Anonymous
Post 04/26/2019 10:52     Subject: More defections from DA to ECNL
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:And yet club after club after club is leaving DA only.to be replaced by NPL teams

And yet DA is morphing into ECNL to save the league.


They are not going to ECNL because they believe in ECNL, they are going because they will be able to charge ECNL prices for 40 kids per age group instead of 20 kids per age group.

They will water down their own brand by turning NPL into ECNL2. Change the name and double the price. Chhhaaaa ching!!!!

How long do you really think ECNL 2 will last when parents are paying higher prices, for further travel than NPL and still be on the B team?



My kid will never play ECNL 2. Unlike you, I dont care what path parents choose to take.

Why are you not in Colorado right now?


Colorado has internet, caveman. Is every ECNLer as clueless as you? That would explain quite a bit of this problem


Good thing to know the DA'ers are posting at 6 am on a ECNL thread while 10 states away during a college showcase. Shows the level of insanity if true.


What empty football stadium is your kid playing HS kickball in this week?
Anonymous
Post 04/26/2019 10:44     Subject: More defections from DA to ECNL
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:And yet club after club after club is leaving DA only.to be replaced by NPL teams

And yet DA is morphing into ECNL to save the league.


They are not going to ECNL because they believe in ECNL, they are going because they will be able to charge ECNL prices for 40 kids per age group instead of 20 kids per age group.

They will water down their own brand by turning NPL into ECNL2. Change the name and double the price. Chhhaaaa ching!!!!

How long do you really think ECNL 2 will last when parents are paying higher prices, for further travel than NPL and still be on the B team?



My kid will never play ECNL 2. Unlike you, I dont care what path parents choose to take.

Why are you not in Colorado right now?


Colorado has internet, caveman. Is every ECNLer as clueless as you? That would explain quite a bit of this problem


Good thing to know the DA'ers are posting at 6 am on a ECNL thread while 10 states away during a college showcase. Shows the level of insanity if true.
Anonymous
Post 04/26/2019 10:31     Subject: More defections from DA to ECNL
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:And yet club after club after club is leaving DA only.to be replaced by NPL teams

And yet DA is morphing into ECNL to save the league.


They are not going to ECNL because they believe in ECNL, they are going because they will be able to charge ECNL prices for 40 kids per age group instead of 20 kids per age group.

They will water down their own brand by turning NPL into ECNL2. Change the name and double the price. Chhhaaaa ching!!!!

How long do you really think ECNL 2 will last when parents are paying higher prices, for further travel than NPL and still be on the B team?



My kid will never play ECNL 2. Unlike you, I dont care what path parents choose to take.

Why are you not in Colorado right now?


Simply asking the potential motives of parents in light of ECNL expanding in this way is not caring about what path parents are choosing. ECNL 2 is likely going to be no more a path than NPL is. It is, by definition, the second tier and assuming the continued existence of DA ECNL two is actually a third tier.

The question is, assuming the whole point is to expand the ECNL club to club scheduling to the B teams I'm simply asking how long that model will last if parents are incurring the same fees to travel to North Carolina to play other B teams?

In some regions like the North East the difference is minimal between current NPL teams as is so it is really no net change for them. Southern California with their density I could see it working. But I don't see how it would possibly stick in our area.

The other way they can go is to add clubs simply as ECNL 2 clubs and try and create a Pro Rel system. But for clubs like PDA, Michigan Hawks etc, who already have two teams in ECNL, true promotion/relegation will be a farce because they can simply stack their rosters each season for optimal results which would effectively block clubs from ever reaching the true ECNL tier.

So the question is will ECNL 2 be a true club to club addition that is simply providing the B team to play against other ECNL clubs or will ECNL 2 be more like CCL 2 where it is a mix of full CCL and non CCL clubs? If it is more of a CCL2 model will there be promotion relegation?
Anonymous
Post 04/26/2019 10:30     Subject: More defections from DA to ECNL
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:And yet club after club after club is leaving DA only.to be replaced by NPL teams

And yet DA is morphing into ECNL to save the league.


They are not going to ECNL because they believe in ECNL, they are going because they will be able to charge ECNL prices for 40 kids per age group instead of 20 kids per age group.

They will water down their own brand by turning NPL into ECNL2. Change the name and double the price. Chhhaaaa ching!!!!

How long do you really think ECNL 2 will last when parents are paying higher prices, for further travel than NPL and still be on the B team?



My kid will never play ECNL 2. Unlike you, I dont care what path parents choose to take.

Why are you not in Colorado right now?


Colorado has internet, caveman. Is every ECNLer as clueless as you? That would explain quite a bit of this problem
Anonymous
Post 04/26/2019 10:00     Subject: More defections from DA to ECNL
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:And yet club after club after club is leaving DA only.to be replaced by NPL teams

And yet DA is morphing into ECNL to save the league.


They are not going to ECNL because they believe in ECNL, they are going because they will be able to charge ECNL prices for 40 kids per age group instead of 20 kids per age group.

They will water down their own brand by turning NPL into ECNL2. Change the name and double the price. Chhhaaaa ching!!!!

How long do you really think ECNL 2 will last when parents are paying higher prices, for further travel than NPL and still be on the B team?



My kid will never play ECNL 2. Unlike you, I dont care what path parents choose to take.

Why are you not in Colorado right now?
Anonymous
Post 04/26/2019 09:59     Subject: More defections from DA to ECNL
ECNL clubs can provide a superior training environment with parents paying for 6 months of focused training versus 10 months for DA.

The clubs can provide more coaches, pay coaches more, provide better facilities, etc. ECNL players actually benefit from the free HS training that players receive.

It is really hard to make the case that DA training is superior. Especially in this area where the DA clubs have lack of facilities and coaches compared to the larger area ECNL clubs.
Anonymous
Post 04/26/2019 09:50     Subject: More defections from DA to ECNL
Anonymous wrote:And yet club after club after club is leaving DA only.to be replaced by NPL teams

And yet DA is morphing into ECNL to save the league.


They are not going to ECNL because they believe in ECNL, they are going because they will be able to charge ECNL prices for 40 kids per age group instead of 20 kids per age group.

They will water down their own brand by turning NPL into ECNL2. Change the name and double the price. Chhhaaaa ching!!!!

How long do you really think ECNL 2 will last when parents are paying higher prices, for further travel than NPL and still be on the B team?

Anonymous
Post 04/26/2019 09:49     Subject: More defections from DA to ECNL
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

Overload, right? Well the majority of DA kids play 10 months plus other sports plus personal training.....and with the newly implemented champions league cup, more games. more travel, and more money.



I've seen a lot of this in this thread. I don't think the competition adds many games at all - it looks to add 3 total games over two weekends for each team, and no more even if the team advances. Later rounds are just integrated into the already existing Showcases, in other words, the cup determines those game pairings at the showcases. So weekend 1 may be a home or away game, then you have one weekend of regional travel for two games. Doesn't seem like a huge increase to me at all.

Even considering this as a 3 game increase assumes that there isn't a game or 3 removed from the regular game schedule, which seems to be more based on providing the correct number of total games than making sure that each team plays other teams a certain number of times.

http://www.ussoccerda.com/New-Cup-Competition-Structure
Anonymous
Post 04/26/2019 09:39     Subject: More defections from DA to ECNL
And yet club after club after club is leaving DA only.to be replaced by NPL teams

And yet DA is morphing into ECNL to save the league.
Anonymous
Post 04/26/2019 09:31     Subject: More defections from DA to ECNL
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:You ever stop to think that maybe is not about HS but rather the ECNL team is better than the DA team....so they chose the ECNL team


That's fair. Every player should choose what she thinks is best for her development.

Did you ever stop to think that players choosing DA think it is better for their development? Maybe another ECNL team overall would be better and maybe it wouldn't. That depends on the club we are talking about in each case. That isn't necessarily the right question. Some players may feel their own development is better with a 10 month schedule over a 5-6 month one.


You ever stop to think that no one posted anything about DA players choosing DA? It's the other way around and you are spearheading most of it. So do yourself a favor. Look in the mirror and state the following: "stop contridicting yourself, (insert name)"

The league doesnt matter!!!!

The DA has great teams and awful teams.
The ECNL has great teams and awful teams.
The DA has some great players and mostly average players
The ECNL has some great players and mostly average players.
The DA has some good coaches and bad coaches
The ECNL has some good coaches and bad coaches

The DA has 4 practices. The 4th practice is on Sunday and used a recovery after Saturdays game. It's not a net gain of a training day like others want you to believe. In reality, the DA and ECNL have 3 real training days.

Some ECNL teams have better players, coaches and will beat DA teams...and vice versa.

DA claims 10 months of training. In other words, they play Spring/Fall and futsal in the winter. Players also play other sports like basketball and track, etc. Nothing special. ECNL kids prior to high school are going the same thing. In fact, the majority of kids playing travel soccer are doing the same thing.

In theory, the ECNL players who choose to play HS (majority do) play a 6 month CLUB SEASON because they are participating in high school. HOWEVER, THEY ARE STILL PLAYING SOCCER FOR THOSE OTHER 4 MONTHS AND STILL DOING COLLEGE SHOWCASES WITH THEIR CLUB. TEAMS.

In reality, ECNL kids play more soccer than the DA kids.

Overload, right? Well the majority of DA kids play 10 months plus other sports plus personal training.....and with the newly implemented champions league cup, more games. more travel, and more money.

The ECNL kids playing HS are not getting the same quality of training during those 4 months, right?....TRUE. They are not. No argument there. HOWEVER, MANY OF THE PLAYERS ARE LEARNING TO PLAY UP AGAINST OLDER KIDS. Much like college...but let me guess, college sucks as well, right?

Maybe it's not considered good soccer. However, that's not the point.

Club sports will typically be better than HS sports IN EVERY SPORT. However, that's not the point.

99.99 percent of players will never get a NT call up.
7 percent will play college soccer.
2 percent will play D1 college soccer.
5 percent will play D2 and D3.

1,156 players in the Girls ECNL Class of 2019 will go on to play soccer at the collegiate level this fall, with 847 players committed to play in NCAA Division I programs.

Playing college soccer is Elite. The above stats prove it. That is the end goal for the vast majority of kids.














With so few college spots it doesn't make sense to allocate 12-16 months worth of training over four years of High School to HS Soccer if you are fighting for a potential college roster spot.

The playing against bigger kids is only valid for freshman and sophomores. The size issue, for women, is done in college. A college freshman is playing against more experienced players, not necessarily bigger players. Playing HS soccer as a freshman will not do anything to close that experience gap.

There just is not much developmental upside to HS soccer. It is social, just call it what it is.

As kids get older, yes, to many games can be detrimental especially if they are overly physical and of poor quality. ECNL packing the fall season simply to accommodate a packed HS season is not looking out for your kids best interests. It is looking out for their bottom line because parents and players seem to want it. But kids and adults alike want lots of things that are still not very good for them health wise.

And then just fiscally, it feels a bit of a ripoff to pay ECNL prices to only get up to 6 months of quality training with quality players.

And, as far as the Sunday re-gen practice? That is not a DA thing. Most clubs have 4 practices during the week and simply take the Sunday off.
Anonymous
Post 04/26/2019 09:13     Subject: More defections from DA to ECNL
Almost forgot!
Did you know that DA allows you to stay with your team and opt out during the HS season so you can play HS soccer.

Anonymous
Post 04/26/2019 09:05     Subject: More defections from DA to ECNL
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:You ever stop to think that maybe is not about HS but rather the ECNL team is better than the DA team....so they chose the ECNL team


That's fair. Every player should choose what she thinks is best for her development.

Did you ever stop to think that players choosing DA think it is better for their development? Maybe another ECNL team overall would be better and maybe it wouldn't. That depends on the club we are talking about in each case. That isn't necessarily the right question. Some players may feel their own development is better with a 10 month schedule over a 5-6 month one.


You ever stop to think that no one posted anything about DA players choosing DA? It's the other way around and you are spearheading most of it. So do yourself a favor. Look in the mirror and state the following: "stop contridicting yourself, (insert name)"

The league doesnt matter!!!!

The DA has great teams and awful teams.
The ECNL has great teams and awful teams.
The DA has some great players and mostly average players
The ECNL has some great players and mostly average players.
The DA has some good coaches and bad coaches
The ECNL has some good coaches and bad coaches

The DA has 4 practices. The 4th practice is on Sunday and used a recovery after Saturdays game. It's not a net gain of a training day like others want you to believe. In reality, the DA and ECNL have 3 real training days.

Some ECNL teams have better players, coaches and will beat DA teams...and vice versa.

DA claims 10 months of training. In other words, they play Spring/Fall and futsal in the winter. Players also play other sports like basketball and track, etc. Nothing special. ECNL kids prior to high school are going the same thing. In fact, the majority of kids playing travel soccer are doing the same thing.

In theory, the ECNL players who choose to play HS (majority do) play a 6 month CLUB SEASON because they are participating in high school. HOWEVER, THEY ARE STILL PLAYING SOCCER FOR THOSE OTHER 4 MONTHS AND STILL DOING COLLEGE SHOWCASES WITH THEIR CLUB. TEAMS.

In reality, ECNL kids play more soccer than the DA kids.

Overload, right? Well the majority of DA kids play 10 months plus other sports plus personal training.....and with the newly implemented champions league cup, more games. more travel, and more money.

The ECNL kids playing HS are not getting the same quality of training during those 4 months, right?....TRUE. They are not. No argument there. HOWEVER, MANY OF THE PLAYERS ARE LEARNING TO PLAY UP AGAINST OLDER KIDS. Much like college...but let me guess, college sucks as well, right?

Maybe it's not considered good soccer. However, that's not the point.

Club sports will typically be better than HS sports IN EVERY SPORT. However, that's not the point.

99.99 percent of players will never get a NT call up.
7 percent will play college soccer.
2 percent will play D1 college soccer.
5 percent will play D2 and D3.

1,156 players in the Girls ECNL Class of 2019 will go on to play soccer at the collegiate level this fall, with 847 players committed to play in NCAA Division I programs.

Playing college soccer is Elite. The above stats prove it. That is the end goal for the vast majority of kids.












Anonymous
Post 04/26/2019 08:31     Subject: Re:More defections from DA to ECNL
Anonymous wrote:This could be done via accreditation by USSF. Lack of accreditation would be a death knell for the orgs not falling in line. Enjoining the US coaching orgs into this and coordinating between pro clubs at all levels and colleges would be the final step. Then “qualifying / certifying ” the coaches and the clubs based on competition level with standard ussf guidelines for development across age groups would come next. Standardizing formal game to training ratios and aged based development guidelines (with ample flexibility but a consistent framework) along with minimum coaching quals at each competition level.


Congrats, you’ve just described the current implementation of DA.

We’re finding that lack of US Soccer support isn’t a “death knell” but actually a call to arms. There are too many opinions and egos in this space to ever come to the kind of utopian solution you outline, with one league and one pathway. That sort of philosophy might work in an autocratic society where individualism has been discouraged and ignored for generations, but there are deep roots against it in this country. For better or worse. If one does support that vision, though, supporting the DA would show it. That’s the de facto centralized league that sets all of the criteria you mention above. That means giving DA clubs preference over the other options and leading the other clubs to the same conclusion you reached.

All this through choice, not edict.
Anonymous
Post 04/26/2019 08:16     Subject: Re:More defections from DA to ECNL
I think that the whole DA v. ECNL thing and to a larger degree, USYS v. US Club has damaged soccer in the US. It has diverted focus from what’s best from a youth development and competition perspective to parallel but dilluted showcases, regional and national leagues, state cups, ID camps, etc. Imagine the competition if USSF organized and structured things so that EDP, ECNL, ECNL2, ODP, ID2, and DA were no longer separate and that leagues were all affiliated and consolidated from local metro/county leagues to state cups to regional and national competitions and showcases. Pro team youth clubs could play in this same structure. Relegation and promotion on an annual basis and a consistent and single ID processes for metro, regional, and national players. It really would not be that hard to draw up the structures and protocols. The hard part would be via getting the leagues and USYS and US Club to cooperate and consolidate. This could be done via accreditation by USSF. Lack of accreditation would be a death knell for the orgs not falling in line. Enjoining the US coaching orgs into this and coordinating between pro clubs at all levels and colleges would be the final step. Then “qualifying / certifying ” the coaches and the clubs based on competition level with standard ussf guidelines for development across age groups would come next. Standardizing formal game to training ratios and aged based development guidelines (with ample flexibility but a consistent framework) along with minimum coaching quals at each competition level.

Pooled money from association fees would be used for underprivileged scholarships issued by the ussf and for grass roots development programs for underserved communities. This would start to engage those left behind in the pay-to-play model.

As far as HS soccer, ussf would neither restrict nor promote or accredit HS teams and leagues. Let the individual decide but with the superior ussf driven and organized platform, the vast majority of top notch players would chose club soccer not HS.
Anonymous
Post 04/25/2019 22:59     Subject: More defections from DA to ECNL
Anonymous wrote:You ever stop to think that maybe is not about HS but rather the ECNL team is better than the DA team....so they chose the ECNL team


That's fair. Every player should choose what she thinks is best for her development.

Did you ever stop to think that players choosing DA think it is better for their development? Maybe another ECNL team overall would be better and maybe it wouldn't. That depends on the club we are talking about in each case. That isn't necessarily the right question. Some players may feel their own development is better with a 10 month schedule over a 5-6 month one.