Anonymous
05/06/2022 23:04
Subject: Re:For parents who are jealous of kids who get extra time/think it's unfair
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:People see it as unfair because of parents who game the system without a real need for the child but for unfair advantage. It’s a regular scam, often used for athletes but not limited to them.
You do realize that the test is marked "with accommodation". My child is entitled to get extra time for an anxiety disorder diagnosed at 4 years old and a life long constant struggle. Because the acknowledged "with accommodations" my child does not take the extra time. We practice 5x more than anyone we know, just to adjust to the setting. We view it as the disadvantage it is.
Neither the SAT nor the ACT mark their tests "with accommodation." The schools do not know what student had accommodations. Why would anyone use them if they were marked as such?
Anonymous
05/06/2022 23:00
Subject: Re:For parents who are jealous of kids who get extra time/think it's unfair
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:As long as the test scores are reported to the colleges indicating that they were taken with particular accommodations, I’m fine with it. Part of the test is to see how testers perform under the time pressure. If that element is reduced, particularly in tests where there is a real intentional time crunch, that should be transparent.
So colleges can engage in even more rampant disability discrimination?
+1000
My child has a vision problem and gets enlarged tests and time and half.
Collage board should not be indicating who got what accommodations on the tests.
Otherwise, it doesn’t matter how brilliant my kid is, they will be overlooked and discriminated against for collage admissions.
In response to a previous poster, I’m saddened but not surprised that GMU doesn’t accommodate disabilities. Good to know ahead of time.
Anonymous
05/06/2022 22:53
Subject: Re:For parents who are jealous of kids who get extra time/think it's unfair
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:People see it as unfair because of parents who game the system without a real need for the child but for unfair advantage. It’s a regular scam, often used for athletes but not limited to them.
You do realize that the test is marked "with accommodation". My child is entitled to get extra time for an anxiety disorder diagnosed at 4 years old and a life long constant struggle. Because the acknowledged "with accommodations" my child does not take the extra time. We practice 5x more than anyone we know, just to adjust to the setting. We view it as the disadvantage it is.
??? SATs are NOT marked as such.
Anonymous
05/06/2022 22:39
Subject: Re:For parents who are jealous of kids who get extra time/think it's unfair
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:As long as the test scores are reported to the colleges indicating that they were taken with particular accommodations, I’m fine with it. Part of the test is to see how testers perform under the time pressure. If that element is reduced, particularly in tests where there is a real intentional time crunch, that should be transparent.
So colleges can engage in even more rampant disability discrimination?
A PP explained it well. There is a range of processing speeds in kids who are neurotypical. Timed tests are measuring this speed and significantly penalizing students with lower processing speeds. All the indicator does is say that a test marked as having received an accommodation should not be used to evaluate speed but can be used for accuracy. Personally, I think we should get rid of timed tests all together.
Anonymous
05/06/2022 22:09
Subject: Re:For parents who are jealous of kids who get extra time/think it's unfair
Anonymous wrote:As long as the test scores are reported to the colleges indicating that they were taken with particular accommodations, I’m fine with it. Part of the test is to see how testers perform under the time pressure. If that element is reduced, particularly in tests where there is a real intentional time crunch, that should be transparent.
So colleges can engage in even more rampant disability discrimination?
Anonymous
05/06/2022 22:07
Subject: For parents who are jealous of kids who get extra time/think it's unfair
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:The ableism in this thread is unreal.
Not really. My kid is in constant pain. Doesn’t get extra time, because no processing issues. But plenty of kids who work the system and need if less get it.
Yes, there is horrifying ableism in this thread. Just because your child doesn’t get extra time doesn’t mean there isn’t horrifying ableism being perpetrated against other people.
My kid is disabled and should also get extra time, yet also doesn’t qualify. That doesn’t stop me from recognizing discriminatory and ableist posts when I see them.
Anonymous
05/06/2022 22:05
Subject: Re:For parents who are jealous of kids who get extra time/think it's unfair
Anonymous wrote:I TA'd organic chemistry at an elite university and was asked to proctor the room with the students who received extra time. It was a three hour exam, so the extra time students got 9-12 hours to take the exam (either 3x or 4x). It was ridiculously too long.
Students without extra time worked diligently and typically finished around the 2 or 2.5 hour mark before going back to check their work. Students in the extra time room typically finished around the 3 hour mark, but then would dither for hours and hours, asking to get drinks of water, trips to the bathroom, and staring at the wall. Absolutely no one was getting more points by hour 6 or 8. These were pre-meds at an elite university--even with learning disabilities they process fast enough to finish without so many hours of extra time, or else they were so drained they were just done.
I don't think it gives the right idea that they should have essentially endless time. It removes all focus. The extended time should be shorter so students work diligently and need to be smart in how they approach the problems. An extra hour on a three hour exam? Sure. An extra 9 hours? No way.
I've never heard of anyone getting 4x time. 2x time is unusual enough; 1.5 time is standard.
Anonymous
05/06/2022 22:05
Subject: For parents who are jealous of kids who get extra time/think it's unfair
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:What happens when these kids make it through college (presumably with accommodations) and then enter the working world? I'm not aware of employers making accommodations.
Many will not need accommodations when they are not within the very strict constraints of the school system. Work will give them the opportunity to shine at what they are good at.
Plenty of employers will not take a cut in profile so they have extra time.
Anonymous
05/06/2022 22:03
Subject: Re:For parents who are jealous of kids who get extra time/think it's unfair
As long as the test scores are reported to the colleges indicating that they were taken with particular accommodations, I’m fine with it. Part of the test is to see how testers perform under the time pressure. If that element is reduced, particularly in tests where there is a real intentional time crunch, that should be transparent.
Anonymous
05/06/2022 22:03
Subject: Re:For parents who are jealous of kids who get extra time/think it's unfair
Anonymous wrote:People see it as unfair because of parents who game the system without a real need for the child but for unfair advantage. It’s a regular scam, often used for athletes but not limited to them.
You do realize that the test is marked "with accommodation". My child is entitled to get extra time for an anxiety disorder diagnosed at 4 years old and a life long constant struggle. Because the acknowledged "with accommodations" my child does not take the extra time. We practice 5x more than anyone we know, just to adjust to the setting. We view it as the disadvantage it is.
Anonymous
05/06/2022 21:52
Subject: For parents who are jealous of kids who get extra time/think it's unfair
Anonymous wrote:What happens when these kids make it through college (presumably with accommodations) and then enter the working world? I'm not aware of employers making accommodations.
How often do you have timed assessments at work? Sure, the lack of accommodations for assignments might be an issue, but testing will not.
Anonymous
05/06/2022 20:51
Subject: Re:For parents who are jealous of kids who get extra time/think it's unfair
Anonymous wrote:I don’t think anyone begrudges kids who genuinely need it but there are parents gaming the system. And of course many other kids who genuinely need extra time but whose families don’t have the time/energy/knowledge/inclination to pursue it.
Exactly. Or even know it's an option.
Anonymous
05/06/2022 20:04
Subject: Re:For parents who are jealous of kids who get extra time/think it's unfair
Anonymous wrote:I don’t think anyone begrudges kids who genuinely need it but there are parents gaming the system. And of course many other kids who genuinely need extra time but whose families don’t have the time/energy/knowledge/inclination to pursue it.
The part that is hard is that it's a spectrum. On normal classroom tests, pretty much everyone has enough time to finish. Those who don't likely have been identified as needing extra time and they get it. I don't think anyone has an issue with this. Everyone gets pretty much all the time they need.
But on tests like the SAT, there are some who do finish and some who don't. That can mean a big difference in scores. Those who don't finish could, with extra time, earn many more points. So why does the 50% processor get extra time, but the 70% or 80% or 90% processing speed kid not get extra time? Why do some 70% processors get extra time, but some 50% processors not? (Likely the bolded reason above.) It just feels unequal. Many could use more time because of their processing speed or ability to focus.
Anonymous
05/06/2022 19:48
Subject: Re:For parents who are jealous of kids who get extra time/think it's unfair
I don’t think anyone begrudges kids who genuinely need it but there are parents gaming the system. And of course many other kids who genuinely need extra time but whose families don’t have the time/energy/knowledge/inclination to pursue it.
Anonymous
05/06/2022 19:44
Subject: For parents who are jealous of kids who get extra time/think it's unfair
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:My issue is not with kids who have conditions that genuinely mean they need extra time.
My issue is with the fact that the procedures one must undertake to be given extra time on the tests are significantly more likely to sought/requested/pushed for by wealthy white parents. And over the past 10 years or so, I’ve seen that it is now significantly easier to get the extra time you want for your child, to the extent that I think there are many kids who technically don’t have one of the original conditions or circumstances extra time was meant to address.
I’m a high school teacher and am vaguely sickened by the fact that our principal proudly tells parents and teachers that “our counsellor knows all the back doors to making sure we get extra time.” It is a rigged system and I know the same “support” is not given to poor kids at public schools with parents who don’t know or care how to request and push for the accommodations.
Wow at my kid's very large public school it's the same small group of kids getting the accommodations and it is a diverse and small group.
OK, well, at the private school where I teach the proportion of kids getting extended time is much greater than that at the inner city public school where my friends teach. And I have seen firsthand how (many, but not all) parents game the system at my school. I’ve even been asked by parents to lie on evaluations/reports. This is not fair to the many, many students who do not have parents willing to push, wheedle, and doctors shop to get accommodations the kid doesn’t really need.
Again, I have no issue with kids who genuinely need extra time getting it.