Anonymous
02/09/2017 14:11
Subject: What do I need to do over the next 6 years to get my child into a top school?
Anonymous wrote:NP here. This has been a (mostly) helpful thread.
I really feel for the OP - I am American, I went through this process myself almost 30 years ago (when by the way, "well rounded" was already OUT, at least for Suburban NJ applicants to top schools . . .) It seems like in the intervening years, the college application process has just gotten worse and more complicated. Back then, with tuition high (but not the sky-high level of today), selective colleges did not provide merit aid (with very few exceptions). Now, it seems like there's a complicated game to be played. The Ivy League and tippy-top schools provide no merit aid, but the middle tier and below of selective colleges and some flaghip state universitities, now do. So, you have to factor that in. Acceptance rates are lower than ever. Seems like a crap shoot!
My older DD is also in 7th grade. She is the one bringing up this topic with me (I've not brought it up). Just got her report card yesterday, and she has a 4.0 in MCPS (public). She asks me: "what do I have to do to get into a really great college? If I keep a 4.0 all through high school, will I get into a really good college?" I hate that my answer has to be: "If you study/work hard, I'm sure you will go to a college that will be really great for you." I think it's hard at 12 years old to have to recognize there is a luck/financial element. The rules are not clear like in Europe (do well on exam - get into good college - end of story). On the one hand, I think it's great that my DD has these dreams, but on the other hand, I don't want her to define "success" as getting into fill-in-the-blank-NAME school given the luck and financial elements at play.
Also, while I get why top schools like "pointy" kids, I take issue with this a bit. My kid is freaking 12 years old. If she wants to try a sport or activity that she's not sure about or might not excel in, she should do it! Not be held back to at 12 only participate in those things that will help build a college resume down the line. Some people have many diverse interests. This is not a bad thing!
FWIW, the message we gave DC was *college* is great -- so many different ones, appealing in so many different ways and the basic set up itself (all kids your own age, coming from different backgrounds, eager to make new friends, all living in close proximity to each other and to classes, arts, sports, and other kinds of fun, more independence without most of the boring overhead of adult life) is pretty awesome. Of course the whole EA/ED thing messes with that line Sr year where you get one chip and want to play it wisely. BUT, if you help your kid find a safety school or schools s/he is excited about, the stress goes way down.
And, honestly, I don't think that highly selective schools are looking for kids who are obsessively focused on one thing and have been for years. I think they're unimpressed by kids who do a bazillion things simultaneously and don't have anything interesting to say about any of them. They're looking for kids who stand out and when everybody seems to be following the same formula, there are lots of different ways to avoid being virtually indistinguishable from hundreds of other applicants.
Anonymous
02/09/2017 13:03
Subject: Re:What do I need to do over the next 6 years to get my child into a top school?
Anonymous wrote:NP here. This has been a (mostly) helpful thread.
I really feel for the OP - I am American, I went through this process myself almost 30 years ago (when by the way, "well rounded" was already OUT, at least for Suburban NJ applicants to top schools . . .) It seems like in the intervening years, the college application process has just gotten worse and more complicated. Back then, with tuition high (but not the sky-high level of today), selective colleges did not provide merit aid (with very few exceptions). Now, it seems like there's a complicated game to be played. The Ivy League and tippy-top schools provide no merit aid, but the middle tier and below of selective colleges and some flaghip state universitities, now do. So, you have to factor that in. Acceptance rates are lower than ever. Seems like a crap shoot!
My older DD is also in 7th grade. She is the one bringing up this topic with me (I've not brought it up). Just got her report card yesterday, and she has a 4.0 in MCPS (public). She asks me: "what do I have to do to get into a really great college? If I keep a 4.0 all through high school, will I get into a really good college?" I hate that my answer has to be: "If you study/work hard, I'm sure you will go to a college that will be really great for you." I think it's hard at 12 years old to have to recognize there is a luck/financial element. The rules are not clear like in Europe (do well on exam - get into good college - end of story). On the one hand, I think it's great that my DD has these dreams, but on the other hand, I don't want her to define "success" as getting into fill-in-the-blank-NAME school given the luck and financial elements at play.
Also, while I get why top schools like "pointy" kids, I take issue with this a bit. My kid is freaking 12 years old. If she wants to try a sport or activity that she's not sure about or might not excel in, she should do it! Not be held back to at 12 only participate in those things that will help build a college resume down the line. Some people have many diverse interests. This is not a bad thing!
Why do you hate that answer?
That is exactly the guidance I give my kids. Work hard, identify your strengths, know yourself, we will help you make a match.
The focus on brand names is an unnecessary distraction.
Anonymous
02/09/2017 12:57
Subject: What do I need to do over the next 6 years to get my child into a top school?
How do colleges define "pointy?"
If I have a child who rock climbs for 9 years before college and sings in community choirs since 1st grade, is that pointy enough? What else are schools looking for?
If I have a child who rock climbs for 9 years before college and sings in community choirs since 1st grade, is that pointy enough? What else are schools looking for?
Anonymous
02/09/2017 12:42
Subject: Re:What do I need to do over the next 6 years to get my child into a top school?
NP here. This has been a (mostly) helpful thread.
I really feel for the OP - I am American, I went through this process myself almost 30 years ago (when by the way, "well rounded" was already OUT, at least for Suburban NJ applicants to top schools . . .) It seems like in the intervening years, the college application process has just gotten worse and more complicated. Back then, with tuition high (but not the sky-high level of today), selective colleges did not provide merit aid (with very few exceptions). Now, it seems like there's a complicated game to be played. The Ivy League and tippy-top schools provide no merit aid, but the middle tier and below of selective colleges and some flaghip state universitities, now do. So, you have to factor that in. Acceptance rates are lower than ever. Seems like a crap shoot!
My older DD is also in 7th grade. She is the one bringing up this topic with me (I've not brought it up). Just got her report card yesterday, and she has a 4.0 in MCPS (public). She asks me: "what do I have to do to get into a really great college? If I keep a 4.0 all through high school, will I get into a really good college?" I hate that my answer has to be: "If you study/work hard, I'm sure you will go to a college that will be really great for you." I think it's hard at 12 years old to have to recognize there is a luck/financial element. The rules are not clear like in Europe (do well on exam - get into good college - end of story). On the one hand, I think it's great that my DD has these dreams, but on the other hand, I don't want her to define "success" as getting into fill-in-the-blank-NAME school given the luck and financial elements at play.
Also, while I get why top schools like "pointy" kids, I take issue with this a bit. My kid is freaking 12 years old. If she wants to try a sport or activity that she's not sure about or might not excel in, she should do it! Not be held back to at 12 only participate in those things that will help build a college resume down the line. Some people have many diverse interests. This is not a bad thing!
I really feel for the OP - I am American, I went through this process myself almost 30 years ago (when by the way, "well rounded" was already OUT, at least for Suburban NJ applicants to top schools . . .) It seems like in the intervening years, the college application process has just gotten worse and more complicated. Back then, with tuition high (but not the sky-high level of today), selective colleges did not provide merit aid (with very few exceptions). Now, it seems like there's a complicated game to be played. The Ivy League and tippy-top schools provide no merit aid, but the middle tier and below of selective colleges and some flaghip state universitities, now do. So, you have to factor that in. Acceptance rates are lower than ever. Seems like a crap shoot!
My older DD is also in 7th grade. She is the one bringing up this topic with me (I've not brought it up). Just got her report card yesterday, and she has a 4.0 in MCPS (public). She asks me: "what do I have to do to get into a really great college? If I keep a 4.0 all through high school, will I get into a really good college?" I hate that my answer has to be: "If you study/work hard, I'm sure you will go to a college that will be really great for you." I think it's hard at 12 years old to have to recognize there is a luck/financial element. The rules are not clear like in Europe (do well on exam - get into good college - end of story). On the one hand, I think it's great that my DD has these dreams, but on the other hand, I don't want her to define "success" as getting into fill-in-the-blank-NAME school given the luck and financial elements at play.
Also, while I get why top schools like "pointy" kids, I take issue with this a bit. My kid is freaking 12 years old. If she wants to try a sport or activity that she's not sure about or might not excel in, she should do it! Not be held back to at 12 only participate in those things that will help build a college resume down the line. Some people have many diverse interests. This is not a bad thing!
Anonymous
02/09/2017 12:02
Subject: What do I need to do over the next 6 years to get my child into a top school?
Even at schools with needblind admission, full pay matters and capacity is not that hard to deduce from info colleges have about where applicants live, go to school, where their parents went to school, and what their parents' occupations are.
Anonymous
02/09/2017 11:38
Subject: What do I need to do over the next 6 years to get my child into a top school?
Anonymous wrote:Make a lot of money. There are 2 admission piles at almost all private colleges. One for students whose parents can pay 100% of tuition, room and board (50-60,000 per year) and those that need financial aid. It is easier to get accepted if you can fully pay. If you have money you can get the best tutors for your child so that if they struggle in calculus or AP biology, or with writing an essay the tutor can help. Money gets you great one in one SAT tutoring. If your child is good at a sport money gets you private coaching. That can lead to a better chance of being a recruited athlete. Affluent parents aren't looking for a sorts scholarship just a hook to make it easier to get into a top school. Being s recruited athlete does that.
So money, money, and more money. It is not an even playing field between the haves and have nots in college admisions.
Is this true? Are there really two admission piles even at all the schools that claim to be need blind? I completely agree that money buys higher SAT/ACT scores. That is a racket. Really what is the difference between a 30 or 32 or 34? A lot of schools obsessed with scores to boost their rankings care way too much about scores. But most kids improve with paid for test prep. The tests should be abolished. We looked into private test prep and they wanted $3500-$4500. That is absurd!
Anonymous
02/09/2017 11:31
Subject: Re:What do I need to do over the next 6 years to get my child into a top school?
Anonymous wrote:My sister went to an ivy and does alumni interviews for them. One thing she always tells me is that as "stacked" as the students' applications are, none of them get accepted - echoing a PP response about colleges not wanting a "jack of all trades, master of none" type of candidate. The universities are filling out a freshman class that is diverse - they need one really great trumpet player, one really amazing physicist, one really passionate activist, etc. They don't need - nor want - one student who has dabbled in a million things but is not passionate about anything. So to agree with many of the PPs, find out what YOUR CHILD is interested in, not what you think they should be interested in. Even I had a hard time accepting that with my children, since I grew up employing the "jack of all trades" strategy. Once I stepped back and reassessed, I find it really does work better in the long run since they are so much happier and empowered by having agency in their lives.
So every twelve year old needs to buckle down and do one activity that they must excel at as if they were going to the Olympics or curing cancer. No time to be a normal kid and try different things even if you aren't great at it but are having fun. What a fun childhood.
Anonymous
02/09/2017 10:02
Subject: Re:What do I need to do over the next 6 years to get my child into a top school?
Anonymous wrote:My sister went to an ivy and does alumni interviews for them. One thing she always tells me is that as "stacked" as the students' applications are, none of them get accepted - echoing a PP response about colleges not wanting a "jack of all trades, master of none" type of candidate. The universities are filling out a freshman class that is diverse - they need one really great trumpet player, one really amazing physicist, one really passionate activist, etc. They don't need - nor want - one student who has dabbled in a million things but is not passionate about anything. So to agree with many of the PPs, find out what YOUR CHILD is interested in, not what you think they should be interested in. Even I had a hard time accepting that with my children, since I grew up employing the "jack of all trades" strategy. Once I stepped back and reassessed, I find it really does work better in the long run since they are so much happier and empowered by having agency in their lives.
And, if they spend their time doing stuff they enjoy and find meaningful, it's not going to matter to them if they do/don't get into an Ivy. What they've done has been intrinsically worthwhile and it helps them figure out what they want to do/learn next.
If they're just doing things in hope of some future payoff and they don't get it, they feel robbed. If they do get it and it's not all that, they feel let down. If they do get it, and they think, game over, they've won, you're all in for a big surprise. Or if they get it and then realize that the prize they're won is 4 more years of even more demanding competition to get the next prize, then they risk burnout and despair.
By contrast, if they've found something they love, they enjoy the ride and realize that there are all sort of interesting ways to travel. That realization also makes the college search process easier and much less fraught. You focus on programs/opportunities rather than rankings. And there are great programs in schools whose admissions aren't highly selective.
Anonymous
02/09/2017 09:47
Subject: What do I need to do over the next 6 years to get my child into a top school?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:what if my kid's only passion is video games? how can i 'engineer' this into something presentable on his application?
How old is he? Send him to video game design and coding camp. Our DS went as a camper for 2 summers and then was a counselor for 2 summers. Have him produce a game.
He's 12 in 7th grade. any good camps you/your son recommend?
Sorry for the delay in getting back to you. Game Camp Nation. Gamecamp.com
Anonymous
02/09/2017 09:44
Subject: Re:What do I need to do over the next 6 years to get my child into a top school?
My sister went to an ivy and does alumni interviews for them. One thing she always tells me is that as "stacked" as the students' applications are, none of them get accepted - echoing a PP response about colleges not wanting a "jack of all trades, master of none" type of candidate. The universities are filling out a freshman class that is diverse - they need one really great trumpet player, one really amazing physicist, one really passionate activist, etc. They don't need - nor want - one student who has dabbled in a million things but is not passionate about anything. So to agree with many of the PPs, find out what YOUR CHILD is interested in, not what you think they should be interested in. Even I had a hard time accepting that with my children, since I grew up employing the "jack of all trades" strategy. Once I stepped back and reassessed, I find it really does work better in the long run since they are so much happier and empowered by having agency in their lives.
Anonymous
02/09/2017 09:25
Subject: Re:What do I need to do over the next 6 years to get my child into a top school?
Anonymous wrote:Any good suggestions for private PSAT tutors?
Why would you get a PSAT tutor?
Anonymous
02/09/2017 09:19
Subject: Re:What do I need to do over the next 6 years to get my child into a top school?
Any good suggestions for private PSAT tutors?
Anonymous
02/09/2017 07:55
Subject: What do I need to do over the next 6 years to get my child into a top school?
. Very bigoted to imply US values and cultures are somehow inferior or do not value education--especially, since in the next breath pp will probably attavknpeopke like op for hothousing their kids...just stop already with the bigotry, not everyone if any one group shares the same values. You are a part of the problem and you are bigoted.Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:9:56
FWIW, I don't think that the poster you're quoting was suggesting your attitudes harmed your child. She was just pointing out that the bragging rights/engineering your kid's life rhetoric wasn't a fair response to a parent who grew up elsewhere and was simply asking "how do things work here?"
That said, my take was that you were responding to the responses and offering OP a different perspective/approach rather than slamming her for asking the question.
FWIW, I wholeheartedly agree with the encourage your kid to do things s/he finds meaningful and to do them well advice.
Industry person here: yes, that is what I meant. Also--OP needs the process operationalized, not parenting advice, which came off as obnoxious with "the problem with this thread....". I also find it offensive because we don't know the country or culture of the OP. Give her the info she or he needs without putting US values/ideas on to them about what they are doing wrong in your eyes.
Amen.
Anonymous
02/09/2017 06:17
Subject: What do I need to do over the next 6 years to get my child into a top school?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:9:56
FWIW, I don't think that the poster you're quoting was suggesting your attitudes harmed your child. She was just pointing out that the bragging rights/engineering your kid's life rhetoric wasn't a fair response to a parent who grew up elsewhere and was simply asking "how do things work here?"
That said, my take was that you were responding to the responses and offering OP a different perspective/approach rather than slamming her for asking the question.
FWIW, I wholeheartedly agree with the encourage your kid to do things s/he finds meaningful and to do them well advice.
Industry person here: yes, that is what I meant. Also--OP needs the process operationalized, not parenting advice, which came off as obnoxious with "the problem with this thread....". I also find it offensive because we don't know the country or culture of the OP. Give her the info she or he needs without putting US values/ideas on to them about what they are doing wrong in your eyes.
Amen.
Anonymous
02/08/2017 19:41
Subject: What do I need to do over the next 6 years to get my child into a top school?
Anonymous wrote:what if my kid's only passion is video games? how can i 'engineer' this into something presentable on his application?
My son is a sophomore at Princeton. He wrote a great essay on his experience as a guild master in WoW where he createf a guild, grew it to over 500 members. He wrote about the parallels of a CEO and the GM of a large, active guild.