Anonymous wrote:Swimming is an individual sport with an artificial team structure imposed on it. You can impose such a structure on almost anything, but it doesn't make it a team sport. The Ryder cup players are playing on a golf team. They work in union with one another. Golf is still not a team sport. Same with swimming. Creating a team structure/competition/relays is just a way to include more kids in the individual sport, and train them as a group rather than individuals.

Teams are ranked by the scores of the kids. There is more to it than just the individual and even relays. That then determines who you compete against. Better teams compete against other better teams.

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Anonymous wrote:Meh. My kids play baseball, basketball, soccer, field hockey. Those are true team sports. They also do gymnastics, diving, track and field and swimming - those are individual sports to me with a strong team element. You care about your team and it is great when you win but the important thing at the end of the day seems to be individual performance more. Though when my daughter's team won track she was very happy that her finish helped push them over the line.

Impossible for your kids to do all those seriously unless some do some and other do others. Or your kids dabble and aren’t serious about any or most of them b

Oh my goodness are you the insufferable about everything or just the sports and leisure activities of children?

NP. I agree with pp that a kid who is on the swim team for 3 years straight, competes in meets, goes to morning practice and participates in Winter Swim.....is probably on more of a team sport than the dabbler who tries every sport out there.

FWIW, both of my kids have both dabbled at times and participated in team sports at times. It's all good.

So, I'm the meh poster...thanks to the one who said they were insufferable First - I didn't realize they had to be hardcore about it to be able to tell whether it is a team sport or not? And I have multiple children so while no one is going to the Olympics - my kids are on competitive teams for these: gymnsatics, diving (make All Stars every summer), swimming - same always divisionals/All Stars during summer - swim and dive at a lighter level during winter to "keep up". baseball and soccer.

Yikes! I just think that with soccer your team is so critical to your individual success. While the team is important in swimming and gymnastics - not the same. Diving really just feells like a cheer squad - which is good!

They don't have to be hardcore about it at all. But the team dynamics are going to vary a lot when you are a dabbler vs an established team member.

God help us. Not that I'm religious at all. And I get that the dynamics are different with dabbler vs. established team member. Were you reading when I said my kids made both Divisionals and All Stars for swimming and diving? Yes, they are mainly summer swimmers but they are very entrenched on their summer swim team - and they are middle school age so this has been going on for a while. My whole point - team element yes but NOT truly a team sport in the way that soccer, baseball and others are. There you are so dependent on your teammates. But the attitude of this one swim parent just astonishes me. Personally, I lvoe that my kids are diversified...we don't get so wrapped up in one thing we can't see beyond it!

What are you ranting about? Swim parents are not these horrible people like you are saying. Our kids enjoy one sport and we know its best to specialize in one so they are successful. You are bragging like your kid does year round swim and multiple sports. You forget that even your summer swim team is ranked and that is by the entire team and the points/scores/swim times that the kids get. There are different rankings and divisions and your kids swim with better teams if they get the higher rankings. Therefore, it is both individual and team. Summer swim is not being a swimmer. That is a dabbler. They may be an established team member but most of the summer teams take anyone in less they are a larger one and can only have so many kids. If kids do too many sports and not focus, they are just marginal at all. Some of our kids actually just choose one and really enjoy it. I don't force my child to go. They choose to go and get upset on days we don't go as they really enjoy it. Swim parents are generally very supportive of each other and the kids, unlike I found in soccer and other sports we tried.

Swimming is an individual sport with an artificial team structure imposed on it. You can impose such a structure on almost anything, but it doesn't make it a team sport. The Ryder cup players are playing on a golf team. They work in union with one another. Golf is still not a team sport. Same with swimming. Creating a team structure/competition/relays is just a way to include more kids in the individual sport, and train them as a group rather than individuals.

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Anonymous wrote:It’s like tennis. There may technically be a tennis team, and sometimes they play in doubles, and they practice together, but they don’t need the team in order to function as a competitive tennis player. It’s not the same as soccer, football, basketball, lacrosse, etc., where you need to play with a team to play the sport at all.

In swimming, your individual scores add up to a win/lose for the team you're on. Yes, you get your own individual times, too, but it's the collective performance of everyone on the team that amounts to a win.

There are gifted athletes on Football teams that might be real standouts - maybe they run in the most touchdowns in a game. But they will not win the game all by themselves.

No, because they can't PLAY the game by themselves. unlike swimmers. If you want to include relays, fine, but they are always individual swimmers first and relayers second.

At the end of the day though? Call it whatever you want, no one will care. Your child may swim for life, because they can, its not a team sport. My kid, if they want to play soccer for life, will have to join a team to do so. Different. (and I use my kid theoretically as my kids swim)

It's not "if you want to include relays," nimrod. Swim meets are scored by a set series of events, which ALWAYS include relays. You can't decide to have, say, a sanctioned high school sectional with just individual events.

When you find yourself calling people names over extremely trivial disagreements about kids’ sports it might be time for a bit of introspection.

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Anonymous wrote:Meh. My kids play baseball, basketball, soccer, field hockey. Those are true team sports. They also do gymnastics, diving, track and field and swimming - those are individual sports to me with a strong team element. You care about your team and it is great when you win but the important thing at the end of the day seems to be individual performance more. Though when my daughter's team won track she was very happy that her finish helped push them over the line.

Impossible for your kids to do all those seriously unless some do some and other do others. Or your kids dabble and aren’t serious about any or most of them b

Oh my goodness are you the insufferable about everything or just the sports and leisure activities of children?

NP. I agree with pp that a kid who is on the swim team for 3 years straight, competes in meets, goes to morning practice and participates in Winter Swim.....is probably on more of a team sport than the dabbler who tries every sport out there.

FWIW, both of my kids have both dabbled at times and participated in team sports at times. It's all good.

So, I'm the meh poster...thanks to the one who said they were insufferable First - I didn't realize they had to be hardcore about it to be able to tell whether it is a team sport or not? And I have multiple children so while no one is going to the Olympics - my kids are on competitive teams for these: gymnsatics, diving (make All Stars every summer), swimming - same always divisionals/All Stars during summer - swim and dive at a lighter level during winter to "keep up". baseball and soccer.

Yikes! I just think that with soccer your team is so critical to your individual success. While the team is important in swimming and gymnastics - not the same. Diving really just feells like a cheer squad - which is good!

They don't have to be hardcore about it at all. But the team dynamics are going to vary a lot when you are a dabbler vs an established team member.

God help us. Not that I'm religious at all. And I get that the dynamics are different with dabbler vs. established team member. Were you reading when I said my kids made both Divisionals and All Stars for swimming and diving? Yes, they are mainly summer swimmers but they are very entrenched on their summer swim team - and they are middle school age so this has been going on for a while. My whole point - team element yes but NOT truly a team sport in the way that soccer, baseball and others are. There you are so dependent on your teammates. But the attitude of this one swim parent just astonishes me. Personally, I lvoe that my kids are diversified...we don't get so wrapped up in one thing we can't see beyond it!

No they don’t. Not with year round swimming.

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Anonymous wrote:It’s like tennis. There may technically be a tennis team, and sometimes they play in doubles, and they practice together, but they don’t need the team in order to function as a competitive tennis player. It’s not the same as soccer, football, basketball, lacrosse, etc., where you need to play with a team to play the sport at all.

In swimming, your individual scores add up to a win/lose for the team you're on. Yes, you get your own individual times, too, but it's the collective performance of everyone on the team that amounts to a win.

There are gifted athletes on Football teams that might be real standouts - maybe they run in the most touchdowns in a game. But they will not win the game all by themselves.

No, because they can't PLAY the game by themselves. unlike swimmers. If you want to include relays, fine, but they are always individual swimmers first and relayers second.

At the end of the day though? Call it whatever you want, no one will care. Your child may swim for life, because they can, its not a team sport. My kid, if they want to play soccer for life, will have to join a team to do so. Different. (and I use my kid theoretically as my kids swim)

It's not "if you want to include relays," nimrod. Swim meets are scored by a set series of events, which ALWAYS include relays. You can't decide to have, say, a sanctioned high school sectional with just individual events.

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Anonymous wrote:So if a runner is out running they are playing a team sport? Its just when its in a race that they need others around (or a meet), or else it isn't a team sport? That seems inane.

If a runner is out running the neighborhood by himself he is exercising. If the runner is actually running in a track meet, he is running on a team.

How is this even hard to understand? Really...it is not that complicated.

So if he is running in a race, lets say a 5K, is he running or not running?

This is silly!

If he is running a 5K as an individual competitor he is running but he is not competing in a team sport.

If he is running in a 5K as part of track team meet then he is running on team.

It really is not that hard.

Its pretty hard. I mean, you say "is baseball a team sport?" and every human says YES. You have just broken running into exercise, competition, and team sport. You've distinguished when one is doing one vs the other, even when doing the exact same thing (running). So, its a little harder than it has to be, don't you think?

How about we just say to questions like, is swimming a team sport or is cheerleading a sport.......

SURE! Whatever you want.

When my son is outside practicing his batting or fielding by himself he is not playing a team sport even though he is building his skills in order to play well on his team. When my son is outside swimming laps in the pool by himself he is honing his skills to swim well in his team meet.

When a professional football player goes outside in his backyard and throws the ball around with his buddies for the fun of it, he is playing with his friends not playing on a team.

Anonymous wrote:Competitive swimming is a very individual activity; more so than track as the crowd plays a less significant role (from the perspective of the swimmer).

My teammates, even those on relays, were and are good friends; in the pool, however, they were more training partners than true teammates.

At the same time, those meets could not have happened without your teammates participating in them. You were reliant on your teammates to make those events happen.

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Anonymous wrote:So if a runner is out running they are playing a team sport? Its just when its in a race that they need others around (or a meet), or else it isn't a team sport? That seems inane.

If a runner is out running the neighborhood by himself he is exercising. If the runner is actually running in a track meet, he is running on a team.

How is this even hard to understand? Really...it is not that complicated.

So if he is running in a race, lets say a 5K, is he running or not running?

This is silly!

If he is running a 5K as an individual competitor he is running but he is not competing in a team sport.

If he is running in a 5K as part of track team meet then he is running on team.

It really is not that hard.

Its pretty hard. I mean, you say "is baseball a team sport?" and every human says YES. You have just broken running into exercise, competition, and team sport. You've distinguished when one is doing one vs the other, even when doing the exact same thing (running). So, its a little harder than it has to be, don't you think?

How about we just say to questions like, is swimming a team sport or is cheerleading a sport.......

SURE! Whatever you want.

In the summer, maybe. Most of the winter club teams around here are so big that many swimmers never compete on a relay. It might feel like more of a team sport on a smaller team, but the big teams don't feel that way at all.

Competitive swimming is a very individual activity; more so than track as the crowd plays a less significant role (from the perspective of the swimmer).

My teammates, even those on relays, were and are good friends; in the pool, however, they were more training partners than true teammates.

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Anonymous wrote:So if a runner is out running they are playing a team sport? Its just when its in a race that they need others around (or a meet), or else it isn't a team sport? That seems inane.

If a runner is out running the neighborhood by himself he is exercising. If the runner is actually running in a track meet, he is running on a team.

How is this even hard to understand? Really...it is not that complicated.

So if he is running in a race, lets say a 5K, is he running or not running?

This is silly!

If he is running a 5K as an individual competitor he is running but he is not competing in a team sport.

If he is running in a 5K as part of track team meet then he is running on team.

It really is not that hard.

If you're doing it as part of a team, yes, it's a team sport. There is the practicing together where teammates help each other out to improve, and the fact that your time doesn't just count for you, it counts for your team. If you slack off and have a crappy race, that doesn't just hurt you, it hurts everyone else out there who gave it a full effort and did their best. In fact, I think swimming arguably teaches some critical teamwork skills that other types of team sports don't do as well. It's easier to stay focused and trying your hardest when you're, say, out on a soccer field and can see in the moment that you're letting your teammate down if you don't hustle down the field so he has someone to pass to. Something like swim forces you to really internalize that your contributions to the team aren't just about your direct interactions with your team, but are also everything you do individually that ends up affecting the team's outcome, directly or indirectly.

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Anonymous wrote:Meh. My kids play baseball, basketball, soccer, field hockey. Those are true team sports. They also do gymnastics, diving, track and field and swimming - those are individual sports to me with a strong team element. You care about your team and it is great when you win but the important thing at the end of the day seems to be individual performance more. Though when my daughter's team won track she was very happy that her finish helped push them over the line.

You clearly don't get swim. Your kids sound like they dabble and don't specialize. After about 7-8, the only good way to get proficient at a sport is to specialize in that sport and focus on it. Most swimmers are going 3-4-5 days a week swim. There is no way your kids can do all those sports at the same time more than an hour a week. To say your kids swim, ok a swim lesson or a predevelopment class is very different from team. Same with diving and gymnastics. Or, your kids do diving/swim at the summer pool which is very different than year round swim. Swim, like other sports is a huge parental committment.

SHE HAS MORE THAN ONE KID.


Swim parents are the worst, seriously. If you have to be a lingual contortionist just to tell us that you spend a lot of money so that your child can be okay at something that IS A sport, it probably isn't.