misogyny showing when you went along with that.

My husband took 4 months of paternity leave with each of our kids. Troll harder next time.


I don’t know a single man who did that and I’m a millennial.


Millennial parent here. 4 months is on the high side (although great!) but I know dads who have taken 2-3 months paid. I work in an industry that is forward-leaning on paid leave. In addition, feds get 12 weeks paid so that's about 3 months.
Anonymous
Post 07/05/2023 10:25     Subject: WFH and taking advantage? (Children)
Anonymous wrote:I work from home and haven’t seen this since way back at the start of covid. I have 3 small children and, though I would love to save money on childcare, there is no way I could work and also watch them.

My husband is the go to parent if kid or kids are sick and he will wfh watching them on these days but never puts them on camera if he has to go into a virtual meeting


I don’t see this either but I suspect it’s because you and I work around highly compensated professionals and OP is referring to people not being paid enough for the $$$$ childcare now costs.
Anonymous
Post 07/05/2023 10:24     Subject: WFH and taking advantage? (Children)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP, wake up and smell the coffee. This isn’t 2020.


Right. Nowadays women can openly fleece their employers and the taxpayer.

Men don’t have children? Your misogyny is showing, in addition to your lack of intelligence.


Sadly, the burden of child rearing is on women in most countries including the US. Remember when you took maternity leave and your husband took a few weeks max? That was your own misogyny showing when you went along with that.

My husband took 4 months of paternity leave with each of our kids. Troll harder next time.


I don’t know a single man who did that and I’m a millennial.
Anonymous
Post 07/05/2023 10:23     Subject: WFH and taking advantage? (Children)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:During and immediately after the pandemic, I was fine with whatever people needed to do to get by. But as someone who pays a ton for good child care, yes, I am beyond annoyed to see someone’s kid in a meeting. It’s not 2020 or 2021. There is no excuse.


HFM went around my daycare a few weeks back, my daughter was out of daycare for a week. Would you rather I call out unexpectedly for the week or have my toddler occasionally making a peep during our call?


Well if you have the ability to call out for a week, why wouldn’t you??


I’m sure you would complain about that, too! “How dare Larla call out sick for a week for her child without advance warning, leaving us to cover her calls and pick up the slack.”