Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why do you say so definitively that spanking won't help?

Because OP says her goal is to prevent the explosion, by which she means the critical behaviour (hitting, spitting on her and such).

If you want to be proactive, which OP states she wants to be, spanking is just about the furthest you can get from your goal. Spanking is an out-of-control reaction if you spank in anger. And if you calmly plan the spanking and postpone it, if you can truly hit your child while you're calm and do it rationally, in a pre-planned way, you are cruel, devoided of any empathy, and - to me at least - in need of professional help.

this is ridiculous. You make yourself sound very dumb when you write like this.

Anonymous wrote:Why do you say so definitively that spanking won't help?

Because OP says her goal is to prevent the explosion, by which she means the critical behaviour (hitting, spitting on her and such).

If you want to be proactive, which OP states she wants to be, spanking is just about the furthest you can get from your goal. Spanking is an out-of-control reaction if you spank in anger. And if you calmly plan the spanking and postpone it, if you can truly hit your child while you're calm and do it rationally, in a pre-planned way, you are cruel, devoided of any empathy, and - to me at least - in need of professional help.

And to everyone saying "My child doesn't respond to anything else." - you are wrong. You haven't done it right yet. I guarantee that any child on this planet can be raised properly without spanking. You have to want to put in the effort of course...

How incredibly condescending to those struggling with a difficult child.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, kids do not need to be spanked. And, IMO, kids do not need to be given time-outs. It sounds like, if you are having that many troubles, you need to try a more positive, loving parenting approach. I don't mean that to be condescending, but if you're using a punitive approach to working with your children it could backfire (i.e., just create more problems now and down the road).

Says the mother of the spoiled brats who scream and run around bothering everyone else and who grow up to be bullies. Children need discipline so that they become decent members of society.

Op here. My kid is well on his way to being this out of control child. I've , no doubt, been on the end of DCUM sneers in public. I can't go out to eat at a decent place (think Cheesecake Factory - yes that is my standard now) for fear he will run into the kitchen etc...
At this point I was trying the hit for a hit. You hit me you get hit back. We are talking punches and smacks from the kid. My response is a swat on the bottom.
I feel horrible. But I worry if it goes unchecked as a teenager or adult another person will check him far worse .

I'm the mom of the 24 and 14 year old. I'm not sure a spanking is going to help your ds. My suggestion? Get some help. My oldest was incredibly unruly. He could be violent to the point that I HAD to physically restrain him for both our safety. I don't think I spanked him past the age of 4 or 5. Ask your doctor for some recommendations on where to go. Research the approach. What worked for us years later (for a while) was basically a tough love approach.

Get yourself some help. This doesn't mean you're a bad or ineffective parent -- it means you have a difficult child and are trying to do your best.

How old is the child, OP? A three or four year old being a holy terror, not being able to go out to eat, hitting, is unfortunate but not out of the realm of normal. But that isn't average behavior for a 6 year old, and if you child is school age (even preschool) I think its time to talk to the teachers and see what is up. Maybe your kid needs some help with emotional regulation and impulsivity. If so, spanking really won't help, because it doesn't teach those things. Your kid can't exercise control he doesn't yet have. So my first step in your case wouldn't be to decide on how to punish, but to figure out what is going on with your guy. Start with the pediatrician and the teachers.

Anonymous wrote:Spanking is illegal in more advanced countries. It is just sad that it still isn't in the US and that some less educated people still believe it's the thing to do. It is useless. It is disgusting. It is despicable.

People who spank their children have lost control. People who spank their children don't know any better. People who spank their children are clueless. People who spank their children are not educated on how to raise children in the 21st century.

Children who respond to spanking do so out of fear. They don't learn anything but to try their best to avoid getting hurt. And those kids will either come to detest their parents and try their best to be anything but their parents...or they will grow to become parents who spank themselves.

I am against judging people. But if you spank your child you must be judged harshly because public shaming of spanking is the ONLY way to stop this.

And to everyone saying "My child doesn't respond to anything else." - you are wrong. You haven't done it right yet. I guarantee that any child on this planet can be raised properly without spanking. You have to want to put in the effort of course...

THIS.

These threads make me smile. Parent of a 24 and 14 year old here. 24 year old was spanked very occasionally, a single swat on the butt to get his attention. It did what I intended it to, it got his attention. The 14 year old has never been spanked.

I was spanked occasionally and while I remember being very pissed off at my parent for it, I also remembered not to do whatever had caused the spanking. So did my brother.

If we were all robots then one approach would work. However.. we aren't. OP, yes I think the occasional swat on the butt may be "needed" for some kids. Get their attention, and then carry on.

Anonymous wrote:What makes spanking bad, but timeout with physical restraint somehow better?

Because physically restraining someone prevents them from a) hitting (thus is proportionate self-defence), b) leaving the time out spot, in the context in which time-out is the consequence for hitting someone or spitting on someone (which is a logical matter - if you hit someone or spit on them, people won't want to be around you).

Spanking is a form of hitting. Which is not ok, because adults in control of themselves don't hit other people, especially weaker people, i.e. children, they're supposed to set an example for.

You really can't see the difference?

What makes spanking bad, but timeout with physical restraint somehow better?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, kids do not need to be spanked. And, IMO, kids do not need to be given time-outs. It sounds like, if you are having that many troubles, you need to try a more positive, loving parenting approach. I don't mean that to be condescending, but if you're using a punitive approach to working with your children it could backfire (i.e., just create more problems now and down the road).

Says the mother of the spoiled brats who scream and run around bothering everyone else and who grow up to be bullies. Children need discipline so that they become decent members of society.

Op here. My kid is well on his way to being this out of control child. I've , no doubt, been on the end of DCUM sneers in public. I can't go out to eat at a decent place (think Cheesecake Factory - yes that is my standard now) for fear he will run into the kitchen etc...
At this point I was trying the hit for a hit. You hit me you get hit back. We are talking punches and smacks from the kid. My response is a swat on the bottom.
I feel horrible. But I worry if it goes unchecked as a teenager or adult another person will check him far worse .

Your guts are sending you a strong message. Listen to it. Civilized people don't hit each other. You need to teach your child to behave in a civilized way.

A more logical consequence than "an eye for an eye" (by which you're actually reinforcing the idea that hitting is ok as long as you're big enough, or in charge - and that will really not end well when your child will be able to really beat you up in a few years), would be "you hit, you sit". Timeout, without fail. With physical restraint if need be.

After all, if someone punches someone else in a dynamic that's not parent-child, what happens? The assailant goes to jail. Timeout is "jail for kids", so to speak. I don't see anything wrong with that.

It's "holy terror" not "wholly terror".

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, kids do not need to be spanked. And, IMO, kids do not need to be given time-outs. It sounds like, if you are having that many troubles, you need to try a more positive, loving parenting approach. I don't mean that to be condescending, but if you're using a punitive approach to working with your children it could backfire (i.e., just create more problems now and down the road).

Says the mother of the spoiled brats who scream and run around bothering everyone else and who grow up to be bullies. Children need discipline so that they become decent members of society.

Op here. My kid is well on his way to being this out of control child. I've , no doubt, been on the end of DCUM sneers in public. I can't go out to eat at a decent place (think Cheesecake Factory - yes that is my standard now) for fear he will run into the kitchen etc...
At this point I was trying the hit for a hit. You hit me you get hit back. We are talking punches and smacks from the kid. My response is a swat on the bottom.
I feel horrible. But I worry if it goes unchecked as a teenager or adult another person will check him far worse .

Speaking as someone who does use spanking, I would say that the "hit for a hit" might not be the most effective way of implementing it, if you choose to use this. In my experience, it is far more effective when the spanking is done as a consistent and calm consequence, not an immediate reaction in the moment. It should be something that they're warned is coming if behavior doesn't change, and then if it is called for, take a moment to say something like "you have earned a spanking for this, so now we're going to your room for it." Make it a disciplinary process, not something that you just immediately do in anger or reaction.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, kids do not need to be spanked. And, IMO, kids do not need to be given time-outs. It sounds like, if you are having that many troubles, you need to try a more positive, loving parenting approach. I don't mean that to be condescending, but if you're using a punitive approach to working with your children it could backfire (i.e., just create more problems now and down the road).

Says the mother of the spoiled brats who scream and run around bothering everyone else and who grow up to be bullies. Children need discipline so that they become decent members of society.

Op here. My kid is well on his way to being this out of control child. I've , no doubt, been on the end of DCUM sneers in public. I can't go out to eat at a decent place (think Cheesecake Factory - yes that is my standard now) for fear he will run into the kitchen etc...
At this point I was trying the hit for a hit. You hit me you get hit back. We are talking punches and smacks from the kid. My response is a swat on the bottom.
I feel horrible. But I worry if it goes unchecked as a teenager or adult another person will check him far worse .

Anonymous wrote:We use spanking judiciously, typically between the ages of 3 and 8. It's not the first resort, but it is used when necessary to correct misbehavior that has not been corrected by other methods.

We will do the calm, over-the-lap style after removing the child from the situation and having a quick talk about behavior, choices, and consequences.

There is no reliable or controlled research on this topic. Usually, the researchers don't even feign an attempt to separate causation from correlation. However, not all the pseudo research shows bad results. When researchesrs have isolated spanking to, I believe, two or three swats, for only certain ages of children, some studies have shown positive long-term outcomes. (Again, I don't think this is specifically from the spanking, but the point is, that it can be a reasonalbe form of discipline.)

+ 1 million. Same here.

I don't really think that the type of discipline is as important as when you use it. The kid has to have control over whether or not he will be spanked, yelled at, whatever. The problem is when people do these things randomly or when they (the parent) is tired and frustrated.

If you spank your kid for doing X, and every time he does X, he knows he will get spanked, and if he doesn't do X, then he won't get spanked, that's okay.

If you don't spank your child, but you use positive reinforcement, only sometimes you just lose it and end up yelling, and the kid never knows if his behavior is going to result in a nice quiet chat with mom or getting screamed at, because it has nothing to do with his behavior, only how mom is feeling, then that is bad. (i.e. a nice quiet chat about good behavior after hitting another kid on the playground, but getting screamed at later that day for dropping a glass of milk when mom was on her way out the door) That is much, much worse than spanking. And THAT is how you get entitled kids who think the rules don't apply to them. Because they grow up believing that the only rule is that the strongest person in the room can do whatever he wants.