Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He really likes video games.

main reason for most of these kids; for successful career in CS you need great math skills

I have a degree in CS from Virginia Tech and I work in cybersecurity, and I don't use any math. To say that you need great math skills is simply not true.

Anonymous wrote:He really likes video games.

main reason for most of these kids; for successful career in CS you need great math skills

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AI has issues with general things. It's been 15 years since the last spewing of AI taking over coding from humans.

Actually if anything AI helps programers from making stupid mistakes but that's it at least for now.

So plenty of CS jobs around.

You clearly haven't been following the latest AI developments. But I agree that for the next few years, CS jobs are safe. Which poses a problem for the kids in undergrad CS right now.

Have you? writing based humanity majors seem to be in great danger on top of already mediocre job prospects
ChatGPT can write very well.

Different person here. Only someone who does not write well would say the ChatGPT writes “very well.” It’s formulaic garbage. I grant you that it will get better, but it’s not replacing a good writer right now.

How is it that DCUM is filled with Shakespeares? There is an OpEd today in the Washington Post today from a philosophy professor at University of Wisconsin:

"This artificial-intelligence tool excels at producing grammatical and even insightful essays — just what we’re hoping to see from our undergraduates. How good is it, really? A friend asked ChatGPT to write an essay about “multiple realization.” This is an important topic in the course I teach on the philosophy of mind, having to do with the possibility that minds might be constructed in ways other than our own brains. The essay ran shorter than the assigned word count, but I would have given it an A grade. Apparently ChatGPT is good enough to create an A-level paper on a topic that’s hardly mainstream."[b]

You pull out a few sentences to completely misstate the point of the OpEd. It was called "Why I'm not worried about my students using ChatGPT!"

Hmmm...you obviously didn't read the OpEd so who is the dips**t? He is not worried because he just decided it is impossible to monitor cheaters and he doesn't care if 25% of his class gets an A using ChatGPT because he knows the other 75% will learn how to write. He states over and over that in fact ChatGPT is excellent...and will only get better. He will award an A to excellent papers and not spend anytime determining the provenance.

You can decide this is a cop-out by a professor...and hopefully he doesn't curve his class.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:She loves it, that’s why. As a former software engineer myself (female), I tried to tell her it’s not worth it…she’s probably not going to get anywhere even though, as she herself once said, she can “code circles around the boys” in her class. She is really good at it (was a Math genius as a younger kid but was too bored at school so gave it up).

However I have persuaded her to double major, so if she hates whatever job she ends up at, she will have options.

DD also considering double major , what are the good options ?

Mine applied to things like Public Policy and Government, depending on the school. Also thinking about law school after undergrad if that helps. She’ll have to work for a couple of years in between, so that will give her time to see if she likes it or not.

To be clear, I am the poster with the DD CS who will double major in CS and something else! Need that morning coffee….

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:She loves it, that’s why. As a former software engineer myself (female), I tried to tell her it’s not worth it…she’s probably not going to get anywhere even though, as she herself once said, she can “code circles around the boys” in her class. She is really good at it (was a Math genius as a younger kid but was too bored at school so gave it up).

However I have persuaded her to double major, so if she hates whatever job she ends up at, she will have options.

DD also considering double major , what are the good options ?

Mine applied to things like Public Policy and Government, depending on the school. Also thinking about law school after undergrad if that helps. She’ll have to work for a couple of years in between, so that will give her time to see if she likes it or not.

My husband did CS l, half of the class did not make it to graduation. Not sure if this is still the case but back then a lot of students who entered as CS majors transferred to Information Systems; I can see some who enroll as CS majors switching to Data Science.

Anonymous wrote:She loves it, that’s why. As a former software engineer myself (female), I tried to tell her it’s not worth it…she’s probably not going to get anywhere even though, as she herself once said, she can “code circles around the boys” in her class. She is really good at it (was a Math genius as a younger kid but was too bored at school so gave it up).

However I have persuaded her to double major, so if she hates whatever job she ends up at, she will have options.

DD also considering double major , what are the good options ?

She loves it, that’s why. As a former software engineer myself (female), I tried to tell her it’s not worth it…she’s probably not going to get anywhere even though, as she herself once said, she can “code circles around the boys” in her class. She is really good at it (was a Math genius as a younger kid but was too bored at school so gave it up).

However I have persuaded her to double major, so if she hates whatever job she ends up at, she will have options.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AI has issues with general things. It's been 15 years since the last spewing of AI taking over coding from humans.

Actually if anything AI helps programers from making stupid mistakes but that's it at least for now.

So plenty of CS jobs around.

You clearly haven't been following the latest AI developments. But I agree that for the next few years, CS jobs are safe. Which poses a problem for the kids in undergrad CS right now.

Have you? writing based humanity majors seem to be in great danger on top of already mediocre job prospects
ChatGPT can write very well.

Different person here. Only someone who does not write well would say the ChatGPT writes “very well.” It’s formulaic garbage. I grant you that it will get better, but it’s not replacing a good writer right now.

How is it that DCUM is filled with Shakespeares? There is an OpEd today in the Washington Post today from a philosophy professor at University of Wisconsin:

"This artificial-intelligence tool excels at producing grammatical and even insightful essays — just what we’re hoping to see from our undergraduates. How good is it, really? A friend asked ChatGPT to write an essay about “multiple realization.” This is an important topic in the course I teach on the philosophy of mind, having to do with the possibility that minds might be constructed in ways other than our own brains. The essay ran shorter than the assigned word count, but I would have given it an A grade. Apparently ChatGPT is good enough to create an A-level paper on a topic that’s hardly mainstream."[b]

You pull out a few sentences to completely misstate the point of the OpEd. It was called "Why I'm not worried about my students using ChatGPT!"

Anonymous wrote:Reality: It is the “engineering major” from the 80s and 90s. That’s fine, but only about 10 percent of the kids who want to major in it as incoming freshmen will actually graduate with the degree.

Colleges know this of course. But, they want the money, and they know that the smart, motivated kids will find their way, transfer to a major that fits them, and graduate. The not so smart kids will leave.

Think I’m nuts? I have a nephew at Illinois who is a recent CS graduate. His mom likes to tell the story of attending the parent meeting for freshmen Engineering/CS majors, and a speaker opening by telling the parents there in the auditorium to look at the parents to their left, and to their right. Only 1 of your kids was going to graduate with an Engineering/CS degree. The point being that it was (a) hard (b) slots were limited and (c) it is not for everyone and your kid can be a big success without that specific type of degree. It is very important to help them find a path they enjoy and can excel at, and that rarely happens based on a kid’s high school experience.

I doubt that's the reality these days, especially at highly ranked CS schools. Most of those schools are direct admit to CS and the top 70-80% of the kids, especially the OOS ones, are not going to be dropping CS. If any, I see a lot of discussions on Reddit about other engineering kids asking for advice on how to switch into CS. General engineering..maybe, since the admit filter is nowhere near as competitive as for CS.

Reality: It is the “engineering major” from the 80s and 90s. That’s fine, but only about 10 percent of the kids who want to major in it as incoming freshmen will actually graduate with the degree.

Colleges know this of course. But, they want the money, and they know that the smart, motivated kids will find their way, transfer to a major that fits them, and graduate. The not so smart kids will leave.

Think I’m nuts? I have a nephew at Illinois who is a recent CS graduate. His mom likes to tell the story of attending the parent meeting for freshmen Engineering/CS majors, and a speaker opening by telling the parents there in the auditorium to look at the parents to their left, and to their right. Only 1 of your kids was going to graduate with an Engineering/CS degree. The point being that it was (a) hard (b) slots were limited and (c) it is not for everyone and your kid can be a big success without that specific type of degree. It is very important to help them find a path they enjoy and can excel at, and that rarely happens based on a kid’s high school experience.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only questionable thing about CS majors I've observed in my big tech work over the last few years is that too many people have become so STEM focused in their education that they are not gaining enough of the writing, speaking, or soft skills that are so vital to moving up in a tech company.

The entry and mid-level coding roles are the ones that AI will eventually impact, so developing a wider skillset while you easily can in college is smart to do with that future threat too.

My DS who’s in it for the remote opportunities and $$$ at least initially is one of the most socially savvy and well-spoken kids you’d meet, plus a writer, and he is a unicorn in his CS classes with those skills. Even though he was a latecomer to CS, beginning in college, kids gravitate to him for help etc because of it. There are probably a handful at most in CS programs like him, however, there are more kids like him in data sciences because it’s slightly easier from what I gather. All these kids will be the ones moving into management.

Similar to my DS

He went got a BS in Supply Chain Management and then decided he would not work for "the man". He's my youngest not one of my others who felt this way. Anyway, his first jobs were all in the supply chain, working for companies like Target, yep they have lots of supply chain jobs however he took one in a Store managing the trucks unloading. Well, when the crews do not show up guess who is unloading? Left Target took a few other "not for the man" jobs. Not sitting at a desk all day jobs.

Fast forward pandemic hits, and his current boss infects the whole office with covid twice. DS quits and enters a grad school program all within about two weeks, CS MS program concentration cyber security, which took a year. Job as soon as he graduated making boatloads more than he was before, no weekends, no holidays and great benefits.

I would agree having the writing component & speaking, plus the CS skills is a great combo. Mine has that as well. So do his siblings. Mine was able to pivot to CS from the supply chain because DH and all his siblings are in CS pretty much at some capacity.

Anonymous wrote:The only questionable thing about CS majors I've observed in my big tech work over the last few years is that too many people have become so STEM focused in their education that they are not gaining enough of the writing, speaking, or soft skills that are so vital to moving up in a tech company.

The entry and mid-level coding roles are the ones that AI will eventually impact, so developing a wider skillset while you easily can in college is smart to do with that future threat too.

My DS who’s in it for the remote opportunities and $$$ at least initially is one of the most socially savvy and well spoken kids you’d meet, plus a writer, and he is a unicorn in his CS classes with those skills. Even though he was a latecomer to CS, beginning in college, kids gravitate to him for help etc because of it. There are probably a handful at most in CS programs like him, however, there are more kids like him in data sciences because it’s slightly easier from what I gather. All these kids will be the ones moving into management.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AI has issues with general things. It's been 15 years since the last spewing of AI taking over coding from humans.

Actually if anything AI helps programers from making stupid mistakes but that's it at least for now.

So plenty of CS jobs around.

You clearly haven't been following the latest AI developments. But I agree that for the next few years, CS jobs are safe. Which poses a problem for the kids in undergrad CS right now.

Have you? writing based humanity majors seem to be in great danger on top of already mediocre job prospects
ChatGPT can write very well.

Different person here. Only someone who does not write well would say the ChatGPT writes “very well.” It’s formulaic garbage. I grant you that it will get better, but it’s not replacing a good writer right now.

It is certainly capable of replacing 99% of human journalists, whose output is also formulaic garbage.

My DS, left to his own devices, would play video games or watch cartoons all day. He only wants to do something that challenges him but doesn't really like any subject. Every year during course selection he doesn't know which elective to pick so we suggest CS and he goes along. Seems to like it.. so why not continue in college? If he finds his passion in college and wants to change, so be it. Doesn't care about money.