Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I used to work at a DC university in public health about three years ago. They hired assistant profs at $85-$95 and most with tenure weren't earning much above $115k. A few rockstars out of many earned closer to $200k. The state research university I worked at in the midwest had tenured people at the END of their careers earning $120k max (most were in the $80k range).

You have to really love the subject matter (or like not having to dress a particular way), because you'll never be rich being a professor.

I should add that the state research university I worked/studied at was in the economics department. So the idea that fresh new grads come out at $125-175k as assistant professors is laughable. The people I went to grad school with now have tenure and teach at middling public universities. They earn about $100k.

Picking a state university I have no affiliation with, the University of Illinois last published a comprehensive list of faculty salaries in 2016. At the time, there were ten assistant professors of economics, all making between $130K and $133K. The top full professor makes $243K. Higher-ranked departments and those at private universities pay more.

Your anecdotes to the contrary are not relevant.

And your cherry picking a random school to support your point isn't really relevant either. You do realize there are THOUSANDS of universities with economics professors. Illinois is #29. The number of universities who pay less than Illinois is probably greater than the number who pay more.

I will represent to you based on personal experience on both sides of the economics job market that Illinois’ starting salary is typical for state universities, and that elite programs pay much more. The private sector (e.g., litigation consulting) can pay more than $200K to fresh PhDs at the high end. The low end of the profession (“directional” state schools without PhD programs, poor-middling liberal arts colleges) indeed pay less, although starting at $80-90K at such a place is entirely reasonable, and they top out slightly into six figures.

Outside of economics, some fields pay even more, some about the same, and some much less. Other posters are correct that options outside of academia are strongly correlated with academic salary.

Oh hey Mr. Economist! Did you know there is actually ... data on this? Median Salary nationwide for post-secondary economics teachers is $98k. of course this varies a lot regionally. In Virginia the median is 90K and the low is 41k and the high is 200k. So to say that 100K plus is "typical" is clearly incorrect. https://www.onetonline.org/link/details/25-1063.00

This has detailed survey information on salaries for new econ PhDs in the 2015-2016 market (tables 6-7, figures 6-7). Per table 7, all PhD-granting departments paid an average of $121K, a min of 83K, and a max of $182K to new PhDs. Top 30 institutions paid an average of $140K, a min of $110K, and a max of $182K. Bachelors and masters granting universities paid an average of $89K, a min of $67K, and a max of $120K to fresh PhDs. The last group of jobs includes both top liberal arts schools (which would be at the top of the distribution) and places you have never heard of (which would be at the bottom). My experience has been that while the places you have never heard of are perfectly fine jobs, they are competing for the bottom of the distribution of new PhDs, i.e. competent teachers from lower-ranked PhD programs who are not promising researchers.

Your survey includes anyone who describes themselves as an "economics teacher." This includes lecturers, adjuncts, and community college instructors. These positions often do not even require PhDs, and invariably require only teaching (which is easy, and so does not pay well) and no research (which is hard, and pays very well). That said, even ignoring this bottom segment of the profession, your data indicate that half of all people who consider themselves to be economics teachers make more than $100K, so I'm not sure what point you see your link as advancing.

Anecdata:

I was recently an Asst. Prof. in a social sciences field at a VA state R1.

Starting salary: $75k, 12-month NTT appointment as a director of a lab
9-month Asst. Profs on the TT in my dept. came in at ~55-60k

I got that job after several YEARS on the market, and with several years of professional experience under my belt. If you want to know crazy, you should hear how effed up the academic job market truly is. It just doesn’t compare to any other industry—although I’ve most accurately heard it compared to the NFL draft.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Associate professors are creeping into the mid $200s now too, non-tenure track, and fresh out of PhD. Part of this is salary creep when mixed with an egalitarian university environment. When you pay $1m+ for the big name ‘vanity professors’ the folks that teach the rest of the core classes can’t be too many multiples off or you’d not be able to staff the courses.

What? Please tell me where non-tenure track newly PhD professors are getting 200k as a starting salary? Maybe in Finance, but not anywhere else, surely. I know a true superstar humanities professor at a truly top school, and he got a bit more than $200k to move there, after he had already had tenure elsewhere for 4-5 years.

DP. Don’t you know that associate professors are usually tenure track and, in some instances, have tenure? Throw in sabbaticals and summers off sometimes (yes, summers off—my parents are tenured professors) and it’s a darn fine job. Good luck getting one, though. Many are staying on through their 80s. There’s an odd, felt need among some people (see, e.g., this thread) to downplay the increased money many professors have been getting for quite some time now. It’s like some folks need to believe they are underpaid.

My aunt is a tenured professor of nursing at a state U in Texas. She was making 157K, 5 years ago and has mentioned at least one raise since then. She has no intention of retiring anytime soon.

Anonymous wrote:Associate professors are creeping into the mid $200s now too, non-tenure track, and fresh out of PhD. Part of this is salary creep when mixed with an egalitarian university environment. When you pay $1m+ for the big name ‘vanity professors’ the folks that teach the rest of the core classes can’t be too many multiples off or you’d not be able to staff the courses.

What? Please tell me where non-tenure track newly PhD professors are getting 200k as a starting salary? Maybe in Finance, but not anywhere else, surely. I know a true superstar humanities professor at a truly top school, and he got a bit more than $200k to move there, after he had already had tenure elsewhere for 4-5 years.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I used to work at a DC university in public health about three years ago. They hired assistant profs at $85-$95 and most with tenure weren't earning much above $115k. A few rockstars out of many earned closer to $200k. The state research university I worked at in the midwest had tenured people at the END of their careers earning $120k max (most were in the $80k range).

You have to really love the subject matter (or like not having to dress a particular way), because you'll never be rich being a professor.

I should add that the state research university I worked/studied at was in the economics department. So the idea that fresh new grads come out at $125-175k as assistant professors is laughable. The people I went to grad school with now have tenure and teach at middling public universities. They earn about $100k.

Picking a state university I have no affiliation with, the University of Illinois last published a comprehensive list of faculty salaries in 2016. At the time, there were ten assistant professors of economics, all making between $130K and $133K. The top full professor makes $243K. Higher-ranked departments and those at private universities pay more.

Your anecdotes to the contrary are not relevant.

And your cherry picking a random school to support your point isn't really relevant either. You do realize there are THOUSANDS of universities with economics professors. Illinois is #29. The number of universities who pay less than Illinois is probably greater than the number who pay more.

I will represent to you based on personal experience on both sides of the economics job market that Illinois’ starting salary is typical for state universities, and that elite programs pay much more. The private sector (e.g., litigation consulting) can pay more than $200K to fresh PhDs at the high end. The low end of the profession (“directional” state schools without PhD programs, poor-middling liberal arts colleges) indeed pay less, although starting at $80-90K at such a place is entirely reasonable, and they top out slightly into six figures.

Outside of economics, some fields pay even more, some about the same, and some much less. Other posters are correct that options outside of academia are strongly correlated with academic salary.

Oh hey Mr. Economist! Did you know there is actually ... data on this? Median Salary nationwide for post-secondary economics teachers is $98k. of course this varies a lot regionally. In Virginia the median is 90K and the low is 41k and the high is 200k. So to say that 100K plus is "typical" is clearly incorrect. https://www.onetonline.org/link/details/25-1063.00

I have an PhD in international relations and have many friends w/IR or political science PhDs in academia. These jobs don't pay what you'd think - and they don't pay what you can make with the same degree in a DC type job (govt/think tank/lobbying/etc.) I don't where it's at now, but I knew someone teaching at a highly regarded private university in DC whose salary was well under $100k. Now, as a PP noted, once you're tenured you've got a job for life, and other perks like tuition remission for your kids. But still, it's not a bonanza. And these are the lucky ones. Many, many PhDs can't find a permanent job in academia - that's the downside of tenure, no one ever retires or gets fired - and lots of others are forced to go places they would never have considered when they dreamed of becoming a professor. You'd be amazed at how many fancy PhDs are at decidedly non-fancy schools. It's a tough profession.

Associate professors are creeping into the mid $200s now too, non-tenure track, and fresh out of PhD. Part of this is salary creep when mixed with an egalitarian university environment. When you pay $1m+ for the big name ‘vanity professors’ the folks that teach the rest of the core classes can’t be too many multiples off or you’d not be able to staff the courses.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I used to work at a DC university in public health about three years ago. They hired assistant profs at $85-$95 and most with tenure weren't earning much above $115k. A few rockstars out of many earned closer to $200k. The state research university I worked at in the midwest had tenured people at the END of their careers earning $120k max (most were in the $80k range).

You have to really love the subject matter (or like not having to dress a particular way), because you'll never be rich being a professor.

I should add that the state research university I worked/studied at was in the economics department. So the idea that fresh new grads come out at $125-175k as assistant professors is laughable. The people I went to grad school with now have tenure and teach at middling public universities. They earn about $100k.

Picking a state university I have no affiliation with, the University of Illinois last published a comprehensive list of faculty salaries in 2016. At the time, there were ten assistant professors of economics, all making between $130K and $133K. The top full professor makes $243K. Higher-ranked departments and those at private universities pay more.

Your anecdotes to the contrary are not relevant.

And your cherry picking a random school to support your point isn't really relevant either. You do realize there are THOUSANDS of universities with economics professors. Illinois is #29. The number of universities who pay less than Illinois is probably greater than the number who pay more.

I will represent to you based on personal experience on both sides of the economics job market that Illinois’ starting salary is typical for state universities, and that elite programs pay much more. The private sector (e.g., litigation consulting) can pay more than $200K to fresh PhDs at the high end. The low end of the profession (“directional” state schools without PhD programs, poor-middling liberal arts colleges) indeed pay less, although starting at $80-90K at such a place is entirely reasonable, and they top out slightly into six figures.

Outside of economics, some fields pay even more, some about the same, and some much less. Other posters are correct that options outside of academia are strongly correlated with academic salary.

Anonymous wrote:i actually like this thread - different from the typical what is your net worth ones. Thanks for posting these salaries and the discussion has been great.

I agree! Interesting topic.

i actually like this thread - different from the typical what is your net worth ones. Thanks for posting these salaries and the discussion has been great.

Professors in the sciences/law/business at private universities make very high salaries.

--married to one

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I used to work at a DC university in public health about three years ago. They hired assistant profs at $85-$95 and most with tenure weren't earning much above $115k. A few rockstars out of many earned closer to $200k. The state research university I worked at in the midwest had tenured people at the END of their careers earning $120k max (most were in the $80k range).

You have to really love the subject matter (or like not having to dress a particular way), because you'll never be rich being a professor.

I should add that the state research university I worked/studied at was in the economics department. So the idea that fresh new grads come out at $125-175k as assistant professors is laughable. The people I went to grad school with now have tenure and teach at middling public universities. They earn about $100k.

Picking a state university I have no affiliation with, the University of Illinois last published a comprehensive list of faculty salaries in 2016. At the time, there were ten assistant professors of economics, all making between $130K and $133K. The top full professor makes $243K. Higher-ranked departments and those at private universities pay more.

Your anecdotes to the contrary are not relevant.

And your cherry picking a random school to support your point isn't really relevant either. You do realize there are THOUSANDS of universities with economics professors. Illinois is #29. The number of universities who pay less than Illinois is probably greater than the number who pay more.

Anonymous wrote:Wow all the salaries on the right.

http://data.richmond.com/salaries/2014/state/george-mason-university/sushil-jajodia

They don'y have a football team at GMU, or you'd really be shocked at how much Big State U football coaches are paid.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I used to work at a DC university in public health about three years ago. They hired assistant profs at $85-$95 and most with tenure weren't earning much above $115k. A few rockstars out of many earned closer to $200k. The state research university I worked at in the midwest had tenured people at the END of their careers earning $120k max (most were in the $80k range).

You have to really love the subject matter (or like not having to dress a particular way), because you'll never be rich being a professor.

I should add that the state research university I worked/studied at was in the economics department. So the idea that fresh new grads come out at $125-175k as assistant professors is laughable. The people I went to grad school with now have tenure and teach at middling public universities. They earn about $100k.

Picking a state university I have no affiliation with, the University of Illinois last published a comprehensive list of faculty salaries in 2016. At the time, there were ten assistant professors of economics, all making between $130K and $133K. The top full professor makes $243K. Higher-ranked departments and those at private universities pay more.

Your anecdotes to the contrary are not relevant.

There is a big difference between professors in fields like business/econ/accounting and humanities fields. Those in the former could easily leave academia and go make 2-3x the listed salaries. That's why schools pay them so much, because they would have a difficult time getting strong professors if the salaries were lower. Humanities, not so much. Academia is really the only realistic option for a PhD in medieval literature or history.

This. A friend is 30 and starting his PhD in German literature after various masters etc. in related fields. Every employer he ever interviews with has the upper hand bc what is a 35 yr old with higher degrees in German lit going to do if not work at a university?? They need to pay him no more than 50-60k and they'd be doing HIM a favor. This isn't like a finance prof who can leave tomorrow for a hedge fund or even a regular business job.