Anonymous wrote:Md. free-range parents to file lawsuit against CPS to fight the "unlawful seizure of their children."

http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/local/maryland/2015/04/14/free-range-parenting-lawsuit-cps/25759523/

I don't like this couple and I'm on CPS side on this one, but I'm actually glad they're suing. Let's get this issue resolved. Is CPS overstepping? I read the regs to be pretty clear that you're not supposed to leave a kid under 8 unsupervised, and the supervision must be by someone 11 (if sibling) or 13 or older. But it's a bit fuzzy whether that applies to public spaces or just at home. So let's get it resolved already. Regardless, I expect there will not be any finding of liability on the part of the police or CPS. They're going to be able to show that they're legally obligated to follow up on the report and not just turn the kids over to the parents without some investigation. To me, the only thing they may have done wrong is take too long in resolving it. But I'm not sure how that leads to any liability.
I also fully expect that if this couple (and all the spittle-flinging crazies on this thread) succeed in removing any regulations for young children being left unsupervised, they will then vilify CPS for NOT protecting unsupervised young kids when something does happen as a result of that. Of course, most of the time, the bad stuff that happens to unsupervised kids doesn't make the news. And I also think that a *lot* of the reason that people think these parents are good parents is simply because they look like us and our friends. A lot packed into that level of bias.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I send my kids to the playground and around our neighborhood without supervision and strict parameters.
However, if CPS and the police told me they could not wander without adult supervision, I would comply.
I have bigger, more important fish to fry.
These parents are narcissistic idiots.
Their poor judgement is not in letting their kids to to the park, it's in not complying with the earlier warnings and using their kids as pawns in their unhappiness with the MD laws.
Watch your kids and lobby your political rep.
Dummies!

What law are you referring to? There is no law that says a 10 and 6yr old can not play in a park alone. None.

O SU already

You are the one who should "SU" since she's right.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I send my kids to the playground and around our neighborhood without supervision and strict parameters.
However, if CPS and the police told me they could not wander without adult supervision, I would comply.
I have bigger, more important fish to fry.
These parents are narcissistic idiots.
Their poor judgement is not in letting their kids to to the park, it's in not complying with the earlier warnings and using their kids as pawns in their unhappiness with the MD laws.
Watch your kids and lobby your political rep.
Dummies!

What law are you referring to? There is no law that says a 10 and 6yr old can not play in a park alone. None.

O SU already

Anonymous wrote:I send my kids to the playground and around our neighborhood without supervision and strict parameters.
However, if CPS and the police told me they could not wander without adult supervision, I would comply.
I have bigger, more important fish to fry.
These parents are narcissistic idiots.
Their poor judgement is not in letting their kids to to the park, it's in not complying with the earlier warnings and using their kids as pawns in their unhappiness with the MD laws.
Watch your kids and lobby your political rep.
Dummies!

What law are you referring to? There is no law that says a 10 and 6yr old can not play in a park alone. None.

Anonymous wrote:Your child is far more likely to die riding in the car with you then they ever are walking to and from a park.

Then their is your home. 500,000 children under the age of 5 are poisoned in their own homes every year.

By being a free range child, I was always taught situational awareness and to be wary of any person who attempted to approach me.

Had mom always been there, I would still be oblivious to my surroundings because I always had a watchdog panting along behind.

Do you teach your children not to walk close to doorways or ally entrances?
Do you teach them not to walk near parked cars - especially vans?
Do you teach them to answer questions asked by strangers at a distance that does not allow them to be grabbed?
Do you teach them to cross the street and go the other way if they think someone is following them?
Do you teach them not to display anything that could be considered valuable on the street including a cell phone?
Do teach them not to use earbuds while walking so they are aware of sounds that may alert them to trouble?

I learned all of the above and more starting at age 4 (I walked alone to school at that age.)

My mother's mantra was "I'm not here to be liked. I'm here to raise you to be a responsible adult." And she took her job VERY seriously.

Hovering parents are how a man could pull a gun on a subway car and nobody even noticed. "Oh, mom will watch out for trouble. I'll just sit here and text my friends."

I agree! My 13yr old daughter has a friend across a 2 lane road with a traffic light and cross-walk and her parents STILL as a teenager won't let her cross. Last summer, they finally decided okay she could do it. Guess what? She was too scared to do it and didn't even know when/how to cross. My daughter showed her but she was still so paranoid she never did it again.

Her friends think it is weird she does her own wash and knows how to make dinners. She has been watching her younger sibling since she was in middle school and has been walking the dog daily on her own since she was in 2nd grade.

My 5yr old has friends that come over 5 minutes into a playdate and say they are bored and have no imagination. Ask me to play with them. They can't tie their shoes, they can't button their pants, they ask for a cup that can't spill. Sheesh, it is like being around a toddler for me. But yet, I realize that people parent different and there is nothing we can all do but find a common denominator.

I send my kids to the playground and around our neighborhood without supervision and strict parameters.
However, if CPS and the police told me they could not wander without adult supervision, I would comply.
I have bigger, more important fish to fry.
These parents are narcissistic idiots.
Their poor judgement is not in letting their kids to to the park, it's in not complying with the earlier warnings and using their kids as pawns in their unhappiness with the MD laws.
Watch your kids and lobby your political rep.
Dummies!

Anonymous wrote:Md. free-range parents to file lawsuit against CPS to fight the "unlawful seizure of their children."

http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/local/maryland/2015/04/14/free-range-parenting-lawsuit-cps/25759523/

Good for them!! I just read the article and the kid's version of the story and that is scary. Left in a cop's car for 3hrs!!

Your child is far more likely to die riding in the car with you then they ever are walking to and from a park.

Then their is your home. 500,000 children under the age of 5 are poisoned in their own homes every year.

By being a free range child, I was always taught situational awareness and to be wary of any person who attempted to approach me.

Had mom always been there, I would still be oblivious to my surroundings because I always had a watchdog panting along behind.

Do you teach your children not to walk close to doorways or ally entrances?
Do you teach them not to walk near parked cars - especially vans?
Do you teach them to answer questions asked by strangers at a distance that does not allow them to be grabbed?
Do you teach them to cross the street and go the other way if they think someone is following them?
Do you teach them not to display anything that could be considered valuable on the street including a cell phone?
Do teach them not to use earbuds while walking so they are aware of sounds that may alert them to trouble?

I learned all of the above and more starting at age 4 (I walked alone to school at that age.)

My mother's mantra was "I'm not here to be liked. I'm here to raise you to be a responsible adult." And she took her job VERY seriously.

Hovering parents are how a man could pull a gun on a subway car and nobody even noticed. "Oh, mom will watch out for trouble. I'll just sit here and text my friends."

Anonymous wrote:Md. free-range parents to file lawsuit against CPS to fight the "unlawful seizure of their children."

http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/local/maryland/2015/04/14/free-range-parenting-lawsuit-cps/25759523/

Damn right. And Wiley Rein is representing them pro bono.

Md. free-range parents to file lawsuit against CPS to fight the "unlawful seizure of their children."

http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/local/maryland/2015/04/14/free-range-parenting-lawsuit-cps/25759523/

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So why didn't the kids speak up and demand to call their parents? Why come the kids didn't fight back, run off, refuse to go, use their cell phone to immediately call their parents? What happened to the mature, knows what to do even In a frightening situation 10 yr old?

Imagine now it wasn't the police who came along and took the kids.
Clearly the 10 yr old and 6 yr old aren't equipped to deal with situations like the parents believed.

But actually it was the police.

Shhh, come on. Let the helicopters keep imagining the worse all the time. It is such a healthy way to parent.

This is from another post. I found it very enlightening and actually really sad how paranoid we have all become into thinking what these parents are doing are wrong.



The quoted list comes from Louise Bates Ames 1980 and is about readiness for first grade. This is the complete list:

1. Will your child be six years, six months or older when he begins first grade and starts receiving reading instruction?

2. Does your child have two to five permanent or second teeth?

3. Can you child tell, in such a way that his speech is understood by a school crossing guard or policeman, where he lives?

4. Can he draw and color and stay within the lines of the design being colored?

5. Can he stand on one foot with eyes closed for five to ten seconds?

6. Can he ride a small two-wheeled bicycle without helper wheels?

7. Can he tell left hand from right?

8. Can he travel alone in the neighborhood (four to eight blocks) to store, school, playground, or to a friend's home?

9. Can he be away from you all day without being upset?

10. Can he repeat an eight- to ten-word sentence, if you say it once, as "The boy ran all the way home from the store"?

11. Can he count eight to ten pennies correctly?

12. Does your child try to write or copy letters or numbers?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The parents are stupid. What's easier, watching your kids at a park, or having to deal with the police? They should be ashamed of themselves for their lousy parenting. I feel sorry for the kids. The older kid is having to act like a parent and the younger one is being parented by a child.

It's called teaching kids responsibility. All this handholding of kids has led to helpless young adults who can't do anything without their parents.

My brother is 29, parent of the millenial generation and 12 years younger than me so basically my parents dealt with him way differently than me. They were helicopter parents with him. I was a typical 80s free roaming kids. My brother has been in arrested development, can't figure out how to wash his clothes, make a decent meal, open a checking account, budget, basic in depending living essentials. It's incredible and sad. All this handholding does have consequences,

My parents always knew where we were, we were heavily supervised, etc. You know what, I can easily do all those things you describe and more. Why? My parents took the time to teach me through parenting. Those are parenting issues. You need to teach your kid how to cook, wash clothing, etc. Saying, hey, I'm not helping you, figure it out so you can learn is lazy parenting.

That is what all the helicopters say to justify their coddling actions. Do you honestly think non-helicopter parents just sit on the coach and say "figure it out!!" There is a difference between doing things FOR your kids and showing them WHAT to do for themselves. But helicopters usually don't understand that. They are too busy doing, doing, doing.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The parents are stupid. What's easier, watching your kids at a park, or having to deal with the police? They should be ashamed of themselves for their lousy parenting. I feel sorry for the kids. The older kid is having to act like a parent and the younger one is being parented by a child.

It's called teaching kids responsibility. All this handholding of kids has led to helpless young adults who can't do anything without their parents.

My brother is 29, parent of the millenial generation and 12 years younger than me so basically my parents dealt with him way differently than me. They were helicopter parents with him. I was a typical 80s free roaming kids. My brother has been in arrested development, can't figure out how to wash his clothes, make a decent meal, open a checking account, budget, basic in depending living essentials. It's incredible and sad. All this handholding does have consequences,

My parents always knew where we were, we were heavily supervised, etc. You know what, I can easily do all those things you describe and more. Why? My parents took the time to teach me through parenting. Those are parenting issues. You need to teach your kid how to cook, wash clothing, etc. Saying, hey, I'm not helping you, figure it out so you can learn is lazy parenting.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To all the posters that say "I walked x miles and crossed x streets alone when I was age X and survived, so it's ok for kids today to do it." Consider this:

The kids that didn't survive aren't here to present the other view.

Think about that every time you get on plane/train and especially when you put your kid in a car which is dangerous!

Yep. That's why we use car seats. Kids used to not do that either.

Kids in car seats die too.

Wow you must be an idiot. So do you reject car seats too?

I reject the idea that a kid in a car seat is safer than a kid walking to a neighborhood park made for kids.

You've entirely missed the point here. Entirely.

The point: People who claim that because they did something and survived, therefore it is fine for the next generation to do it, are completely overlooking the fact that the kids from their generation who didn't survive aren't here to make the counter argument.

But you're missing a larger point. There is nothing lost of any real value in using a car seat. There is no trade off in adopting this additional safety measure, so of course everyone should have their children in car seats. That is not the case with walking to the park. By walking to the park alone, the children learn to navigate though the world alone, make decisions and judgements, enjoy freedom, gain confidence in themselves, etc. These are real, valuable lessons that children today are increasingly without the opportunity to learn.

So if the parents wait until the 6yo is 10 this child will never be able to make a decision for the rest of his life.