Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Recent study suggests that EV owners don't buy EVs to save on gas, but rather because they have expendable income to spend on their belief in saving the environment.

But they save on gas just the same. I'd buy an EV in a heartbeat if my building had charging stations and if I could make it far enough to visit family on a charge. Back in 2007/2008 I bought a Honda Civic because it got 45 mpg on the highway and saved me a ton of money.

The point is that EVs are by and large more expensive than your average gas vehicle, and the price point is too high for most. Plus, the battery of an EV is very expensive to replace and dies after like 7-10 years, so used EVs aren't necessarily the greatest option. People who have fewer spare dollars aren't going to spend it to feel good about their environmental commitment. EVs are still a luxury good.

Plus, as you've noted, they don't quite fit in the market widely yet because of the low range per charge (particularly for the cheaper ones) and a lack of charging infrastructure.

The average new car costs $40,000; there are plenty of EVs for that price or less, and most of them also get a $7,500 federal tax credit. So if you can afford a new car, you can afford an electric one. Yes, some of them are very expensive, but that’s the case with gas cars, too. Simply being electric doesn’t make a car a luxury good anymore.

Still have the problems of range and charging infrastructure.

Range of 250 miles is perfectly fine for most driving most people. The only time the range even needs to become something you think about is if you're on a road trip. And charging infrastructure (which, if you can install a charging station at your house, is also only a problem on road trips) is rapidly improving. Check out Plugshare.com to see the many, many places you could fast-charge an EV in this area or en route to almost anywhere else. West Virginia is a problem, I'll grant you that.

Pffff if West Virginia had its way, cars would be contraptions powered by coal fired steam boilers.

And where do you think we are getting our electricity from? What combination of sources?

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't it be better to encourage people to drive less? Someone driving 30K miles a year in an EV isn't really more environmental than someone driving 5K miles a year in a gas car. Plus, if they have a gas car, its less environmental to get rid of that car and buy/build a new one.

And flying less! The jet fuel usage is astronomical.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Recent study suggests that EV owners don't buy EVs to save on gas, but rather because they have expendable income to spend on their belief in saving the environment.

But they save on gas just the same. I'd buy an EV in a heartbeat if my building had charging stations and if I could make it far enough to visit family on a charge. Back in 2007/2008 I bought a Honda Civic because it got 45 mpg on the highway and saved me a ton of money.

The point is that EVs are by and large more expensive than your average gas vehicle, and the price point is too high for most. Plus, the battery of an EV is very expensive to replace and dies after like 7-10 years, so used EVs aren't necessarily the greatest option. People who have fewer spare dollars aren't going to spend it to feel good about their environmental commitment. EVs are still a luxury good.

Plus, as you've noted, they don't quite fit in the market widely yet because of the low range per charge (particularly for the cheaper ones) and a lack of charging infrastructure.

The average new car costs $40,000; there are plenty of EVs for that price or less, and most of them also get a $7,500 federal tax credit. So if you can afford a new car, you can afford an electric one. Yes, some of them are very expensive, but that’s the case with gas cars, too. Simply being electric doesn’t make a car a luxury good anymore.

EVs are still horribly expensive. People in the DMV and the 1-10% bubble need to realize that your median HHI is only $68,000 per year, yet now you you want people to fork over $40k+ for a car, which is nearly 60% of their entire income on a car? You are also quoting 'averages' for car prices, but what is the actual median sales price? The average numbers get skewed too much by all of the idiots buying Mercedes, bmws, Porsches, volvos, etc.

Here are the top most popular cars: https://www.edmunds.com/most-popular-cars/

The base price for F150s and Silverados is only around $30k. Cars like corollas and civics come in below $25k. Mazda is one of the most reliable brands. You can buy many models below $25k and even closer to $20k. EVs are just too expensive for the median HHI. It's the difference between a $325/mo car payment for a Corolla vs. a $700+ per mo. payment for.many EVs. Just too expensive. Many people will have to wait until they come down in price or used inventory builds up of EVs. 4-6 year old used cars is generally the sweet spot for balancing age with pricing in depreciation. Maybe EVs will become more affordable in 2030.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Recent study suggests that EV owners don't buy EVs to save on gas, but rather because they have expendable income to spend on their belief in saving the environment.

But they save on gas just the same. I'd buy an EV in a heartbeat if my building had charging stations and if I could make it far enough to visit family on a charge. Back in 2007/2008 I bought a Honda Civic because it got 45 mpg on the highway and saved me a ton of money.

The point is that EVs are by and large more expensive than your average gas vehicle, and the price point is too high for most. Plus, the battery of an EV is very expensive to replace and dies after like 7-10 years, so used EVs aren't necessarily the greatest option. People who have fewer spare dollars aren't going to spend it to feel good about their environmental commitment. EVs are still a luxury good.

Plus, as you've noted, they don't quite fit in the market widely yet because of the low range per charge (particularly for the cheaper ones) and a lack of charging infrastructure.

The average new car costs $40,000; there are plenty of EVs for that price or less, and most of them also get a $7,500 federal tax credit. So if you can afford a new car, you can afford an electric one. Yes, some of them are very expensive, but that’s the case with gas cars, too. Simply being electric doesn’t make a car a luxury good anymore.

There are like two EVs that cost less than $40,000 -- the Leaf and the Bolt. The Bolt has a battery that keeps getting recalled due to fires, and the Leaf has a crap range.

And new cars only cost $40,000 this year because of the various problems related to the pandemic. Generally the number is lower.

Leaf Plus has a range of 226 miles. Or 215. Its bigger problem is it has chademo quick charging, which is like the betamax of quick charging. That's a problem. It's sti a fantastic car that punches well above its price point.

It is a pity about the Bolt. GM bungled the recall badly. What's notable is they identified the problem, fixed it, and are repairing or taking back all affected cars. I had one. They gave me a new car.

The Kia EV6 is probably the one to watch. Comes in just below 40K. The biggest issue with all these models is the same as with cars everywhere:lack of inventory.

American car makers seem to always bungle on newer tech. Just like how they could never make a decent diesel passenger vehicle while the Germans could even make a little VW rabbit be built like a tank and give 40 mpg with a diesel engine

Or maybe they were just good at making it LOOK like they had gotten that MPG... and thus, here we are, with electric VWs built as penance.

They lied about the NOx emissions not the MPG. The fuel economy was the selling point.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Recent study suggests that EV owners don't buy EVs to save on gas, but rather because they have expendable income to spend on their belief in saving the environment.

But they save on gas just the same. I'd buy an EV in a heartbeat if my building had charging stations and if I could make it far enough to visit family on a charge. Back in 2007/2008 I bought a Honda Civic because it got 45 mpg on the highway and saved me a ton of money.

The point is that EVs are by and large more expensive than your average gas vehicle, and the price point is too high for most. Plus, the battery of an EV is very expensive to replace and dies after like 7-10 years, so used EVs aren't necessarily the greatest option. People who have fewer spare dollars aren't going to spend it to feel good about their environmental commitment. EVs are still a luxury good.

Plus, as you've noted, they don't quite fit in the market widely yet because of the low range per charge (particularly for the cheaper ones) and a lack of charging infrastructure.

The average new car costs $40,000; there are plenty of EVs for that price or less, and most of them also get a $7,500 federal tax credit. So if you can afford a new car, you can afford an electric one. Yes, some of them are very expensive, but that’s the case with gas cars, too. Simply being electric doesn’t make a car a luxury good anymore.

There are like two EVs that cost less than $40,000 -- the Leaf and the Bolt. The Bolt has a battery that keeps getting recalled due to fires, and the Leaf has a crap range.

And new cars only cost $40,000 this year because of the various problems related to the pandemic. Generally the number is lower.

Leaf Plus has a range of 226 miles. Or 215. Its bigger problem is it has chademo quick charging, which is like the betamax of quick charging. That's a problem. It's sti a fantastic car that punches well above its price point.

It is a pity about the Bolt. GM bungled the recall badly. What's notable is they identified the problem, fixed it, and are repairing or taking back all affected cars. I had one. They gave me a new car.

The Kia EV6 is probably the one to watch. Comes in just below 40K. The biggest issue with all these models is the same as with cars everywhere:lack of inventory.

American car makers seem to always bungle on newer tech. Just like how they could never make a decent diesel passenger vehicle while the Germans could even make a little VW rabbit be built like a tank and give 40 mpg with a diesel engine

Or maybe they were just good at making it LOOK like they had gotten that MPG... and thus, here we are, with electric VWs built as penance.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Recent study suggests that EV owners don't buy EVs to save on gas, but rather because they have expendable income to spend on their belief in saving the environment.

But they save on gas just the same. I'd buy an EV in a heartbeat if my building had charging stations and if I could make it far enough to visit family on a charge. Back in 2007/2008 I bought a Honda Civic because it got 45 mpg on the highway and saved me a ton of money.

The point is that EVs are by and large more expensive than your average gas vehicle, and the price point is too high for most. Plus, the battery of an EV is very expensive to replace and dies after like 7-10 years, so used EVs aren't necessarily the greatest option. People who have fewer spare dollars aren't going to spend it to feel good about their environmental commitment. EVs are still a luxury good.

Plus, as you've noted, they don't quite fit in the market widely yet because of the low range per charge (particularly for the cheaper ones) and a lack of charging infrastructure.

The average new car costs $40,000; there are plenty of EVs for that price or less, and most of them also get a $7,500 federal tax credit. So if you can afford a new car, you can afford an electric one. Yes, some of them are very expensive, but that’s the case with gas cars, too. Simply being electric doesn’t make a car a luxury good anymore.

There are like two EVs that cost less than $40,000 -- the Leaf and the Bolt. The Bolt has a battery that keeps getting recalled due to fires, and the Leaf has a crap range.

And new cars only cost $40,000 this year because of the various problems related to the pandemic. Generally the number is lower.

Leaf Plus has a range of 226 miles. Or 215. Its bigger problem is it has chademo quick charging, which is like the betamax of quick charging. That's a problem. It's sti a fantastic car that punches well above its price point.

It is a pity about the Bolt. GM bungled the recall badly. What's notable is they identified the problem, fixed it, and are repairing or taking back all affected cars. I had one. They gave me a new car.

The Kia EV6 is probably the one to watch. Comes in just below 40K. The biggest issue with all these models is the same as with cars everywhere:lack of inventory.

American car makers seem to always bungle on newer tech. Just like how they could never make a decent diesel passenger vehicle while the Germans could even make a little VW rabbit be built like a tank and give 40 mpg with a diesel engine

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Recent study suggests that EV owners don't buy EVs to save on gas, but rather because they have expendable income to spend on their belief in saving the environment.

But they save on gas just the same. I'd buy an EV in a heartbeat if my building had charging stations and if I could make it far enough to visit family on a charge. Back in 2007/2008 I bought a Honda Civic because it got 45 mpg on the highway and saved me a ton of money.

The point is that EVs are by and large more expensive than your average gas vehicle, and the price point is too high for most. Plus, the battery of an EV is very expensive to replace and dies after like 7-10 years, so used EVs aren't necessarily the greatest option. People who have fewer spare dollars aren't going to spend it to feel good about their environmental commitment. EVs are still a luxury good.

Plus, as you've noted, they don't quite fit in the market widely yet because of the low range per charge (particularly for the cheaper ones) and a lack of charging infrastructure.

The average new car costs $40,000; there are plenty of EVs for that price or less, and most of them also get a $7,500 federal tax credit. So if you can afford a new car, you can afford an electric one. Yes, some of them are very expensive, but that’s the case with gas cars, too. Simply being electric doesn’t make a car a luxury good anymore.

Still have the problems of range and charging infrastructure.

Range of 250 miles is perfectly fine for most driving most people. The only time the range even needs to become something you think about is if you're on a road trip. And charging infrastructure (which, if you can install a charging station at your house, is also only a problem on road trips) is rapidly improving. Check out Plugshare.com to see the many, many places you could fast-charge an EV in this area or en route to almost anywhere else. West Virginia is a problem, I'll grant you that.

Pffff if West Virginia had its way, cars would be contraptions powered by coal fired steam boilers.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Recent study suggests that EV owners don't buy EVs to save on gas, but rather because they have expendable income to spend on their belief in saving the environment.

But they save on gas just the same. I'd buy an EV in a heartbeat if my building had charging stations and if I could make it far enough to visit family on a charge. Back in 2007/2008 I bought a Honda Civic because it got 45 mpg on the highway and saved me a ton of money.

The point is that EVs are by and large more expensive than your average gas vehicle, and the price point is too high for most. Plus, the battery of an EV is very expensive to replace and dies after like 7-10 years, so used EVs aren't necessarily the greatest option. People who have fewer spare dollars aren't going to spend it to feel good about their environmental commitment. EVs are still a luxury good.

Plus, as you've noted, they don't quite fit in the market widely yet because of the low range per charge (particularly for the cheaper ones) and a lack of charging infrastructure.

The average new car costs $40,000; there are plenty of EVs for that price or less, and most of them also get a $7,500 federal tax credit. So if you can afford a new car, you can afford an electric one. Yes, some of them are very expensive, but that’s the case with gas cars, too. Simply being electric doesn’t make a car a luxury good anymore.

There are like two EVs that cost less than $40,000 -- the Leaf and the Bolt. The Bolt has a battery that keeps getting recalled due to fires, and the Leaf has a crap range.

And new cars only cost $40,000 this year because of the various problems related to the pandemic. Generally the number is lower.

Leaf Plus has a range of 226 miles. Or 215. Its bigger problem is it has chademo quick charging, which is like the betamax of quick charging. That's a problem. It's sti a fantastic car that punches well above its price point.

It is a pity about the Bolt. GM bungled the recall badly. What's notable is they identified the problem, fixed it, and are repairing or taking back all affected cars. I had one. They gave me a new car.

The Kia EV6 is probably the one to watch. Comes in just below 40K. The biggest issue with all these models is the same as with cars everywhere:lack of inventory.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Recent study suggests that EV owners don't buy EVs to save on gas, but rather because they have expendable income to spend on their belief in saving the environment.

But they save on gas just the same. I'd buy an EV in a heartbeat if my building had charging stations and if I could make it far enough to visit family on a charge. Back in 2007/2008 I bought a Honda Civic because it got 45 mpg on the highway and saved me a ton of money.

The point is that EVs are by and large more expensive than your average gas vehicle, and the price point is too high for most. Plus, the battery of an EV is very expensive to replace and dies after like 7-10 years, so used EVs aren't necessarily the greatest option. People who have fewer spare dollars aren't going to spend it to feel good about their environmental commitment. EVs are still a luxury good.

Plus, as you've noted, they don't quite fit in the market widely yet because of the low range per charge (particularly for the cheaper ones) and a lack of charging infrastructure.

The average new car costs $40,000; there are plenty of EVs for that price or less, and most of them also get a $7,500 federal tax credit. So if you can afford a new car, you can afford an electric one. Yes, some of them are very expensive, but that’s the case with gas cars, too. Simply being electric doesn’t make a car a luxury good anymore.

Still have the problems of range and charging infrastructure.

Range of 250 miles is perfectly fine for most driving most people. The only time the range even needs to become something you think about is if you're on a road trip. And charging infrastructure (which, if you can install a charging station at your house, is also only a problem on road trips) is rapidly improving. Check out Plugshare.com to see the many, many places you could fast-charge an EV in this area or en route to almost anywhere else. West Virginia is a problem, I'll grant you that.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Recent study suggests that EV owners don't buy EVs to save on gas, but rather because they have expendable income to spend on their belief in saving the environment.

But they save on gas just the same. I'd buy an EV in a heartbeat if my building had charging stations and if I could make it far enough to visit family on a charge. Back in 2007/2008 I bought a Honda Civic because it got 45 mpg on the highway and saved me a ton of money.

The point is that EVs are by and large more expensive than your average gas vehicle, and the price point is too high for most. Plus, the battery of an EV is very expensive to replace and dies after like 7-10 years, so used EVs aren't necessarily the greatest option. People who have fewer spare dollars aren't going to spend it to feel good about their environmental commitment. EVs are still a luxury good.

Plus, as you've noted, they don't quite fit in the market widely yet because of the low range per charge (particularly for the cheaper ones) and a lack of charging infrastructure.

The average new car costs $40,000; there are plenty of EVs for that price or less, and most of them also get a $7,500 federal tax credit. So if you can afford a new car, you can afford an electric one. Yes, some of them are very expensive, but that’s the case with gas cars, too. Simply being electric doesn’t make a car a luxury good anymore.

There are like two EVs that cost less than $40,000 -- the Leaf and the Bolt. The Bolt has a battery that keeps getting recalled due to fires, and the Leaf has a crap range.

And new cars only cost $40,000 this year because of the various problems related to the pandemic. Generally the number is lower.

The VW ID.4 base price is $39,500. The Kia Niro EV starts at about $39,000, too. The Ford Mach-E starts at $43,000. The average price of a new car now is actually $47,000; in 2019, pre-pandemic, it was about $40,000. The point is, once you account for the tax credit, a brand-new EV is significantly cheaper than the average brand-new car, both before and after the pandemic, and even without the pandemic supply problems, there are plenty of non-luxury-priced EVs.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Recent study suggests that EV owners don't buy EVs to save on gas, but rather because they have expendable income to spend on their belief in saving the environment.

But they save on gas just the same. I'd buy an EV in a heartbeat if my building had charging stations and if I could make it far enough to visit family on a charge. Back in 2007/2008 I bought a Honda Civic because it got 45 mpg on the highway and saved me a ton of money.

The point is that EVs are by and large more expensive than your average gas vehicle, and the price point is too high for most. Plus, the battery of an EV is very expensive to replace and dies after like 7-10 years, so used EVs aren't necessarily the greatest option. People who have fewer spare dollars aren't going to spend it to feel good about their environmental commitment. EVs are still a luxury good.

Plus, as you've noted, they don't quite fit in the market widely yet because of the low range per charge (particularly for the cheaper ones) and a lack of charging infrastructure.

The average new car costs $40,000; there are plenty of EVs for that price or less, and most of them also get a $7,500 federal tax credit. So if you can afford a new car, you can afford an electric one. Yes, some of them are very expensive, but that’s the case with gas cars, too. Simply being electric doesn’t make a car a luxury good anymore.

There are like two EVs that cost less than $40,000 -- the Leaf and the Bolt. The Bolt has a battery that keeps getting recalled due to fires, and the Leaf has a crap range.

And new cars only cost $40,000 this year because of the various problems related to the pandemic. Generally the number is lower.

I will be buying an EV simply because I don't wanna deal with transmission care, oil changes, etc.

I don't need a pledge to sign so I feel good about myself.

SAVE THE WHALES

This is dumb on so many levels. This is about as effective as elementary students signing a petition to get better food in the cafeteria.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gas cars are going the way of the horse and buggy. So long gasoline.

Maybe in 50 years, maybe not. EVs are not as "clean" as you think they are, and they can be very expensive to repair after an accident. There are not enough fast charging stations, and the range on most EVs is pathetic. Also, most of them are not big enough to carry a family of 5 comfortably. I'll drive my gas powered SUV a few more years before I buy an EV. In fact, I am waiting on delivery of a new one as I write this.

+1. I have a hybrid. I thought that I was doing a good thing for the environment until I read up on how bad current EV technology is. The cobalt & nickel mining is disastrous and in over exhausting an already short supply, and we have no way to currently break down these EV batteries - which are currently being shipped to E Europe to be buried in the ground. These things are incredibly hazardous and we've not yet developed reliable recycling methods for them. I'm not sure why we're not talking more about EV technology and how it's not as clean as we're led to believe. Yes, they emissions are nil but it's the production and what to do with car after use that's the issue. Hopefully, they'll work on the battery issue but until then I hope that we don't move entirely EV. It's too much, too fast. We're not ready yet.

Meant to add *lithium mining

... She says, typing from her cell phone

There are new technologies like extracting lithium from seawater, it makes for a virtually unlimited, cost effective supply. https://electrek.co/2021/06/04/scientists-have-cost-effectively-harvested-lithium-from-seawater/

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Recent study suggests that EV owners don't buy EVs to save on gas, but rather because they have expendable income to spend on their belief in saving the environment.

But they save on gas just the same. I'd buy an EV in a heartbeat if my building had charging stations and if I could make it far enough to visit family on a charge. Back in 2007/2008 I bought a Honda Civic because it got 45 mpg on the highway and saved me a ton of money.

Do you still have that Honda Civic? Or did you buy a new one?

Or did you buy a 3 row SUV because you have *a*kid and might need to carpool to soccer sometimes in the next 5 years?

Thank you!!!!! I am so tired of the "I need an SUV for the children" argument. I remember being a kid and sitting three to a backseat in a LeCar. It wasn't that freaking bad. We could do a lot by just driving smaller cars...

And what I find selfishly infuriating about the SUV trend is electric car manufacturers are abandoning small evs in favor of these gigantic tanks.