Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, I know a lot of people who tried, and lots without cars (myself included) or who have a car they use sparingly (we live in the city proper though).

But the "limit travel" is, in my experience where the UMC folks step off. They're not willing to sacrifice that, and at the end of the day, any other changes you're making, basically everything on your list, is dwarfed by two or three round trip cross-country/european plane trips.

Amen. Zero UMC people I know are willing to change their travel. But they all preach about plug in vehicles and composting. It’s exhausting.

I guess we must be outliers. We're limiting ourselves to one flight every three years. It's not easy, but it's necessary given where things are apparently headed.

Thank you for doing this.

I'm curious -- have you gently tried to encourage friends or neighbors to take the same approach?

I've been too nervous to encourage friends/neighbors to reduce their emissions, recognizing the likely reaction. But I'm curious if others have tried and what their experience has been.

It's really difficult not to say something when family members are taking their fifth flight of the year, but I've found it's much better to just do what I think is right and let others make their own decisions. They're all very intelligent and have read almost as much as I have about what's happening to the planet, and gentle coaxing isn't likely to nudge them any further along.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In North Arlington, my wife and I feel like we are completely alone in our efforts to reduce CO2 emissions. We have just one car that we use sparingly, and we use bicycles for our local errands. We keep our thermostat at 65F in the winter (and wear sweaters) and 79F in the summer, using ceiling fans to make the bedrooms more comfortable. We greatly limit our international and domestic travel. We eat mostly vegetarian meals, and we never eat beef.

All of our neighbors have multiple large SUVs, and many neighbors have knocked their 2000 square foot houses down and replaced them with 5000 square foot homes. Some neighbors with 5000 square foot homes have only 1 child, so they don't truly need a huge living space. Many neighbors drive to work in their SUV without any other passengers to accompany them. They go on multiple international vacations a year (lots of CO2 per flight). Huge amounts of garbage are generated each week and placed on the curb, presumably to make way for yet more stuff that they are buying for their homes -- stuff that will probably end up on the curbside, destined for the landfill, a year or two down the road.

I've posted my frustrations in the "car and transport" section of this forum, only to be told by other posters that I'm jealous of my neighbor's SUVs and large homes. Despite a high level of education among DCUM posters, most don't appear concerned about the consequences of their consumerism, and can't even conceive of a high-income family exercising some restraint.

We are, in fact, a high net worth family, but we are striving to reduce our carbon footprint. We feel completely alone, like strangers in a foreign country. I'm curious if anybody else here feels the same way.

OP, you are taking so many positive steps and should be applauded for them but until you do more than just "limit" your domestic and internatinal air travel (esp the international) you are doing far more harm to the environment than all the good you are doing put together. It is just the facts.

And this is the thing that is so annoying about posts like the OP.

OP's family has decided that they'll limit but not give up travel, including flights. They live in a SFH in North Arlington, even though they have just one kid. I'm sure there are other things that aren't mentioned that aren't the environmental ideal. So, OP has drawn a line for things that he (assuming here) and his family will do, and won't do. That's fine, and something everyone should do. But then he writes this passive aggressive screed ("I feel so alone in my fight against climate change! Where are all the other like minded souls? Woe is me!") that is, when you get down to it, just criticizing others for drawing that line in a different place than he did. Anything less than his efforts are insufficient, and shows that others just don't care. But there's no recognition that the line that *he* drew is completely arbitrary, and there are tradeoffs that he has refused to make because they are necessary, or would make his life too uncomfortable. He's fine with his choices, but other choices are bad!

Short version, OP is a passive aggressive, sanctimonious hypocrite, but the most irritating thing about him is the complete lack of self-awareness.

OP here. A couple of responses to your post. First, I haven't taken a flight for a vacation in 5 years. Prior to that, I flew a great deal, but I altered my habits after calculating my CO2 footprint and waking up to the consequences of my behavior. Second, my wife has an elderly parent in another country. She visits her mother once every 2 to 3 years. That is the total extent of my family's air travels. Nothing else. Our airline CO2 amounts to about 10% of our household's annual emissions.

In regard to our single family home -- if we sell this home (where we have lived for 10 years), the lot will be used to build a McMansion. So selling the house won't lower CO2 emissions, but rather increase them. Second, our average monthly power consumption is about 375 KWH, or 12KWH per day. This is about the same level of consumption that we had when we lived in a condo 15 years ago. Our monthly gas consumption is about 50 therms. As far as I can tell, this is quite low. We achieve these low numbers by being extremely conservative with heating and cooling, and we don't have a large screen TV (in fact, we don't have a TV at all).

We have compared our household's per capita CO2 emissions against various metrics. This past year, our per capita emissions were about one-third of the national average. Of course, even this isn't good enough -- net zero will require even deeper cuts.

I think "self-awareness" on this issue involves (1) calculating your CO2 footprint, (2) comparing it to various benchmarks to develop a sense of how your emissions stack up to the emissions of others, (3) figuring out what you can do to push your CO2 emissions down, and (4) implementing your emissions cuts. We have gone through this process, leading to large reduction in our footprint.

I have trouble really sacrificing my limited leisure travel when I know how much business travel there is out there. I take 1-2 airplane trips a year for vacation. Yet the airplanes are filled with business travelers gojng cross country for one day meetings, one hour court appearances, stupid conferences and conventions…..the business world needs to really reform its practices to make any real progress here.
But I do all the other stuff like commuting by metro, driving electric when I do drive, composting, buying less, etc. And I push back on the pointless business travel whenever I can.

Anonymous wrote:I focus on reducing waste in my house and whenever out and about. For me, not using single use plastic and reducing food waste (among many other efforts) makes me feel like I’m making a difference. Helps me focus and not get overwhelmed with how gargantuan this challenge actually is.

Because it comes down to the production and use of cement, steel, plastics and synthetic ammonia. And only governments and industry can begin to tackle that.

And this really is it. Individual efforts are so trivial that they don't matter at all; only governments can deal with this. So do what you need to to make yourself feel OK.

I focus on reducing waste in my house and whenever out and about. For me, not using single use plastic and reducing food waste (among many other efforts) makes me feel like I’m making a difference. Helps me focus and not get overwhelmed with how gargantuan this challenge actually is.

Because it comes down to the production and use of cement, steel, plastics and synthetic ammonia. And only governments and industry can begin to tackle that.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In North Arlington, my wife and I feel like we are completely alone in our efforts to reduce CO2 emissions. We have just one car that we use sparingly, and we use bicycles for our local errands. We keep our thermostat at 65F in the winter (and wear sweaters) and 79F in the summer, using ceiling fans to make the bedrooms more comfortable. We greatly limit our international and domestic travel. We eat mostly vegetarian meals, and we never eat beef.

All of our neighbors have multiple large SUVs, and many neighbors have knocked their 2000 square foot houses down and replaced them with 5000 square foot homes. Some neighbors with 5000 square foot homes have only 1 child, so they don't truly need a huge living space. Many neighbors drive to work in their SUV without any other passengers to accompany them. They go on multiple international vacations a year (lots of CO2 per flight). Huge amounts of garbage are generated each week and placed on the curb, presumably to make way for yet more stuff that they are buying for their homes -- stuff that will probably end up on the curbside, destined for the landfill, a year or two down the road.

I've posted my frustrations in the "car and transport" section of this forum, only to be told by other posters that I'm jealous of my neighbor's SUVs and large homes. Despite a high level of education among DCUM posters, most don't appear concerned about the consequences of their consumerism, and can't even conceive of a high-income family exercising some restraint.

We are, in fact, a high net worth family, but we are striving to reduce our carbon footprint. We feel completely alone, like strangers in a foreign country. I'm curious if anybody else here feels the same way.

OP, you are taking so many positive steps and should be applauded for them but until you do more than just "limit" your domestic and internatinal air travel (esp the international) you are doing far more harm to the environment than all the good you are doing put together. It is just the facts.

And this is the thing that is so annoying about posts like the OP.

OP's family has decided that they'll limit but not give up travel, including flights. They live in a SFH in North Arlington, even though they have just one kid. I'm sure there are other things that aren't mentioned that aren't the environmental ideal. So, OP has drawn a line for things that he (assuming here) and his family will do, and won't do. That's fine, and something everyone should do. But then he writes this passive aggressive screed ("I feel so alone in my fight against climate change! Where are all the other like minded souls? Woe is me!") that is, when you get down to it, just criticizing others for drawing that line in a different place than he did. Anything less than his efforts are insufficient, and shows that others just don't care. But there's no recognition that the line that *he* drew is completely arbitrary, and there are tradeoffs that he has refused to make because they are necessary, or would make his life too uncomfortable. He's fine with his choices, but other choices are bad!

Short version, OP is a passive aggressive, sanctimonious hypocrite, but the most irritating thing about him is the complete lack of self-awareness.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, I know a lot of people who tried, and lots without cars (myself included) or who have a car they use sparingly (we live in the city proper though).

But the "limit travel" is, in my experience where the UMC folks step off. They're not willing to sacrifice that, and at the end of the day, any other changes you're making, basically everything on your list, is dwarfed by two or three round trip cross-country/european plane trips.

Amen. Zero UMC people I know are willing to change their travel. But they all preach about plug in vehicles and composting. It’s exhausting.

I guess we must be outliers. We're limiting ourselves to one flight every three years. It's not easy, but it's necessary given where things are apparently headed.

Thank you for doing this.

I'm curious -- have you gently tried to encourage friends or neighbors to take the same approach?

I've been too nervous to encourage friends/neighbors to reduce their emissions, recognizing the likely reaction. But I'm curious if others have tried and what their experience has been.

Anonymous wrote:Bring vegetarian does not improve the world.
Mono rip agricultural practices are ruining the world and producing crops that are less nutritious each generation. If you really want to make a difference, support or start incorporating regenerative farming practices including meat, which is more nutritionally dense and healthier for humans.

Also, most affluent people are “do as I say, not as I do”… every person that I know with means has full gas Viking ranges, live in large homes, and take multiple flights and vacations every year.

Virtue signaling doesn’t actually do anything but feed your ego.

It seems to me that smug cynicism is focused on feeding the ego. Individuals making changes does matter, and there are many who do it because they do care, not to show everyone how virtuous they are.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, I know a lot of people who tried, and lots without cars (myself included) or who have a car they use sparingly (we live in the city proper though).

But the "limit travel" is, in my experience where the UMC folks step off. They're not willing to sacrifice that, and at the end of the day, any other changes you're making, basically everything on your list, is dwarfed by two or three round trip cross-country/european plane trips.

Amen. Zero UMC people I know are willing to change their travel. But they all preach about plug in vehicles and composting. It’s exhausting.

I guess we must be outliers. We're limiting ourselves to one flight every three years. It's not easy, but it's necessary given where things are apparently headed.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Bring vegetarian does not improve the world.
Mono rip agricultural practices are ruining the world and producing crops that are less nutritious each generation. If you really want to make a difference, support or start incorporating regenerative farming practices including meat, which is more nutritionally dense and healthier for humans.

Also, most affluent people are “do as I say, not as I do”… every person that I know with means has full gas Viking ranges, live in large homes, and take multiple flights and vacations every year.

Virtue signaling doesn’t actually do anything but feed your ego.

So your answer is for everyone to stop living entirely? We do nearly everything on these lists. I think a vacation once in a while is a reasonable use of resources.

I'm skeptical that we can halt the growth of atmospheric CO2 without very significant lifestyle adjustments, including the elimination of leisure-related air travel. If we aren't willing to give up our present lifestyles, then we need to rapidly expand our nuclear power capabilities. Solar, wind and tidal energy aren't likely to give us enough power output per capita.

We do what we can. I am in no way perfect, but something is better than nothing.

We have solar panels.
Drive a hybrid and try hard to reduce our driving overall.
My spouse commutes by Metro.
We've reduced our meat consumption.
We still travel, but are more conscious about it and try to do driving vacations if at all possible.

Anonymous wrote:Bring vegetarian does not improve the world.
Mono rip agricultural practices are ruining the world and producing crops that are less nutritious each generation. If you really want to make a difference, support or start incorporating regenerative farming practices including meat, which is more nutritionally dense and healthier for humans.

Also, most affluent people are “do as I say, not as I do”… every person that I know with means has full gas Viking ranges, live in large homes, and take multiple flights and vacations every year.

Virtue signaling doesn’t actually do anything but feed your ego.

So your answer is for everyone to stop living entirely? We do nearly everything on these lists. I think a vacation once in a while is a reasonable use of resources.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have converted our gas appliances (water heater, dryer, etc) to electric when they died. We downsized into a smaller more fuel efficient house in a close in suburb near a Metro stop. We drive less, we fly very infrequently, we take the trains more. We buy less stuff in general.

We would like to buy an EV or hybrid vehicle, but they are scarce and pricey. We are trying. We want to impact the environment less but it's not that easy.

Gas stoves need to be banned too. This can easily done without Congress, just by a simple change to EPA regulations.

If you have a gas stove, you really need to switch to electric as soon as possible.

It's not such a big deal in SFH.

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, I know a lot of people who tried, and lots without cars (myself included) or who have a car they use sparingly (we live in the city proper though).

But the "limit travel" is, in my experience where the UMC folks step off. They're not willing to sacrifice that, and at the end of the day, any other changes you're making, basically everything on your list, is dwarfed by two or three round trip cross-country/european plane trips.

Amen. Zero UMC people I know are willing to change their travel. But they all preach about plug in vehicles and composting. It’s exhausting.

Honestly, I know a lot of people who tried, and lots without cars (myself included) or who have a car they use sparingly (we live in the city proper though).

But the "limit travel" is, in my experience where the UMC folks step off. They're not willing to sacrifice that, and at the end of the day, any other changes you're making, basically everything on your list, is dwarfed by two or three round trip cross-country/european plane trips.