Anonymous
03/03/2021 12:31
Subject: Black Ops for WSYL
Given that this is a thread for Black Ops for WSYL (an age-based tournament for 14U and 13U teams), can we take the discussion of holdbacks and which programs are better at the high school level to another thread?
Anonymous
03/03/2021 11:19
Subject: Black Ops for WSYL
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:For the record at 2023 NL may be ranked #5 the last two times they faced VLC they lost by four. I think that age group goes Dc Dogs #1. (They beat VLC 8-4) then VLC then NL then DCE but all the teams are pretty close. DC dogs are a bit ahead of the other three
+1
Shouldn’t this comparison really examine the number of kids in each team that go to private school and subsequently reclass. The rankings of the top teams correlate to average age of the team. The older kids on the team the better their ranking. Public school kids typically don’t reclass.
It doesn't matter which sport you want to look at and it's been widely publicized by Gladwell and others. Older kids perform better for the most part in athletics for a number of reasons. It doesn't matter when they turn older with regard to kindergarten and summer babies or reaching into college and red-shirts. Older typically means bigger, faster, stronger. It's not against the rules and the only remedy is to force kids onto an older team the day of their birthday, not January 1 or September 1 or any other date on the calendar.
Anonymous
03/03/2021 09:50
Subject: Black Ops for WSYL
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:For the record at 2023 NL may be ranked #5 the last two times they faced VLC they lost by four. I think that age group goes Dc Dogs #1. (They beat VLC 8-4) then VLC then NL then DCE but all the teams are pretty close. DC dogs are a bit ahead of the other three
+1
Shouldn’t this comparison really examine the number of kids in each team that go to private school and subsequently reclass. The rankings of the top teams correlate to average age of the team. The older kids on the team the better their ranking. Public school kids typically don’t reclass.
Anonymous
03/03/2021 09:48
Subject: Black Ops for WSYL
I think they point of referencing the HS age in this topic is that between the four clubs these are the top players in the DC area. The under class Under Armor and Nike teams were well represented by each of these clubs in HS and did very well. The WSYL could do the same but not as one club. At the 2023 age which is the one that is important this summer, the talent at these clubs is very close.
Anonymous
03/03/2021 05:32
Subject: Black Ops for WSYL
Anonymous wrote:For the record at 2023 NL may be ranked #5 the last two times they faced VLC they lost by four. I think that age group goes Dc Dogs #1. (They beat VLC 8-4) then VLC then NL then DCE but all the teams are pretty close. DC dogs are a bit ahead of the other three
+1
Anonymous
03/02/2021 23:00
Subject: Black Ops for WSYL
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Black Ops’ Defense and Attack are strong. Middles are weak. NL and DCE didn’t need VLC. Us Maryland folks are still confused why they joined forces with them. Aside from their one Pole they don’t have elite players.
I think there is a bit more talent than you understand. At this age group there are kids that definitely stand out but there is a second tier of kids with potential and the right work ethic/attitude that will put them ahead of some of the early bloomers. Until these kids reach high school you just can't tell and even then some don't get it all together until their sophomore and junior years. So give kids a bit of a break and realize that opportunity for talented kids to work with each other is a good thing. At some ages DCE, NL and VLC might be uneven but high tides raise all boats. 2023 VLC is ranked #20 at usclublax (https://www.usclublax.com/2020-Fall-rankings.html); 2023 DCE is #17, 2023 NL is not listed. 2024 has VLC (22); DCE (15); NL (10). So again, once these kids get to high school they are all doing pretty well. Each club has plus and minus years but to posit that NL and DCE are in a different class than VLC is a bit short sighted. The whole purpose of this is to take the best kids from each and make a competition team.
May want to check that. 2023 Next Level is ranked 5, DCE is 17 and VLC is 20.
2024 has Next Level 10 and DCE is 15 and VLC 22.
And by the way, the 23's are sophomores in high school and the 24's are freshman.
My point (even if i missed the numbers) was that ONCE they are in high school it all normalizes. Judging elite talent in 5-8th grade is silly. Let them get to their sophomore year of HS and then start looking. That is why I used 23s.
Also this year's sophomores didn't really play in HS last year.
Anonymous
03/02/2021 19:52
Subject: Black Ops for WSYL
For the record at 2023 NL may be ranked #5 the last two times they faced VLC they lost by four. I think that age group goes Dc Dogs #1. (They beat VLC 8-4) then VLC then NL then DCE but all the teams are pretty close. DC dogs are a bit ahead of the other three
Anonymous
03/02/2021 18:10
Subject: Black Ops for WSYL
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Black Ops’ Defense and Attack are strong. Middles are weak. NL and DCE didn’t need VLC. Us Maryland folks are still confused why they joined forces with them. Aside from their one Pole they don’t have elite players.
I think there is a bit more talent than you understand. At this age group there are kids that definitely stand out but there is a second tier of kids with potential and the right work ethic/attitude that will put them ahead of some of the early bloomers. Until these kids reach high school you just can't tell and even then some don't get it all together until their sophomore and junior years. So give kids a bit of a break and realize that opportunity for talented kids to work with each other is a good thing. At some ages DCE, NL and VLC might be uneven but high tides raise all boats. 2023 VLC is ranked #20 at usclublax (https://www.usclublax.com/2020-Fall-rankings.html); 2023 DCE is #17, 2023 NL is not listed. 2024 has VLC (22); DCE (15); NL (10). So again, once these kids get to high school they are all doing pretty well. Each club has plus and minus years but to posit that NL and DCE are in a different class than VLC is a bit short sighted. The whole purpose of this is to take the best kids from each and make a competition team.
May want to check that. 2023 Next Level is ranked 5, DCE is 17 and VLC is 20.
2024 has Next Level 10 and DCE is 15 and VLC 22.
And by the way, the 23's are sophomores in high school and the 24's are freshman.
My point (even if i missed the numbers) was that ONCE they are in high school it all normalizes. Judging elite talent in 5-8th grade is silly. Let them get to their sophomore year of HS and then start looking. That is why I used 23s.
Anonymous
03/02/2021 17:00
Subject: Re:Black Ops for WSYL
Anonymous wrote:Madlax didn't go it alone. They announced a Monuments team and invitational tryouts. After no one accepted the invitation, they moved to open tryouts with very limited turnout. They were going to cherry pick players from other clubs and force them to join ML for the experience of playing WSYL. Cabell didn't count on group teams forming under the loose guidelines of the WSYL and now he is stuck with a middling 14u team and a very questionable 13u team. But he still doesn't care because he charged his own club members $75 for a few extra practices and will now charge them $700+ for the qualifier.
why do you care soo much about this... its youth lacrosse at the end of the day.
And honestly, who cares what another company charges its customers... there are other options to choose from
The Mad Lax obsession on this website is very strange
Because Madlax families always try to make excuses and apologize for the owner to justify playing for the club. There is never a defense, just cries about obsession to deflect from poor choices.
Anonymous
03/02/2021 15:47
Subject: Black Ops for WSYL
Anonymous wrote:Practice was strong. Defense looks really solid. Coaches were great and enthusiastic.
Rain didn't impact it at all. Couple more practices then first tourney. We'll know soon enough.
BLC and Looneys kid were outstanding a will be a force as this team moves forward; very impressed with their play and lacrosse IQ at 13.
Anonymous
03/02/2021 13:45
Subject: Re:Black Ops for WSYL
Madlax didn't go it alone. They announced a Monuments team and invitational tryouts. After no one accepted the invitation, they moved to open tryouts with very limited turnout. They were going to cherry pick players from other clubs and force them to join ML for the experience of playing WSYL. Cabell didn't count on group teams forming under the loose guidelines of the WSYL and now he is stuck with a middling 14u team and a very questionable 13u team. But he still doesn't care because he charged his own club members $75 for a few extra practices and will now charge them $700+ for the qualifier.
why do you care soo much about this... its youth lacrosse at the end of the day.
And honestly, who cares what another company charges its customers... there are other options to choose from
The Mad Lax obsession on this website is very strange
Anonymous
03/02/2021 13:40
Subject: Re:Black Ops for WSYL
Anonymous wrote:Combining three programs into one world series team definitely has its pros and cons. I guess questions like "what did program XYZ bring to the table" are inevitable.
You should think of it as a package deal between 13U and 14U teams. On the 13U team, I believe that VLC placed more players on the team than either BLC or NL.
VLC also provided more than its share of support and organization. For instance I believe VLC got the field permits for tryouts, which neither of the other two could pull off.
But if the BLC or NextLevel programs would prefer to go alone, like MadLax is doing, in future years they can do so. Maybe Madlax has the better approach, because they avoid the inevitable politics of three programs combining for short term purposes.
Hope this helps!
Madlax didn't go it alone. They announced a Monuments team and invitational tryouts. After no one accepted the invitation, they moved to open tryouts with very limited turnout. They were going to cherry pick players from other clubs and force them to join ML for the experience of playing WSYL. Cabell didn't count on group teams forming under the loose guidelines of the WSYL and now he is stuck with a middling 14u team and a very questionable 13u team. But he still doesn't care because he charged his own club members $75 for a few extra practices and will now charge them $700+ for the qualifier.
Anonymous
03/02/2021 11:44
Subject: Re:Black Ops for WSYL
Combining three programs into one world series team definitely has its pros and cons. I guess questions like "what did program XYZ bring to the table" are inevitable.
You should think of it as a package deal between 13U and 14U teams. On the 13U team, I believe that VLC placed more players on the team than either BLC or NL.
VLC also provided more than its share of support and organization. For instance I believe VLC got the field permits for tryouts, which neither of the other two could pull off.
But if the BLC or NextLevel programs would prefer to go alone, like MadLax is doing, in future years they can do so. Maybe Madlax has the better approach, because they avoid the inevitable politics of three programs combining for short term purposes.
Hope this helps!
You should think of it as a package deal between 13U and 14U teams. On the 13U team, I believe that VLC placed more players on the team than either BLC or NL.
VLC also provided more than its share of support and organization. For instance I believe VLC got the field permits for tryouts, which neither of the other two could pull off.
But if the BLC or NextLevel programs would prefer to go alone, like MadLax is doing, in future years they can do so. Maybe Madlax has the better approach, because they avoid the inevitable politics of three programs combining for short term purposes.
Hope this helps!
Anonymous
03/02/2021 10:58
Subject: Black Ops for WSYL
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Black Ops’ Defense and Attack are strong. Middles are weak. NL and DCE didn’t need VLC. Us Maryland folks are still confused why they joined forces with them. Aside from their one Pole they don’t have elite players.
I think there is a bit more talent than you understand. At this age group there are kids that definitely stand out but there is a second tier of kids with potential and the right work ethic/attitude that will put them ahead of some of the early bloomers. Until these kids reach high school you just can't tell and even then some don't get it all together until their sophomore and junior years. So give kids a bit of a break and realize that opportunity for talented kids to work with each other is a good thing. At some ages DCE, NL and VLC might be uneven but high tides raise all boats. 2023 VLC is ranked #20 at usclublax (https://www.usclublax.com/2020-Fall-rankings.html); 2023 DCE is #17, 2023 NL is not listed. 2024 has VLC (22); DCE (15); NL (10). So again, once these kids get to high school they are all doing pretty well. Each club has plus and minus years but to posit that NL and DCE are in a different class than VLC is a bit short sighted. The whole purpose of this is to take the best kids from each and make a competition team.
May want to check that. 2023 Next Level is ranked 5, DCE is 17 and VLC is 20.
2024 has Next Level 10 and DCE is 15 and VLC 22.
And by the way, the 23's are sophomores in high school and the 24's are freshman.
Anonymous
03/02/2021 10:37
Subject: Black Ops for WSYL
Anonymous wrote:Black Ops’ Defense and Attack are strong. Middles are weak. NL and DCE didn’t need VLC. Us Maryland folks are still confused why they joined forces with them. Aside from their one Pole they don’t have elite players.
I think there is a bit more talent than you understand. At this age group there are kids that definitely stand out but there is a second tier of kids with potential and the right work ethic/attitude that will put them ahead of some of the early bloomers. Until these kids reach high school you just can't tell and even then some don't get it all together until their sophomore and junior years. So give kids a bit of a break and realize that opportunity for talented kids to work with each other is a good thing. At some ages DCE, NL and VLC might be uneven but high tides raise all boats. 2023 VLC is ranked #20 at usclublax (https://www.usclublax.com/2020-Fall-rankings.html); 2023 DCE is #17, 2023 NL is not listed. 2024 has VLC (22); DCE (15); NL (10). So again, once these kids get to high school they are all doing pretty well. Each club has plus and minus years but to posit that NL and DCE are in a different class than VLC is a bit short sighted. The whole purpose of this is to take the best kids from each and make a competition team.