Anonymous
07/05/2016 14:01
Subject: s/o - feeling "poor" at these ludicrously high incomes. what are they actually missing?
Anonymous wrote:I think the definitions and income bands have shifted over time. In the 80s-90s middle class or even UMC meant you owned a home in a good district so ideally you sent the kids to public school but the home wasn't necessarily new or large and often your kids shared bedrooms; you saved some for retirement and college; you had 2 cars but it's possible one or both were used and neither was luxury; you took 1 driving vacation a yr; you ate out once a week max and in some families it was more like once a month or a few times a yr for birthdays etc.
Now people seem to think UMC means huge new house and no kid will be sharing a bathroom let alone a bedroom; the option of going to private school when they get in a snit with their public school teacher; maxing out retirement; 2 cars - both new and both luxury; and at least 2 flying vacations per yr; and eating out 5-10 times/week -- fast casual any time their heart desires + all groceries MUST come from Whole Foods. Then when they realize that even at 300k, all of that can be a financial stress -- then they act miserable bc they "feel" poor.
+1 It's expensive to be rich!!!!
Anonymous
07/05/2016 14:00
Subject: s/o - feeling "poor" at these ludicrously high incomes. what are they actually missing?
Anonymous wrote:If you are from the north and move to dc you are happy, from elsewhere not so
+100000. I'm from the north and definitely agree. I assume people from the west coast are (financially) happy here too though huge weather and environment change.
Anonymous
07/05/2016 14:00
Subject: s/o - feeling "poor" at these ludicrously high incomes. what are they actually missing?
Proof that money doesn't buy happiness.
Anonymous
07/05/2016 13:56
Subject: s/o - feeling "poor" at these ludicrously high incomes. what are they actually missing?
If you are from the north and move to dc you are happy, from elsewhere not so
Anonymous
07/05/2016 13:55
Subject: Re:s/o - feeling "poor" at these ludicrously high incomes. what are they actually missing?
It's because they don't understand how math works. They buy a bunch of expensive stuff, like paying a nanny's salary or a 4-5k mortgage, and then don't understand why there isn't enough "left over." YOU BOUGHT A LOT OF EXPENSIVE THINGS, LIKE A RICH PERSON. Maybe really rich people feel poor after they pay out their household staffs and buy yachts and see that there isn't much "left over."
You sound very jealous and very ignorant. I'm sure you're leading a happy life.
I am, because I realize that our high HHI makes us very fortunate and is nothing to complain about.
Anonymous
07/05/2016 13:54
Subject: s/o - feeling "poor" at these ludicrously high incomes. what are they actually missing?
I think the definitions and income bands have shifted over time. In the 80s-90s middle class or even UMC meant you owned a home in a good district so ideally you sent the kids to public school but the home wasn't necessarily new or large and often your kids shared bedrooms; you saved some for retirement and college; you had 2 cars but it's possible one or both were used and neither was luxury; you took 1 driving vacation a yr; you ate out once a week max and in some families it was more like once a month or a few times a yr for birthdays etc.
Now people seem to think UMC means huge new house and no kid will be sharing a bathroom let alone a bedroom; the option of going to private school when they get in a snit with their public school teacher; maxing out retirement; 2 cars - both new and both luxury; and at least 2 flying vacations per yr; and eating out 5-10 times/week -- fast casual any time their heart desires + all groceries MUST come from Whole Foods. Then when they realize that even at 300k, all of that can be a financial stress -- then they act miserable bc they "feel" poor.
Now people seem to think UMC means huge new house and no kid will be sharing a bathroom let alone a bedroom; the option of going to private school when they get in a snit with their public school teacher; maxing out retirement; 2 cars - both new and both luxury; and at least 2 flying vacations per yr; and eating out 5-10 times/week -- fast casual any time their heart desires + all groceries MUST come from Whole Foods. Then when they realize that even at 300k, all of that can be a financial stress -- then they act miserable bc they "feel" poor.
Anonymous
07/05/2016 13:49
Subject: s/o - feeling "poor" at these ludicrously high incomes. what are they actually missing?
Anonymous wrote:I agree PP - our HHI is 145$ and we live comfortably in NWDC. I can't buy every thing I want, and we go on one simple beach vacation a year. I cook dinner every night and we don't eat out often. Our cars are 12 and 6 years old subarus with no plans for new ones in sight. My kids wear hand me downs and clothes from Target. My husband and I pack lunch for work. I am a teacher so my hours make it so we don't need aftercare or camp.
I certainly don't feel poor. I feel fortunate. If you're always looking at what you DON'T have, you won't be happy.
This is it. People look up the income ladder and see what they don't have. Glance back down the income ladder every now and then and appreciate what you do have! I get sucked in occasionally to thinking our house is small (1940s cape in N. Arlington) but then I visit my ILs in southern VA and their tiny, poorly kept houses and come back feeling like our house is a mansion.
Anonymous
07/05/2016 13:47
Subject: s/o - feeling "poor" at these ludicrously high incomes. what are they actually missing?
I think it's because people don't "count" having a nanny, and a $800k house, and outsourcing as their luxuries.
The $600k poster was a really good example of that, how she explained away "well we have to have a nanny since our work hours are so long and we don't have family" and justifies the student loan at $1k "because one of us is a lawyer."
Not realizing that some people would HAVE to move close to family, not a choice to have a nanny, or put their child in a high ratio daycare that is cheap but has extended hours and add an hour to their daily commute to get there, or even be up to date on their student loans without having a parent bail them out, get on a deferred payment plan, etc.
And having 2 cars instead of getting a small condo, kids share a room, and take metro.
They look at their money AFTER doing all those things.
That's the problem.
The $600k poster was a really good example of that, how she explained away "well we have to have a nanny since our work hours are so long and we don't have family" and justifies the student loan at $1k "because one of us is a lawyer."
Not realizing that some people would HAVE to move close to family, not a choice to have a nanny, or put their child in a high ratio daycare that is cheap but has extended hours and add an hour to their daily commute to get there, or even be up to date on their student loans without having a parent bail them out, get on a deferred payment plan, etc.
And having 2 cars instead of getting a small condo, kids share a room, and take metro.
They look at their money AFTER doing all those things.
That's the problem.
Anonymous
07/05/2016 13:46
Subject: s/o - feeling "poor" at these ludicrously high incomes. what are they actually missing?
They know they aren't poor. But they can't afford what they think they should be able to afford on a $300k salary.
Anonymous
07/05/2016 13:40
Subject: Re:s/o - feeling "poor" at these ludicrously high incomes. what are they actually missing?
“There is more happiness in giving than there is in receiving.”—ACTS 20:35.
“Do not wear yourself out to gain wealth.”—Proverbs 23:4.
“Let your way of life be free of the love of money, while you are content with the present things.”—Hebrews 13:5.
“The one trusting in his riches will fall.”—Proverbs 11:28.
“Those who are determined to be rich fall into temptation and a snare and many senseless and harmful desires.”—1 TIMOTHY 6:9.
“Guard against every sort of greed, because even when a person has an abundance, his life does not result from the things he possesses.”—LUKE 12:15.
“Do not wear yourself out to gain wealth.”—Proverbs 23:4.
“Let your way of life be free of the love of money, while you are content with the present things.”—Hebrews 13:5.
“The one trusting in his riches will fall.”—Proverbs 11:28.
“Those who are determined to be rich fall into temptation and a snare and many senseless and harmful desires.”—1 TIMOTHY 6:9.
“Guard against every sort of greed, because even when a person has an abundance, his life does not result from the things he possesses.”—LUKE 12:15.
Anonymous
07/05/2016 13:39
Subject: s/o - feeling "poor" at these ludicrously high incomes. what are they actually missing?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I think it's that simple. Lots of people in this area are not from here and are not from any competitive market like SF or NYC or even NJ or Mass. So they think by making it to DC and making 300k, they have ARRIVED. Then they look around and realize there are people making 400k, 500k, 1 million etc. They look around at the Jones and realize that at 300k, they may have to think about private school and it's no fair that their friends making 500k have to give zero thought to whether to enroll their 3 kids in private school.
And then they look back home to Wisconsin or Arkansas or wherever and realize that it's no fair that their old high school classmates -- who weren't even class valedictorian and weren't ivy bound land are grads of the local non flagship u are making 150k in sales and living in a McMansion style house with 2 brand new cars, whereas they HAVE ARRIVED in DC but "only" have a 700k brick home from the 1960s to show for it.
I haven't seen the same insecurity from people coming from say Long Island or NJ or the Bay Area bc they are used to be around A LOT of money and are also from competitive places so they never expected that they would be "the one" in their group of peers who'd be the success.
I'm from LI and we moved to DC from NYC a few years ago. We have a HHI of $1 million, which is a lot around here but not that much in Manhattan. It is all relative. My friends in NYC live in more expensive homes but we love our $1 million single family home here. $1 million will not even get you a 1 bedroom in Manhattan. Our friends all spent at least $2 million for their 2-3 bedroom apartments.
I get what you're saying as I moved here from Manhattan too but let's not exaggerate. Yes you can get a 1 bedroom for a million. A sibling of mine just bought one -- 1 bedroom, doorman building, though in midtown -- not upper east or west -- for ~600k. Yes if you have a family you want a 2 bedroom and a more "luxury" building so you're going to pay $2 million+ for it. But it's ridiculous to say that you just CAN'T get 1 bedroom for $1 million in Manhattan.
You don't know what you're talking about. I call bullshit on that 600k one bedroom in Manhattan, but assuming it exists, it is a co-op and your sibling had to pay all kinds of taxes -- millionaire tax, mortgage tax -- to get in AND the maintenance costs are easily 2.5-3k monthly. If you deny that, your sibling is either committing some kind of fraud or you're lying.
One more possibility- it's a foreclosure. Maintenance costs are still going to be sky high.
Anonymous
07/05/2016 13:38
Subject: s/o - feeling "poor" at these ludicrously high incomes. what are they actually missing?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I think it's that simple. Lots of people in this area are not from here and are not from any competitive market like SF or NYC or even NJ or Mass. So they think by making it to DC and making 300k, they have ARRIVED. Then they look around and realize there are people making 400k, 500k, 1 million etc. They look around at the Jones and realize that at 300k, they may have to think about private school and it's no fair that their friends making 500k have to give zero thought to whether to enroll their 3 kids in private school.
And then they look back home to Wisconsin or Arkansas or wherever and realize that it's no fair that their old high school classmates -- who weren't even class valedictorian and weren't ivy bound land are grads of the local non flagship u are making 150k in sales and living in a McMansion style house with 2 brand new cars, whereas they HAVE ARRIVED in DC but "only" have a 700k brick home from the 1960s to show for it.
I haven't seen the same insecurity from people coming from say Long Island or NJ or the Bay Area bc they are used to be around A LOT of money and are also from competitive places so they never expected that they would be "the one" in their group of peers who'd be the success.
I'm from LI and we moved to DC from NYC a few years ago. We have a HHI of $1 million, which is a lot around here but not that much in Manhattan. It is all relative. My friends in NYC live in more expensive homes but we love our $1 million single family home here. $1 million will not even get you a 1 bedroom in Manhattan. Our friends all spent at least $2 million for their 2-3 bedroom apartments.
I get what you're saying as I moved here from Manhattan too but let's not exaggerate. Yes you can get a 1 bedroom for a million. A sibling of mine just bought one -- 1 bedroom, doorman building, though in midtown -- not upper east or west -- for ~600k. Yes if you have a family you want a 2 bedroom and a more "luxury" building so you're going to pay $2 million+ for it. But it's ridiculous to say that you just CAN'T get 1 bedroom for $1 million in Manhattan.
You don't know what you're talking about. I call bullshit on that 600k one bedroom in Manhattan, but assuming it exists, it is a co-op and your sibling had to pay all kinds of taxes -- millionaire tax, mortgage tax -- to get in AND the maintenance costs are easily 2.5-3k monthly. If you deny that, your sibling is either committing some kind of fraud or you're lying.
Anonymous
07/05/2016 13:35
Subject: s/o - feeling "poor" at these ludicrously high incomes. what are they actually missing?
Anonymous wrote:
Comparison is the enemy of joy, people.
This. I grew up in food stamps in the Deep South but didn't know I was poor because everyone I knew also was on food stamps or close to it. No one had new clothes, I thought that's how life was for everyone and I was pretty happy. Now in DC Imy family has a 6 figure income, which back home would have been unthinkably rich, but my peers here are so much wealthier than I ever knew existed back home. If this is my new comparison group I'm poor and I'm frankly less happy here.
Anonymous
07/05/2016 13:25
Subject: s/o - feeling "poor" at these ludicrously high incomes. what are they actually missing?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I think it's that simple. Lots of people in this area are not from here and are not from any competitive market like SF or NYC or even NJ or Mass. So they think by making it to DC and making 300k, they have ARRIVED. Then they look around and realize there are people making 400k, 500k, 1 million etc. They look around at the Jones and realize that at 300k, they may have to think about private school and it's no fair that their friends making 500k have to give zero thought to whether to enroll their 3 kids in private school.
And then they look back home to Wisconsin or Arkansas or wherever and realize that it's no fair that their old high school classmates -- who weren't even class valedictorian and weren't ivy bound land are grads of the local non flagship u are making 150k in sales and living in a McMansion style house with 2 brand new cars, whereas they HAVE ARRIVED in DC but "only" have a 700k brick home from the 1960s to show for it.
I haven't seen the same insecurity from people coming from say Long Island or NJ or the Bay Area bc they are used to be around A LOT of money and are also from competitive places so they never expected that they would be "the one" in their group of peers who'd be the success.
I'm from LI and we moved to DC from NYC a few years ago. We have a HHI of $1 million, which is a lot around here but not that much in Manhattan. It is all relative. My friends in NYC live in more expensive homes but we love our $1 million single family home here. $1 million will not even get you a 1 bedroom in Manhattan. Our friends all spent at least $2 million for their 2-3 bedroom apartments.
I get what you're saying as I moved here from Manhattan too but let's not exaggerate. Yes you can get a 1 bedroom for a million. A sibling of mine just bought one -- 1 bedroom, doorman building, though in midtown -- not upper east or west -- for ~600k. Yes if you have a family you want a 2 bedroom and a more "luxury" building so you're going to pay $2 million+ for it. But it's ridiculous to say that you just CAN'T get 1 bedroom for $1 million in Manhattan.
A 600k apartment in NY is either in crappy condition or minuscule. The average one bedroom in Manhattan is one million. So the apartment he or she bought is well less than the average price. The average house in the DC metro is ~350k. Would you want to purchase a 200k home here!?
Anonymous
07/05/2016 13:21
Subject: s/o - feeling "poor" at these ludicrously high incomes. what are they actually missing?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I think it's that simple. Lots of people in this area are not from here and are not from any competitive market like SF or NYC or even NJ or Mass. So they think by making it to DC and making 300k, they have ARRIVED. Then they look around and realize there are people making 400k, 500k, 1 million etc. They look around at the Jones and realize that at 300k, they may have to think about private school and it's no fair that their friends making 500k have to give zero thought to whether to enroll their 3 kids in private school.
And then they look back home to Wisconsin or Arkansas or wherever and realize that it's no fair that their old high school classmates -- who weren't even class valedictorian and weren't ivy bound land are grads of the local non flagship u are making 150k in sales and living in a McMansion style house with 2 brand new cars, whereas they HAVE ARRIVED in DC but "only" have a 700k brick home from the 1960s to show for it.
I haven't seen the same insecurity from people coming from say Long Island or NJ or the Bay Area bc they are used to be around A LOT of money and are also from competitive places so they never expected that they would be "the one" in their group of peers who'd be the success.
I'm from LI and we moved to DC from NYC a few years ago. We have a HHI of $1 million, which is a lot around here but not that much in Manhattan. It is all relative. My friends in NYC live in more expensive homes but we love our $1 million single family home here. $1 million will not even get you a 1 bedroom in Manhattan. Our friends all spent at least $2 million for their 2-3 bedroom apartments.
I get what you're saying as I moved here from Manhattan too but let's not exaggerate. Yes you can get a 1 bedroom for a million. A sibling of mine just bought one -- 1 bedroom, doorman building, though in midtown -- not upper east or west -- for ~600k. Yes if you have a family you want a 2 bedroom and a more "luxury" building so you're going to pay $2 million+ for it. But it's ridiculous to say that you just CAN'T get 1 bedroom for $1 million in Manhattan.
I was just agreeing with the pp. I'm from NY and was constantly surrounded by other people with money. In Manhattan, there is a lot of money so I was just saying that $1 million in Manhattan is not a lot. I knew a lot of millionaires, probably like us now. I always thought they were rich. They were mostly lawyers, doctors and bankers in NYC. Then I met real rich people when I went to college and grad school. Those kids don't need to work. All relative.