Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This particular story is so deeply disturbing, I can't believe there are still fraternities on Penn State campus...honestly.

Imagine being his brother and knowing you were just minutes away if anyone would've bothered to call you. And I can't even bring myself to imagine being his parents.

I hope everyone one of the frat members who ignored his obvious injuries and medical issues and those who tried to cover up what happened are thrown in jail for a long, long time. These are exactly the types of sociopaths who go on to become a$$h0l3 bosses and politicians destroying society.

This story is especially horrific. But imagine if your kid was sitting in his dorm room studying all night. His good friend and roommate (19 years old) came home from a party, passed out on the bed and began choking on his own vomit.

Your kid runs over and tries to help his buddy as best as he can. Then he starts to debate....should he call 911 knowing that his roommate will very likely get into big trouble over this (maybe expelled or even arrested for underage drinking) or should he wait and watch hoping that his friend will sleep it off and be o.k. in the morning?

What would you advise your kid to do in that situation?

No brainer for me. Alive > expulsion. My kid should call 911.

O.k. Now your kid is the one who is passed out. His friend turns him on his side so that he won't choke on his vomit. Do you want the friend to call 911 or should the friend wait, watch and see if he'll sleep it off?

I don't know why you think this is a hard question, from either perspective. If my kid is blackout drunk and vomiting such that calling 911 is on the table, I want someone to call 911. If my kid's roommate is blackout drunk and vomiting such that calling 911 is on the table, my kid knows to call 911. Better safe than ACTUALLY DEAD. Jeez.

It's not that I find the question so hard to answer exactly. It's just that it is more complicated than it may appear. Kids have to make a judgement call - knowing that there is a fairly slim chance that their friend will not sleep it off (more than likely the kid will be o.k.) it may be hard to choose calling 911 if they think that there is a 100% chance that their friend could get into big trouble (arrested/kicked out of school).

As a parent, I can totally see wanting the kid to err on the side of caution in both situations. But as a former college student who saw plenty of kids get black out drunk/sick/passed out and live to tell about it....I know that the thought processes of a college friend are not necessarily going to be the same as a parent's thought processes.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This particular story is so deeply disturbing, I can't believe there are still fraternities on Penn State campus...honestly.

Imagine being his brother and knowing you were just minutes away if anyone would've bothered to call you. And I can't even bring myself to imagine being his parents.

I hope everyone one of the frat members who ignored his obvious injuries and medical issues and those who tried to cover up what happened are thrown in jail for a long, long time. These are exactly the types of sociopaths who go on to become a$$h0l3 bosses and politicians destroying society.

This story is especially horrific. But imagine if your kid was sitting in his dorm room studying all night. His good friend and roommate (19 years old) came home from a party, passed out on the bed and began choking on his own vomit.

Your kid runs over and tries to help his buddy as best as he can. Then he starts to debate....should he call 911 knowing that his roommate will very likely get into big trouble over this (maybe expelled or even arrested for underage drinking) or should he wait and watch hoping that his friend will sleep it off and be o.k. in the morning?

What would you advise your kid to do in that situation?

No brainer for me. Alive > expulsion. My kid should call 911.

O.k. Now your kid is the one who is passed out. His friend turns him on his side so that he won't choke on his vomit. Do you want the friend to call 911 or should the friend wait, watch and see if he'll sleep it off?

I don't know why you think this is a hard question, from either perspective. If my kid is blackout drunk and vomiting such that calling 911 is on the table, I want someone to call 911. If my kid's roommate is blackout drunk and vomiting such that calling 911 is on the table, my kid knows to call 911. Better safe than ACTUALLY DEAD. Jeez.

Ohio State U just ended all sorority and frat activities. U Michigan ended all frat activities a two weeks ago.

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/ohio-state-suspends-sorority-fraternity-activities-amid-probes-155020539.html

Anonymous wrote:OP here and I had a lot of fun too but looking back on it I am lucky I made it out alive and without being sexually assaulted. Probably only because I played a coed varsity sport so had fraternity brothers looking after me. I remember being told "don't drink that", etc. and I think they have gotten much worse recently.

+1 I was recently at a sorority reunion and going over our stories from the past I can't believe that some of us made it out alive. Too much alcohol, driving drunk, questionable boyfriends etc.

Reading about the Penn State story makes me question how fraternities can continue to exist. They seemed to have outlived their benefits when you let someone die.

Anonymous wrote:Greeks are here to stay. Many parents and kids place the importance of a top house bid over grades.

Right. And football is "here to stay," too.

Wake up. Your beloved culture is dying.

The Penn State story is horrifying.

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2017/11/a-death-at-penn-state/540657/

I hope those boys get what they deserve. The death penalty isn't good enough for the one who punched him in the stomach.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Greeks are here to stay. Many parents and kids place the importance of a top house bid over grades.

Many of the Greek houses require minimum GPAs to stay in the fraternity. If you don't keep your grades up, you get kicked out. They support each other through school, tutor each other and make friendships that last a lifetime.

They are not all involved in crazy hazing rituals. They do have parties but that does not mean that they aren't serious students, too.

Not all frats are Animal House.

Right.

You mean they have banks of old tests and help each other cheat.

Er...how else are they supposed to get their grades up??????

No rushing in first year. And more education is needed. Also amnesty for those who call for help.

https://www.dontstalljustcall.org

Another pledge death in the news today: http://www.businessinsider.com/matthew-ellis-texas-state-fraternity-death-2017-11

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Greeks are here to stay. Many parents and kids place the importance of a top house bid over grades.

Many of the Greek houses require minimum GPAs to stay in the fraternity. If you don't keep your grades up, you get kicked out. They support each other through school, tutor each other and make friendships that last a lifetime.

They are not all involved in crazy hazing rituals. They do have parties but that does not mean that they aren't serious students, too.

Not all frats are Animal House.

Right.

You mean they have banks of old tests and help each other cheat.

Here is the list
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_hazing_deaths_in_the_United_States

Ha! Here is a list of deaths related to frat hazing (it's about one per year) in America.

Do you know how many people in America die from gunshots? Every year? Let us get our priorities straight.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They should serve only cake, ice cream and Capri Sun at college parties....

Tell you what. You go right ahead and throw that cake and ice cream party. See how many students come to it.

Herein lies the problem in American culture. A few weeks ago around homecoming time, My 17 year old was recently explaining that kids only want to go to parties at the houses of kids with parents who allow drinking because without alcohol...they're bored. Has the Information Age screwed our youth so badly that nothing other than substance abuse is considered fun?

ban "cool parents" and our teens will figure out how to have sober fun

Meh. My kid wasn't cool at all in high school and never drank (just not the kind of thing her friends did) but even she managed to find alcohol and overindulge a few times her freshman year.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They should serve only cake, ice cream and Capri Sun at college parties....

Tell you what. You go right ahead and throw that cake and ice cream party. See how many students come to it.

Herein lies the problem in American culture. A few weeks ago around homecoming time, My 17 year old was recently explaining that kids only want to go to parties at the houses of kids with parents who allow drinking because without alcohol...they're bored. Has the Information Age screwed our youth so badly that nothing other than substance abuse is considered fun?

ban "cool parents" and our teens will figure out how to have sober fun

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The news out of Penn State today is so disturbing. There is zero positive benefit to having fraternities and sororities. Everyone who went to college and reads the news knows this. It has got to end. Obama should have had his department of education do something because surely Trump and Betsey DeVos will not touch it because they pretty much epitomize a frat bro and a sorority sister.

Wrong.
Wrong.
Wrong.

So enlightening and convincing. I guess you can't even come up with an actual benefit.