Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's say the driver went elsewhere to pick up his car and OTHER people are to blame for letting him drive. Would you still think Saltzman was responsible for letting him drive? Even if someone took the driver to his car at another location??

He knowingly allowed underage people (both minors and adults) to drink in his home. He told his daughter to make them leave. The presumption is that they had to leave some way, and the presumption is that they would collect their vehicles. Definitely negligence if not more.

If the driver didn't drive himself away then how would he know that he might eventually get into a car and drive?

He did drive himself and others away, though. Why are you exploring these hypotheticals when we have facts we can discuss?

What if he didn't DRIVE HIMSELF AWAY when he left, but got in the driver's seat at a later point? Would you still think the party hosts should be responsible for anything more than hosting a party? This isn't hypothetical. I'm truly curious about whether people think the party dad is responsible.

If you give underage people alcohol you should assume they are going to do something stupid that night, so you don't serve children alcohol

Even though some kids left the party shit faced with a designated driver, the adult that knew ey were dripunl should have let some parent know their kid was shit faced so they could make sure he did not make a drunk decision like take a car from his house.

Also, the Holton parent should joy kick drunks out of his house to go drive home. They should have gotten their names and called their parents.

I was at a NYE party and teens stole alcohol. The parents were called and a clean hand off was done, adult to adult.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's say the driver went elsewhere to pick up his car and OTHER people are to blame for letting him drive. Would you still think Saltzman was responsible for letting him drive? Even if someone took the driver to his car at another location??

He knowingly allowed underage people (both minors and adults) to drink in his home. He told his daughter to make them leave. The presumption is that they had to leave some way, and the presumption is that they would collect their vehicles. Definitely negligence if not more.

If the driver didn't drive himself away then how would he know that he might eventually get into a car and drive?

He did drive himself and others away, though. Why are you exploring these hypotheticals when we have facts we can discuss?

What if he didn't DRIVE HIMSELF AWAY when he left, but got in the driver's seat at a later point? Would you still think the party hosts should be responsible for anything more than hosting a party? This isn't hypothetical. I'm truly curious about whether people think the party dad is responsible.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know who's always trying to divert our attention away from the irresponsible parent. No mystery there.

I'm a parent in the community and I have kids. I am 100% unrelated to the "irresponsible parent". In fact, I think he's a jerk. I'm just trying to understand the thinking of people on here.

Did you see the other thread that someone managed to get locked?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know who's always trying to divert our attention away from the irresponsible parent. No mystery there.

I'm a parent in the community and I have kids. I am 100% unrelated to the "irresponsible parent". In fact, I think he's a jerk. I'm just trying to understand the thinking of people on here.

Anonymous wrote:I know who's always trying to divert our attention away from the irresponsible parent. No mystery there.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's say the driver went elsewhere to pick up his car and OTHER people are to blame for letting him drive. Would you still think Saltzman was responsible for letting him drive? Even if someone took the driver to his car at another location??

He knowingly allowed underage people (both minors and adults) to drink in his home. He told his daughter to make them leave. The presumption is that they had to leave some way, and the presumption is that they would collect their vehicles. Definitely negligence if not more.

If the driver didn't drive himself away then how would he know that he might eventually get into a car and drive?

He did drive himself and others away, though. Why are you exploring these hypotheticals when we have facts we can discuss?

What if he didn't DRIVE HIMSELF AWAY when he left, but got in the driver's seat at a later point? Would you still think the party hosts should be responsible for anything more than hosting a party? This isn't hypothetical. I'm truly curious about whether people think the party dad is responsible.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's say the driver went elsewhere to pick up his car and OTHER people are to blame for letting him drive. Would you still think Saltzman was responsible for letting him drive? Even if someone took the driver to his car at another location??

He knowingly allowed underage people (both minors and adults) to drink in his home. He told his daughter to make them leave. The presumption is that they had to leave some way, and the presumption is that they would collect their vehicles. Definitely negligence if not more.

If the driver didn't drive himself away then how would he know that he might eventually get into a car and drive?

He did drive himself and others away, though. Why are you exploring these hypotheticals when we have facts we can discuss?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's say the driver went elsewhere to pick up his car and OTHER people are to blame for letting him drive. Would you still think Saltzman was responsible for letting him drive? Even if someone took the driver to his car at another location??

He knowingly allowed underage people (both minors and adults) to drink in his home. He told his daughter to make them leave. The presumption is that they had to leave some way, and the presumption is that they would collect their vehicles. Definitely negligence if not more.

If the driver didn't drive himself away then how would he know that he might eventually get into a car and drive?

PP, you are trying to have a fact-based argument with people who are not interested in the facts.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's say the driver went elsewhere to pick up his car and OTHER people are to blame for letting him drive. Would you still think Saltzman was responsible for letting him drive? Even if someone took the driver to his car at another location??

He knowingly allowed underage people (both minors and adults) to drink in his home. He told his daughter to make them leave. The presumption is that they had to leave some way, and the presumption is that they would collect their vehicles. Definitely negligence if not more.

If the driver didn't drive himself away then how would he know that he might eventually get into a car and drive?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's say the driver went elsewhere to pick up his car and OTHER people are to blame for letting him drive. Would you still think Saltzman was responsible for letting him drive? Even if someone took the driver to his car at another location??

He knowingly allowed underage people (both minors and adults) to drink in his home. He told his daughter to make them leave. The presumption is that they had to leave some way, and the presumption is that they would collect their vehicles. Definitely negligence if not more.

If the driver didn't drive himself away then how would he know that he might eventually get into a car and drive?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's say the driver went elsewhere to pick up his car and OTHER people are to blame for letting him drive. Would you still think Saltzman was responsible for letting him drive? Even if someone took the driver to his car at another location??

He knowingly allowed underage people (both minors and adults) to drink in his home. He told his daughter to make them leave. The presumption is that they had to leave some way, and the presumption is that they would collect their vehicles. Definitely negligence if not more.

Anonymous wrote:Let's say the driver went elsewhere to pick up his car and OTHER people are to blame for letting him drive. Would you still think Saltzman was responsible for letting him drive? Even if someone took the driver to his car at another location??

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:accident

1
a : an unforeseen and unplanned event or circumstance b : lack of intention or necessity : chance <met by accident rather than by design>

2
a : an unfortunate event resulting especially from carelessness or ignorance

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/accident

So Saltzman was careless to allow those kids to drive. Ok.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:accident

1
a : an unforeseen and unplanned event or circumstance b : lack of intention or necessity : chance <met by accident rather than by design>

2
a : an unfortunate event resulting especially from carelessness or ignorance

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/accident

We use the phrase "car accident" instead of "car crash" because it sounds gentler, milder. We already know that two people died in the car accident, and that there was a cause. We don't have to say "drunk-driving-car-collision-with-two-fatalities" when "car accident" conveys the same information in a less negative manner.