Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you worrying so much about DC's learning and performance COMPARED TO PEERS? (Capital letters for emphasis, not shouting.)

Because otherwise it's hard to gauge whether a child is being challenged for the age or not, is falling behind or not, etc. Getting a P for a grade level benchmark doesn't tell me much.

If you want to know whether your child is being challenged and is learning, the HGC test results won't tell you that. Standard letter grades wouldn't tell you that either, if you had them. The P on a grade-level benchmark at least tells you that your child is meeting the grade-level benchmarks, i.e., is not falling behind. You can look at the MAP test results over time to see if the scores are going up; that would show if your child is learning at least the stuff on that the MAP tests test.

But really, OP, I sense some anxiety around the general topic "other children are getting ahead, therefore my child is falling behind!". Perhaps a conference with your child's teacher might assuage your concerns. And focus on your child's learning, not what the other kids are doing.

There might in fact be some anxiety, but it's probably more centered around myself than my child's abilities. I try not to be an overly obsessive parent and so while we work on (what I assume are) some enriching things at home, I try not to push too hard if it seems all is going well. On the other hand I don't want to let my kid down if I should perhaps be doing a bit more to meet DCs potential. Sadly, I haven't gotten much from previous teacher conferences, other than "child is doing great, no concerns". Hard to know if this "great" report is because DC is not a struggling child, or is actually excelling. This test was eye opening. Again, I'm not freaking out about it, but just want to understand what it means. It sounds like 100 may be the average score, which would set my mind at ease. Before this thread, I wasn't sure if it was perhaps an unusually low score, which is what raised a flag for me.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you worrying so much about DC's learning and performance COMPARED TO PEERS? (Capital letters for emphasis, not shouting.)

Because otherwise it's hard to gauge whether a child is being challenged for the age or not, is falling behind or not, etc. Getting a P for a grade level benchmark doesn't tell me much.

If you want to know whether your child is being challenged and is learning, the HGC test results won't tell you that. Standard letter grades wouldn't tell you that either, if you had them. The P on a grade-level benchmark at least tells you that your child is meeting the grade-level benchmarks, i.e., is not falling behind. You can look at the MAP test results over time to see if the scores are going up; that would show if your child is learning at least the stuff on that the MAP tests test.

But really, OP, I sense some anxiety around the general topic "other children are getting ahead, therefore my child is falling behind!". Perhaps a conference with your child's teacher might assuage your concerns. And focus on your child's learning, not what the other kids are doing.

OP - my DD's teacher told me that if DD was falling below the "average" range on the MAP tests - that they would be sending that information home. In other words - the fact that I haven't heard anything is good. I don't know for sure if that is system wide or just our school though.

Anonymous wrote:MAP tests will tell you how much your DC is learning and retaining in school. HGC test will show you your DC's cognitive abilities, which honestly, changes over time. Some kids are just late bloomers. I say this as a parent of a child in HGC.

Also, MAP test %iles figures are nationwide, so it will also tell you how your DC is doing compared to kids from other states.

Thank you, this is so helpful to know. I will request these.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you worrying so much about DC's learning and performance COMPARED TO PEERS? (Capital letters for emphasis, not shouting.)

Because otherwise it's hard to gauge whether a child is being challenged for the age or not, is falling behind or not, etc. Getting a P for a grade level benchmark doesn't tell me much.

If you want to know whether your child is being challenged and is learning, the HGC test results won't tell you that. Standard letter grades wouldn't tell you that either, if you had them. The P on a grade-level benchmark at least tells you that your child is meeting the grade-level benchmarks, i.e., is not falling behind. You can look at the MAP test results over time to see if the scores are going up; that would show if your child is learning at least the stuff on that the MAP tests test.

But really, OP, I sense some anxiety around the general topic "other children are getting ahead, therefore my child is falling behind!". Perhaps a conference with your child's teacher might assuage your concerns. And focus on your child's learning, not what the other kids are doing.

oh how I wish they would routinely send home the MAP test results. I didn't even know about them until DC was in first grade.

MAP tests will tell you how much your DC is learning and retaining in school. HGC test will show you your DC's cognitive abilities, which honestly, changes over time. Some kids are just late bloomers. I say this as a parent of a child in HGC.

Also, MAP test %iles figures are nationwide, so it will also tell you how your DC is doing compared to kids from other states.

Anonymous wrote:Why are you worrying so much about DC's learning and performance COMPARED TO PEERS? (Capital letters for emphasis, not shouting.)

Because otherwise it's hard to gauge whether a child is being challenged for the age or not, is falling behind or not, etc. Getting a P for a grade level benchmark doesn't tell me much.

Why are you worrying so much about DC's learning and performance COMPARED TO PEERS? (Capital letters for emphasis, not shouting.)

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Well if I found out that that it was typical for a test-taker to score in the low 100s, then I wouldn't think about it for another minute. I would know that my DC's testing ability is right on par with the majority of DC's peers. If, however, I learned that DC was let's say in the bottom 10%, then I would seek to better understand what is going on: Is DC a poor test taker, and would have done better with more time? Or is DC more of a book-knowledge person and wouldn't have done well no matter how much time given? Or was the problem that I could have prepared DC better, or emphasized speed, for example? I don't know how I'd find out the answers to any of those questions, but it would put these potential things to look out for on my radar.

My advice (which you didn't ask for) is: spend less time thinking about testing and more time thinking about your child's actual learning. A test result is only an indicator, and not even necessarily a good one.

I agree, the actual learning is the important thing. There's not much info to go on though, to gauge this, outside of tests (whether they're standardized or regular classroom tests). Also, unfortunately, testing is such a reality of life from here onward, so I think it would be good to know more about my child's potential strengths or weaknesses in this area. But perhaps you can tell (maybe from my obvious lack of in-depth "prep" for the HGC test) that I'm not obsessed about testing...just a bit surprised by the results and wanting to know more.

There is plenty to go on. Talk to your child. Look at the work your child does at school. Look at your child's homework and how he does it. Look at the other things your child does when he's not in school. Talk to your child's teacher. All of these are much better indicators of your child's learning than a standardized test.

What I mean is that there's not much to go on to know how DC's learning and performance compares to that of peers. I might look at DCs homework and think DC is doing great, not realizing that everyone is doing even better. For example, DCs homework comes home with Ps on it even if there is poor spelling. Does this mean other students are also spelling like my DC, or is the spelling lagging and we should actually work on it more than we are? I don't know what's typical for this age. If everyone else is doing better, then I would ask myself why this is. If this is the best DC can do, ok. But if I need to work on some things at home, if DC is not meeting DCs potential or what is typical for the age, I want to know that, too. I don't want to overload DC for no reason though, if DC is overall on par with well-performing peers.

OP, I have an extremely bright child who bombed the HGC test as well. She got well above median for verbal and below for quantitative and non-verbal. Not sure if it was test anxiety or a LD that is just coming to light (FWIW, I have an older SN child so I will probably look into whether there is a missed LD first--It would not surprise me). However, HCG is just two years of ES. Really, big picture---it does not matter.

Anonymous wrote:Yes, the SAS scores are based on a mean of 100. The average test taker nationally scores 100. They are age normed by month. An older child has to get more questions correct than the younger child to receive the same score.

This information is available.

Is this the HGC test?

Yes, the SAS scores are based on a mean of 100. The average test taker nationally scores 100. They are age normed by month. An older child has to get more questions correct than the younger child to receive the same score.

This information is available.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Well if I found out that that it was typical for a test-taker to score in the low 100s, then I wouldn't think about it for another minute. I would know that my DC's testing ability is right on par with the majority of DC's peers. If, however, I learned that DC was let's say in the bottom 10%, then I would seek to better understand what is going on: Is DC a poor test taker, and would have done better with more time? Or is DC more of a book-knowledge person and wouldn't have done well no matter how much time given? Or was the problem that I could have prepared DC better, or emphasized speed, for example? I don't know how I'd find out the answers to any of those questions, but it would put these potential things to look out for on my radar.

My advice (which you didn't ask for) is: spend less time thinking about testing and more time thinking about your child's actual learning. A test result is only an indicator, and not even necessarily a good one.

I agree, the actual learning is the important thing. There's not much info to go on though, to gauge this, outside of tests (whether they're standardized or regular classroom tests). Also, unfortunately, testing is such a reality of life from here onward, so I think it would be good to know more about my child's potential strengths or weaknesses in this area. But perhaps you can tell (maybe from my obvious lack of in-depth "prep" for the HGC test) that I'm not obsessed about testing...just a bit surprised by the results and wanting to know more.

There is plenty to go on. Talk to your child. Look at the work your child does at school. Look at your child's homework and how he does it. Look at the other things your child does when he's not in school. Talk to your child's teacher. All of these are much better indicators of your child's learning than a standardized test.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DC didn't get in but got well into the hundreds on all sections. I'd say DC bombed it based on potential. Ordinarily performs well on tests but is very deliberate and slow on tests so I'm pretty sure some questions were not even attempted. I had the say questions as you OP such as what would the average student get on the HGC test and were my DC falls.

Does anyone know if this information is available somehow, from teachers or any other avenue? Basically, I guess the question would be, what are the average or median scores on the HGC test, for all test-takers (not just those accepted).

If you had this information, how would you use it?

Well if I found out that that it was typical for a test-taker to score in the low 100s, then I wouldn't think about it for another minute. I would know that my DC's testing ability is right on par with the majority of DC's peers. If, however, I learned that DC was let's say in the bottom 10%, then I would seek to better understand what is going on: Is DC a poor test taker, and would have done better with more time? Or is DC more of a book-knowledge person and wouldn't have done well no matter how much time given? Or was the problem that I could have prepared DC better, or emphasized speed, for example? I don't know how I'd find out the answers to any of those questions, but it would put these potential things to look out for on my radar.

I think the way the test (which MCPS tells us is above grade level, btw) is normed, an average score should be 100, so I'd hardly call getting above 100 "bombing" the test. Sounds like your child scored above average but possibly, because of time pressures or whatever, didn't score in the gifted range. That appeals case that gets into the nitty gritty of the scoring criteria might shed some light on how the testing population breaks down, if someone has that link. But I really wouldn't stress it, OP. School performance is waaay more important in the grand scheme of things.

Thanks, if this is true, that would make me feel a lot less concerned. Is this explained somewhere that you know of?

Would love to read more about the scoring criteria/testing population, if anyone does have the link to the case.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DC didn't get in but got well into the hundreds on all sections. I'd say DC bombed it based on potential. Ordinarily performs well on tests but is very deliberate and slow on tests so I'm pretty sure some questions were not even attempted. I had the say questions as you OP such as what would the average student get on the HGC test and were my DC falls.

Does anyone know if this information is available somehow, from teachers or any other avenue? Basically, I guess the question would be, what are the average or median scores on the HGC test, for all test-takers (not just those accepted).

If you had this information, how would you use it?

Well if I found out that that it was typical for a test-taker to score in the low 100s, then I wouldn't think about it for another minute. I would know that my DC's testing ability is right on par with the majority of DC's peers. If, however, I learned that DC was let's say in the bottom 10%, then I would seek to better understand what is going on: Is DC a poor test taker, and would have done better with more time? Or is DC more of a book-knowledge person and wouldn't have done well no matter how much time given? Or was the problem that I could have prepared DC better, or emphasized speed, for example? I don't know how I'd find out the answers to any of those questions, but it would put these potential things to look out for on my radar.

I think the way the test (which MCPS tells us is above grade level, btw) is normed, an average score should be 100, so I'd hardly call getting above 100 "bombing" the test. Sounds like your child scored above average but possibly, because of time pressures or whatever, didn't score in the gifted range. That appeals case that gets into the nitty gritty of the scoring criteria might shed some light on how the testing population breaks down, if someone has that link. But I really wouldn't stress it, OP. School performance is waaay more important in the grand scheme of things.