Anonymous
Post 12/22/2021 12:05     Subject: Sheer scale of new student covid cases (real data)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We don’t have the vaccination numbers to let it blow through schools. Some children will die.

What we should be doing is identifying the problem spots (indoor lunch) and figuring out how to mitigate them.


More children will die in a cross walk in DC than from COVID. Even unvaccinated kids. We need to move on to the acceptance part of grief with this virus.


THIS! Let’s switch focus away from COVID, which we will likely all get at some point or another just like we all get colds or even the flu on a bad year, even if vaccinated. Kids are overwhelmingly not dying from COVID.*

Let’s focus instead on something that families and government in DC can actually do something about! The horrendous lack of safety for pedestrians and cyclists everywhere in the district.

*of course people who are immunocompromised have to take special precautions, but that is not new with COVID. I have worked with more than one colleague who wore a surgical mask to the office during cancer treatment, well before COVID.



As others have said, the mortality risk to children (and honestly, folks under 30) is infinitesimal.

I have young kids, one of whom is too young to be vaccinated, and I worry WAY more about cars and traffic safety. When they're older, I'll worry more about alcohol and drugs. You can smart be and careful about COVID, not to mention other illnesses, while also not over-stating the risks. We need to focus our efforts on those who need our help (older and immunocompromised folks), rather than drive ourselves nuts trying to get the risk down to zero for groups that aren't at much risk to begin with.

I don't think extending winter break by a couple days is a big deal, but I also don't see what it accomplishes unless you can somehow guarantee that everyone will isolate for 48 hours? I'd rather my kids be at school with vaccinated adults and good supervision than everyone spend two more days in ad hoc childcare arrangements (which often can fall to older relatives, who are the most at risk).



The point of the extra 2 days is to allow DCPS time to distribute tests. From the sounds of things they will at least request (if not require) a negative test before coming back to school. So they are not asking anyone to quarantine for those 2 days or do anything differently than they normally would. They just need the time to distribute tests. Given omicron's hyper-contagiousness I agree that we need to give up on trying to prevent any transmission in schools. But I think that saying you should not come to school if you are covid-positive is a reasonable mitigation measure. And asking for tests after returning from break when families will be traveling and mixing it up with new people seems very reasonable (even in non-covid years there are a lot of viruses going around the schools post-break for these reasons). And they need two days to put the system in place to allow for the testing. And they have given families a reasonable amount of time to plan for this. Extend your vacation if you want, or don't. NBD.
Anonymous
Post 12/22/2021 11:56     Subject: Sheer scale of new student covid cases (real data)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We don’t have the vaccination numbers to let it blow through schools. Some children will die.

What we should be doing is identifying the problem spots (indoor lunch) and figuring out how to mitigate them.


More children will die in a cross walk in DC than from COVID. Even unvaccinated kids. We need to move on to the acceptance part of grief with this virus.


THIS! Let’s switch focus away from COVID, which we will likely all get at some point or another just like we all get colds or even the flu on a bad year, even if vaccinated. Kids are overwhelmingly not dying from COVID.*

Let’s focus instead on something that families and government in DC can actually do something about! The horrendous lack of safety for pedestrians and cyclists everywhere in the district.

*of course people who are immunocompromised have to take special precautions, but that is not new with COVID. I have worked with more than one colleague who wore a surgical mask to the office during cancer treatment, well before COVID.



As others have said, the mortality risk to children (and honestly, folks under 30) is infinitesimal.

I have young kids, one of whom is too young to be vaccinated, and I worry WAY more about cars and traffic safety. When they're older, I'll worry more about alcohol and drugs. You can smart be and careful about COVID, not to mention other illnesses, while also not over-stating the risks. We need to focus our efforts on those who need our help (older and immunocompromised folks), rather than drive ourselves nuts trying to get the risk down to zero for groups that aren't at much risk to begin with.

I don't think extending winter break by a couple days is a big deal, but I also don't see what it accomplishes unless you can somehow guarantee that everyone will isolate for 48 hours? I'd rather my kids be at school with vaccinated adults and good supervision than everyone spend two more days in ad hoc childcare arrangements (which often can fall to older relatives, who are the most at risk).

Anonymous
Post 12/22/2021 11:51     Subject: Sheer scale of new student covid cases (real data)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Oh really. What improved ventilation did DCPS implement?

Checked the filter? Maybe bumped it up a MERV rating or two? There was no comprehensive upgrades to classroom ventilation. Please.


Our school has fans, open windows whenever possible and an air purifier when it's not possible.


And kids standing around in a room spitting into a cup for testing. But yeah, cool fan.
Anonymous
Post 12/22/2021 11:51     Subject: Sheer scale of new student covid cases (real data)
Anonymous wrote:Oh really. What improved ventilation did DCPS implement?

Checked the filter? Maybe bumped it up a MERV rating or two? There was no comprehensive upgrades to classroom ventilation. Please.


Yes the filters at my school and my son’s school were upgraded. Classrooms in both schools I am directly in contact with have working, quality stand alone HEPA filter units running constantly in the individual rooms. I open my window in my classroom no matter the temperature which I would not have done pre-covid. So yes- ventilation is much improved.

Kids wear masks. Not perfectly but they do. It has helped.

You can be unhappy with DCPS’s response but it is a lie to say mitigation is not occurring.
Anonymous
Post 12/22/2021 11:49     Subject: Sheer scale of new student covid cases (real data)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:In the face of everybody in the world, it seems, doing everything they can to keep the schools open, it’s not enough for you. You still have to come on here and complain. So many of you are so damned selfish, thinking only of how the pandemic affects you and your family and no one else. It’s really sad.


I actually think the schools-open-at-any-cost folks are the selfish ones. Totally ignoring that large swaths of our city are still unvaccinated, that immunocompromised folks exist, that hospital workers are at their breaking point and that schools have proven to be a major source of infection in our city. But we can’t possibly close school for three days!!!


If they are unvaccinated that's their fault. They've had ample time to get free shots to protect themselves and their family. If they failed to do that, that's on them.

Also, there is zero proof that schools are a "major source of infection in our city." You are spreading panic and misinformation. Get your doctor to prescribe you something for your anxiety.



DP: This is getting so silly. Where do you think all these teachers and students are getting infected. I feel like at this point we need a moderator to step in bc there’s no way to prove it one way or another


Where are they getting infected? Literally anywhere. The equivalent of .5% of the city's population tested positive over the weekend. You think all those cases are because of schools? It's because of two things: One, the omicron variant seems to be hypercontagious. And two, everything else in the city/region/nation is open for business as usual, 2019-style. Masks weren't required until yesterday at 6 p.m. I wouldn't be surprised if the transmission rate in schools is lower than it is in the community as a whole, because the schools at least try to require masks, at least some schools have implemented other mitigation strategies (like better ventilation or outdoor lunches), and at least attempt to do some surveillance testing.

Unless students and teachers are living an entirely sequestered life when they're not in school, there is no way to keep covid out of the schools -- and no way to prove that the schools are where people are catching it.

I don't want to get covid, and even more than I don't want to get covid, I don't want to pass covid on to someone who's at higher risk than I am (and I am relatively high risk, with Type 1 diabetes, but I'm also otherwise healthy and vaxxed/boosted). But after two years of this, I'm not interested in shutting down schools for my kids or anyone else's if the main goal is to keep unvaccinated people from getting sick. They've had almost a year to go get a free, safe, effective shot. They haven't. Now covid is everywhere, and pretending it's only in the schools or that you can address it by only focusing on the schools is pointless.
Anonymous
Post 12/22/2021 11:48     Subject: Sheer scale of new student covid cases (real data)
Anonymous wrote:Oh really. What improved ventilation did DCPS implement?

Checked the filter? Maybe bumped it up a MERV rating or two? There was no comprehensive upgrades to classroom ventilation. Please.


Our school has fans, open windows whenever possible and an air purifier when it's not possible.
Anonymous
Post 12/22/2021 11:42     Subject: Sheer scale of new student covid cases (real data)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We don’t have the vaccination numbers to let it blow through schools. Some children will die.

What we should be doing is identifying the problem spots (indoor lunch) and figuring out how to mitigate them.


Some children have died.
4 under 9 years old in Maryland - can't find numbers for >9, the MD website is still recovering from its cyberattack.
9 children (all ages) in Virginia.
0 for DC.

People might think it's a small number, but no child should ever die from a preventable disease.


But the best way to prevent it is to vaccinate people -- children, if they're old enough, and their households, if they're not.
Anonymous
Post 12/22/2021 11:39     Subject: Sheer scale of new student covid cases (real data)
Anonymous wrote:We don’t have the vaccination numbers to let it blow through schools. Some children will die.

What we should be doing is identifying the problem spots (indoor lunch) and figuring out how to mitigate them.


It's actually statistically unlikely that some children in D.C. will die if it blows through schools -- as of last week, 706 children had died of covid in the entire United States, and only .01% of children's covid cases were fatal. https://downloads.aap.org/AAP/PDF/AAP%20and%20CHA%20-%20Children%20and%20COVID-19%20State%20Data%20Report%2012.16%20FINAL.pdf

It's especially unlikely that children will die as a result of keeping school open for the three days before a two-week winter break.

I don't say that to minimize the tragedy involved in any of those deaths, but ... the risk to kids from these three days of school really is pretty low.
Anonymous
Post 12/22/2021 11:38     Subject: Sheer scale of new student covid cases (real data)
Oh really. What improved ventilation did DCPS implement?

Checked the filter? Maybe bumped it up a MERV rating or two? There was no comprehensive upgrades to classroom ventilation. Please.
Anonymous
Post 12/22/2021 11:32     Subject: Sheer scale of new student covid cases (real data)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:In the face of everybody in the world, it seems, doing everything they can to keep the schools open, it’s not enough for you. You still have to come on here and complain. So many of you are so damned selfish, thinking only of how the pandemic affects you and your family and no one else. It’s really sad.


I actually think the schools-open-at-any-cost folks are the selfish ones. Totally ignoring that large swaths of our city are still unvaccinated, that immunocompromised folks exist, that hospital workers are at their breaking point and that schools have proven to be a major source of infection in our city. But we can’t possibly close school for three days!!!


If they are unvaccinated that's their fault. They've had ample time to get free shots to protect themselves and their family. If they failed to do that, that's on them.

Also, there is zero proof that schools are a "major source of infection in our city." You are spreading panic and misinformation. Get your doctor to prescribe you something for your anxiety.




DP: This is getting so silly. Where do you think all these teachers and students are getting infected. I feel like at this point we need a moderator to step in bc there’s no way to prove it one way or another


How can schools not be a source of Covid spread. Lots of people packed together in small spaces for extended periods of time. Inconsistent mask wearing. Vaccines not mandated. What is so magical about schools that Covid is suppressed there? I want my kids in school but som of you live in your own reality


It did not really spread in schools pre-delta. Positive cases did not tend to infect close contacts due to mitigation like improved ventilation. It is unclear if the super spike of omicron in schools right now ids just community spread but student case rates are higher than community case rates right now and that is new I believe.
Anonymous
Post 12/22/2021 11:32     Subject: Sheer scale of new student covid cases (real data)
Anonymous wrote:Questions for the "let's all get COVID" crowd: Do you have any room in your world view for people who don't want to accept that we're all going to get infected? What about people with underlying health conditions?

It would be great if we could all make our own risk decisions, but your decisions impact other people.

Also, there's no evidence that the severity is worse than Delta.
https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/omicron-five-times-more-likely-reinfect-than-delta-study-says-2021-12-17/


Reports are out from South Africa today saying 80% less hospitalizations than delta.

https://www.newsweek.com/omicron-hospitalization-risk-80-percent-less-delta-south-africa-study-1662181
Anonymous
Post 12/22/2021 11:28     Subject: Sheer scale of new student covid cases (real data)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:In the face of everybody in the world, it seems, doing everything they can to keep the schools open, it’s not enough for you. You still have to come on here and complain. So many of you are so damned selfish, thinking only of how the pandemic affects you and your family and no one else. It’s really sad.


I actually think the schools-open-at-any-cost folks are the selfish ones. Totally ignoring that large swaths of our city are still unvaccinated, that immunocompromised folks exist, that hospital workers are at their breaking point and that schools have proven to be a major source of infection in our city. But we can’t possibly close school for three days!!!


If they are unvaccinated that's their fault. They've had ample time to get free shots to protect themselves and their family. If they failed to do that, that's on them.

Also, there is zero proof that schools are a "major source of infection in our city." You are spreading panic and misinformation. Get your doctor to prescribe you something for your anxiety.



DP: This is getting so silly. Where do you think all these teachers and students are getting infected. I feel like at this point we need a moderator to step in bc there’s no way to prove it one way or another


How can schools not be a source of Covid spread. Lots of people packed together in small spaces for extended periods of time. Inconsistent mask wearing. Vaccines not mandated. What is so magical about schools that Covid is suppressed there? I want my kids in school but som of you live in your own reality
Anonymous
Post 12/22/2021 11:25     Subject: Sheer scale of new student covid cases (real data)
Anonymous wrote:I would lock myself in my bedroom 23 hours a damn day if it would keep the kids in school. I will order curbside groceries. I don't give AF about me. But goddamn send the kids to school. I will double mask her. She can get boosted when she's eligible. But dear jesus i wish they would keep them in school.


You sound nuts
Anonymous
Post 12/22/2021 11:17     Subject: Sheer scale of new student covid cases (real data)
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:In the face of everybody in the world, it seems, doing everything they can to keep the schools open, it’s not enough for you. You still have to come on here and complain. So many of you are so damned selfish, thinking only of how the pandemic affects you and your family and no one else. It’s really sad.


I actually think the schools-open-at-any-cost folks are the selfish ones. Totally ignoring that large swaths of our city are still unvaccinated, that immunocompromised folks exist, that hospital workers are at their breaking point and that schools have proven to be a major source of infection in our city. But we can’t possibly close school for three days!!!


If they are unvaccinated that's their fault. They've had ample time to get free shots to protect themselves and their family. If they failed to do that, that's on them.

Also, there is zero proof that schools are a "major source of infection in our city." You are spreading panic and misinformation. Get your doctor to prescribe you something for your anxiety.



Where are people without kids or who don’t teach getting infected? It varies, right? So again, unless you can prove the schools are the driver, not just a place where spread occurs, schools shouldn’t be shut down unless all those other places where spread is occurring are shut down.

DP: This is getting so silly. Where do you think all these teachers and students are getting infected. I feel like at this point we need a moderator to step in bc there’s no way to prove it one way or another
Anonymous
Post 12/22/2021 11:16     Subject: Sheer scale of new student covid cases (real data)
Anonymous wrote:I would lock myself in my bedroom 23 hours a damn day if it would keep the kids in school. I will order curbside groceries. I don't give AF about me. But goddamn send the kids to school. I will double mask her. She can get boosted when she's eligible. But dear jesus i wish they would keep them in school.


I understand why there’s low trust but I believe most teachers feel this way too.

The problem we’re facing today is that the school is hobbled both by the initial (very rapid) spread of omicron through an immunologically naive population, and also delta mitigation measures (like staying out if you’re healthy but positive) that do little to stop the spread of omicron.

We’ll be better informed by January 5. I believe a lot of people, students and teachers, want to go back, and I believe by then the schools will have found a way. Maybe they’ll be an enhanced virtual option. Maybe we’ll finally enforce a vaccine mandate for eligible students. We will get there.