Anonymous
05/22/2019 10:47
Subject: The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:My DS has experienced problems with this from the other side. Very smart kid, sailed through elementary and middle school with straight A’s requiring not much effort on his part. Then high school hit. A quarter to a third of the kids in his private high school get extra time for tests. He often can’t finish them in the allotted time. His grades are suffering. He is especially frustrated when they get a short test and he sees the kids with extra time finishing up before the end of the (regular) period and he is still scrambling at the end. He has begged us to get tested for extra time, but we are hesitant. What is fair here? Should he suddenly get accommodations in 10th or 11th grade, and have people telling us we are gaming the system? Or just suck it up that he is now a B+ student because he can’t finish high school tests in the allotted time?
Serious question here. What would you do if he were your kid?
I would get him evaluated. It is often the case that problems don't emerge until later for smart kids that were able to cover when the academic demands were less. The 'allotted time' is usually more than enough time, so if he can't finish, there may be an issue. Find out. And do not worry about people telling you that you are gaming the system. I'm AA so I've been told that I must have gamed the system simply by going to college. So what if people think that. Gaming the system is looking for ways to get an unfair advantage, but if your kid has an actual issue then it is not gaming a system, it is merely getting equal footing so you can have the same opportunities they have. If they feel threatened by that, it's their problem, not yours.
It is not equal footing - it will never be. Extra time allocated will always be too much or too little for the disability so even for those who truly need it, there is already an advantage if they get too much time compared to those who got too little or none. Mark the tests of those who didn’t have extra time or give extra time to all or offer a choice to the kids - timed or untimed.
Anonymous
05/22/2019 10:45
Subject: The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions
Anonymous wrote:I want employees who can do the job in the alotted time. I want to know who cant before I hire them.
Since SAT's aren't used in hiring, that's not really relevant.
Anonymous
05/22/2019 10:43
Subject: The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions
Anonymous wrote:My DS has experienced problems with this from the other side. Very smart kid, sailed through elementary and middle school with straight A’s requiring not much effort on his part. Then high school hit. A quarter to a third of the kids in his private high school get extra time for tests. He often can’t finish them in the allotted time. His grades are suffering. He is especially frustrated when they get a short test and he sees the kids with extra time finishing up before the end of the (regular) period and he is still scrambling at the end. He has begged us to get tested for extra time, but we are hesitant. What is fair here? Should he suddenly get accommodations in 10th or 11th grade, and have people telling us we are gaming the system? Or just suck it up that he is now a B+ student because he can’t finish high school tests in the allotted time?
Serious question here. What would you do if he were your kid?
I would get him evaluated. It is often the case that problems don't emerge until later for smart kids that were able to cover when the academic demands were less. The 'allotted time' is usually more than enough time, so if he can't finish, there may be an issue. Find out. And do not worry about people telling you that you are gaming the system. I'm AA so I've been told that I must have gamed the system simply by going to college. So what if people think that. Gaming the system is looking for ways to get an unfair advantage, but if your kid has an actual issue then it is not gaming a system, it is merely getting equal footing so you can have the same opportunities they have. If they feel threatened by that, it's their problem, not yours.
Anonymous
05/22/2019 10:38
Subject: The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions
. Have your son evaluated and see what he needs.Anonymous wrote:My DS has experienced problems with this from the other side. Very smart kid, sailed through elementary and middle school with straight A’s requiring not much effort on his part. Then high school hit. A quarter to a third of the kids in his private high school get extra time for tests. He often can’t finish them in the allotted time. His grades are suffering. He is especially frustrated when they get a short test and he sees the kids with extra time finishing up before the end of the (regular) period and he is still scrambling at the end. He has begged us to get tested for extra time, but we are hesitant. What is fair here? Should he suddenly get accommodations in 10th or 11th grade, and have people telling us we are gaming the system? Or just suck it up that he is now a B+ student because he can’t finish high school tests in the allotted time?
Serious question here. What would you do if he were your kid?
Anonymous
05/22/2019 10:36
Subject: The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions
My DS has experienced problems with this from the other side. Very smart kid, sailed through elementary and middle school with straight A’s requiring not much effort on his part. Then high school hit. A quarter to a third of the kids in his private high school get extra time for tests. He often can’t finish them in the allotted time. His grades are suffering. He is especially frustrated when they get a short test and he sees the kids with extra time finishing up before the end of the (regular) period and he is still scrambling at the end. He has begged us to get tested for extra time, but we are hesitant. What is fair here? Should he suddenly get accommodations in 10th or 11th grade, and have people telling us we are gaming the system? Or just suck it up that he is now a B+ student because he can’t finish high school tests in the allotted time?
Serious question here. What would you do if he were your kid?
Serious question here. What would you do if he were your kid?
Anonymous
05/22/2019 10:27
Subject: Re:The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:LOL, you people are so angry...it is comical. So glad my ADHD kid got his deserved extra time that he needed and scored well on the ACT and got into his first choice top 20 school. As for what is done to curb the abuse, I doubt it will change much. Maybe be more careful about who gets accommodations. If you have a kid who struggled since elementary school, it is doubtful that kid is "gaming the system." I believe it is more suspect when kids suddenly in late middle school or in high school decide to get evaluated. Maybe just have more stringent requirements for evaluation for them.
But you will NEVER see the accommodations go away. Sorry, but you won't win this one...nice try though.
Sure it will. Your kid will have a hard time in a top 20 school bc of his SN.
Different PP, but my DC with SN is at a top 20 school and is kicking ass. Your child’s experience may vary, though.
Anonymous
05/22/2019 10:26
Subject: The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions
Anonymous wrote:I really want to see this extra time scam go away. I’d like ACT and SAT to have to disclose the exact accommodations. But I know this won’t happen.
Instead I invite everyone to get their kids extra time. Go to an ed psych and explain how you think your dc is slow and not performing to his potential. Have your dc absolutely bomb the processing speed subtests. It’s not hard to explain to your kid how and why. Done.
If more and more people do this hopefully this will change for the better.
My DC had extra time because he had a reader and a scribe. Both take longer to take tests as a result. It has to go through two brains ad the scribe frequently doesnt write very fast. He received 50% extra time as a result.
Anonymous
05/22/2019 10:25
Subject: Re:The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:LOL, you people are so angry...it is comical. So glad my ADHD kid got his deserved extra time that he needed and scored well on the ACT and got into his first choice top 20 school. As for what is done to curb the abuse, I doubt it will change much. Maybe be more careful about who gets accommodations. If you have a kid who struggled since elementary school, it is doubtful that kid is "gaming the system." I believe it is more suspect when kids suddenly in late middle school or in high school decide to get evaluated. Maybe just have more stringent requirements for evaluation for them.
But you will NEVER see the accommodations go away. Sorry, but you won't win this one...nice try though.
Sure it will. Your kid will have a hard time in a top 20 school bc of his SN.
DP. Once he was admitted, she probably applied for accommodations. He'll be fine. Then when he graduates, he'll be have his pick of jobs, and can select one that doesn't involve time pressure. There are many great jobs that fit that bill and that will appreciate her DS's talents.
Anonymous
05/22/2019 10:24
Subject: The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions
I agree with this.Anonymous wrote:Ok, if you want to go down this route, let’s also restrict everyone to taking the test only once.
Anonymous
05/22/2019 10:24
Subject: The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions
. So a blind person who needs technology/reader that slows things down because of the technology should be penalized?Anonymous wrote:If your kid has a slow processing speed they deserve a lower score. This charade will end soon. Affluent parents gaming the system so their kid can bump their 1400 to a 1500 is going to end. They have to have a non-timed test, call it something else and offer it as an addition to the traditional ACT or SAT. Call it the NTSAT (non-timed SAT) offer to anyone with a 504 or to any kid who doesn't want to take the SAT with time constraints. Let the colleges then decide then. But the colleges should KNOW who is getting more time on these tests and this seems like the only fair way. NO MORE EXTRA TIME ON SAT OR ACT FOR ANYONE
Anonymous
05/22/2019 10:23
Subject: The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions
Ok, if you want to go down this route, let’s also restrict everyone to taking the test only once.
Anonymous
05/22/2019 10:21
Subject: The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions
I really want to see this extra time scam go away. I’d like ACT and SAT to have to disclose the exact accommodations. But I know this won’t happen.
Instead I invite everyone to get their kids extra time. Go to an ed psych and explain how you think your dc is slow and not performing to his potential. Have your dc absolutely bomb the processing speed subtests. It’s not hard to explain to your kid how and why. Done.
If more and more people do this hopefully this will change for the better.
Instead I invite everyone to get their kids extra time. Go to an ed psych and explain how you think your dc is slow and not performing to his potential. Have your dc absolutely bomb the processing speed subtests. It’s not hard to explain to your kid how and why. Done.
If more and more people do this hopefully this will change for the better.
Anonymous
05/22/2019 10:20
Subject: The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Truth is, more time on a (proctored, closed book) standardized test doesn’t make you smarter or enable you to know more. It just gives people a chance to show what they already know/can do.
No way. Extra time would help everyone. Timed tests are much more stressful and require you to think quickly in less than ideal ways. I guarantee you that I would absolutely score higher if I had extra time.
Then the solution to that problem is keep the test the same length and give everybody more time/enough time. Colleges aren’t looking for speed.
Personally, more time would drive me batty. And too much time would probably decrease the scores of second-guessers and kids who see ambiguity.
Anonymous
05/22/2019 10:18
Subject: Re:The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions
Anonymous wrote:Take it up with your congressional rep.
Also, read the Americans with Disabilities Act.
+1
Anonymous
05/22/2019 10:17
Subject: The very definition of "standardized" means same test/same testing conditions
I believe the fairest possible test is the one that makes the base I was born on third base.