Anonymous wrote:Joe's decision to file for divorce while in the US, where none of them currently have a home, is forcing the entire family to live out of suitcases in hotels until they can sort something out. It was a selfish choice to file for divorce so suddenly, while he had custody of the kids, and while Sophie was merely in the US for a short period before a work commitment later this month.

If Joe is really fine with the kids being raised in both the UK and the US, then there's no reason that Sophie shouldn't be allowed to take them to their current home, in the UK. Especially as that was original plan, and the girls have been with their dad for the last month. Joe could have waited to discuss it wit Sophie before filing, and they could have made these arrangements in advance.

This is all very much Joe's doing. Sophie didn't even have divorce counsel a week ago. She is seeking to protect her rights and not get forced into staying in the US, indefinitely, if she wants to be with her children, when she has a home and a support system in the UK.

Anonymous wrote:Joe's decision to file for divorce while in the US, where none of them currently have a home, is forcing the entire family to live out of suitcases in hotels until they can sort something out. It was a selfish choice to file for divorce so suddenly, while he had custody of the kids, and while Sophie was merely in the US for a short period before a work commitment later this month.

If Joe is really fine with the kids being raised in both the UK and the US, then there's no reason that Sophie shouldn't be allowed to take them to their current home, in the UK. Especially as that was original plan, and the girls have been with their dad for the last month. Joe could have waited to discuss it wit Sophie before filing, and they could have made these arrangements in advance.

This is all very much Joe's doing. Sophie didn't even have divorce counsel a week ago. She is seeking to protect her rights and not get forced into staying in the US, indefinitely, if she wants to be with her children, when she has a home and a support system in the UK.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is nothing in any of the filings that Joes intent was to keep the kids in the USA as a primary parent and not let them spend time with her in England. Right now they are in the midst of getting a proper custody order in place which is why for a temporary period they can’t leave. She is the one filing saying she would keep the kids in the UK.

There is a lot of legal wrangling happening right now. It is a little strange to go for dinner all together the night before you file a suit saying he abducted the kids. I really don’t think this is what The Hague Convention related to child abduction was meant for.

It's pretty much exactly what it's for. It was intended to help restore/resolve child custody disputes where parents are citizens of different countries and one parent takes the kids from one country to another against an agreed upon custody arrangement.

Think about it from her perspective. When Joe and the girls left the UK, she was under the impression they would be spending a few weeks traveling around the US on tour with his band, and then reuniting withe her in NY before returning to their rental home in the UK and continuing to prepare to move into the home they purchased in Dec. Then, in the middle of that trip, Sophie and Joe have a fight, he files for divorce, and suddenly a court in Florida, where neither of them even lives, is telling her that she can't take her kids back to what she considers their familial home. Think about how you would feel if your spouse filed for divorce when you were separated for work reasons and the kids were with him, and then you found out if you wanted to be with your kids, you needed to stay in a hotel in NY because you can't go home.

People who think she's being overly aggressive should ask themselves what they do in the exact same situation. Because personally, I'd do what Sophie is doing -- find a lawyer who is an expert in international divorce involving child custody, and follow his advice. Yes "child abduction" sounds really serious, but the way Joe chose to go about it falls within the definition under The Hague Conventions. If he didn't want it to escalate like this, perhaps he should have considered waiting until he and Sophie were in the same place with equal access to their kids before discussing it with her and figuring out how best to dissolve their marriage while taking care of their kids. He set all this in motion by acting very rashly and filing in such a way as to put Sophie in an impossible situation.

In her own filing she says the intended plan was only to return to the UK for a week and then she was also going to join Joe on tour with the kids for the rest of the USA shows.

I don’t really get the back and forth. There is no custody order in place yet. If both parents can have access to the passports at any time and bring them to their home countries then she could take them back the UK and Joe could just go get them again and bring them back in tour as was originally planned. It seems it makes sense to stay in one place until a temporary custody order is in place. I don’t consider that abduction. He has a court order keeping them in the USA for that temporary period.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is nothing in any of the filings that Joes intent was to keep the kids in the USA as a primary parent and not let them spend time with her in England. Right now they are in the midst of getting a proper custody order in place which is why for a temporary period they can’t leave. She is the one filing saying she would keep the kids in the UK.

There is a lot of legal wrangling happening right now. It is a little strange to go for dinner all together the night before you file a suit saying he abducted the kids. I really don’t think this is what The Hague Convention related to child abduction was meant for.

It's pretty much exactly what it's for. It was intended to help restore/resolve child custody disputes where parents are citizens of different countries and one parent takes the kids from one country to another against an agreed upon custody arrangement.

Think about it from her perspective. When Joe and the girls left the UK, she was under the impression they would be spending a few weeks traveling around the US on tour with his band, and then reuniting withe her in NY before returning to their rental home in the UK and continuing to prepare to move into the home they purchased in Dec. Then, in the middle of that trip, Sophie and Joe have a fight, he files for divorce, and suddenly a court in Florida, where neither of them even lives, is telling her that she can't take her kids back to what she considers their familial home. Think about how you would feel if your spouse filed for divorce when you were separated for work reasons and the kids were with him, and then you found out if you wanted to be with your kids, you needed to stay in a hotel in NY because you can't go home.

People who think she's being overly aggressive should ask themselves what they do in the exact same situation. Because personally, I'd do what Sophie is doing -- find a lawyer who is an expert in international divorce involving child custody, and follow his advice. Yes "child abduction" sounds really serious, but the way Joe chose to go about it falls within the definition under The Hague Conventions. If he didn't want it to escalate like this, perhaps he should have considered waiting until he and Sophie were in the same place with equal access to their kids before discussing it with her and figuring out how best to dissolve their marriage while taking care of their kids. He set all this in motion by acting very rashly and filing in such a way as to put Sophie in an impossible situation.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think she was embarrassed at all the talk of her partying and this stunt is damage control. Joe Jonas is not flakey and even his statement was calm and reasonable. The kids are American citizens and have never lived abroad so this idea of homeland feels like a stunt. He also said the kids can go back and forth but her attempt to have this adjudicated abroad is lame. He is going to be super careful after what Kelly Rutherford has experienced when her kids got shipped abroad. Hopefully they can work this out. Sad to see this kind of drama.

The kids are also UK citizens and dad decided to divorce mom who lives in the UK. It’s reasonable for her to want a UK court to decide custody considering they own a home there and intended to settle there long term. He’s a monster trying to steal kids don’t their mother

No… mom is a born and raised and UK citizen. Kids are dual citizens by birth but have been raised in the us. Mom tried to bring kids over to the UK to raise them there at the same time she was getting divorced. That does not make their residence UK. Would have had to establish true precedent before divorce which is why Sophie is desperately claiming that she and Joe had “talked” about England being their forever home.

He could be a prick for all I know. The kids could be better off with her. But legally she has no grounds to do what she’s doing, and it seems like an attempt to bring them over to the UK and raise them there despite having an American dad. This is a grown up issue the two of them should be sorting out.

Her filing says they started looking at houses to buy in the UK as early as Dec. 2022. They were living near her family for several months and then went under contract for a house in July. If they did talk about making UK their permanent home, there are likely realtors, family members, etc. who could testify to those conversations. Also if the children attended nursery school and other activities, there may be contracts with those entities that show intent for a long-term stay.

Also the fact that they sold their home in Miami concurrent with going to the UK and entering into a contract to buy a home there.

If Sophie is making it all up in order to steal the kids away from the US, what is she stealing them from? Living in hotels in various cities for the next 10 months while Joe tours? Spending most of their time with a nanny between visits with their mom? They don't even have a home here. All there stuff is in England.

Anonymous wrote:There is nothing in any of the filings that Joes intent was to keep the kids in the USA as a primary parent and not let them spend time with her in England. Right now they are in the midst of getting a proper custody order in place which is why for a temporary period they can’t leave. She is the one filing saying she would keep the kids in the UK.

There is a lot of legal wrangling happening right now. It is a little strange to go for dinner all together the night before you file a suit saying he abducted the kids. I really don’t think this is what The Hague Convention related to child abduction was meant for.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think she was embarrassed at all the talk of her partying and this stunt is damage control. Joe Jonas is not flakey and even his statement was calm and reasonable. The kids are American citizens and have never lived abroad so this idea of homeland feels like a stunt. He also said the kids can go back and forth but her attempt to have this adjudicated abroad is lame. He is going to be super careful after what Kelly Rutherford has experienced when her kids got shipped abroad. Hopefully they can work this out. Sad to see this kind of drama.

The kids are also UK citizens and dad decided to divorce mom who lives in the UK. It’s reasonable for her to want a UK court to decide custody considering they own a home there and intended to settle there long term. He’s a monster trying to steal kids don’t their mother

No… mom is a born and raised and UK citizen. Kids are dual citizens by birth but have been raised in the us. Mom tried to bring kids over to the UK to raise them there at the same time she was getting divorced. That does not make their residence UK. Would have had to establish true precedent before divorce which is why Sophie is desperately claiming that she and Joe had “talked” about England being their forever home.

He could be a prick for all I know. The kids could be better off with her. But legally she has no grounds to do what she’s doing, and it seems like an attempt to bring them over to the UK and raise them there despite having an American dad. This is a grown up issue the two of them should be sorting out.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think she was embarrassed at all the talk of her partying and this stunt is damage control. Joe Jonas is not flakey and even his statement was calm and reasonable. The kids are American citizens and have never lived abroad so this idea of homeland feels like a stunt. He also said the kids can go back and forth but her attempt to have this adjudicated abroad is lame. He is going to be super careful after what Kelly Rutherford has experienced when her kids got shipped abroad. Hopefully they can work this out. Sad to see this kind of drama.

The kids are also UK citizens and dad decided to divorce mom who lives in the UK. It’s reasonable for her to want a UK court to decide custody considering they own a home there and intended to settle there long term. He’s a monster trying to steal kids don’t their mother

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think she was embarrassed at all the talk of her partying and this stunt is damage control. Joe Jonas is not flakey and even his statement was calm and reasonable. The kids are American citizens and have never lived abroad so this idea of homeland feels like a stunt. He also said the kids can go back and forth but her attempt to have this adjudicated abroad is lame. He is going to be super careful after what Kelly Rutherford has experienced when her kids got shipped abroad. Hopefully they can work this out. Sad to see this kind of drama.

The kids are also UK citizens and dad decided to divorce mom who lives in the UK. It’s reasonable for her to want a UK court to decide custody considering they own a home there and intended to settle there long term. He’s a monster trying to steal kids don’t their mother

My dad is Canadian and my mom is American. I’ve never lived in Canada (though we’ve visited family there and vacationed there many times) and I’m a dual citizen. my primary residence is about as much Canada as much as Sophie turners kids primary residence is england.

I know it's hard for you to understand this, but you and Sophie Turner's kids don't really have very much in common.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think she was embarrassed at all the talk of her partying and this stunt is damage control. Joe Jonas is not flakey and even his statement was calm and reasonable. The kids are American citizens and have never lived abroad so this idea of homeland feels like a stunt. He also said the kids can go back and forth but her attempt to have this adjudicated abroad is lame. He is going to be super careful after what Kelly Rutherford has experienced when her kids got shipped abroad. Hopefully they can work this out. Sad to see this kind of drama.

The kids are also UK citizens and dad decided to divorce mom who lives in the UK. It’s reasonable for her to want a UK court to decide custody considering they own a home there and intended to settle there long term. He’s a monster trying to steal kids don’t their mother

My dad is Canadian and my mom is American. I’ve never lived in Canada (though we’ve visited family there and vacationed there many times) and I’m a dual citizen. my primary residence is about as much Canada as much as Sophie turners kids primary residence is england.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think she was embarrassed at all the talk of her partying and this stunt is damage control. Joe Jonas is not flakey and even his statement was calm and reasonable. The kids are American citizens and have never lived abroad so this idea of homeland feels like a stunt. He also said the kids can go back and forth but her attempt to have this adjudicated abroad is lame. He is going to be super careful after what Kelly Rutherford has experienced when her kids got shipped abroad. Hopefully they can work this out. Sad to see this kind of drama.

The kids are also UK citizens and dad decided to divorce mom who lives in the UK. It’s reasonable for her to want a UK court to decide custody considering they own a home there and intended to settle there long term. He’s a monster trying to steal kids don’t their mother

The kids have never lived in UK . The kids were born in USA and their passports are USA. If they were British she could have gotten another passport but she cannot. This is all a stunt. Interesting that she was seen having lunch with him and the kids which backs up his surprise that she suddenly went scorched earth.

You sound delusional. The kids have dual citizenships and spent more time in the UK over the last six months than anywhere else.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think she was embarrassed at all the talk of her partying and this stunt is damage control. Joe Jonas is not flakey and even his statement was calm and reasonable. The kids are American citizens and have never lived abroad so this idea of homeland feels like a stunt. He also said the kids can go back and forth but her attempt to have this adjudicated abroad is lame. He is going to be super careful after what Kelly Rutherford has experienced when her kids got shipped abroad. Hopefully they can work this out. Sad to see this kind of drama.

The kids are also UK citizens and dad decided to divorce mom who lives in the UK. It’s reasonable for her to want a UK court to decide custody considering they own a home there and intended to settle there long term. He’s a monster trying to steal kids don’t their mother

The kids have never lived in UK . The kids were born in USA and their passports are USA. If they were British she could have gotten another passport but she cannot. This is all a stunt. Interesting that she was seen having lunch with him and the kids which backs up his surprise that she suddenly went scorched earth.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think she was embarrassed at all the talk of her partying and this stunt is damage control. Joe Jonas is not flakey and even his statement was calm and reasonable. The kids are American citizens and have never lived abroad so this idea of homeland feels like a stunt. He also said the kids can go back and forth but her attempt to have this adjudicated abroad is lame. He is going to be super careful after what Kelly Rutherford has experienced when her kids got shipped abroad. Hopefully they can work this out. Sad to see this kind of drama.

The kids are also UK citizens and dad decided to divorce mom who lives in the UK. It’s reasonable for her to want a UK court to decide custody considering they own a home there and intended to settle there long term. He’s a monster trying to steal kids don’t their mother