Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.vdh.virginia.gov/coronavirus/coronavirus/covid-19-in-virginia-cases/

OP, toggle this visualization to the northern region and look at the cases, hospitalizations, and deaths. Please then explain to me how you interpret this as the pandemic getting worse.

I’m convinced that the fear porn lovers like OP want to cherry pick data that fits in with their world is ending mentality. I’m convinced the people loving quarantine life are the friendless people who have spent their lives as outcasts always feeling like they couldn’t really quite fit in. They know they aren’t respected at work. Some claim their kids are “thriving” because they are raising antisocial kids who would rather spend all day playing Minecraft and chatting online than actually talking to other human beings. And this pandemic gives them something to finally feel superior about. They enjoy judging others for not wearing a mask just right or not isolating as much as they deem necessary. They feel sad and threatened that there is a vaccine and the pandemic is going to end at some point, so they’re clinging to whatever they can.

Sorry, but those of us who have friends, hobbies, kids who do sports/in-person activities, who don’t hide behind computers all day are ready to get back to all the fun stuff we did prior to COVID. My kids are back in in-person sports and I’m planning travel and brunches with friends soon. I’m so excited to return to my normal life.

OP here....maybe that describes a lot of people who are cautious right now, but before the lockdown I was out until 3 at ESL, going to SAX for brunch and strip shows, and hoping that Town would reopen in that church soon, with friends from all walks of life. So, try again.

You're not a parent, I take it? That might explain your position.

Not a parent. Just a troll.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.vdh.virginia.gov/coronavirus/coronavirus/covid-19-in-virginia-cases/

OP, toggle this visualization to the northern region and look at the cases, hospitalizations, and deaths. Please then explain to me how you interpret this as the pandemic getting worse.

I’m convinced that the fear porn lovers like OP want to cherry pick data that fits in with their world is ending mentality. I’m convinced the people loving quarantine life are the friendless people who have spent their lives as outcasts always feeling like they couldn’t really quite fit in. They know they aren’t respected at work. Some claim their kids are “thriving” because they are raising antisocial kids who would rather spend all day playing Minecraft and chatting online than actually talking to other human beings. And this pandemic gives them something to finally feel superior about. They enjoy judging others for not wearing a mask just right or not isolating as much as they deem necessary. They feel sad and threatened that there is a vaccine and the pandemic is going to end at some point, so they’re clinging to whatever they can.

Sorry, but those of us who have friends, hobbies, kids who do sports/in-person activities, who don’t hide behind computers all day are ready to get back to all the fun stuff we did prior to COVID. My kids are back in in-person sports and I’m planning travel and brunches with friends soon. I’m so excited to return to my normal life.

OP here....maybe that describes a lot of people who are cautious right now, but before the lockdown I was out until 3 at ESL, going to SAX for brunch and strip shows, and hoping that Town would reopen in that church soon, with friends from all walks of life. So, try again.

You're not a parent, I take it? That might explain your position.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, per Emily Ouster’s data in areas of high spread by the CDC’s definition, the most open schools had a lower case count than half open schools among students and staff at all grades. Basic mitigation (masking and 3 feet) works, look: https://statsiq.co1.qualtrics.com/public-dashboard/v0/dashboard/5f78e5d4de521a001036f78e?fbclid=IwAR3CnonaZI2WH0J76iFNz9mIVfW8lnOai_BNvGZDFZ7o3lFkLlIe9t3tk8s#/dashboard/5f78e5d4de521a001036f78e?pageId=Page_ffb4dc52-5543-46b2-8126-2b7229fd1b17

OP here, ok at least this is data, but my premise is that PAST U.S. data is not relevant IF there is widespread transmission of these NEW variants in the U.S. in the future.

https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2021/03/experts-3-foot-rule-schools-problematic-light-covid-variants

"At the same time that CDC officials were updating school policy, they were also warning that B117, a variant strain 50% more transmissible than the wild-type virus, would likely become the dominant strain in the United States by April. In some states, such as Florida and California, the variant, which was first detected in the United Kingdom, already accounts for 25% of cases.

Now several experts are concerned that schools may be opening during an inflection point in the pandemic and are being misguided about how to do so."

So to summarize, you are advocating to keep kids (who are low risk) from school with fully vaccinated teachers because you are afraid that some variant MIGHT run wild at some point in the future. You have not indicated any concern about the actual local numbers currently reported in Northern Virginia, this is all about some theoretical "what if" scenario. If you are going to decide that past data isn't relevant and vaccines aren't relevant, I don't really know what to tell you.

For the record, schools can be closed again if opening turns out to be a mistake.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. I am not Ventilation lady and I have never posted on AEM and I don't belong to it either.

Why are people posting things without sources? Maybe that's my answer - the people who are demanding return right now have really, really, really strong cognitive bias and believe what they want to believe and don't seek out information.

The current vaccines are not as effective against South African strain and Brazil strain. The NYTimes article cited by a PP was based on health workers in the U.S., where the other variants were not yet circulating. In fact, the reason the J&J vaccine had lower efficacy was because it was partially tested in South Africa.

https://www.ama-assn.org/delivering-care/public-health/why-coronavirus-variants-might-undercut-vaccine-efficacy
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2102214

I posted earlier that the Brazil variant reinfects people who already were infected. Also, vaccine manufacturers are actively working on new vaccines for the variants. If the current vaccines were effective, why would they work on new ones? If you don't believe me, or in science, or in data, or in news, can you at least believe in market capitalism?



Also, I don't fly, go to bars, eat at restaurants, etc. I'm not advocating for that instead of schools opening? What a straw man argument! jeez

Ok well just like you don’t go to bars, restaurants, etc. you also DON’T HAVE TO SEND YOUR KID TO SCHOOL. Just OPT OUT if you’re not comfortable with it. And it’s not a straw man argument. You sound like you don’t even know what that means. The point is that why are you not worried about exposure at these other locations (bars, planes, etc.) but you are worried about schools? It’s not like COVID variants act differently in a restaurant than in a school. And if society can only tolerate a certain level of potential exposure then I would argue education is vastly more important than drinking a beer at a bar. So it’s a perfectly rational point to bring up — go fight the spread of COVID at all these other locations if you’re *that* worried about the new variants.

If you aren’t worried about the spread in those places b/c you don’t go there, then why do you care about potential spread at schools when all districts have announced plans to continue with virtual. Just don’t send your kid if you’re that worried but you don’t get to take away this fundamental right from the rest of us because you think the world owes you safety from COVID.

OP here. I'm not worried for myself! I'm not sending my kids back to in-person school in 2021. At some point I may worry about collapse of the health care system and needing to go to a hospital for something unrelated to covid, but I'm not worried about exposure because of my choices.

I asked why YOU weren't worried because you are wanting to send your kids back to in-person school in 2021. I would ask the same exact question to anyone who went to a bar, went to a restaurant, or flew on a plane. In fact, I have mentioned this to friends and family last week.

I’m not worried about schools reopening because I’m done suffering actual harm (from isolation, school closures, draining savings to pay for in-home help) because of some theoretical collapse of our healthcare system that had not yet happened even without the vaccines. If there is a bad spike, then we can reassess and do a temporary closure the way other school districts have done that have been open since last fall. But I think people who expect schools to stay closed ... until when exactly? (COVID Zero? No new variants? 100% vaccine efficacy?) ... are delusion and borderline insane. I also guess I’m a realist and accept that while I wish COVID didn’t exist, it does. I have accepted living with this risk the same way I accept all the other risks in life. I’m also tired of the goal posts moving. It seems like those who are against reopening always have a reason as to *why not* without any stated timeline for when it would be ok to reopen. There were teachers asking for NO community spread of COVID before reopening, which may legitimately never happen in our lifetimes.

The safest thing from a COVID perspective would be to close schools forever, but obviously we (sane people) recognize that would do other type of harm. So we need to balance accepting COVID with trying to counteract the harm of school closures. Because the “not yet” crowd doesn’t seem to have any good faith intent of reopening, I’m done listening to them.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.vdh.virginia.gov/coronavirus/coronavirus/covid-19-in-virginia-cases/

OP, toggle this visualization to the northern region and look at the cases, hospitalizations, and deaths. Please then explain to me how you interpret this as the pandemic getting worse.

I’m convinced that the fear porn lovers like OP want to cherry pick data that fits in with their world is ending mentality. I’m convinced the people loving quarantine life are the friendless people who have spent their lives as outcasts always feeling like they couldn’t really quite fit in. They know they aren’t respected at work. Some claim their kids are “thriving” because they are raising antisocial kids who would rather spend all day playing Minecraft and chatting online than actually talking to other human beings. And this pandemic gives them something to finally feel superior about. They enjoy judging others for not wearing a mask just right or not isolating as much as they deem necessary. They feel sad and threatened that there is a vaccine and the pandemic is going to end at some point, so they’re clinging to whatever they can.

Sorry, but those of us who have friends, hobbies, kids who do sports/in-person activities, who don’t hide behind computers all day are ready to get back to all the fun stuff we did prior to COVID. My kids are back in in-person sports and I’m planning travel and brunches with friends soon. I’m so excited to return to my normal life.

OP here....maybe that describes a lot of people who are cautious right now, but before the lockdown I was out until 3 at ESL, going to SAX for brunch and strip shows, and hoping that Town would reopen in that church soon, with friends from all walks of life. So, try again.

Um what?

Anonymous wrote:

OP here. I'm not worried for myself! I'm not sending my kids back to in-person school in 2021. At some point I may worry about collapse of the health care system and needing to go to a hospital for something unrelated to covid, but I'm not worried about exposure because of my choices.

I asked why YOU weren't worried because you are wanting to send your kids back to in-person school in 2021. I would ask the same exact question to anyone who went to a bar, went to a restaurant, or flew on a plane. In fact, I have mentioned this to friends and family last week.

DP. I am not worried because I am relatively young and healthy, my spouse is relatively young and healthy, and our kids are very healthy. If we get COVID the statistics indicate that at worst we will feel like we have a bad cold, and at beat we will be asymptotic and won’t even know we have it. This latter point is what keeps us away from grandparents, hospitals, nursing homes, etc. but it certainly should not keep the kids away from schools...

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.vdh.virginia.gov/coronavirus/coronavirus/covid-19-in-virginia-cases/

OP, toggle this visualization to the northern region and look at the cases, hospitalizations, and deaths. Please then explain to me how you interpret this as the pandemic getting worse.

I’m convinced that the fear porn lovers like OP want to cherry pick data that fits in with their world is ending mentality. I’m convinced the people loving quarantine life are the friendless people who have spent their lives as outcasts always feeling like they couldn’t really quite fit in. They know they aren’t respected at work. Some claim their kids are “thriving” because they are raising antisocial kids who would rather spend all day playing Minecraft and chatting online than actually talking to other human beings. And this pandemic gives them something to finally feel superior about. They enjoy judging others for not wearing a mask just right or not isolating as much as they deem necessary. They feel sad and threatened that there is a vaccine and the pandemic is going to end at some point, so they’re clinging to whatever they can.

Sorry, but those of us who have friends, hobbies, kids who do sports/in-person activities, who don’t hide behind computers all day are ready to get back to all the fun stuff we did prior to COVID. My kids are back in in-person sports and I’m planning travel and brunches with friends soon. I’m so excited to return to my normal life.

OP here....maybe that describes a lot of people who are cautious right now, but before the lockdown I was out until 3 at ESL, going to SAX for brunch and strip shows, and hoping that Town would reopen in that church soon, with friends from all walks of life. So, try again.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. I am not Ventilation lady and I have never posted on AEM and I don't belong to it either.

Why are people posting things without sources? Maybe that's my answer - the people who are demanding return right now have really, really, really strong cognitive bias and believe what they want to believe and don't seek out information.

The current vaccines are not as effective against South African strain and Brazil strain. The NYTimes article cited by a PP was based on health workers in the U.S., where the other variants were not yet circulating. In fact, the reason the J&J vaccine had lower efficacy was because it was partially tested in South Africa.

https://www.ama-assn.org/delivering-care/public-health/why-coronavirus-variants-might-undercut-vaccine-efficacy
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2102214

I posted earlier that the Brazil variant reinfects people who already were infected. Also, vaccine manufacturers are actively working on new vaccines for the variants. If the current vaccines were effective, why would they work on new ones? If you don't believe me, or in science, or in data, or in news, can you at least believe in market capitalism?



Also, I don't fly, go to bars, eat at restaurants, etc. I'm not advocating for that instead of schools opening? What a straw man argument! jeez

Ok well just like you don’t go to bars, restaurants, etc. you also DON’T HAVE TO SEND YOUR KID TO SCHOOL. Just OPT OUT if you’re not comfortable with it. And it’s not a straw man argument. You sound like you don’t even know what that means. The point is that why are you not worried about exposure at these other locations (bars, planes, etc.) but you are worried about schools? It’s not like COVID variants act differently in a restaurant than in a school. And if society can only tolerate a certain level of potential exposure then I would argue education is vastly more important than drinking a beer at a bar. So it’s a perfectly rational point to bring up — go fight the spread of COVID at all these other locations if you’re *that* worried about the new variants.

If you aren’t worried about the spread in those places b/c you don’t go there, then why do you care about potential spread at schools when all districts have announced plans to continue with virtual. Just don’t send your kid if you’re that worried but you don’t get to take away this fundamental right from the rest of us because you think the world owes you safety from COVID.

OP here. I'm not worried for myself! I'm not sending my kids back to in-person school in 2021. At some point I may worry about collapse of the health care system and needing to go to a hospital for something unrelated to covid, but I'm not worried about exposure because of my choices.

I asked why YOU weren't worried because you are wanting to send your kids back to in-person school in 2021. I would ask the same exact question to anyone who went to a bar, went to a restaurant, or flew on a plane. In fact, I have mentioned this to friends and family last week.

You'll be vaccinated in the next couple months if you aren't already. Your kids will likely be vaccinated before the end of 2021.

Please reconsider, OP. You need to be out in the world, your kids need that too. Even more than you, since they are only children and not full adults yet.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. I am not Ventilation lady and I have never posted on AEM and I don't belong to it either.

Why are people posting things without sources? Maybe that's my answer - the people who are demanding return right now have really, really, really strong cognitive bias and believe what they want to believe and don't seek out information.

The current vaccines are not as effective against South African strain and Brazil strain. The NYTimes article cited by a PP was based on health workers in the U.S., where the other variants were not yet circulating. In fact, the reason the J&J vaccine had lower efficacy was because it was partially tested in South Africa.

https://www.ama-assn.org/delivering-care/public-health/why-coronavirus-variants-might-undercut-vaccine-efficacy
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2102214

I posted earlier that the Brazil variant reinfects people who already were infected. Also, vaccine manufacturers are actively working on new vaccines for the variants. If the current vaccines were effective, why would they work on new ones? If you don't believe me, or in science, or in data, or in news, can you at least believe in market capitalism?



Also, I don't fly, go to bars, eat at restaurants, etc. I'm not advocating for that instead of schools opening? What a straw man argument! jeez

Ok well just like you don’t go to bars, restaurants, etc. you also DON’T HAVE TO SEND YOUR KID TO SCHOOL. Just OPT OUT if you’re not comfortable with it. And it’s not a straw man argument. You sound like you don’t even know what that means. The point is that why are you not worried about exposure at these other locations (bars, planes, etc.) but you are worried about schools? It’s not like COVID variants act differently in a restaurant than in a school. And if society can only tolerate a certain level of potential exposure then I would argue education is vastly more important than drinking a beer at a bar. So it’s a perfectly rational point to bring up — go fight the spread of COVID at all these other locations if you’re *that* worried about the new variants.

If you aren’t worried about the spread in those places b/c you don’t go there, then why do you care about potential spread at schools when all districts have announced plans to continue with virtual. Just don’t send your kid if you’re that worried but you don’t get to take away this fundamental right from the rest of us because you think the world owes you safety from COVID.

OP here. I'm not worried for myself! I'm not sending my kids back to in-person school in 2021. At some point I may worry about collapse of the health care system and needing to go to a hospital for something unrelated to covid, but I'm not worried about exposure because of my choices.

I asked why YOU weren't worried because you are wanting to send your kids back to in-person school in 2021. I would ask the same exact question to anyone who went to a bar, went to a restaurant, or flew on a plane. In fact, I have mentioned this to friends and family last week.

Anonymous wrote:https://www.vdh.virginia.gov/coronavirus/coronavirus/covid-19-in-virginia-cases/

OP, toggle this visualization to the northern region and look at the cases, hospitalizations, and deaths. Please then explain to me how you interpret this as the pandemic getting worse.

I’m convinced that the fear porn lovers like OP want to cherry pick data that fits in with their world is ending mentality. I’m convinced the people loving quarantine life are the friendless people who have spent their lives as outcasts always feeling like they couldn’t really quite fit in. They know they aren’t respected at work. Some claim their kids are “thriving” because they are raising antisocial kids who would rather spend all day playing Minecraft and chatting online than actually talking to other human beings. And this pandemic gives them something to finally feel superior about. They enjoy judging others for not wearing a mask just right or not isolating as much as they deem necessary. They feel sad and threatened that there is a vaccine and the pandemic is going to end at some point, so they’re clinging to whatever they can.

Sorry, but those of us who have friends, hobbies, kids who do sports/in-person activities, who don’t hide behind computers all day are ready to get back to all the fun stuff we did prior to COVID. My kids are back in in-person sports and I’m planning travel and brunches with friends soon. I’m so excited to return to my normal life.

What about the California variant? It's so widespread we don't even mention it.

OP, you're very concerned about the British and SA variants. Look at the covid curves for those countries. Google "UK covid" and "South Africa covid" and Google will show you up-to-date curves. A

Anonymous wrote:OP, per Emily Ouster’s data in areas of high spread by the CDC’s definition, the most open schools had a lower case count than half open schools among students and staff at all grades. Basic mitigation (masking and 3 feet) works, look: https://statsiq.co1.qualtrics.com/public-dashboard/v0/dashboard/5f78e5d4de521a001036f78e?fbclid=IwAR3CnonaZI2WH0J76iFNz9mIVfW8lnOai_BNvGZDFZ7o3lFkLlIe9t3tk8s#/dashboard/5f78e5d4de521a001036f78e?pageId=Page_ffb4dc52-5543-46b2-8126-2b7229fd1b17

OP here, ok at least this is data, but my premise is that PAST U.S. data is not relevant IF there is widespread transmission of these NEW variants in the U.S. in the future.

https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2021/03/experts-3-foot-rule-schools-problematic-light-covid-variants

"At the same time that CDC officials were updating school policy, they were also warning that B117, a variant strain 50% more transmissible than the wild-type virus, would likely become the dominant strain in the United States by April. In some states, such as Florida and California, the variant, which was first detected in the United Kingdom, already accounts for 25% of cases.

Now several experts are concerned that schools may be opening during an inflection point in the pandemic and are being misguided about how to do so."

Anonymous wrote:OP here. I am not Ventilation lady and I have never posted on AEM and I don't belong to it either.

Why are people posting things without sources? Maybe that's my answer - the people who are demanding return right now have really, really, really strong cognitive bias and believe what they want to believe and don't seek out information.

The current vaccines are not as effective against South African strain and Brazil strain. The NYTimes article cited by a PP was based on health workers in the U.S., where the other variants were not yet circulating. In fact, the reason the J&J vaccine had lower efficacy was because it was partially tested in South Africa.

https://www.ama-assn.org/delivering-care/public-health/why-coronavirus-variants-might-undercut-vaccine-efficacy
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2102214

I posted earlier that the Brazil variant reinfects people who already were infected. Also, vaccine manufacturers are actively working on new vaccines for the variants. If the current vaccines were effective, why would they work on new ones? If you don't believe me, or in science, or in data, or in news, can you at least believe in market capitalism?



Also, I don't fly, go to bars, eat at restaurants, etc. I'm not advocating for that instead of schools opening? What a straw man argument! jeez

Ok well just like you don’t go to bars, restaurants, etc. you also DON’T HAVE TO SEND YOUR KID TO SCHOOL. Just OPT OUT if you’re not comfortable with it. And it’s not a straw man argument. You sound like you don’t even know what that means. The point is that why are you not worried about exposure at these other locations (bars, planes, etc.) but you are worried about schools? It’s not like COVID variants act differently in a restaurant than in a school. And if society can only tolerate a certain level of potential exposure then I would argue education is vastly more important than drinking a beer at a bar. So it’s a perfectly rational point to bring up — go fight the spread of COVID at all these other locations if you’re *that* worried about the new variants.

If you aren’t worried about the spread in those places b/c you don’t go there, then why do you care about potential spread at schools when all districts have announced plans to continue with virtual. Just don’t send your kid if you’re that worried but you don’t get to take away this fundamental right from the rest of us because you think the world owes you safety from COVID.

The infectious disease doctors and epidemiologists I foster are still fairly hopeful.
[twitter] https://mobile.twitter.com/cmyeaton/status/1376605078484828166[/twitter]

OP, per Emily Ouster’s data in areas of high spread by the CDC’s definition, the most open schools had a lower case count than half open schools among students and staff at all grades. Basic mitigation (masking and 3 feet) works, look: https://statsiq.co1.qualtrics.com/public-dashboard/v0/dashboard/5f78e5d4de521a001036f78e?fbclid=IwAR3CnonaZI2WH0J76iFNz9mIVfW8lnOai_BNvGZDFZ7o3lFkLlIe9t3tk8s#/dashboard/5f78e5d4de521a001036f78e?pageId=Page_ffb4dc52-5543-46b2-8126-2b7229fd1b17