Anonymous wrote:And the elephant in the room is......

WTF is happening that so many kids are having problems, whether they be learning disabilities, emotional issues, behavioral issues, etc.?

There is a tipping point where so many kids need therapies, special interventions, special accommodations, etc, that it becomes unsustainable. Not to mention the cost to the future of society when we have a generation of kids that aren't learning, CAN NOT learn, need "extra" help to learn, are disrupting learning, cannot focus, cannot sit still and follow rules, are disruptive and even violent. When you read this whole thread, this is a common theme and it stands out so starkly to me, yet the whole thread is focusing on teachers.

I personally don't believe it is possible to give every child exactly what they need in a public school setting. Especially true if so many kids need so much extra. It just seems like the paperwork alone is too cumbersome for teachers to keep up with. Pretty soon they will have 25 kids with IEPs that need documenting, accommodations, and she will spin herself in circles trying to keep everyone happy. Not to mention the problems that come along with kids that aren't being parented at all.

This is a society/culture/mental health/physical health issue. Not a school and teacher issue. The schools are just where the problems are coming to a head and get the most notice.

This is one of the main reasons I turned in my retirement paperwork last month, a few years early. I'm stretched too thin and I am burning out trying to plan and implement the expected small group and individual accommodations.

And the elephant in the room is......

WTF is happening that so many kids are having problems, whether they be learning disabilities, emotional issues, behavioral issues, etc.?

There is a tipping point where so many kids need therapies, special interventions, special accommodations, etc, that it becomes unsustainable. Not to mention the cost to the future of society when we have a generation of kids that aren't learning, CAN NOT learn, need "extra" help to learn, are disrupting learning, cannot focus, cannot sit still and follow rules, are disruptive and even violent. When you read this whole thread, this is a common theme and it stands out so starkly to me, yet the whole thread is focusing on teachers.

I personally don't believe it is possible to give every child exactly what they need in a public school setting. Especially true if so many kids need so much extra. It just seems like the paperwork alone is too cumbersome for teachers to keep up with. Pretty soon they will have 25 kids with IEPs that need documenting, accommodations, and she will spin herself in circles trying to keep everyone happy. Not to mention the problems that come along with kids that aren't being parented at all.

This is a society/culture/mental health/physical health issue. Not a school and teacher issue. The schools are just where the problems are coming to a head and get the most notice.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“ We talk so much on DCUM about wanting to change different laws, so why is nobody talking about changing whatever laws allow behaviorally disruptive kids to stay in classrooms and drive out all the good teachers? Have the teachers (either through unions or not) actually tried to change this? Or everyone just assumes it’s too hard?”

I’d join a campaign for this. Teachers generally don’t lobby on stuff like that.

So racist and ableist

What could possibly be racist about that?

Are you saying kids of certain races are more disruptive?

Further, are kids with special needs necessarily disruptive?

No, they are not. There are many special needs children that can fit into the regular classroom and programs with, at most, minor disruptions or problems.

But the issue is that we went from one extreme to another. We had a system where special needs children were completely segregated, some in special schools and sometimes, neglected by the system. Many of the special schools were not well staffed and the children and staff were not given appropriate treatment or support. So we placed a change to incorporate the special needs into the regular school programs. But now, we've gone to the opposite extreme where we accommodate all children and even when the children are disruptive, we allow the disruptive students to completely damage the education of the majority of students. Most schools now make it virtually impossble for a teacher to remove a physically disruptive child from their class at the expense of the rest of the children. These days, that's often more than 20 children.

We need to have a system where we incorporate all children into the regular classroom and adapt to include the special needs. But when a student becomes physically disruptive (whether special needs or not), we need to have a way to remove the children from the regular classroom and have different programs or classrooms for them to go to where they can be attended, taught and treated by special education teachers who can work with the students. I understand the need to incorporate special needs into a regular setting and sometimes have 1:1 special educatators who can help a special needs child learn to fit into the regular classroom. When possible and when it works, that's great. But repeated physical disruptions to a classroom need to be taken out of the classroom. My child was in a classroom with one special needs child for 3 years. This child routinely threw books, toys, furniture; repeatedly kicked, punched slapped and choked other students. Actually injured teachers and students multiple times over those three years. There were several times when this child threw a tantrum and the teacher's only recourse was to evacuate all of other children into the hallway and have a special education teacher go in and 1:1 calm the child down. My child and their classmates lost many hours of learning to catering to this child's special needs. This child needed to be removed, but the school administration said their hands were tied and they had no power to remove the child from the classroom. That's the unreasonable extreme that we have swung to.

We need to find a better middle ground. One where special needs are accommodated in the classroom, special educators are assigned to help children assimilate and to cater to their special needs and accommodations, but when they behavior exceeds the ability of the accommodations to address, the children need to be removed from the regular classroom and alternative learning and accommodations need to be provided for these children without endangering and taking away classtime for the majority of the students.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“ We talk so much on DCUM about wanting to change different laws, so why is nobody talking about changing whatever laws allow behaviorally disruptive kids to stay in classrooms and drive out all the good teachers? Have the teachers (either through unions or not) actually tried to change this? Or everyone just assumes it’s too hard?”

I’d join a campaign for this. Teachers generally don’t lobby on stuff like that.

So racist and ableist

What could possibly be racist about that?

Are you saying kids of certain races are more disruptive?

Further, are kids with special needs necessarily disruptive?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“ We talk so much on DCUM about wanting to change different laws, so why is nobody talking about changing whatever laws allow behaviorally disruptive kids to stay in classrooms and drive out all the good teachers? Have the teachers (either through unions or not) actually tried to change this? Or everyone just assumes it’s too hard?”

I’d join a campaign for this. Teachers generally don’t lobby on stuff like that.

So racist and ableist

What could possibly be racist about that?

Are you saying kids of certain races are more disruptive?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“ We talk so much on DCUM about wanting to change different laws, so why is nobody talking about changing whatever laws allow behaviorally disruptive kids to stay in classrooms and drive out all the good teachers? Have the teachers (either through unions or not) actually tried to change this? Or everyone just assumes it’s too hard?”

I’d join a campaign for this. Teachers generally don’t lobby on stuff like that.

So racist and ableist

What could possibly be racist about that?

Anonymous wrote:“ We talk so much on DCUM about wanting to change different laws, so why is nobody talking about changing whatever laws allow behaviorally disruptive kids to stay in classrooms and drive out all the good teachers? Have the teachers (either through unions or not) actually tried to change this? Or everyone just assumes it’s too hard?”

I’d join a campaign for this. Teachers generally don’t lobby on stuff like that.

So racist and ableist

Anonymous wrote:I don’t think some of you understand the negative impact that the influx of poor illegals has had on schools in other states.

It's bigger than this...yes this is a piece but there is so much more going on.

I don’t think some of you understand the negative impact that the influx of poor illegals has had on schools in other states.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“ We talk so much on DCUM about wanting to change different laws, so why is nobody talking about changing whatever laws allow behaviorally disruptive kids to stay in classrooms and drive out all the good teachers? Have the teachers (either through unions or not) actually tried to change this? Or everyone just assumes it’s too hard?”

I’d join a campaign for this. Teachers generally don’t lobby on stuff like that.

Teachers barely have time for lunch.

It’s sharpening the saw. Takes time now but saves more time later.

Ugh, Leader in Me cult alert.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It sounds like a lot of the “overworked” is more just frustration at handling behavioral issues (either directly or indirectly through not getting enough subs to agree to teach at the school due to behaviors), so why don’t teachers try to do something about the behavior? Most parents want much higher behavioral expectations in the schools too. We talk so much on DCUM about wanting to change different laws, so why is nobody talking about changing whatever laws allow behaviorally disruptive kids to stay in classrooms and drive out all the good teachers? Have the teachers (either through unions or not) actually tried to change this? Or everyone just assumes it’s too hard?

Maybe in wealthy areas but at my Title One school, most parents just don't want to be bothered. Many won't answer the phone if you call them during the day. No kidding. They ignore other communications too.

Okay, so maybe “most voters” is a better thing to say. Most voters want higher expectations for behavior in our schools. The schools are government institutions funded by taxpayers, so what we want for our country is how it should be.

I'm not so sure about this. I'm fairly liberal on a lot of issues but as a former teacher I'm conflicted sometimes because on one hand a lot of Republicans don't care about having strong public schools with decent funding, teacher pay, etc, but on the other hand a lot of the Democrats in my district get obsessed with things like the "School to Prison Pipeline" which really just translates into policies that make it impossible to get disruptive and even dangerous students out of the mainstream classrooms.

One day everyone will realize that more pay isn’t the answer to the problems in our schools. American public schools (particularly in areas like DC) are already literally the most expensive in the world. No other countries spend anything even close to what we do.

What they have though is standards - behavioral standards and academic standards.

I guess we’ll need to hit rock bottom first before everyone understands that even more money isn’t the solution here. Unfortunately it will be an entire generation who suffers in the meantime though.

It’s already happening. Families are moving their kids to private school or homeschooling if they can afford it. The numbers don’t lie.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For the teacher that has three hours of planning time per week, you are lucky. In our school, we are pulled from our planning time to go cover other classrooms where teachers is out, no sub is available

That happens in our school district, but teachers do get paid for the time the spend subbing/covering. $18/hour

My teenage gets paid more than that and he’s in high school!

Go get an education.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“ We talk so much on DCUM about wanting to change different laws, so why is nobody talking about changing whatever laws allow behaviorally disruptive kids to stay in classrooms and drive out all the good teachers? Have the teachers (either through unions or not) actually tried to change this? Or everyone just assumes it’s too hard?”

I’d join a campaign for this. Teachers generally don’t lobby on stuff like that.

Teachers barely have time for lunch.

It’s sharpening the saw. Takes time now but saves more time later.

Anonymous wrote:“ We talk so much on DCUM about wanting to change different laws, so why is nobody talking about changing whatever laws allow behaviorally disruptive kids to stay in classrooms and drive out all the good teachers? Have the teachers (either through unions or not) actually tried to change this? Or everyone just assumes it’s too hard?”

I’d join a campaign for this. Teachers generally don’t lobby on stuff like that.

Teachers barely have time for lunch.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Imagine having to manage your co-workers AND their parents. Nurses know our struggle.

I'll put the mic down now.

#TeachersAreUndervalued

People in the medical field have to manage patients and their families. I’m a civil rights lawyer, and I need to manage the people on whose behalf I’m advocating (who are not my clients, because I work for the government) plus my client and employer plus the families plus affected communities plus advocacy groups. The list goes on and on.

I am incredibly grateful to my child’s teacher. I suspect she doesn’t complain like the teachers on DCUM do. I don’t understand why the teachers here think the things they complain about are unique to teaching. You’d get less flack if you complained less.

You'd be complaining too if students with behavior issues were ruining your child's classroom. Should teachers just suck it up and pretend this isn't a huge issue? My son is in 1st grade and it's not the second year that his class is being ruined by ONE student. This student regularly causes the rest of the class to have to evacuate, sometimes several times per day. I'm basically teaching my son how to read since this student is interrupting the teacher so much that she can barely get any teaching in.

I guess that the PP either works so much that they have no idea what’s happening in their kid’s classroom or they already know that their child is one of the classroom problems that luckily the teacher isn’t complaining about.