Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, I have donated to my alma mater when my child was a senior in high school. Yes, I have gotten my children summer jobs through my connections. How differentiated are 20 year olds in skill sets anyway?

No problem with multifamily housing in the neighborhood, other than traffic congestion.

I'd have a problem with multifamily housing in my neighborhood if it affected my quality of life and the value of my house. I mean, if I wanted to live near multifamily residences, I would have bought there to begin with.

So do you think this book is a bit demonizing?

Is it possible that it SHOULD be demonizing. The growing wealth gap in the United States isn't just bad for poor kids. It's bad for the country. We literally cannot continue on this path and expect to have a functioning economy or democracy. So, yeah, perhaps it is demonizing, but perhaps it is time that UMC folks start working toward the common good rather than just the good of their own progeny.

I worked my ass off to make it into the UMC, and I'd like to see the wealthy who can afford to come down a few rungs on the ladder without taking a major hit to their lifestyle go first. It's not that hard a tumble back down the ladder from UMC, and a lot of us aren't here because of generational wealth or some other sort of safety net that prevents socioeconomic class slippage. We are fortunate to be able to make a lot of positive contributions through donations and volunteering, but expecting me to disadvantage my kid deliberately? Nope. I came from the working middle class, and I'm not going back.

I hate people like you. You happily climb ladder rungs while hoping others above you fall down.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
+1. Never mind that every single one of us in this thread said we would use whatever connections and resources we reasonably could to help our own kids. If the GT Asian child doesn't get in, it's because a black student took the spot, not because a spot was taken by a white student whose parents know the college president and several trustees. Is this the argument, PP?

This is PP. Yes, that is my point. Not to simplify it but affirmative action means looking not only at test scores but also at a variety of factors (including income). I do agree with this. While it certainly may help many African-Americans and other URM who may have otherwise been overlooked, it also helps white students against Asian students (gasp!) Nobody wants to examine that part of it--just read a thread on how high test scores shouldn't be the be all and end all (in regards to Asians).

Also, many URM are belittled for being under-qualified while people are admitting that they are ok with "under qualified." As long as it is the privileged kind of under qualified. When I heard that Julian Castro had a fairly average SAT score, I admit I was a bit shocked. He went much further in his career than many people with higher scores. How do you account for this? You look at how hard he had to work to get to that SAT score. It became an indicator for how much further he could go. I know this isn't always the case but this is the reason to look at multiple factors. I do find that this excuse to look at a variety of factors is biased against Asians by being dismissive of their accomplishments BUT let's be clear about what we're talking about. The previous PP immediately decided to make it Asians vs. black in a twisted way. I think this is a common perception though.

You are not just simplifying it, but you are mis-characterizing it. Affirmative action is about race. If it was purely about individual circumstances, I would not have any problems with it: a kid's achievement is in the context of his environment, and if the college represents a common environment for the students, then it's logical to make adjustments for applicants based on their differentiated circumstances. As I noted earlier, there are poor black neighborhoods, poor hispanic neighborhoods, and poor asian neighborhoods, they all have challenges. Yet we are somehow to believe that there are some special insurmountable challenges faced by poor black families that can only be remedied by differentiated action based on skin color.

IMO, college applications should be anonymous - when you submit an application you get a number and that's what the reviewers see. They don't see your name, they don't see your age, sex, race, religion, or anything that is a protected class. Let the achievements and the context of those achievements speak for themselves. A poor kid is just a poor kid, poverty doesn't care about skin color, only people who care about skin color, care about skin color.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
+1. Never mind that every single one of us in this thread said we would use whatever connections and resources we reasonably could to help our own kids. If the GT Asian child doesn't get in, it's because a black student took the spot, not because a spot was taken by a white student whose parents know the college president and several trustees. Is this the argument, PP?

This is PP. Yes, that is my point. Not to simplify it but affirmative action means looking not only at test scores but also at a variety of factors (including income). I do agree with this. While it certainly may help many African-Americans and other URM who may have otherwise been overlooked, it also helps white students against Asian students (gasp!) Nobody wants to examine that part of it--just read a thread on how high test scores shouldn't be the be all and end all (in regards to Asians).

Also, many URM are belittled for being under-qualified while people are admitting that they are ok with "under qualified." As long as it is the privileged kind of under qualified. When I heard that Julian Castro had a fairly average SAT score, I admit I was a bit shocked. He went much further in his career than many people with higher scores. How do you account for this? You look at how hard he had to work to get to that SAT score. It became an indicator for how much further he could go. I know this isn't always the case but this is the reason to look at multiple factors. I do find that this excuse to look at a variety of factors is biased against Asians by being dismissive of their accomplishments BUT let's be clear about what we're talking about. The previous PP immediately decided to make it Asians vs. black in a twisted way. I think this is a common perception though.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My take away from this is that there are all of this little social cues and social capital that we all take for granted that ends up keeping poorer people out of certain things.

The article David Brooks wrote resonated with me. I am going through the college selection/application process now with my kid and it actually turns my stomach to think about all of the ways disadvantaged kids are shut out and all of the hurdles that you have to cross. And how we get sidetracked by stuff like affirmative action. Here are some of the challenges I can think of:

-living in a neighborhood with good schools and good guidance counselors and college application support
-being the academic track to take AP classes or the right classes
-Being able to afford multiple AP tests
-Being able to afford multiple ACT/SAT tests
-Having solid academic support or being able to afford tutors or have the social capital to know where to go to get help at low cost
-Understanding the college application process, deadlines, financial aid process
-Having the confidence to even apply for top schools
-Knowing how to connect with admissions officers
-Being able to visit schools

Obviously everyone wants the best for their kid, but I never really thought about how I am contributing and participating in this system that actually leaves others behind. For me this is just one of those conversations that is food-for-thought and has given me a lot to think about. I am also Black so thinking about this is actually torture.

I am Asian and there are plenty of poor Asian immigrants. My oldest has a classmate - good kid, very polite, very confident, popular among his peers. His parents are blue collar workers, one is a cashier and the other one is a restaurant cook. They don't buy fancy clothes, no fancy hair cuts, old Japanese beater cars, they bought into an affordable corner of the good school pyramid, and send their kid to many of the tutoring workshops that are popular with Asians. That kid was always in the GT program and currently has better grades than mine in the same classes. I don't know if he is going on a college tour, my guess is no, but I wouldn't be surprised if his parents scrimped and saved to make that happen. He is kind, happy, and very hard working, just like his parents. Yet he knows that despite all his efforts and those of his parents, a college admission officer will favor a black student over him because of his race. You telling me this is a more fair state of affairs?

So we can't have a conversation about this because you made it about race and you used one anecdote (the exceptional poor Asian) to justify your position. If you look at the list of things I listed, these are activities and norms that are part of the college process for UMC families. It is difficult for poor families of any color to crack all of that to gain admission to top schools.During the college selection process, I've been trying to put myself in the shoes of parents who may not have attending college, don't have friends or family that went to college, don't have money or well-informed guidance counselors, and live in communities that may not support academic achievement. It is difficult for poor families of any color to crack all of that to gain admission to top schools. While I think personal responsibility is part of the equation, there are still systemic problems that go far beyond what an individual family can overcome. It's not just about priorities.

Have a great life!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My take away from this is that there are all of this little social cues and social capital that we all take for granted that ends up keeping poorer people out of certain things.

The article David Brooks wrote resonated with me. I am going through the college selection/application process now with my kid and it actually turns my stomach to think about all of the ways disadvantaged kids are shut out and all of the hurdles that you have to cross. And how we get sidetracked by stuff like affirmative action. Here are some of the challenges I can think of:

-living in a neighborhood with good schools and good guidance counselors and college application support
-being the academic track to take AP classes or the right classes
-Being able to afford multiple AP tests
-Being able to afford multiple ACT/SAT tests
-Having solid academic support or being able to afford tutors or have the social capital to know where to go to get help at low cost
-Understanding the college application process, deadlines, financial aid process
-Having the confidence to even apply for top schools
-Knowing how to connect with admissions officers
-Being able to visit schools

Obviously everyone wants the best for their kid, but I never really thought about how I am contributing and participating in this system that actually leaves others behind. For me this is just one of those conversations that is food-for-thought and has given me a lot to think about. I am also Black so thinking about this is actually torture.

No, it's about priorities. To each of your points:

1. School performance is largely dependent on parental involvement. Which of our surrounding counties has the worst schools? PG. Go take a look at the school threads for the counties, and see what the degree of parental involvement for PG is compared against the other counties. Don't blame the teachers and guidance counselors - they are not substitutes for parenting.

2. Regarding academic track and AP classes: see #1

3. Again a matter of life priorities. The reduced fee for AP test is $53, I refuse to believe that a family cannot find $53 to take the AP test.

4. Life priorities: it's a $57 test, and there are fee waivers available for low income families. The money barrier simply is not there.

5. Academic support is again a family function. I can see the point about tutors, but one does not need tutors to be successful.

6. We all have to learn the application process, I don't see this is especially difficult for people who are in the lower SES. Are you arguing that they are less capable?

7. Confidence is again a combination of upbringing and personal achievement. I think the masses have swung to far on the confidence scale. Everyone thinks they are special.

8. Helping your child develop inter-personal skills is a parental function.

9. You don't need to visit schools, and it affords you no special preference when applying to the schools. It's pretty much a vacation.

I am Asian and there are plenty of poor Asian immigrants. My oldest has a classmate - good kid, very polite, very confident, popular among his peers. His parents are blue collar workers, one is a cashier and the other one is a restaurant cook. They don't buy fancy clothes, no fancy hair cuts, old Japanese beater cars, they bought into an affordable corner of the good school pyramid, and send their kid to many of the tutoring workshops that are popular with Asians. That kid was always in the GT program and currently has better grades than mine in the same classes. I don't know if he is going on a college tour, my guess is no, but I wouldn't be surprised if his parents scrimped and saved to make that happen. He is kind, happy, and very hard working, just like his parents. Yet he knows that despite all his efforts and those of his parents, a college admission officer will favor a black student over him because of his race. You telling me this is a more fair state of affairs?

Why are you so sure that a black student is supposedly taking this GT Asian child's spot? Black people represent a very small percentage of all college attendees. Also, do you think that colleges don't take into account his SES? I don't agree with having racing quotas that harm Asians but please do more research into how college admissions work.

+1. Never mind that every single one of us in this thread said we would use whatever connections and resources we reasonably could to help our own kids. If the GT Asian child doesn't get in, it's because a black student took the spot, not because a spot was taken by a white student whose parents know the college president and several trustees. Is this the argument, PP?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My take away from this is that there are all of this little social cues and social capital that we all take for granted that ends up keeping poorer people out of certain things.

The article David Brooks wrote resonated with me. I am going through the college selection/application process now with my kid and it actually turns my stomach to think about all of the ways disadvantaged kids are shut out and all of the hurdles that you have to cross. And how we get sidetracked by stuff like affirmative action. Here are some of the challenges I can think of:

-living in a neighborhood with good schools and good guidance counselors and college application support
-being the academic track to take AP classes or the right classes
-Being able to afford multiple AP tests
-Being able to afford multiple ACT/SAT tests
-Having solid academic support or being able to afford tutors or have the social capital to know where to go to get help at low cost
-Understanding the college application process, deadlines, financial aid process
-Having the confidence to even apply for top schools
-Knowing how to connect with admissions officers
-Being able to visit schools

Obviously everyone wants the best for their kid, but I never really thought about how I am contributing and participating in this system that actually leaves others behind. For me this is just one of those conversations that is food-for-thought and has given me a lot to think about. I am also Black so thinking about this is actually torture.

No, it's about priorities. To each of your points:

1. School performance is largely dependent on parental involvement. Which of our surrounding counties has the worst schools? PG. Go take a look at the school threads for the counties, and see what the degree of parental involvement for PG is compared against the other counties. Don't blame the teachers and guidance counselors - they are not substitutes for parenting.

2. Regarding academic track and AP classes: see #1

3. Again a matter of life priorities. The reduced fee for AP test is $53, I refuse to believe that a family cannot find $53 to take the AP test.

4. Life priorities: it's a $57 test, and there are fee waivers available for low income families. The money barrier simply is not there.

5. Academic support is again a family function. I can see the point about tutors, but one does not need tutors to be successful.

6. We all have to learn the application process, I don't see this is especially difficult for people who are in the lower SES. Are you arguing that they are less capable?

7. Confidence is again a combination of upbringing and personal achievement. I think the masses have swung to far on the confidence scale. Everyone thinks they are special.

8. Helping your child develop inter-personal skills is a parental function.

9. You don't need to visit schools, and it affords you no special preference when applying to the schools. It's pretty much a vacation.

I am Asian and there are plenty of poor Asian immigrants. My oldest has a classmate - good kid, very polite, very confident, popular among his peers. His parents are blue collar workers, one is a cashier and the other one is a restaurant cook. They don't buy fancy clothes, no fancy hair cuts, old Japanese beater cars, they bought into an affordable corner of the good school pyramid, and send their kid to many of the tutoring workshops that are popular with Asians. That kid was always in the GT program and currently has better grades than mine in the same classes. I don't know if he is going on a college tour, my guess is no, but I wouldn't be surprised if his parents scrimped and saved to make that happen. He is kind, happy, and very hard working, just like his parents. Yet he knows that despite all his efforts and those of his parents, a college admission officer will favor a black student over him because of his race. You telling me this is a more fair state of affairs?

Why are you so sure that a black student is supposedly taking this GT Asian child's spot? Black people represent a very small percentage of all college attendees. Also, do you think that colleges don't take into account his SES? I don't agree with having racing quotas that harm Asians but please do more research into how college admissions work.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My take away from this is that there are all of this little social cues and social capital that we all take for granted that ends up keeping poorer people out of certain things.

The article David Brooks wrote resonated with me. I am going through the college selection/application process now with my kid and it actually turns my stomach to think about all of the ways disadvantaged kids are shut out and all of the hurdles that you have to cross. And how we get sidetracked by stuff like affirmative action. Here are some of the challenges I can think of:

-living in a neighborhood with good schools and good guidance counselors and college application support
-being the academic track to take AP classes or the right classes
-Being able to afford multiple AP tests
-Being able to afford multiple ACT/SAT tests
-Having solid academic support or being able to afford tutors or have the social capital to know where to go to get help at low cost
-Understanding the college application process, deadlines, financial aid process
-Having the confidence to even apply for top schools
-Knowing how to connect with admissions officers
-Being able to visit schools

Obviously everyone wants the best for their kid, but I never really thought about how I am contributing and participating in this system that actually leaves others behind. For me this is just one of those conversations that is food-for-thought and has given me a lot to think about. I am also Black so thinking about this is actually torture.

No, it's about priorities. To each of your points:

1. School performance is largely dependent on parental involvement. Which of our surrounding counties has the worst schools? PG. Go take a look at the school threads for the counties, and see what the degree of parental involvement for PG is compared against the other counties. Don't blame the teachers and guidance counselors - they are not substitutes for parenting.

2. Regarding academic track and AP classes: see #1

3. Again a matter of life priorities. The reduced fee for AP test is $53, I refuse to believe that a family cannot find $53 to take the AP test.

4. Life priorities: it's a $57 test, and there are fee waivers available for low income families. The money barrier simply is not there.

5. Academic support is again a family function. I can see the point about tutors, but one does not need tutors to be successful.

6. We all have to learn the application process, I don't see this is especially difficult for people who are in the lower SES. Are you arguing that they are less capable?

7. Confidence is again a combination of upbringing and personal achievement. I think the masses have swung to far on the confidence scale. Everyone thinks they are special.

8. Helping your child develop inter-personal skills is a parental function.

9. You don't need to visit schools, and it affords you no special preference when applying to the schools. It's pretty much a vacation.

I am Asian and there are plenty of poor Asian immigrants. My oldest has a classmate - good kid, very polite, very confident, popular among his peers. His parents are blue collar workers, one is a cashier and the other one is a restaurant cook. They don't buy fancy clothes, no fancy hair cuts, old Japanese beater cars, they bought into an affordable corner of the good school pyramid, and send their kid to many of the tutoring workshops that are popular with Asians. That kid was always in the GT program and currently has better grades than mine in the same classes. I don't know if he is going on a college tour, my guess is no, but I wouldn't be surprised if his parents scrimped and saved to make that happen. He is kind, happy, and very hard working, just like his parents. Yet he knows that despite all his efforts and those of his parents, a college admission officer will favor a black student over him because of his race. You telling me this is a more fair state of affairs?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My take away from this is that there are all of this little social cues and social capital that we all take for granted that ends up keeping poorer people out of certain things.

The article David Brooks wrote resonated with me. I am going through the college selection/application process now with my kid and it actually turns my stomach to think about all of the ways disadvantaged kids are shut out and all of the hurdles that you have to cross. And how we get sidetracked by stuff like affirmative action. Here are some of the challenges I can think of:

-living in a neighborhood with good schools and good guidance counselors and college application support
-being the academic track to take AP classes or the right classes
-Being able to afford multiple AP tests
-Being able to afford multiple ACT/SAT tests
-Having solid academic support or being able to afford tutors or have the social capital to know where to go to get help at low cost
-Understanding the college application process, deadlines, financial aid process
-Having the confidence to even apply for top schools
-Knowing how to connect with admissions officers
-Being able to visit schools

Obviously everyone wants the best for their kid, but I never really thought about how I am contributing and participating in this system that actually leaves others behind. For me this is just one of those conversations that is food-for-thought and has given me a lot to think about. I am also Black so thinking about this is actually torture.

No, it's about priorities. To each of your points:

1. School performance is largely dependent on parental involvement. Which of our surrounding counties has the worst schools? PG. Go take a look at the school threads for the counties, and see what the degree of parental involvement for PG is compared against the other counties. Don't blame the teachers and guidance counselors - they are not substitutes for parenting.

2. Regarding academic track and AP classes: see #1

3. Again a matter of life priorities. The reduced fee for AP test is $53, I refuse to believe that a family cannot find $53 to take the AP test.

4. Life priorities: it's a $57 test, and there are fee waivers available for low income families. The money barrier simply is not there.

5. Academic support is again a family function. I can see the point about tutors, but one does not need tutors to be successful.

6. We all have to learn the application process, I don't see this is especially difficult for people who are in the lower SES. Are you arguing that they are less capable?

7. Confidence is again a combination of upbringing and personal achievement. I think the masses have swung to far on the confidence scale. Everyone thinks they are special.

8. Helping your child develop inter-personal skills is a parental function.

9. You don't need to visit schools, and it affords you no special preference when applying to the schools. It's pretty much a vacation.

I am Asian and there are plenty of poor Asian immigrants. My oldest has a classmate - good kid, very polite, very confident, popular among his peers. His parents are blue collar workers, one is a cashier and the other one is a restaurant cook. They don't buy fancy clothes, no fancy hair cuts, old Japanese beater cars, they bought into an affordable corner of the good school pyramid, and send their kid to many of the tutoring workshops that are popular with Asians. That kid was always in the GT program and currently has better grades than mine in the same classes. I don't know if he is going on a college tour, my guess is no, but I wouldn't be surprised if his parents scrimped and saved to make that happen. He is kind, happy, and very hard working, just like his parents. Yet he knows that despite all his efforts and those of his parents, a college admission officer will favor a black student over him because of his race. You telling me this is a more fair state of affairs?

Anonymous wrote:We really, really need to soak the rich with higher taxes.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My take away from this is that there are all of this little social cues and social capital that we all take for granted that ends up keeping poorer people out of certain things.

The article David Brooks wrote resonated with me. I am going through the college selection/application process now with my kid and it actually turns my stomach to think about all of the ways disadvantaged kids are shut out and all of the hurdles that you have to cross. And how we get sidetracked by stuff like affirmative action. Here are some of the challenges I can think of:

-living in a neighborhood with good schools and good guidance counselors and college application support
-being the academic track to take AP classes or the right classes
-Being able to afford multiple AP tests
-Being able to afford multiple ACT/SAT tests
-Having solid academic support or being able to afford tutors or have the social capital to know where to go to get help at low cost
-Understanding the college application process, deadlines, financial aid process
-Having the confidence to even apply for top schools
-Knowing how to connect with admissions officers
-Being able to visit schools

Obviously everyone wants the best for their kid, but I never really thought about how I am contributing and participating in this system that actually leaves others behind. For me this is just one of those conversations that is food-for-thought and has given me a lot to think about. I am also Black so thinking about this is actually torture.

No, it's about priorities. To each of your points:

1. School performance is largely dependent on parental involvement. Which of our surrounding counties has the worst schools? PG. Go take a look at the school threads for the counties, and see what the degree of parental involvement for PG is compared against the other counties. Don't blame the teachers and guidance counselors - they are not substitutes for parenting.

2. Regarding academic track and AP classes: see #1

3. Again a matter of life priorities. The reduced fee for AP test is $53, I refuse to believe that a family cannot find $53 to take the AP test.

4. Life priorities: it's a $57 test, and there are fee waivers available for low income families. The money barrier simply is not there.

5. Academic support is again a family function. I can see the point about tutors, but one does not need tutors to be successful.

6. We all have to learn the application process, I don't see this is especially difficult for people who are in the lower SES. Are you arguing that they are less capable?

7. Confidence is again a combination of upbringing and personal achievement. I think the masses have swung to far on the confidence scale. Everyone thinks they are special.

8. Helping your child develop inter-personal skills is a parental function.

9. You don't need to visit schools, and it affords you no special preference when applying to the schools. It's pretty much a vacation.

I am Asian and there are plenty of poor Asian immigrants. My oldest has a classmate - good kid, very polite, very confident, popular among his peers. His parents are blue collar workers, one is a cashier and the other one is a restaurant cook. They don't buy fancy clothes, no fancy hair cuts, old Japanese beater cars, they bought into an affordable corner of the good school pyramid, and send their kid to many of the tutoring workshops that are popular with Asians. That kid was always in the GT program and currently has better grades than mine in the same classes. I don't know if he is going on a college tour, my guess is no, but I wouldn't be surprised if his parents scrimped and saved to make that happen. He is kind, happy, and very hard working, just like his parents. Yet he knows that despite all his efforts and those of his parents, a college admission officer will favor a black student over him because of his race. You telling me this is a more fair state of affairs?

No it's not a fair state of affairs. What you are overlooking, though, is that calling that family "poor Asian immigrant" doesn't tell the whole story and doesn't put that kid on the same step as a poor black kid. The Asian family, poor though they are, is helped along by the culture that prizes academic achievement and hard work. Don't underestimate the importance of cultural norms.

Anonymous wrote:It's silly to pretend that only wealthy people use their contacts to help their kids. That is completely not true.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My take away from this is that there are all of this little social cues and social capital that we all take for granted that ends up keeping poorer people out of certain things.

The article David Brooks wrote resonated with me. I am going through the college selection/application process now with my kid and it actually turns my stomach to think about all of the ways disadvantaged kids are shut out and all of the hurdles that you have to cross. And how we get sidetracked by stuff like affirmative action. Here are some of the challenges I can think of:

-living in a neighborhood with good schools and good guidance counselors and college application support
-being the academic track to take AP classes or the right classes
-Being able to afford multiple AP tests
-Being able to afford multiple ACT/SAT tests
-Having solid academic support or being able to afford tutors or have the social capital to know where to go to get help at low cost
-Understanding the college application process, deadlines, financial aid process
-Having the confidence to even apply for top schools
-Knowing how to connect with admissions officers
-Being able to visit schools

Obviously everyone wants the best for their kid, but I never really thought about how I am contributing and participating in this system that actually leaves others behind. For me this is just one of those conversations that is food-for-thought and has given me a lot to think about. I am also Black so thinking about this is actually torture.

No, it's about priorities. To each of your points:

1. School performance is largely dependent on parental involvement. Which of our surrounding counties has the worst schools? PG. Go take a look at the school threads for the counties, and see what the degree of parental involvement for PG is compared against the other counties. Don't blame the teachers and guidance counselors - they are not substitutes for parenting.

2. Regarding academic track and AP classes: see #1

3. Again a matter of life priorities. The reduced fee for AP test is $53, I refuse to believe that a family cannot find $53 to take the AP test.

4. Life priorities: it's a $57 test, and there are fee waivers available for low income families. The money barrier simply is not there.

5. Academic support is again a family function. I can see the point about tutors, but one does not need tutors to be successful.

6. We all have to learn the application process, I don't see this is especially difficult for people who are in the lower SES. Are you arguing that they are less capable?

7. Confidence is again a combination of upbringing and personal achievement. I think the masses have swung to far on the confidence scale. Everyone thinks they are special.

8. Helping your child develop inter-personal skills is a parental function.

9. You don't need to visit schools, and it affords you no special preference when applying to the schools. It's pretty much a vacation.

I am Asian and there are plenty of poor Asian immigrants. My oldest has a classmate - good kid, very polite, very confident, popular among his peers. His parents are blue collar workers, one is a cashier and the other one is a restaurant cook. They don't buy fancy clothes, no fancy hair cuts, old Japanese beater cars, they bought into an affordable corner of the good school pyramid, and send their kid to many of the tutoring workshops that are popular with Asians. That kid was always in the GT program and currently has better grades than mine in the same classes. I don't know if he is going on a college tour, my guess is no, but I wouldn't be surprised if his parents scrimped and saved to make that happen. He is kind, happy, and very hard working, just like his parents. Yet he knows that despite all his efforts and those of his parents, a college admission officer will favor a black student over him because of his race. You telling me this is a more fair state of affairs?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We really, really need to soak the rich with higher taxes.

Remember, you are rich to somebody.