Anonymous
Post 04/17/2015 16:47     Subject: Why don't white students go to Banneker?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Why would you not think your white student can score higher than MoCo average for white scores at Banneker?


Because white students' scores are higher because they go to schools with lots of other people with high scores. Your logic would make more sense if whites were somehow inherently better at the SATs than blacks, such that any other difference away from the mean has to be explained by school performance. But of course that's not true. Their scores are higher because of some combination of cultural biases on the test and because they spend more time in peer groups of other kids who are likely to obtain high scores. Regardless of the precise balance of reasons that white scores are higher, the surest way to perpetuate that high score is to send your kid to a school with high overall test scores and a lot of white kids.


Testing gaps appear before Kindergarten. The issue is a lot more complex than what you make it appear to be.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/sats/etc/gap.html


I agree I was oversimplifying, but the linchpin of the argument "if black Banneker students score above the average for blacks, then white Banneker students would score above the average for whites" is that the reason black Banneker students outperform the average for blacks is because of something unique to Banneker that would necessarily apply equally to whites (and would be unavailable at the other schools white students might attend). And there is no reason to make that assumption. Maybe black Banneker students outperform the average for blacks because they test in to the school. Or maybe they outperform the average for blacks because the fact that they applied shows that they have parents who are unusually invested in their education. Or maybe Banneker gives them the opportunity to attend a school with other highly-motivated and intelligent black students, and that helps bolster their success. There's no reason to assume that any of those factors would apply in the same manner and to the same degree to a white student.
Anonymous
Post 04/17/2015 16:45     Subject: Re:Why don't white students go to Banneker?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:It's socioeconomic too. Many of you do not seem to realize that there is a large contingent of high SES AA families that opt out of DCPS and charters after ES and go private.

So true! Most of my high SES AA friends, relatives, and myself included opt out of DCPS period. We all send our children to private schools.


Not even Wilson?


Heck no!
Anonymous
Post 04/17/2015 16:42     Subject: Why don't white students go to Banneker?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Hi everyone,

I'm a reporter with the Washington City Paper, and I'm working on a story on a question that has been raised several times on this forum: Why don't white students go to Banneker? I'm interested in speaking with parents who fall under one of these categories:

- You have (or recently have) a child at Banneker
- You're considering Banneker
- You opted not to apply to Banneker, or got in but decided not to go there

If you match the description, please feel free to send me an email at awiener (at) washingtoncitypaper (dot) com.

Thanks very much!
Aaron


Because its Majority Black and located in Georgia Avenue near Howard University. Whites will not send their kids to majority black schools regardless of the test scores. People will say "Wilson" but lets be honest the "honor courses" or "humanities program" are Majority white and a school within a school where whites are the majority


Then how do explain all of the sudden interest in Cleveland Elementary School right down the street? White people just discovered it. It frequently appeared on this year's DCUM lottery threads.

(I'm black and didn't mention Cleveland to a soul until my kids got in. It's golden. Also one of the things I loved about Cleveland is that is majority AA/Latino, so my kids get to experience a strong minority populated educational setting, where all of the high achievers and school leadership looked like them.)


Wow, that's racist


Nope, it is not. It is countering a racist society that has a preschool to prison pipeline for Black children. Please stop calling black people racists for trying to counter institutional racism. It is not cute.


Exactly.

Remember in the film about the big upcoming fight, Muhammad Ali commented with astonishment that the airline pilots were black?

It's quite dated, but you get the idea: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jclLiDjwuE0

It's important that my children see leaders, high achievers, involved parents (especially fathers!), who look like them so that they grow up with an understanding that this is possible. They are constantly fed a narrow stereotype of what AA youth represent, and it's so undermining. I like that they see teachers and families in a positive light and that they are exposed to a broad spectrum of people throughout the black community. African, Caribbean, homegrown DC, affluent, public housing----so much is represented within Cleveland. It's wonderful.

I don't think my stance is comparable to white supremacy. I believe it's more akin to single-sex education. I went to an all-girls school and a majority female college. I had a very different experience than those who went co-ed. Girls speak up in class and excel in math. Girls are strong and capable. Female head of school, female teachers. Great experience.

I also went to Banneker and relished being surrounded by a bunch of fellow black nerds. It felt great to belong and never be afraid of "acting white" or "talking white" when I just wanted to embrace algebra. I'm glad they had us all take Latin our first year there. I only pray my children get in and have the opportunity to be smart and engaged in a safe environment like Banneker. Other predominantly-black high schools punish their nerds. I don't want that for my children.

Understand it or not, it's real.





If it's real, then it's not a stereotype. You have to seek out exceptions, like Banneker, to break the mold. Which is a wise thing to do when the reality is not going to change itself.


Well than how do u explain the nerds at TJ that openly state that its a school u go too when you are too nerdy for the general school population and if u didn't go would probably end up being stuffed into a Gym Locker or Hallway Trashcan. So I guess its a "reality" for lots of groups not just blacks


Cringe.

Who refers to black peoples as "blacks" in 2015?

Oh puh-lease, lots of black people do!
Anonymous
Post 04/17/2015 16:40     Subject: Why don't white students go to Banneker?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Hi everyone,

I'm a reporter with the Washington City Paper, and I'm working on a story on a question that has been raised several times on this forum: Why don't white students go to Banneker? I'm interested in speaking with parents who fall under one of these categories:

- You have (or recently have) a child at Banneker
- You're considering Banneker
- You opted not to apply to Banneker, or got in but decided not to go there

If you match the description, please feel free to send me an email at awiener (at) washingtoncitypaper (dot) com.

Thanks very much!
Aaron


Because its Majority Black and located in Georgia Avenue near Howard University. Whites will not send their kids to majority black schools regardless of the test scores. People will say "Wilson" but lets be honest the "honor courses" or "humanities program" are Majority white and a school within a school where whites are the majority


Then how do explain all of the sudden interest in Cleveland Elementary School right down the street? White people just discovered it. It frequently appeared on this year's DCUM lottery threads.

(I'm black and didn't mention Cleveland to a soul until my kids got in. It's golden. Also one of the things I loved about Cleveland is that is majority AA/Latino, so my kids get to experience a strong minority populated educational setting, where all of the high achievers and school leadership looked like them.)


Wow, that's racist


Nope, it is not. It is countering a racist society that has a preschool to prison pipeline for Black children. Please stop calling black people racists for trying to counter institutional racism. It is not cute.


Exactly.

Remember in the film about the big upcoming fight, Muhammad Ali commented with astonishment that the airline pilots were black?

It's quite dated, but you get the idea: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jclLiDjwuE0

It's important that my children see leaders, high achievers, involved parents (especially fathers!), who look like them so that they grow up with an understanding that this is possible. They are constantly fed a narrow stereotype of what AA youth represent, and it's so undermining. I like that they see teachers and families in a positive light and that they are exposed to a broad spectrum of people throughout the black community. African, Caribbean, homegrown DC, affluent, public housing----so much is represented within Cleveland. It's wonderful.

I don't think my stance is comparable to white supremacy. I believe it's more akin to single-sex education. I went to an all-girls school and a majority female college. I had a very different experience than those who went co-ed. Girls speak up in class and excel in math. Girls are strong and capable. Female head of school, female teachers. Great experience.

I also went to Banneker and relished being surrounded by a bunch of fellow black nerds. It felt great to belong and never be afraid of "acting white" or "talking white" when I just wanted to embrace algebra. I'm glad they had us all take Latin our first year there. I only pray my children get in and have the opportunity to be smart and engaged in a safe environment like Banneker. Other predominantly-black high schools punish their nerds. I don't want that for my children.

Understand it or not, it's real.

Thank you so much for this. So often white DCUMers go on about the lack of white students at Banneker but they are totally clueless about the type of black students who attend Banneker and thus have a distorted picture of the school. My white kid didn't want to go to Banneker, because she didn't think she could handle the pressure. Those kids work very very hard. She probably was also influenced by the lack of white kids there but that didn't stop her from going to Ellington, her first choice. But if she had gone to Banneker, she would have been fine.
Anonymous
Post 04/17/2015 16:36     Subject: Re:Why don't white students go to Banneker?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:It's socioeconomic too. Many of you do not seem to realize that there is a large contingent of high SES AA families that opt out of DCPS and charters after ES and go private.

So true! Most of my high SES AA friends, relatives, and myself included opt out of DCPS period. We all send our children to private schools.


Not even Wilson?


Np here, my sister and I went to Bullis.


I'm the earlier PP that mentioned that many of the middle/upper SES AAs I know are at charters and privates. It seems that Shepherd and possibly Cleveland may be the only DCPS elementaries w/relatively high numbers of middle/high SES AAs. I know there's a sprinkling at JKLMs and other schools, but not large numbers.

Any others? (I haven't been in DC very long.)


I'm the poster who went to Bullis, we lived in Takoma area of DC and after we finished Takoma Education Campus we both went on to Bullis. Some neighbors kids went to St. John's or Carroll.

Coolidge was not an option even back in then for the majority of the higher SES AA families.
Anonymous
Post 04/17/2015 16:33     Subject: Why don't white students go to Banneker?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Hi everyone,

I'm a reporter with the Washington City Paper, and I'm working on a story on a question that has been raised several times on this forum: Why don't white students go to Banneker? I'm interested in speaking with parents who fall under one of these categories:

- You have (or recently have) a child at Banneker
- You're considering Banneker
- You opted not to apply to Banneker, or got in but decided not to go there

If you match the description, please feel free to send me an email at awiener (at) washingtoncitypaper (dot) com.

Thanks very much!
Aaron


Because its Majority Black and located in Georgia Avenue near Howard University. Whites will not send their kids to majority black schools regardless of the test scores. People will say "Wilson" but lets be honest the "honor courses" or "humanities program" are Majority white and a school within a school where whites are the majority


Then how do explain all of the sudden interest in Cleveland Elementary School right down the street? White people just discovered it. It frequently appeared on this year's DCUM lottery threads.

(I'm black and didn't mention Cleveland to a soul until my kids got in. It's golden. Also one of the things I loved about Cleveland is that is majority AA/Latino, so my kids get to experience a strong minority populated educational setting, where all of the high achievers and school leadership looked like them.)


Wow, that's racist


Nope, it is not. It is countering a racist society that has a preschool to prison pipeline for Black children. Please stop calling black people racists for trying to counter institutional racism. It is not cute.
Agree with this pp. Additionally, when my white kid was applying to magnet schools and programs, I didn't want her to go to Wilson where the humanities program was majority white. I wanted her to go to Walls, Banneker, or Ellington where black students would be her peers and not tracked in slower classes.
Anonymous
Post 04/17/2015 16:33     Subject: Why don't white students go to Banneker?
Anonymous wrote:16:29 again. Someone commented earlier that high SES AAs may even be more likely to opt out of DCPS than high SES white families. If true, any idea why that might be?


Whoops, wrong thread--but I'm still curious!
Anonymous
Post 04/17/2015 16:31     Subject: Why don't white students go to Banneker?
16:29 again. Someone commented earlier that high SES AAs may even be more likely to opt out of DCPS than high SES white families. If true, any idea why that might be?
Anonymous
Post 04/17/2015 16:29     Subject: Re:Why don't white students go to Banneker?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:It's socioeconomic too. Many of you do not seem to realize that there is a large contingent of high SES AA families that opt out of DCPS and charters after ES and go private.

So true! Most of my high SES AA friends, relatives, and myself included opt out of DCPS period. We all send our children to private schools.


Not even Wilson?


Np here, my sister and I went to Bullis.


I'm the earlier PP that mentioned that many of the middle/upper SES AAs I know are at charters and privates. It seems that Shepherd and possibly Cleveland may be the only DCPS elementaries w/relatively high numbers of middle/high SES AAs. I know there's a sprinkling at JKLMs and other schools, but not large numbers.

Any others? (I haven't been in DC very long.)
Anonymous
Post 04/17/2015 16:28     Subject: Why don't white students go to Banneker?
Anonymous wrote:I don't think Banneker is anything like KIPP at all. I have interviewed several Banneker students for college and found them all very impressive. SAT scores are not everything. I would totally send my kid to Banneker when she is of age.
Yes, Banneker is not like KIPP at all.
Anonymous
Post 04/17/2015 16:26     Subject: Why don't white students go to Banneker?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Hi everyone,

I'm a reporter with the Washington City Paper, and I'm working on a story on a question that has been raised several times on this forum: Why don't white students go to Banneker? I'm interested in speaking with parents who fall under one of these categories:

- You have (or recently have) a child at Banneker
- You're considering Banneker
- You opted not to apply to Banneker, or got in but decided not to go there

If you match the description, please feel free to send me an email at awiener (at) washingtoncitypaper (dot) com.

Thanks very much!
Aaron


Because its Majority Black and located in Georgia Avenue near Howard University. Whites will not send their kids to majority black schools regardless of the test scores. People will say "Wilson" but lets be honest the "honor courses" or "humanities program" are Majority white and a school within a school where whites are the majority


Then how do explain all of the sudden interest in Cleveland Elementary School right down the street? White people just discovered it. It frequently appeared on this year's DCUM lottery threads.

(I'm black and didn't mention Cleveland to a soul until my kids got in. It's golden. Also one of the things I loved about Cleveland is that is majority AA/Latino, so my kids get to experience a strong minority populated educational setting, where all of the high achievers and school leadership looked like them.)


Wow, that's racist


Yup. PP is openly saying that they don't want white students around, because they would destroy that spirit of a place "where all of the high achievers and school leadership looked like them."

Amazing


I'm the PP and what I am openly saying is that I was very pleased that my children have an abundance of role models at Cleveland (and Banneker), positives images of themselves reflected back at them, that this is an aspect of their educational experience that I paid attention to and highly value. Yup.

It's wonderful that there are responsible, caring black men throughout the school who counter by their very presence the pervasive negative image of black men. They get to walk past the men hanging out on the corners and see black men in positive leadership positions on a daily basis, and interact with these men in a way that powerfully relates to them that caregiving is a positive aspect of manhood, not a weakness. Young girls get to see the respect and authority black women can attain through education, when most of what they're offered is of the Video Vixen variety. Great role models. Positive, empowering atmosphere, and a strong sense of community. None of this has anything to do with what you choose to do with your children and quite a bit of what I choose to do with mine.

Let's see how much of this assets-based perspective makes it into the WP article.
Anonymous
Post 04/17/2015 16:21     Subject: Re:Why don't white students go to Banneker?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:It's socioeconomic too. Many of you do not seem to realize that there is a large contingent of high SES AA families that opt out of DCPS and charters after ES and go private.

So true! Most of my high SES AA friends, relatives, and myself included opt out of DCPS period. We all send our children to private schools.


Not even Wilson?


Np here, my sister and I went to Bullis.
Anonymous
Post 04/17/2015 16:19     Subject: Re:Why don't white students go to Banneker?
No one has really mentioned this, but I think the culture and environment of the school plays a large part as to why many white families don't consider Banneker. It's very "old-school", high pressure, focus on academics above all else, etc. The extracurricular offerings aren't great. The administration is a total mess. The building itself is old and decrepit. These types of things are not super appealing to white families in DC.

The academics are wonderful at Banneker, and, for the right kid, it is a wonderful school. It's slated for renovation in a few years and that might start a demographic change. I think the renovation at Walls made it more appealing for white families.
Anonymous
Post 04/17/2015 16:07     Subject: Re:Why don't white students go to Banneker?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:It's socioeconomic too. Many of you do not seem to realize that there is a large contingent of high SES AA families that opt out of DCPS and charters after ES and go private.

So true! Most of my high SES AA friends, relatives, and myself included opt out of DCPS period. We all send our children to private schools.


Not even Wilson?
Anonymous
Post 04/17/2015 16:07     Subject: Why don't white students go to Banneker?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Hi everyone,

I'm a reporter with the Washington City Paper, and I'm working on a story on a question that has been raised several times on this forum: Why don't white students go to Banneker? I'm interested in speaking with parents who fall under one of these categories:

- You have (or recently have) a child at Banneker
- You're considering Banneker
- You opted not to apply to Banneker, or got in but decided not to go there

If you match the description, please feel free to send me an email at awiener (at) washingtoncitypaper (dot) com.

Thanks very much!
Aaron


Because its Majority Black and located in Georgia Avenue near Howard University. Whites will not send their kids to majority black schools regardless of the test scores. People will say "Wilson" but lets be honest the "honor courses" or "humanities program" are Majority white and a school within a school where whites are the majority


Then how do explain all of the sudden interest in Cleveland Elementary School right down the street? White people just discovered it. It frequently appeared on this year's DCUM lottery threads.

(I'm black and didn't mention Cleveland to a soul until my kids got in. It's golden. Also one of the things I loved about Cleveland is that is majority AA/Latino, so my kids get to experience a strong minority populated educational setting, where all of the high achievers and school leadership looked like them.)


Wow, that's racist


Yup. PP is openly saying that they don't want white students around, because they would destroy that spirit of a place "where all of the high achievers and school leadership looked like them."

Amazing