Anonymous wrote:OP here. To the posters that mentioned bipolar I'm curious why you ask? Is this a sign? What are some of the other symptoms? I doubt it, but who knows. She is generally batty but I doubt she deserves a mental illness pass. She has always been extremely selfish but I'm willing to keep an open mind.

OP, I'm a new poster who has been away and just saw this thread.

Crazy overspending can be a sign of bipolar for sure. My friend came across to the world as a very "got it together" person, super smart, kind (not selfish like your MIL) -- but in her manic states she would spend money like crazy and end up with closets stuffed with unopened items and clothes with the tags still on them. She lost a great job because she used a company credit card to spend on personal stuff while in a severe manic period. That kind of woke her up to the problem. She stopped it all once she actually got properly diagnosed (she was misdiagnosed as depressed for quite a while) and got medications and the right therapy for bipolar.

We can't diagnose your MIL here but I'm just adding that yes, excessive spending can definitely be a sign of bipolar disorder.

If your MIL spends and spends but does it consistently, all the time, she might instead be addicted to shopping or merely very, very self-centered and naïve about credit. Someone who is bipolar might spend in intense bursts but then later regret it during a depressive episode -- that was my friend's pattern, at least; I can't speak for all of those with bipolar disorder.

But a diagnosis of any mental health issues would not excuse the damage done, or change the fact that your MIL's spending is going to harm YOUR family if your husband and you keep supporting the spending habit, no matter what its psychological roots.

Time for a serious intervention that includes some of the legal tactics others mention above, maybe. And as someone noted above -- if your husband got ill, for instance, or you did, or a child had as serious or sudden illness or your own family incurred an unexpected debt -- what happens then, if you're on the hook for MIL as well? Your husband sounds great but it's time to put that question to him.

Oh my gosh. What a crazy can of worms to try to contain. Good luck, OP.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So I just posted in another tread and realized the therapeutic value of posting! I hope I can safely vent here. My DH and I and my BIL and SIL all financially support my in-laws. I'm actually fine with this generally as I know my DH loves his parents, he always puts me and our family first, and we can generally afford to help. However, I just learned (while on a family vacation with in-laws and family) that my MIL just racked up thousands of dollars in credit card debt after secretly opening up a new credit card. This even after promising us years ago she wouldn't do so. Several years ago we bailed out ILs by paying off their house. A few years later we found out that ILs secretly took out a second mortgage in their paid off house to pay off my MIL's cc debt. After that, DH and BIL established a trust and took over their finances. Well, apparently she is at it again.

Her selfishness sickens me and my FIL's enabling is pathetic. I'm so angry but just need to get through this vacation. I'm just so disgusted and sad for DH. His mother looked straight at him and lied to his face years ago with her promise to not over spend. Oh, and to top it off, her dog just shit all over the rug at the beach house we are paying for. The idiots showed up ( without asking) with their dog in our "no pets allowed" rental. They sicken me. So why am I here- for the kids. On surface everything is fine, no fighting, etc. and our kids love their grandparents and their cousins. Thanks for letting me vent. I'm just so upset, angry and sad.

So when this happens again (and it will, obviously) make turning the house over to one of their kids a condition of the bailout. Rent it back to them for a token amount. She will have no assets and not be able to get anymore credit.

^^^^^ This is very wise advice. You don't need to wait for it to happen again, because it is always happening along the ways based on what you describe. The kids, your husband and his siblings, need to communicate as a group over buying the home for your their parents to live in. Call paying the utilities, insurance, taxes and ongoing maintenance "the rent" and be done with the issue. Your husband and his siblings will never reform or escape their mother's habits, and by now your MIL has no apparent motivation level to change or you'd have seen it. So let her "enjoy" her retirement in a home her kids have underwritten and hold arm's length. Of course she will complain. And complain. And complain. And complain. You are telling her how to live, treating her with disrespect, etc., but that is all bullshit and is also easier for you to hear once in a while rather than be exposed to the anxieties of this on an ongoing basis.

Even if it makes you sick that your husband goes in on a group "bailout", it really isn't one. 1. This way you know with certainty what the one-time amount is. 2. The correct way to think about it is this isn't money in a hole, a house is an asset. An asset you partially own. 3. To the extent you once day come to hate your siblings-in-law the way you hate the MIL or in the instance where one sibling-in-law goes into money duress, you have the future options of them buying you out or you buying them out. Get 5 valuation guesses from local realtors and take the median or average -- then clean the decks, or 4. Your husband and his siblings all agree to treat the house like an inheritance to be sold in the instance of the deaths of their parents.

I was married into a family with dependent parents-in-law. The problem there was my ex-wife's siblings were also adult dependentd at times and would ask the parents for $$$ that synthetically came from my ex-wife's "helping her parents when they asked and needed it". I found that a common denominator in that family seemed to be a genetic condition to be frivolous with money the parents passed to their kids. The best point to reach is an end point. That end point can be financial (buyout of the house and have FIL & MIL live in it for their retirement & that's it) or the endpoint can be your marriage. Sorry to be so brutal, but it is just a fact. This will eat you up from the inside out and end worse if you don't draw the line now.

Op I'm sorry to hear about this. In many cultures it's common for a child to provide for elderly parents, so I get what you were trying to do. I think you took the precautions that you reasonably could to protect yourselves.

At this point it sounds like the betrayal and hurt are the biggest issues. It must be hard for your DH to deal with this emotionally. All you can control are your own reactions as you clearly can't control your ILs. Are you open to therapy? Marital and perhaps individual therapy for DH might be best to learn to set boundaries.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm so not impressed by your manner of dealing with this op and I'm fairly disgusted by the posters patting your duh on the head for being such a good widdle boy to hims mommy.

" I am not really taking away from my own family to help the ILs if that makes sense."

No,it doesn't make sense. It's absolute nonsense. Just because you think you make enough to help fund their ridiculous behavior, don't fool yourself that you aren't taking resources from your children. You are.

The fact that your ils expect this is disgusting.

You are putting these idiots ahead of your children.

If your duh became seriously ill, would they be able to help you? You know a serious illness for anyone in your nuclear family could bankrupt you? Your ils have made sure they are in no position to help anyone else.

Also go read about the crab pot mentality of lower income familes.

In case you don't realize it, you sound crazy too. If OPD says what they've been doing thus far is not unduly burden event thing for you to tell them that their financial situation is something other than what they know what is? Going forward Opie is looking for help and how to address MIL's addiction consequences, not your reassessment of their budget?

No Hon, I'm the opposite of crazy here. I'm the rational one cutting through op's layers of bs. Op, you need to think clearly about this and cut the I'm-so-sweet bullshit. Women are allowed to speak directly. PP, op has no control over her mil's problems. Grown ups realize that. Children looking for the love they never got get caught up in this enmeshed crap.

OP here. I'm trying to keep an open mind with everyone posting and appreciate all the viewpoints. I get your anger - I feel it too. However, what layers of bs are you claiming I've engaged in? Without sordid details I thought I was pretty clear about our financial situation. Not sure how I'm bsing or what you took away from my posts.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm so not impressed by your manner of dealing with this op and I'm fairly disgusted by the posters patting your duh on the head for being such a good widdle boy to hims mommy.

" I am not really taking away from my own family to help the ILs if that makes sense."

No,it doesn't make sense. It's absolute nonsense. Just because you think you make enough to help fund their ridiculous behavior, don't fool yourself that you aren't taking resources from your children. You are.

The fact that your ils expect this is disgusting.

You are putting these idiots ahead of your children.

If your duh became seriously ill, would they be able to help you? You know a serious illness for anyone in your nuclear family could bankrupt you? Your ils have made sure they are in no position to help anyone else.

Also go read about the crab pot mentality of lower income familes.

In case you don't realize it, you sound crazy too. If OPD says what they've been doing thus far is not unduly burden event thing for you to tell them that their financial situation is something other than what they know what is? Going forward Opie is looking for help and how to address MIL's addiction consequences, not your reassessment of their budget?

No Hon, I'm the opposite of crazy here. I'm the rational one cutting through op's layers of bs. Op, you need to think clearly about this and cut the I'm-so-sweet bullshit. Women are allowed to speak directly. PP, op has no control over her mil's problems. Grown ups realize that. Children looking for the love they never got get caught up in this enmeshed crap.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Stop helping them out financially.

If you do, you need to get power of attorney. Your MIL shouldn't be allowed to open new credit card accounts.

OP, take your DH to a reputable credit counselor who can explain why enabling them is BAD.
http://www.consumerfinance.gov/managing-someone-elses-money/

Ok
What is it with you people and power of attorney ???
You cannot just get a POA because someone has bad credit and over spends !!!!
Da hell ! you think bankruptcies would be happening if you could just do that ?

Those people just crazy.... You can't stop sane person from making financial decisions. Optiins are limited - protect property ( as Ops DH already done - house is owned by the trust), pay utilities directly, and sign IL for grocery delivery ( or give GC to closest grocery store), and let free market to deal with it. Once MIl max out her card - she wont be able to spend more, credit will be tanked, no more cc for her.
I suggest therapy for OPs DH to help set boundaries, and don't feel bad about it. I bet that MIL will try to send poor son into guilt trip.
MIL does need professional help too, but unless she is ready to get help - it won't work.

EXACTLY!!!!!!!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Stop helping them out financially.

If you do, you need to get power of attorney. Your MIL shouldn't be allowed to open new credit card accounts.

OP, take your DH to a reputable credit counselor who can explain why enabling them is BAD.
http://www.consumerfinance.gov/managing-someone-elses-money/

Ok
What is it with you people and power of attorney ???
You cannot just get a POA because someone has bad credit and over spends !!!!
Da hell ! you think bankruptcies would be happening if you could just do that ?

Those people just crazy.... You can't stop sane person from making financial decisions. Optiins are limited - protect property ( as Ops DH already done - house is owned by the trust), pay utilities directly, and sign IL for grocery delivery ( or give GC to closest grocery store), and let free market to deal with it. Once MIl max out her card - she wont be able to spend more, credit will be tanked, no more cc for her.
I suggest therapy for OPs DH to help set boundaries, and don't feel bad about it. I bet that MIL will try to send poor son into guilt trip.
MIL does need professional help too, but unless she is ready to get help - it won't work.

Anonymous wrote:Stop helping them out financially.

If you do, you need to get power of attorney. Your MIL shouldn't be allowed to open new credit card accounts.

OP, take your DH to a reputable credit counselor who can explain why enabling them is BAD.
http://www.consumerfinance.gov/managing-someone-elses-money/

Ok
What is it with you people and power of attorney ???
You cannot just get a POA because someone has bad credit and over spends !!!!
Da hell ! you think bankruptcies would be happening if you could just do that ?

Stop helping them out financially.

If you do, you need to get power of attorney. Your MIL shouldn't be allowed to open new credit card accounts.

OP, take your DH to a reputable credit counselor who can explain why enabling them is BAD.
http://www.consumerfinance.gov/managing-someone-elses-money/

Anonymous wrote:So I just posted in another tread and realized the therapeutic value of posting! I hope I can safely vent here. My DH and I and my BIL and SIL all financially support my in-laws. I'm actually fine with this generally as I know my DH loves his parents, he always puts me and our family first, and we can generally afford to help. However, I just learned (while on a family vacation with in-laws and family) that my MIL just racked up thousands of dollars in credit card debt after secretly opening up a new credit card. This even after promising us years ago she wouldn't do so. Several years ago we bailed out ILs by paying off their house. A few years later we found out that ILs secretly took out a second mortgage in their paid off house to pay off my MIL's cc debt. After that, DH and BIL established a trust and took over their finances. Well, apparently she is at it again.

Her selfishness sickens me and my FIL's enabling is pathetic. I'm so angry but just need to get through this vacation. I'm just so disgusted and sad for DH. His mother looked straight at him and lied to his face years ago with her promise to not over spend. Oh, and to top it off, her dog just shit all over the rug at the beach house we are paying for. The idiots showed up ( without asking) with their dog in our "no pets allowed" rental. They sicken me. So why am I here- for the kids. On surface everything is fine, no fighting, etc. and our kids love their grandparents and their cousins. Thanks for letting me vent. I'm just so upset, angry and sad.

So when this happens again (and it will, obviously) make turning the house over to one of their kids a condition of the bailout. Rent it back to them for a token amount. She will have no assets and not be able to get anymore credit.

Anonymous wrote:I'm so not impressed by your manner of dealing with this op and I'm fairly disgusted by the posters patting your duh on the head for being such a good widdle boy to hims mommy.

" I am not really taking away from my own family to help the ILs if that makes sense."

No,it doesn't make sense. It's absolute nonsense. Just because you think you make enough to help fund their ridiculous behavior, don't fool yourself that you aren't taking resources from your children. You are.

The fact that your ils expect this is disgusting.

You are putting these idiots ahead of your children.

If your duh became seriously ill, would they be able to help you? You know a serious illness for anyone in your nuclear family could bankrupt you? Your ils have made sure they are in no position to help anyone else.

Also go read about the crab pot mentality of lower income familes.

In case you don't realize it, you sound crazy too. If OPD says what they've been doing thus far is not unduly burden event thing for you to tell them that their financial situation is something other than what they know what is? Going forward Opie is looking for help and how to address MIL's addiction consequences, not your reassessment of their budget?