Anonymous
Post 02/20/2015 17:36     Subject: Re:"Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
We're only supposed to care about the fates of teachers and their càreers, but who cares about the fact that each year we graduate millions of kids who are at best semiliterate and who can't make change, forget about them in terms of meaningful employment outlook...


Have you considered the damage that can be done to the teaching "profession"? Have you wondered who will join a "profession" that is not peer monitored (as other professions like law and medicine ) are, but where a person is treated as a blue collar worker? This may affect the students far more than you think. It's circling around the drain as it is. Teaching is a professional job. Because the students matter. When states started reducing union power and then NCLB put in the top down control (which exacerbated the problem of lack of control), things started really going downhill. It didn't help that pay was decreasing (relative to COL) at the same time. Other professions peer monitor for a reason. It works.

The interesting districts to look at would be the ones in the middle (not the top or bottom). What has been happening to them?


Have you considered the damage that could be done to entire generations of kids due to a lack of adequate standards?


The PP is not arguing against standards. In fact, the PP said nothing about standards. The PP is arguing in favor of teacher professionalization and teacher unions and against the high-stakes testing requirements in the No Child Left Behind Act.


You're missing the point. The complaining and "high stakes" moniker only seems to come up when it affects teachers. But when it was affecting millions of students nobody cared.[/quote]

You are making a pretty big generalization there. Nobody cared about the effects of this kind of testing on students?

I believe this thread started out with a teacher who was quitting over the effects of these tests on the students (since it is titled "Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests). May I go so far as to say that she cared?






Anonymous
Post 02/20/2015 17:29     Subject: Re:"Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests
You're missing the point. The complaining and "high stakes" moniker only seems to come up when it affects teachers. But when it was affecting millions of students nobody cared.


People have been complaining about these "high stakes" tests for years. People complain about the effect they have in narrowing the curriculum for STUDENTS. Yes, people care about the effect on students. Also, what affects the teachers affects the students. The two are very closely linked because the teacher is teaching the students. Teachers give instruction. Instruction affects students. Therefore, teachers affect students. "High stakes"tests affect instruction. You can't affect one thing without affecting the rest. When you talk about any of it, you are talking about impacts on students.
Anonymous
Post 02/20/2015 16:44     Subject: Re:"Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
We're only supposed to care about the fates of teachers and their càreers, but who cares about the fact that each year we graduate millions of kids who are at best semiliterate and who can't make change, forget about them in terms of meaningful employment outlook...


Have you considered the damage that can be done to the teaching "profession"? Have you wondered who will join a "profession" that is not peer monitored (as other professions like law and medicine ) are, but where a person is treated as a blue collar worker? This may affect the students far more than you think. It's circling around the drain as it is. Teaching is a professional job. Because the students matter. When states started reducing union power and then NCLB put in the top down control (which exacerbated the problem of lack of control), things started really going downhill. It didn't help that pay was decreasing (relative to COL) at the same time. Other professions peer monitor for a reason. It works.

The interesting districts to look at would be the ones in the middle (not the top or bottom). What has been happening to them?


Have you considered the damage that could be done to entire generations of kids due to a lack of adequate standards?


The PP is not arguing against standards. In fact, the PP said nothing about standards. The PP is arguing in favor of teacher professionalization and teacher unions and against the high-stakes testing requirements in the No Child Left Behind Act.


You're missing the point. The complaining and "high stakes" moniker only seems to come up when it affects teachers. But when it was affecting millions of students nobody cared.
Anonymous
Post 02/20/2015 11:02     Subject: Re:"Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests
Have you considered the damage that could be done to entire generations of kids due to a lack of adequate standards?


It's getting hard to distinguish sarcasm from real belief on this thread.

Anonymous
Post 02/20/2015 10:59     Subject: Re:"Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
We're only supposed to care about the fates of teachers and their càreers, but who cares about the fact that each year we graduate millions of kids who are at best semiliterate and who can't make change, forget about them in terms of meaningful employment outlook...


Have you considered the damage that can be done to the teaching "profession"? Have you wondered who will join a "profession" that is not peer monitored (as other professions like law and medicine ) are, but where a person is treated as a blue collar worker? This may affect the students far more than you think. It's circling around the drain as it is. Teaching is a professional job. Because the students matter. When states started reducing union power and then NCLB put in the top down control (which exacerbated the problem of lack of control), things started really going downhill. It didn't help that pay was decreasing (relative to COL) at the same time. Other professions peer monitor for a reason. It works.

The interesting districts to look at would be the ones in the middle (not the top or bottom). What has been happening to them?


Have you considered the damage that could be done to entire generations of kids due to a lack of adequate standards?


The PP is not arguing against standards. In fact, the PP said nothing about standards. The PP is arguing in favor of teacher professionalization and teacher unions and against the high-stakes testing requirements in the No Child Left Behind Act.



Thank you. That's exactly right. There have always been standards and I didn't mention anything about standards in my post.
Anonymous
Post 02/20/2015 10:03     Subject: Re:"Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
We're only supposed to care about the fates of teachers and their càreers, but who cares about the fact that each year we graduate millions of kids who are at best semiliterate and who can't make change, forget about them in terms of meaningful employment outlook...


Have you considered the damage that can be done to the teaching "profession"? Have you wondered who will join a "profession" that is not peer monitored (as other professions like law and medicine ) are, but where a person is treated as a blue collar worker? This may affect the students far more than you think. It's circling around the drain as it is. Teaching is a professional job. Because the students matter. When states started reducing union power and then NCLB put in the top down control (which exacerbated the problem of lack of control), things started really going downhill. It didn't help that pay was decreasing (relative to COL) at the same time. Other professions peer monitor for a reason. It works.

The interesting districts to look at would be the ones in the middle (not the top or bottom). What has been happening to them?


Have you considered the damage that could be done to entire generations of kids due to a lack of adequate standards?


The PP is not arguing against standards. In fact, the PP said nothing about standards. The PP is arguing in favor of teacher professionalization and teacher unions and against the high-stakes testing requirements in the No Child Left Behind Act.
Anonymous
Post 02/20/2015 09:41     Subject: Re:"Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests
Anonymous wrote:
We're only supposed to care about the fates of teachers and their càreers, but who cares about the fact that each year we graduate millions of kids who are at best semiliterate and who can't make change, forget about them in terms of meaningful employment outlook...



Have you considered the damage that can be done to the teaching "profession"? Have you wondered who will join a "profession" that is not peer monitored (as other professions like law and medicine ) are, but where a person is treated as a blue collar worker? This may affect the students far more than you think. It's circling around the drain as it is. Teaching is a professional job. Because the students matter. When states started reducing union power and then NCLB put in the top down control (which exacerbated the problem of lack of control), things started really going downhill. It didn't help that pay was decreasing (relative to COL) at the same time. Other professions peer monitor for a reason. It works.

The interesting districts to look at would be the ones in the middle (not the top or bottom). What has been happening to them?


Have you considered the damage that could be done to entire generations of kids due to a lack of adequate standards?
Anonymous
Post 02/20/2015 09:25     Subject: Re:"Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests

We're only supposed to care about the fates of teachers and their càreers, but who cares about the fact that each year we graduate millions of kids who are at best semiliterate and who can't make change, forget about them in terms of meaningful employment outlook...


So, who would you choose to teach if your job depended on test scores? Kids in the projects or those in very affluent suburbs?


Anonymous
Post 02/20/2015 09:14     Subject: Re:"Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests


Here is an interesting article that shows what can happen when teachers are given some administrative control of a school (plus more money). But, I think the control factor is big in this. People want a voice in their workplace.

http://qz.com/290912/this-is-what-happens-to-test-scores-when-you-pay-teachers-125000-a-year/
Anonymous
Post 02/20/2015 09:05     Subject: Re:"Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests
We're only supposed to care about the fates of teachers and their càreers, but who cares about the fact that each year we graduate millions of kids who are at best semiliterate and who can't make change, forget about them in terms of meaningful employment outlook...



Have you considered the damage that can be done to the teaching "profession"? Have you wondered who will join a "profession" that is not peer monitored (as other professions like law and medicine ) are, but where a person is treated as a blue collar worker? This may affect the students far more than you think. It's circling around the drain as it is. Teaching is a professional job. Because the students matter. When states started reducing union power and then NCLB put in the top down control (which exacerbated the problem of lack of control), things started really going downhill. It didn't help that pay was decreasing (relative to COL) at the same time. Other professions peer monitor for a reason. It works.

The interesting districts to look at would be the ones in the middle (not the top or bottom). What has been happening to them?
Anonymous
Post 02/20/2015 08:40     Subject: Re:"Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests
Here's some humor with a message:

http://www.theonion.com/articles/new-education-initiative-replaces-k12-curriculum-w,38048/?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=SocialMarketing&utm_campaign=LinkPreview:1efault


Enjoy!!
Anonymous
Post 02/20/2015 08:36     Subject: Re:"Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests
We're only supposed to care about the fates of teachers and their càreers, but who cares about the fact that each year we graduate millions of kids who are at best semiliterate and who can't make change, forget about them in terms of meaningful employment outlook...



Okay, but maybe you can figure out how much the teacher has to do with these "problems". The Statistical Association study says it is somewhere between 1 and 14 percent. Changing the teacher is not going to make a huge difference if the statistical association has studied this correctly.

And, we do care about the students. We are working hard to teach them. Maybe you should look at other reasons why the kids are semiliterate and can't make change (some of it has to do with tests that allow the use of calculators and cash registers that calculate change for you). And our use of technology screens. I would wager that you might get better test scores if you took all of those things away (and it would be cheaper). Just saying.
Anonymous
Post 02/20/2015 08:32     Subject: Re:"Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
But, apparently we are to understand that now, if teachers' evaluations are based on whether or not kids show improvement in their classrooms, that's "high stakes"


It is certainly "high stakes" when teachers may be fired. It's pretty scary for people who have put a lot of years into a profession. And it's scary when teachers are hearing that only 30% of students are expected to pass these tests. That's going to mean a lot of poor evaluations.


We're only supposed to care about the fates of teachers and their càreers, but who cares about the fact that each year we graduate millions of kids who are at best semiliterate and who can't make change, forget about them in terms of meaningful employment outlook...


That assumes that firing teachers based on student test results would improve the education of these kids. But there is plenty of research to show that it wouldn't.
Anonymous
Post 02/20/2015 08:21     Subject: Re:"Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests
Anonymous wrote:
But, apparently we are to understand that now, if teachers' evaluations are based on whether or not kids show improvement in their classrooms, that's "high stakes"


It is certainly "high stakes" when teachers may be fired. It's pretty scary for people who have put a lot of years into a profession. And it's scary when teachers are hearing that only 30% of students are expected to pass these tests. That's going to mean a lot of poor evaluations.


We're only supposed to care about the fates of teachers and their càreers, but who cares about the fact that each year we graduate millions of kids who are at best semiliterate and who can't make change, forget about them in terms of meaningful employment outlook...
Anonymous
Post 02/20/2015 06:23     Subject: "Teacher of the Year" quits over Common Core tests
Anonymous wrote:
Sorry---that didn't copy right. The quotes are from the article cited above (the one supposedly showing that VAMs do work):

https://www.amstat.org/policy/pdfs/ASA_VAM_Statement.pdf

hardly a ringing endorsement of VAMs


Sorry -- I posted the link to the American Statistical Association position about value-added models. The link wasn't supposed to demonstrate that there are studies that show that value-added models do work. It was just supposed to demonstrate the American Statistical Association position about value-added models.