Just make sure you have a supportive work place and flexible hours. ExDH I had had DD in our late 20s, both made around 100K in federal positions. Our jobs allowed for relatively flexible schedules and we found a lovely inhome daycare center in our neighborhood that was affordable. We worked hours that allowed one of us to do drop off and the other pick up so we each worked full days. We also had option to work flexible schedules of longer days for less days per week/pay period. It was very doable in this area (prepandemic) bc childcare centers are used to two working parent households with commutes, so the hours allowed for that.

As far as sleep, we were lucky and DD slept through the night fairly early, but the trick is to swap out and share the burden. When DD was an infant, we would both wake up so one did the diaper, the other the bottle, so it wasn't a longer stretch awake and we would swap so one parent wasn't always waking up.

The key is a supportive workplace and a supportive spouse.

It's totally doable.
Pre Covid with two working parents you take maternity leave ( my DH had 4 weeks and I had 14, having him with me the first month was great to get a schedule ironed out).
You get on a schedule so you can survive. Baby was not a great sleeper but we were asleep 30 mins after she was for her first stretch in the night. You go without late night movies and going out for the first 6 months because that is how you survive.
Fast forward 3 year pre covid and I was up at 630 to shower get dressed and get breakfast/lunch prepped and ready. DD was up by 715 and it was get her dressed and we are all out the door by 755. We lived in NYC suburbs then so drive to daycare (5 mins away) - essential that it is close to home, we almost made that mistake) and one of us was on the 805 train and the other on the 825 after dropoff (we would switch off). Daycare was 8 - 6pm. One of us left at 5 for 6pm pickup and the other at 545/6 (again you need a partner that also is going to flex with you). Dinner by 630 (usually I would cook meals over the weekend for reheating during the week), bathtime 7/715 lights out 745/8 for DD. Rinse, repeat.

Now in covid times DD's daycare is open again and she goes 9-5pm and we are both working fulltime from home and so happy we don't have to commute for the time being!

Anonymous wrote:I was worried to but it’s been better than I expected. Partially because we sleep trained around 4 months. It’s a game changer. I’m not sleep deprived at all.

Similar for us, but we waited until almost 6 months. We only had one kid and she's been a solid sleeper since then (now age 9).

Anonymous wrote:I dare you to post this in the special needs forum. Anyone who says parents working full time can handle a special needs child without a nanny (and likely still hating their lives) is lying.

What your describing, OP, is a big roll of the dice. Particularly since you don't make enough money for a nanny and don't have local family. What are you going to do if you roll snake eyes?

Cosigned. Even a kid with "mild" special needs. The therapies (for parents and kids), extra doctors appointments, meetings with the school to get a good learning plan are a solid part time job in normal times. In pandemic times, helping a special needs kid with distance learning is a very exhausting full time job. Add sibling to the mix? One parent stays home. That's reality in a best case scenario of a kid with special needs.

Anonymous wrote:Hi OP, I was you awhile ago. I’ve got two kids now. We are a dual income family. It sucks.

But! No one would ever have kids if the choice was sleep vs. no sleep, or having disposable income vs. spending all our money on your kids.

You need to be thinking long-term... over my expected lifespan of 60-80 more years, will the joy of having children outweigh the fact that no one gets sleep with a newborn?

That’s a “heart” decision, not a dollars and sense decision.

+1

Objectively my child free friends have a lot more perks in life than I do (more sleep, more travel, ability to go full throttle in their careers, more disposable income, more time for self care, etc.). I can totally understand the appeal of that lifestyle and there are days I would kill for silence and a nap. And plenty days I’ve had to power through working sick (from home luckily I have a telework-friendly job) because I need to save sick leave for when my kids are sick.

But then there are also dance parties in the kitchen, family board game/movie nights, sweet toddler giggles to help get through the early mornings, the art work made of tiny handprints hanging on my fridge, the unintentionally hilarious things my kindergartner says, snow ball fights on snow days, bedtime snuggles, introducing my oldest to the joys of Mario Kart, a reason to bundle up and get some fresh air even on a chilly day, a hand sneaking past the shower curtain to show me an awesome Lego creation that could not wait, etc

It’s hard to tangibly quantify why anyone would have kids. If you make a pro/con spreadsheet there is no logical reason to have children. Like a PP said, it’s a decision of the heart. Neither choice is wrong.

A few things that help as a working parent though — flexible jobs ideally with telework, a partner who shares in parenting duties, nearby family help is the jackpot if you have it, money for babysitters and a reliable childcare center, COFFEE and did I mention COFFEE?

I love being a working mom. My kids are 9 and 12 so definitely easier. It of course depends on the situation. We've always had a lot of flex, and for the first several years we had nearby retired grandparents and that was HUGE. Neither of us have had jobs that required a lot of travel. I WFH a few days a week pre pandemic and that is huge. I can't imagine commuting 5 days a week and I don't think either of us ever will again.

Things change. When they are younger and you have daycare or a nanny the schedule is clearer, but it is harder to WFH on a sick day. When they are older, the schedule is more complicated but they can more easily carpool to soccer etc. and they are busy after school doing their own things, so it's a mix.

We outsource a lot of our yard care and housecleaning (less frequent housecleaning during the pandemic because it's a pain but still having someone come every 6 weeks or so). We now do grocery delivery and neither of us are commuting so that makes it easier. I don't think I'll ever go back to regularly working in an office frankly, and I think DH will have regular WFH days when things go back to "normal" so that will be easier.

Anonymous wrote:I did not love the baby and young toddler years. While they were really wonderful and cute and magical, they were also a slog. In some ways it was a huge relief to drop them off for age appropriate care during the day and go to work where I only had to take care of myself and my adult responsibilities.

+1. My youngest is 4 and it's still a slog.

DH and I both work, with a combined (evenly split) HHI of about $200K. We have a 4yo and a 1.5yo. Our office - we're both non-Fed gov workers) has a very generous unpaid leave policy, and he and I both took close to 7 months off for each kid. Which meant we had a long stretch of single income, but no childcare expenses (and more time to prep meals at home, etc, so some savings there). We've been WFH since March but will have to go back to the office eventually. We've never actually had 2 working commuting parents with 2 kids, since DH was still on leave with DS when Covid struck. But it's doable. We have a daycare that we love, and kept our DD longer than we might have (when other families were going the more structured "nursery school" route) because having 1 drop off, longer coverage hours, meals provided, and holidays covered, made sense to us as working parents. We're moving our son to a different daycare next year when our daughter starts kindergarten (hopefully in person...).

We don't go out often (so no babysitter, even pre-covid), clean our small apartment ourselves (no housecleaner), but did love to travel pre-covid, and generally found our lives manageable. We both work full time but our hours are good (generally 8-4 and 9-5 so one did drop off and one pick up) and our work offers a bit of flexibility with sick days etc as needed.

We are absolutely equal parents, in terms of time/roles/responsibilities. Earning almost the exact same amount helps with that dynamic, too! But yeah, it's doable.

My kids are 9 and 12. I *was* sleep deprived in the early years and truthfully have rarely felt truly rested since then since I ended up the default parent on weekends. (Long story, and my spouse is really helpful in other aspects of parenting.) But at the same time, we also survived. And I never felt like we had made a mistake. Both DH and I have longish commutes, and he was really resentful of the extra time neighborhood friends had with their spouses and kids because at least one parent worked very close to home.

We don't have local family, although my mother (essentially) lived with us from the time our first was 5 months to about 15 months. Then DC1 went to a day care center recommended by neighborhood friends. The day care was amazing, but also expensive. It was less than my salary, so I felt we were still coming out ahead, especially when thinking about continued retirement investment.

With DC2, we had a nanny for a couple of months until a spot opened at the day care where DC1 was.

DH had always gone into work earlier than I did, and that sort of staggered schedule has really helped. I take care of all the morning stuff, and he does all the afternoon and evening stuff. So he ended up becoming the parent who checks homework and oversees music practice, etc.

Anonymous wrote:OP, get ready for people to tell you you’re going to be sleep deprived and miserable no matter what you do.

I was nervous about having kids, for a lot of the same reasons you are. Everyone told me you never sleep, it’s so hard, you never get time alone, how will you possible do things you love? It was really weird how much negativity there was around being a parent. When I was pregnant and hated being pregnant people said “oh just wait it’s going to get so much worse”. When he was a calm, sweet baby they said, “oh just wait until he crawls”. Then he crawled and it was so much fun, and they said “oh just wait until he walks, THEN you’ll be miserable”. Then when I wasn’t miserable, they said well wait until he starts taking, preschool, elementary school, teenagers.... And on and on.

I’m not sleep deprived or miserable, but a lot of people for some reason want to tell you that you will be. It’s really weird.

It's because they were miserable and misery loves company. I've experienced the same. Everyone kept telling me at some point it would be awful. Kids are in elementary now and while I am not deluding myself that everything will be perfect, it hasn't been awful like some people say it is. I think the main things that contribute to bad experiences include (1) kids who don't sleep (some of this is kid-related, some of this is the parents' fault), (2) not enough money (no surprise that money makes everything easier), (3) spouses who are unhelpful (this can happen with both husbands and wives), (4) stressful jobs (i.e. no ability to be flexible, constant pressure to perform, etc.), (5) environmental factors (i.e. long commutes, high cost of living - see #2), and (6) loss of identity (some of the most miserable people I know gave up everything they did pre-kids so they have no outlets or ability to get away from it all).

I did not love the baby and young toddler years. While they were really wonderful and cute and magical, they were also a slog. In some ways it was a huge relief to drop them off for age appropriate care during the day and go to work where I only had to take care of myself and my adult responsibilities.

I dare you to post this in the special needs forum. Anyone who says parents working full time can handle a special needs child without a nanny (and likely still hating their lives) is lying.

What your describing, OP, is a big roll of the dice. Particularly since you don't make enough money for a nanny and don't have local family. What are you going to do if you roll snake eyes?

I would make sure not to fall into the two income trap. If you need both your incomes to make rent or mortgage payments, you are going to feel a lot of pressure if and when you have a kid.

Other things that make our lives easier with kids:
-Formula
-Sleep train
-Really good nanny or very close by in-home daycare
-Don’t neglect your sleep or health
-Don’t get your kids in activities or other things that require extra logistics, at least not til they’re late ES or MS.
-Prioritize the total logistics for the family. To the extent you can, choose doctors, schools, activities that are close by to your home
-make sure your partner is at least as competent as you are with childcare. Leave him alone with the baby often and for long stretches, starting in infancy. Don’t become the only expert.

Yeah it can be hard, but 100% worth it in my opinion and I also think work flexibility will increase post covid even when going back into the office. We’ve shown that parents can manage both without being on rigid schedules and I think most of us are going to push to keep that flexibility. And our income was much less than $200k when we had our first a few years ago, no problems.

I was worried to but it’s been better than I expected. Partially because we sleep trained around 4 months. It’s a game changer. I’m not sleep deprived at all.