She sounds unmedicated bipolar.

Any update OP?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OK- OP one final time- I drafted a letter. I left out any hit of judgment and didnt call her out on anything but I hit the major points. Does this look good?


Dear "Katy",

I understand friendships come and go. I had genuinely hoped that my caring and ideas based on the experiences of others, as well my own, would be of help to you. I really cared and really tried. I can see you tried to be friends as well. And I appreciate that.

We may not ultimately be compatible as friends, but that doesn't mean I cannot see the good and bad in your situation. I understand you feel your challenges are unique, as do we all when we face the hardest of times. My biggest worry is that you are reaching a breaking point. Its something you have been saying yourself on and off for a few years now.

Based on my direct personal experience with my husband, seeking the help of a really good therapist and considering real treatment for depression and anxiety can turn a persons life around. Ive seen it too many times to dismiss. Its hard to admit that help is needed, but in your case, "Timmy" depends on you so completely that you truly cannot afford to break down.

"Timmy" deserves to see the best qualities his mom has to offer, and you also deserve to enjoy your own strengths and positive qualities. I believe you can build a better life for yourself like you have said you want to. But I think you need smart and savvy help from a professional who knows what they are doing. They are out there. Your job's insurance is the best place to begin.

Wishing you the best,

I would NEVER send a letter like this to anyone, certainly not to someone I thought was on the verge of some kind of breakdown. Wow, how would YOU feel receiving this letter? I don't understand the point of your urgency, either -- you want to dump her before she dumps you?

I also don't get what "push back" is. Seriously, what does that mean, or is it code for "she is clearly not liking me as much as she used to"? If she is interrupting you, hanging up on you and generally being not nice, she is probably expecting the friendship to end. I wouldn't write the letter. I would just not be warm or friendly if I spoke to her. If she asks why, say "I'm mad that you hung up on me -- I don't need that crap on my way to work" or whatever.

I haven't dealt with that kind of behavior in years and years. Seriously. You might want to ask yourself why you are friends with someone like that in the first place.

Well, the truth is, I decided to give her a second chance. PP, if I was as messed up as she is, I _hope_ I would have sought help LONG AGO. I cant know how it would feel to be so disconnected from reality that a third party would even feel compelled to write a letter like that to me, and I hope I never do. However, I dont believe if my only problem was a potential nervous breakdown that this letter would push me over the edge.

YOu say you havent dealt with this behavior in years and years. Well Im 45 and I never have. I have no analog for this whatsoever. I thought it was a series of misunderstandings and misreads and now I can see she is just very distorted in her thinking.

"Push Back" is not code. Its a simple way of stating the complete and total rejection of any positive help, suggestions, or even possible POV ideas out there in the world generally. Push back happens when you suggest her POV might not be the only one at play.

You are right PP: I should just say I dont need that crap. But why would you think thats better to say to someone on the edge of a nervous breakdown than a letter addressing a history of exchanges anchored in some kind of potential mutual...understanding? Aaaaand as I write this I see there is no mutual understanding, which is your whole point.

Yeah, you're right.

I

OP, honestly, you are starting to sound like a drama queen. Numerous people have told you just to disengage. But it sounds like you don't want to hear that. Why did you write this thread if you already had in your mind what you wanted to do?

You aren't this woman's therapist. I also haven't read anything truly horrible that this woman has done to you, except call and hang up. But I wonder if maybe you said something to her remotely like in your ridiculous letter, and in that case, I think she's might be justified in being irritated/angry with you.

Her life may well be a mess, and she may not be handling it well. Maybe she's paranoid and defensive and passive aggressive. But it sounds to me like you are very condescending and you have some sort of need to play therapist. If you don't like this woman, then tell her not to call you, that you don't have the time/energy. Be polite and be done with it. She'll probably leave you a few nasty messages and then be done. But if you don't respond, it will fade.

If you keep telling her what your diagnosis of her is or acting like you are some sort guidance counselor, then she is going to feel like she needs to defend herself. Just back away.

But also ask yourself what is lacking in your own life that you are so heavily invested in diagnosing someone else's problems. Because it sounds to me like you kind of thrive on this.

Anonymous wrote:New poster here. I know people like this. The only thing to do is DISENGAGE. Ignore, and if somehow she catches you, pleasantly be too busy. Do not respond. She will twist whatever you do or say, so give her nothing to work with. She'll get tired of it eventually.

Did you get that, OP? Stop interacting.

+1000

Anything else, including the letter or an explanation, only feeds the drama.

Just let her go and move on.

Also, I agree with the PPs who said you've gotten far too involved here. I'm sure your intentions are good, but you are working way too hard to try to solve her problems. I know you worry for her son, but you need to accept that you can't help any longer.

Let her go and move on. Do it simply, without explanation or drama.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OK- OP one final time- I drafted a letter. I left out any hit of judgment and didnt call her out on anything but I hit the major points. Does this look good?


Dear "Katy",

I understand friendships come and go. I had genuinely hoped that my caring and ideas based on the experiences of others, as well my own, would be of help to you. I really cared and really tried. I can see you tried to be friends as well. And I appreciate that.

We may not ultimately be compatible as friends, but that doesn't mean I cannot see the good and bad in your situation. I understand you feel your challenges are unique, as do we all when we face the hardest of times. My biggest worry is that you are reaching a breaking point. Its something you have been saying yourself on and off for a few years now.

Based on my direct personal experience with my husband, seeking the help of a really good therapist and considering real treatment for depression and anxiety can turn a persons life around. Ive seen it too many times to dismiss. Its hard to admit that help is needed, but in your case, "Timmy" depends on you so completely that you truly cannot afford to break down.

"Timmy" deserves to see the best qualities his mom has to offer, and you also deserve to enjoy your own strengths and positive qualities. I believe you can build a better life for yourself like you have said you want to. But I think you need smart and savvy help from a professional who knows what they are doing. They are out there. Your job's insurance is the best place to begin.

Wishing you the best,

OP, the best and most compassionate way to let someone go is to let them go. This isn't letting "Katy" go. This is saying "I want to say that you have some problems, and I'm going to walk away from you now. Get help on your own." How is that even remotely close to compassionate?!

You say she's not making contact. Why can't you just leave her alone?

NP here. I totally agree with this.

Sorry, OP, but a couple of your posts have led me to believe you are one of those people who like to diagnose everyone around you and tell them what kind of help they need. It sounds like you wanted to be a therapist but didn't and so view yourself as the only sane person around and essential to your friend (the friend you really don't like).

First, if your friend is distancing herself from you, then let her. Maybe she needs space. Maybe she has realized that she can't really talk to you or anyone else right now without eventually talking about the problems going on, so it's easier for her to just not call.

Maybe she has reason to be suspicious of people in her life. You have talked more about the things she does and only alluded to her circumstances, but what you alluded to included being a single mom, emergency room experiences. Perhaps she has some trauma from relationships past that make it difficult for her to trust people. Perhaps she feels that because of her current situation people are constantly judging her. Maybe her child has asked repeatedly why they aren't going on vacation, so when a mom at the pool asks about it, she's on the defensive.

And while therapy is great, it isn't a cure-all. And it isn't going to suddenly make a person's financial life better, make them afford vacations for their child, et cetera.

If you don't want to hear about her problems or you don't believe what she tells you or you think she is passive-aggressive, then just leave her be. If she calls, then tell her the truth -- that you don't have energy/time for her right now. That you have your own things going on and best of luck.

But don't go all sanctimonious and "you really need help," because that's just going to make her feel more defensive. It's going to make her feel more abandoned and more like the world is constantly judging her and against her. It will confirm in her mind that, yep, that woman at the pool probably WAS making an insult.

If you don't want to be friends with her, then it is YOUR choice, it is about YOU. Make it about YOU, not about her. If you truly want to be compassionate, then you WON"T say, "you're just too crazy. Go get help. I'm out." Instead, you'll just say that you have your own things going on and you don't really have the time or energy right now and leave it at that.

New poster here. I know people like this. The only thing to do is DISENGAGE. Ignore, and if somehow she catches you, pleasantly be too busy. Do not respond. She will twist whatever you do or say, so give her nothing to work with. She'll get tired of it eventually.

Did you get that, OP? Stop interacting.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At this point I would ask her to please not contact me again and wish her the best.

Interestingly, she has had a workplace stalker/bully herself.

I think she made contact because I didnt call her back the FIRST time, and now she has had time to create a narrative in which I not only called her and gave her info she didnt want at that time, I didnt deliver the thing she asked for.

This way, she can avoid facing the fact that I went through some time and effort above and beyond- which does NOT fit with her victim complex.

To reiterate what others have said, I think you now need to disengage. Disengage. Ignore her messages and let things cool off. If you happen to run across her again at some point in the future and she asks, maybe use that moment to explain why you felt it was time to end the friendship.

MarleySkye840 wrote:PP, that is extremely passive aggressive. Be an adult and tell her how you feel.

She is clearly a difficult person. Maybe just say to her that other people have issues in life and her life isn't the worst case scenario. A little tough love, but love nonetheless. If she really needs a reality check, give it to her, but don't become a bitch in the process. If she really has only one friend, be there for her.

no it is not passive aggressive it is the correct way to handle her. Why waste time on this type of person-it is draining dealing with them. Don't you have better things to do?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd just phase her out. Even though your motivations are kind, resist the urge to tell her that her version of reality is out of whack and she needs help. I think doing so it just poking the bear. She's looking for your reaction and you need to stop giving it to her IMO.

+1

OP here. Agreed on all points. Critical update: She called AGAIN and left an irritated sounding message (as if once I again I didnt do it right) regarding the information that I left on her work voicemail (on a topic she asked me to research for her and then was upset I had given her the information too soon) acting as if the detailed info I left didnt have one detail in it that was "the one thing" she wanted to know.

Needless to say, this is a new level of nuts. The info WAS all there and so much more.

Im actually now getting more disturbed, and am thinking maybe I need to close this out by telling her the info she apparently didnt grasp in an email-short- and THEN.......... I guess I wonder should I tell her I didnt appreciate being hung up on, that it was pretty upsetting and I dont want that kind of thing in my life?

Or just give her the info and thats that. And then begin the drift away?

At this point I am in new territory here. Ive not seen this side of her, and have not dealt with anyone like her before. I would strongly prefer she no longer contact me. But she might go more nuts at that strong of a pushback. Agreed?

BTW she doesnt sound like she is on the verge of a nervous breakdown at all now. I guess she is in the mode that has allowed her to survive this long, dysfunctional though it mya be.

At this point

I would call her or send a short email telling her "I included that specific info for you, you can find it here_________. To reiterate, the info I already gave you stated ___________. I have to say, I'm pretty upset that I worked so hard finding this information for you and you haven't expressed any appreciation [or all you focus on are these little things you think I messed up]." Then leave it at that. If she responds, you can take it from there (probably just ignore her responses and let it fade away). If she doesn't respond, or if she responds with crazy, again, you can just let it go. Walk away.

Anonymous wrote:

OP, stop giving your energy to this. You've gotten good advice here. Disengage. You are starting to sound as if you like the drama.

+100 It's like listening to co-dependent lovers or some soap opera nonsense.

Mountain out of of molehill, OP. Get over it, disengage from the drama, and move on.

Anonymous wrote:OP You sound really angry. And starting a fight only prolongs a relationship. And BTW telling someone they "need therapy" is starting a fight.

Nope, not angry. Just tired.

Ive long since agreed/figured out I wont be telling her she needs help.

In fact, Ive kind of decided Im just going to do whatever feels natural, and say it however it comes up if it comes up. If she perisistently calls, I will say whatever I feel and that will have to be good enough.

Thanks everyone!

OP You sound really angry. And starting a fight only prolongs a relationship. And BTW telling someone they "need therapy" is starting a fight.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At this point I would ask her to please not contact me again and wish her the best.

Interestingly, she has had a workplace stalker/bully herself.

I think she made contact because I didnt call her back the FIRST time, and now she has had time to create a narrative in which I not only called her and gave her info she didnt want at that time, I didnt deliver the thing she asked for.

This way, she can avoid facing the fact that I went through some time and effort above and beyond- which does NOT fit with her victim complex.

OP, stop giving your energy to this. You've gotten good advice here. Disengage. You are starting to sound as if you like the drama.

In fact I do NOT like this in the least. this is not even drama, its just creepy. I want to do the best thing as soon as possible because I am creeped out. While I did get good advice, I got contrary advice regarding specifically if I _say_ we should part ways or do it passively.

I get the disengage part. But I can either completely leave out the clear message to leave me alone, or say it. I am genearlly a straight shooter. I just dont know if in this case it will make her engage more if I say lets part ways.

ITs just anyone's guess of course, but based on the profle, which is better?

I think you should read The Gift of Fear. It actually goes into these kind of situations in depth-- i.e., people who don't respect/understand normal boundaries.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At this point I would ask her to please not contact me again and wish her the best.

Interestingly, she has had a workplace stalker/bully herself.

I think she made contact because I didnt call her back the FIRST time, and now she has had time to create a narrative in which I not only called her and gave her info she didnt want at that time, I didnt deliver the thing she asked for.

This way, she can avoid facing the fact that I went through some time and effort above and beyond- which does NOT fit with her victim complex.

OP, stop giving your energy to this. You've gotten good advice here. Disengage. You are starting to sound as if you like the drama.

In fact I do NOT like this in the least. this is not even drama, its just creepy. I want to do the best thing as soon as possible because I am creeped out. While I did get good advice, I got contrary advice regarding specifically if I _say_ we should part ways or do it passively.

I get the disengage part. But I can either completely leave out the clear message to leave me alone, or say it. I am genearlly a straight shooter. I just dont know if in this case it will make her engage more if I say lets part ways.

ITs just anyone's guess of course, but based on the profle, which is better?