Anonymous
01/28/2019 16:37
Subject: Re:William & Mary Admissions by Residency and Gender
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:That admit rate (particularly from in-state) is higher than I would expect. I wonder if the number of applicants has been dropping.
It's self-selecting. Only top students with stellar stats apply.
Sure, honey
Anonymous
01/28/2019 16:36
Subject: William & Mary Admissions by Residency and Gender
Hoping my 1490 SAT, 4.0 UW out of state kid has a chance. Crazy how high the stats are and how competitive it is.
Anonymous
01/28/2019 15:28
Subject: Re:William & Mary Admissions by Residency and Gender
Anonymous wrote:NP: I think it's very hard to look at any of these schools' trends without holding all three of these in mind across the years:
1. the profile of admitted applicants? SAT scores/GPA
2. the % admitted
3. the yield
Taken together these trend lines tell you something about the school's enrollment trajectory W&M is particularly unusual as the most expensive in-state public school that presents (and attracts students) like a private liberal arts college: it's going to be a bit quirky. But it's got very solid trends in admitted profiles (consistently attracting very high SAT & GPA students). I don't think the Parchment data tell you much when you compare schools that are too different from one another, and there are really no other schools in the same niche as W&M. I think W&M suffers just a bit compared to private schools in the out-of-state bin because as a public school it can't throw merit money around to compete with private schools, nor does it guarantee meeting demonstrated need OOS. It suffers a bit to public schools in-state by being more expensive. But for the high achieving students who know they want to go there, it consistently does just fine (and then surveys suggest they are happy once there--and the Princeton Review Surveys have a decent research design/sampling process).
William & Mary list price is relatively high for a public school (but considerably lower than private), but it also provides strong financial aid (to in-state students). This aid helps W&M have the second lowest student loan default rate among public schools (after Colorado School of Mines).
Anonymous
01/25/2019 21:38
Subject: William & Mary Admissions by Residency and Gender
My D applied RD. 4.1 and 1300. NOVA.
Anonymous
01/25/2019 18:49
Subject: Re:William & Mary Admissions by Residency and Gender
NP: I think it's very hard to look at any of these schools' trends without holding all three of these in mind across the years:
1. the profile of admitted applicants? SAT scores/GPA
2. the % admitted
3. the yield
Taken together these trend lines tell you something about the school's enrollment trajectory W&M is particularly unusual as the most expensive in-state public school that presents (and attracts students) like a private liberal arts college: it's going to be a bit quirky. But it's got very solid trends in admitted profiles (consistently attracting very high SAT & GPA students). I don't think the Parchment data tell you much when you compare schools that are too different from one another, and there are really no other schools in the same niche as W&M. I think W&M suffers just a bit compared to private schools in the out-of-state bin because as a public school it can't throw merit money around to compete with private schools, nor does it guarantee meeting demonstrated need OOS. It suffers a bit to public schools in-state by being more expensive. But for the high achieving students who know they want to go there, it consistently does just fine (and then surveys suggest they are happy once there--and the Princeton Review Surveys have a decent research design/sampling process).
1. the profile of admitted applicants? SAT scores/GPA
2. the % admitted
3. the yield
Taken together these trend lines tell you something about the school's enrollment trajectory W&M is particularly unusual as the most expensive in-state public school that presents (and attracts students) like a private liberal arts college: it's going to be a bit quirky. But it's got very solid trends in admitted profiles (consistently attracting very high SAT & GPA students). I don't think the Parchment data tell you much when you compare schools that are too different from one another, and there are really no other schools in the same niche as W&M. I think W&M suffers just a bit compared to private schools in the out-of-state bin because as a public school it can't throw merit money around to compete with private schools, nor does it guarantee meeting demonstrated need OOS. It suffers a bit to public schools in-state by being more expensive. But for the high achieving students who know they want to go there, it consistently does just fine (and then surveys suggest they are happy once there--and the Princeton Review Surveys have a decent research design/sampling process).
Anonymous
01/25/2019 13:27
Subject: William & Mary Admissions by Residency and Gender
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Historical totals:
Not exactly the trend lines the Board of Visitors would want to see.
Yield rates are down at most schools over this time period because students apply to more schools. (Schools like Harvard and Stanford buck the trend.) UVA yield rate declined 10.5 percentage points over the same period. At Doctoral institutions, average yield declined from 37.3% in 2007 to 30.3% in 2014.
Notre Dame (not exactly Harvard or Stanford):
2013: 52.6%
2014: 53.1%
2015: 55.8%
2016: 56.0%
2017: 55.4%
2018: 57.4%
The missing piece is that as a private school. Notre Dame probably spends more money than a public on yielding their admitted students.
Um, you forgot to mention that ND is a much more desired school than W&M. https://www.parchment.com/c/college/tools/college-cross-admit-comparison.php?compare=University+of+Notre+Dame&with=College+of+William+and+Mary
For many who apply also to elite schools, W&M is just a safety.
Um, let's be clear and fair, against highly elite schools (e.g. HYPSM etc.), ALL schools in Virginia (UVA, W&M, W&L, Richmond) are usually safeties and backups.
You cite a cross-admit rate from Parchment with Notre Dame (88% choose ND, 12% W&M). The cross-admit rate of Notre Dame with UVA is 85% Notre Dame, 15% UVA. (W&L is 76%/24% in favor of Notre Dame). Looking more broadly: Duke is 88/12 vs UVA, 77/23 vs W&M, and 67/23 vs W&L. Princeton is 94/6 vs UVA, 72/28 vs W&M, 67/33 vs W&L. Harvard is 75/25 vs UVA, 77/23 vs W&M, and 78/22 vs W&L. Stanford is 87/13 vs UVA, 67/33 vs W&M, and 60/40 vs W&L. Yale is 79/21 vs UVA, 60/40 vs W&M, 72/28 vs W&L.
Cross admits with top schools and the Virginia schools are probably typically enticed to attend the Virginia schools only through merit or athletic scholarships. W&L has much broader merit aid than either UVA or W&M.
Washington & Lee probably does better on average against these schools than in cross-admits than UVA or W&M because it has the Johnson scholarships. These scholarships go to about 10% of each class and pays tuition, room, board + about $7K to enhance summer experiences. UVA has the similar Jefferson scholar program and William & Mary has the 1693 program, but they are for only about 1% of a class.
Anonymous
01/25/2019 13:16
Subject: William & Mary Admissions by Residency and Gender
Anonymous wrote:
Year by year, residency and gender.
You can find more information on the Common Data Sets, which are available on the W&M website (most colleges have them available and they are consistent data to federal specifications). Search William and Mary Common Data Set and year.
There is also good, consistent data for all Virginia public colleges at schev.edu. It is a state site. Look under research and publications -> research and statistics.
There is even a report on historical admissions stats going back to 2004. I think what you'll find is majority of applications come from OOS, but acceptance rate and yield are lower. OOS cost is close to private alternatives. In-state acceptance rate is actually higher than most people realize. It averaged about 44% from 2004-2017 and was 45.2% in 2017. UVA and W&M are actually the only two Virginia schools that average under 50% in-state acceptance. UVA has averaged about 45% over the same time period and was at 40.3% in 2017. The SCHEV site doesn't have 2018 data yet, but it should be in the Common Data Set by now.
With in-state applicants, I think there is a lot of self-selection in that typically only higher stat (good standardized tests and GPAs) kids apply. This is probably with input from guidance counselors.
Anonymous
01/25/2019 00:18
Subject: William & Mary Admissions by Residency and Gender
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Historical totals:
Not exactly the trend lines the Board of Visitors would want to see.
Yield rates are down at most schools over this time period because students apply to more schools. (Schools like Harvard and Stanford buck the trend.) UVA yield rate declined 10.5 percentage points over the same period. At Doctoral institutions, average yield declined from 37.3% in 2007 to 30.3% in 2014.
Notre Dame (not exactly Harvard or Stanford):
2013: 52.6%
2014: 53.1%
2015: 55.8%
2016: 56.0%
2017: 55.4%
2018: 57.4%
The missing piece is that as a private school. Notre Dame probably spends more money than a public on yielding their admitted students.
Um, you forgot to mention that ND is a much more desired school than W&M. https://www.parchment.com/c/college/tools/college-cross-admit-comparison.php?compare=University+of+Notre+Dame&with=College+of+William+and+Mary
For many who apply also to elite schools, W&M is just a safety.
Why with all the problems with the Catholic church would any parent send their kid to a Catholic University when there are 5,399 others to pick. And in South Bend? And at $72K a year in after-tax dollars????
Nobody has ever said it better than Lou Holtz: "Those who know Notre Dame, no explanation’s necessary. Those who don’t, no explanation will suffice."
How did Notre Dame get interjected into this thread? Did it move to the DC area?
Anonymous
01/24/2019 18:01
Subject: William & Mary Admissions by Residency and Gender
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:It has a reputation as not being a very "fun" school.
But ranked #1 for happiest students in Princeton Review based on survey data.
That’s from the Best 380 whatever book. It’s based on some surveys, not really systematic data. How many W&M students filled out those surveys?
Retention rate and alumni giving are more indicative of overall student happiness. Those stats don’t rely on students filling out a survey.
OK. W&M has the highest alumni giving rate among national public universities and the 2nd highest 4 year graduation rate among national public universities.
It's also the top public university in ratings of "professor interesting" and "professor accessible"
http://www.thecollegesolution.com/colleges-with-the-best-and-worst-professors/
Now you are back to confusing survey data with comprehensive data. Survey data isn’t all that interesting if you don’t know how many people were surveyed or how.
But still:
#1 in alumni giving rate for public national universities (USNews)
#2 in 4 year graduation rate for public universities
Based on Princeton Review survey data (granted this is Princeton Review's survey methodology per the point made by the poster above):
#1 Happiest Students
#2 Students Love their Colleges
#2 Lots of Race/Class Interactions
#5 Most beautiful campus
#8 Best Quality of Life
#1 among state universities in Professor Interesting rating (Also Princeton Review)
#1 among state universities in Professor Accessible rating
Some of this must be somewhat OK.
Anonymous
01/24/2019 16:49
Subject: William & Mary Admissions by Residency and Gender
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:It has a reputation as not being a very "fun" school.
But ranked #1 for happiest students in Princeton Review based on survey data.
That’s from the Best 380 whatever book. It’s based on some surveys, not really systematic data. How many W&M students filled out those surveys?
Retention rate and alumni giving are more indicative of overall student happiness. Those stats don’t rely on students filling out a survey.
OK. W&M has the highest alumni giving rate among national public universities and the 2nd highest 4 year graduation rate among national public universities.
It's also the top public university in ratings of "professor interesting" and "professor accessible"
http://www.thecollegesolution.com/colleges-with-the-best-and-worst-professors/
Now you are back to confusing survey data with comprehensive data. Survey data isn’t all that interesting if you don’t know how many people were surveyed or how.
Anonymous
01/24/2019 15:51
Subject: William & Mary Admissions by Residency and Gender
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Historical totals:
Not exactly the trend lines the Board of Visitors would want to see.
Yield rates are down at most schools over this time period because students apply to more schools. (Schools like Harvard and Stanford buck the trend.) UVA yield rate declined 10.5 percentage points over the same period. At Doctoral institutions, average yield declined from 37.3% in 2007 to 30.3% in 2014.
Notre Dame (not exactly Harvard or Stanford):
2013: 52.6%
2014: 53.1%
2015: 55.8%
2016: 56.0%
2017: 55.4%
2018: 57.4%
The missing piece is that as a private school. Notre Dame probably spends more money than a public on yielding their admitted students.
Um, you forgot to mention that ND is a much more desired school than W&M. https://www.parchment.com/c/college/tools/college-cross-admit-comparison.php?compare=University+of+Notre+Dame&with=College+of+William+and+Mary
For many who apply also to elite schools, W&M is just a safety.
Why with all the problems with the Catholic church would any parent send their kid to a Catholic University when there are 5,399 others to pick. And in South Bend? And at $72K a year in after-tax dollars????
Nobody has ever said it better than Lou Holtz: "Those who know Notre Dame, no explanation’s necessary. Those who don’t, no explanation will suffice."
Anonymous
01/24/2019 15:34
Subject: William & Mary Admissions by Residency and Gender
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:It has a reputation as not being a very "fun" school.
But ranked #1 for happiest students in Princeton Review based on survey data.
That’s from the Best 380 whatever book. It’s based on some surveys, not really systematic data. How many W&M students filled out those surveys?
Retention rate and alumni giving are more indicative of overall student happiness. Those stats don’t rely on students filling out a survey.
OK. W&M has the highest alumni giving rate among national public universities and the 2nd highest 4 year graduation rate among national public universities.
It's also the top public university in ratings of "professor interesting" and "professor accessible"
http://www.thecollegesolution.com/colleges-with-the-best-and-worst-professors/
Anonymous
01/24/2019 15:25
Subject: William & Mary Admissions by Residency and Gender
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:It has a reputation as not being a very "fun" school.
But ranked #1 for happiest students in Princeton Review based on survey data.
That’s from the Best 380 whatever book. It’s based on some surveys, not really systematic data. How many W&M students filled out those surveys?
Retention rate and alumni giving are more indicative of overall student happiness. Those stats don’t rely on students filling out a survey.
OK. W&M has the highest alumni giving rate among national public universities and the 2nd highest 4 year graduation rate among national public universities.
Anonymous
01/24/2019 15:23
Subject: William & Mary Admissions by Residency and Gender
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Historical totals:
Not exactly the trend lines the Board of Visitors would want to see.
Yield rates are down at most schools over this time period because students apply to more schools. (Schools like Harvard and Stanford buck the trend.) UVA yield rate declined 10.5 percentage points over the same period. At Doctoral institutions, average yield declined from 37.3% in 2007 to 30.3% in 2014.
Notre Dame (not exactly Harvard or Stanford):
2013: 52.6%
2014: 53.1%
2015: 55.8%
2016: 56.0%
2017: 55.4%
2018: 57.4%
The missing piece is that as a private school. Notre Dame probably spends more money than a public on yielding their admitted students.
Um, you forgot to mention that ND is a much more desired school than W&M. https://www.parchment.com/c/college/tools/college-cross-admit-comparison.php?compare=University+of+Notre+Dame&with=College+of+William+and+Mary
For many who apply also to elite schools, W&M is just a safety.
Um, let's be clear and fair, against highly elite schools (e.g. HYPSM etc.), ALL schools in Virginia (UVA, W&M, W&L, Richmond) are usually safeties and backups.
You cite a cross-admit rate from Parchment with Notre Dame (88% choose ND, 12% W&M). The cross-admit rate of Notre Dame with UVA is 85% Notre Dame, 15% UVA. (W&L is 76%/24% in favor of Notre Dame). Looking more broadly: Duke is 88/12 vs UVA, 77/23 vs W&M, and 67/23 vs W&L. Princeton is 94/6 vs UVA, 72/28 vs W&M, 67/33 vs W&L. Harvard is 75/25 vs UVA, 77/23 vs W&M, and 78/22 vs W&L. Stanford is 87/13 vs UVA, 67/33 vs W&M, and 60/40 vs W&L. Yale is 79/21 vs UVA, 60/40 vs W&M, 72/28 vs W&L.
Cross admits with top schools and the Virginia schools are probably typically enticed to attend the Virginia schools only through merit or athletic scholarships. W&L has much broader merit aid than either UVA or W&M.
Anonymous
01/24/2019 15:02
Subject: William & Mary Admissions by Residency and Gender
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Historical totals:
Not exactly the trend lines the Board of Visitors would want to see.
Yield rates are down at most schools over this time period because students apply to more schools. (Schools like Harvard and Stanford buck the trend.) UVA yield rate declined 10.5 percentage points over the same period. At Doctoral institutions, average yield declined from 37.3% in 2007 to 30.3% in 2014.
Notre Dame (not exactly Harvard or Stanford):
2013: 52.6%
2014: 53.1%
2015: 55.8%
2016: 56.0%
2017: 55.4%
2018: 57.4%
The missing piece is that as a private school. Notre Dame probably spends more money than a public on yielding their admitted students.
Um, you forgot to mention that ND is a much more desired school than W&M. https://www.parchment.com/c/college/tools/college-cross-admit-comparison.php?compare=University+of+Notre+Dame&with=College+of+William+and+Mary
For many who apply also to elite schools, W&M is just a safety.
Um, let's be clear and fair, against highly elite schools (e.g. HYPSM etc.), ALL schools in Virginia (UVA, W&M, W&L, Richmond) are usually safeties and backups.
You cite a cross-admit rate from Parchment with Notre Dame (88% choose ND, 12% W&M). The cross-admit rate of Notre Dame with UVA is 85% Notre Dame, 15% UVA. (W&L is 76%/24% in favor of Notre Dame). Looking more broadly: Duke is 88/12 vs UVA, 77/23 vs W&M, and 67/23 vs W&L. Princeton is 94/6 vs UVA, 72/28 vs W&M, 67/33 vs W&L. Harvard is 75/25 vs UVA, 77/23 vs W&M, and 78/22 vs W&L. Stanford is 87/13 vs UVA, 67/33 vs W&M, and 60/40 vs W&L. Yale is 79/21 vs UVA, 60/40 vs W&M, 72/28 vs W&L.