Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Huh? Because you're pushing people out of the neighborhood who possibly lived there for generations and can't afford it anymore (rent or property taxes) due to people like you.

Whether this bothers you or not is one thing but it's absolutely true that this is a real thing going on.

Right - but the question becomes - as an UMC white family - what should you do? I don't want to live surrounded by all white people. I want my kid to have a diverse friend group, racially, ethnically, and socio-economically. While yes, UMC white people moving into historically black neighborhoods pushes black people out. But the alternative is to move to a white-only area, which seems worse to me.

It seems to me that the system here is clearly racist, but that individual families moving to black neighborhoods (as primary residences) aren't doing anything wrong, and may in fact be doing the best they can to fight racism. What would you propose they do instead? Move to Arlington?

PP. The thing is, it's obviously fine and maybe even good for society when it's just one or two white families moving in and integrating the neighborhood (assuming you are decent people and use the neighborhood public schools/don't call the cops on your neighbors for noise or other petty complaints, etc.).

however, it gets to be a big problem without a good solution when it's tons of white families doing it and completely changing the cultural tenor of the area. See, for example: Brooklyn and all its myriad problems related to this issue.

You really don't get why the old families are unhappy about this? It's not just having to see white faces. It's all the restaurants and bars and stores that come in chasing their money, which they can't afford and which raise their rents. It's their schools changing and no longer servicing their community's needs.

There is a lot of literature about this issue, I shouldn't have to tell you this. None of this is a mystery.

Wait, but another comment said that white people moving into a black neighborhood can be more ethical by sending their kids to local schools and changing them for the better. Now I’m even more confused.

PP, again, I think everyone agrees with you and understands the macro issue. But you still haven’t answered the question of specifically what one individual UMC white person’s responsibility is.

I think it's along the lines of: don't move in and start throwing your weight (money/education) around. Don't push the school to start changing how it does things right away. Be a good neighbor. Don't call the cops for noise complaints or "junk" in someone's yard or some other petty reason. Don't call the cops on groups of teenagers "loitering." Don't get scared by seeing a group of black teens hanging out on the corner. Don't call the cops on black people at all.

I'm not at all saying you wouldn't be a good neighbor. But let's be real, many white people have a problem with entitlement due to how they grew up. They will go into a school and start pushing for changes right away that would benefit their special snowflake over other kids who have been there longer. They have a hard time understanding that their needs/issues/concerns shouldn't always get first priority.

Anonymous wrote:I recently bought a place in Columbia Heights and multiple liberal friends of mine have called me a gentrifier.

I don’t understand why buying the best house we could afford is somehow unethical. Should we look at white only neighborhoods? I mean, truly, what are people proposing? Even if we wanted to self segregate (we don’t), we couldn’t afford those super white parts of DC.

I truly don’t understand... what are these anti gentrification people suggesting homebuyers do? By the way, it is ONLY our White friends who care. None of our POC friends have said anything negative at all.

Anonymous wrote:The big problem with cities is that middle class whites (middle class anyone!) aren’t moving there. Thus you have only poor POC and very rich whites. It exacerbated stereotypes and I think it distorts the perception of both sides. Rich while kids grow up thinking all brown people are poor. And poor brown people grow up thinking no one cares about them and that only white people make it in the world. Poor whites are way out in the rural areas and middle class brown and white people are out living in suburbia.

There’s a whole suburban and rural area out there guys!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ok, to the people who think gentrification is not a big deal, where do the poor people go who get pushed out due to rising rents and property taxes?

Do you even know? Do you not care if the new neighborhood is further from their work/friends/family or if it's less safe?

they go somewhere cheaper usually further out. It's the same thing that happens to any renter when the value the house the live in rises (at least cities tend to have rent protection). What is the alternative, to literally create ghettos (in the historic sense) reserved for members of a certain race or class in perpetuity?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Huh? Because you're pushing people out of the neighborhood who possibly lived there for generations and can't afford it anymore (rent or property taxes) due to people like you.

Whether this bothers you or not is one thing but it's absolutely true that this is a real thing going on.

Right - but the question becomes - as an UMC white family - what should you do? I don't want to live surrounded by all white people. I want my kid to have a diverse friend group, racially, ethnically, and socio-economically. While yes, UMC white people moving into historically black neighborhoods pushes black people out. But the alternative is to move to a white-only area, which seems worse to me.

It seems to me that the system here is clearly racist, but that individual families moving to black neighborhoods (as primary residences) aren't doing anything wrong, and may in fact be doing the best they can to fight racism. What would you propose they do instead? Move to Arlington?

PP. The thing is, it's obviously fine and maybe even good for society when it's just one or two white families moving in and integrating the neighborhood (assuming you are decent people and use the neighborhood public schools/don't call the cops on your neighbors for noise or other petty complaints, etc.).

however, it gets to be a big problem without a good solution when it's tons of white families doing it and completely changing the cultural tenor of the area. See, for example: Brooklyn and all its myriad problems related to this issue.

You really don't get why the old families are unhappy about this? It's not just having to see white faces. It's all the restaurants and bars and stores that come in chasing their money, which they can't afford and which raise their rents. It's their schools changing and no longer servicing their community's needs.

There is a lot of literature about this issue, I shouldn't have to tell you this. None of this is a mystery.

Wait, but another comment said that white people moving into a black neighborhood can be more ethical by sending their kids to local schools and changing them for the better. Now I’m even more confused.

PP, again, I think everyone agrees with you and understands the macro issue. But you still haven’t answered the question of specifically what one individual UMC white person’s responsibility is.

I think it's along the lines of: don't move in and start throwing your weight (money/education) around. Don't push the school to start changing how it does things right away. Be a good neighbor. Don't call the cops for noise complaints or "junk" in someone's yard or some other petty reason. Don't call the cops on groups of teenagers "loitering." Don't get scared by seeing a group of black teens hanging out on the corner. Don't call the cops on black people at all.

I'm not at all saying you wouldn't be a good neighbor. But let's be real, many white people have a problem with entitlement due to how they grew up. They will go into a school and start pushing for changes right away that would benefit their special snowflake over other kids who have been there longer. They have a hard time understanding that their needs/issues/concerns shouldn't always get first priority.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This argument of "I don't want my kids to live in an all-white neighborhood" is a bit silly. You know you can just teach your kids to be a good person by exemple? Black people are not there as an experience for your child to have. You can afford to buy somewhere else, it doesn't have to be "all-white". My neighborhood here in VA is anything but all-white! There are literally kids from all over the world, what else do you want? I don't blame the gentrifiers for making the most profitable move, because the system is messed up. But don't make silly excuses. And don't expect others to be please by your choice.

+ 1

Gentrifiers buy where they do because that's the best they can afford. Nothing wrong with that, given the way real estate works here. Just don't try to dress it up and defend what you're doing by saying you are "seeking diversity." Because we all know that if you could afford it, you'd in the mostly all white, super affluent, urban area too.

Anonymous wrote:This argument of "I don't want my kids to live in an all-white neighborhood" is a bit silly. You know you can just teach your kids to be a good person by exemple? Black people are not there as an experience for your child to have. You can afford to buy somewhere else, it doesn't have to be "all-white". My neighborhood here in VA is anything but all-white! There are literally kids from all over the world, what else do you want? I don't blame the gentrifiers for making the most profitable move, because the system is messed up. But don't make silly excuses. And don't expect others to be please by your choice.