Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The essence of a personality disorder is that the patient doesn't believe there's anything wrong with him/her.

The part I don't understand is how do they think other people do it? Do they really think they've been dealt a crap hand and everyone in their life is a horrible human out to get them? Do they not realize that most people are not estranged from all their family members and long-time friends?

That's the deal with the borderline in my life and I just don't understand how she doesn't see that there's a problem.

You could have been describing me a few years ago. I was raised by a BPD narcissist mother, so I was always drawn to equally unhealthy people for friendships and relationships. They seemed normal to me. When i became estranged from my family, it was the healthiest thing I could have done. I also started to see how unhealthy my long-term friendships had been and wasn't interested in accepting behavior in others that I used to think was normal. So even though what you describe could also describe me, I am a much healthier person now than I was before I broke those ties. The upside is that I am also much happier, able to be myself and have healthy friendships.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Am not sure why a lot of PPs are insisting BPD occurs only in individuals who are abused. This is not correct, although there is significant overlap.

It is a disorder of emotional dysregulation, and there is evidence via PET scans that there are abnormalities in the function of the amygdala, thought to be the seat of the emotions.

In addition, BPD individuals tend to have a highly refined ability to read faces and, thus, pick up the slightest hint of negative emotion, which they take to heart. One way of thinking of BPD individuals is that they are at the extreme end of the emotionally thin skinned.

Yes, they are very difficult to deal with, but they also suffer greatly from their emotional neediness and often seek solace in drugs and alcohol. When they become overwhelmed by all the emotional input they are constantly taking in they often contemplate suicide. Their life is hell.

I realize this may make me sound cold, but frankly, I don't care. You know what's hell? Being the target of someone with BPD when they unleash. When they not only attack you, but they go around telling others that the non-BPD person is the "crazy" one, manipulating them and others, compulsively lying, concocting their own web of revisionist history.

BPDs seem to persist because they are in denial, and what they're doing seems "right" or "natural" for them, in their warped non-sensical way. If they experience hell, it is a hell of their own creation. I can have empathy for someone who is really, truly, actively working on themselves and changed, but having been the target of someone with BPD, having supported them only to be further abused by them, I could not care less.

This. My DH has BPD and I'm too freaking tired of his shit (and, thanks to Mr. Manipulative, isolated) to care.

PP, hope you are getting help to move out of this situation.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Am not sure why a lot of PPs are insisting BPD occurs only in individuals who are abused. This is not correct, although there is significant overlap.

It is a disorder of emotional dysregulation, and there is evidence via PET scans that there are abnormalities in the function of the amygdala, thought to be the seat of the emotions.

In addition, BPD individuals tend to have a highly refined ability to read faces and, thus, pick up the slightest hint of negative emotion, which they take to heart. One way of thinking of BPD individuals is that they are at the extreme end of the emotionally thin skinned.

Yes, they are very difficult to deal with, but they also suffer greatly from their emotional neediness and often seek solace in drugs and alcohol. When they become overwhelmed by all the emotional input they are constantly taking in they often contemplate suicide. Their life is hell.

I realize this may make me sound cold, but frankly, I don't care. You know what's hell? Being the target of someone with BPD when they unleash. When they not only attack you, but they go around telling others that the non-BPD person is the "crazy" one, manipulating them and others, compulsively lying, concocting their own web of revisionist history.

BPDs seem to persist because they are in denial, and what they're doing seems "right" or "natural" for them, in their warped non-sensical way. If they experience hell, it is a hell of their own creation. I can have empathy for someone who is really, truly, actively working on themselves and changed, but having been the target of someone with BPD, having supported them only to be further abused by them, I could not care less.

This. My DH has BPD and I'm too freaking tired of his shit (and, thanks to Mr. Manipulative, isolated) to care.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Am not sure why a lot of PPs are insisting BPD occurs only in individuals who are abused. This is not correct, although there is significant overlap.

It is a disorder of emotional dysregulation, and there is evidence via PET scans that there are abnormalities in the function of the amygdala, thought to be the seat of the emotions.

In addition, BPD individuals tend to have a highly refined ability to read faces and, thus, pick up the slightest hint of negative emotion, which they take to heart. One way of thinking of BPD individuals is that they are at the extreme end of the emotionally thin skinned.

Yes, they are very difficult to deal with, but they also suffer greatly from their emotional neediness and often seek solace in drugs and alcohol. When they become overwhelmed by all the emotional input they are constantly taking in they often contemplate suicide. Their life is hell.

I realize this may make me sound cold, but frankly, I don't care. You know what's hell? Being the target of someone with BPD when they unleash. When they not only attack you, but they go around telling others that the non-BPD person is the "crazy" one, manipulating them and others, compulsively lying, concocting their own web of revisionist history.

BPDs seem to persist because they are in denial, and what they're doing seems "right" or "natural" for them, in their warped non-sensical way. If they experience hell, it is a hell of their own creation. I can have empathy for someone who is really, truly, actively working on themselves and changed, but having been the target of someone with BPD, having supported them only to be further abused by them, I could not care less.

Agreed, PP, at some point you have no choice but to do what's necessary to care for yourself.

Your description of the way people with BPD persist in their denial points to the likely origin of the "borderline" concept as being on the border of psychosis. A very difficult condition to treat.

Agreed as well. I can only have so much empathy for my batterer who was abused as a child and made the conscious choice to abuse both me and our child. Finally, blaming me for his abuse and insisting he doesn't need treatment but only does it to satisfy the court.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Am not sure why a lot of PPs are insisting BPD occurs only in individuals who are abused. This is not correct, although there is significant overlap.

It is a disorder of emotional dysregulation, and there is evidence via PET scans that there are abnormalities in the function of the amygdala, thought to be the seat of the emotions.

In addition, BPD individuals tend to have a highly refined ability to read faces and, thus, pick up the slightest hint of negative emotion, which they take to heart. One way of thinking of BPD individuals is that they are at the extreme end of the emotionally thin skinned.

Yes, they are very difficult to deal with, but they also suffer greatly from their emotional neediness and often seek solace in drugs and alcohol. When they become overwhelmed by all the emotional input they are constantly taking in they often contemplate suicide. Their life is hell.

I realize this may make me sound cold, but frankly, I don't care. You know what's hell? Being the target of someone with BPD when they unleash. When they not only attack you, but they go around telling others that the non-BPD person is the "crazy" one, manipulating them and others, compulsively lying, concocting their own web of revisionist history.

BPDs seem to persist because they are in denial, and what they're doing seems "right" or "natural" for them, in their warped non-sensical way. If they experience hell, it is a hell of their own creation. I can have empathy for someone who is really, truly, actively working on themselves and changed, but having been the target of someone with BPD, having supported them only to be further abused by them, I could not care less.

Agreed, PP, at some point you have no choice but to do what's necessary to care for yourself.

Your description of the way people with BPD persist in their denial points to the likely origin of the "borderline" concept as being on the border of psychosis. A very difficult condition to treat.

Anonymous wrote:Am not sure why a lot of PPs are insisting BPD occurs only in individuals who are abused. This is not correct, although there is significant overlap.

It is a disorder of emotional dysregulation, and there is evidence via PET scans that there are abnormalities in the function of the amygdala, thought to be the seat of the emotions.

In addition, BPD individuals tend to have a highly refined ability to read faces and, thus, pick up the slightest hint of negative emotion, which they take to heart. One way of thinking of BPD individuals is that they are at the extreme end of the emotionally thin skinned.

Yes, they are very difficult to deal with, but they also suffer greatly from their emotional neediness and often seek solace in drugs and alcohol. When they become overwhelmed by all the emotional input they are constantly taking in they often contemplate suicide. Their life is hell.

I realize this may make me sound cold, but frankly, I don't care. You know what's hell? Being the target of someone with BPD when they unleash. When they not only attack you, but they go around telling others that the non-BPD person is the "crazy" one, manipulating them and others, compulsively lying, concocting their own web of revisionist history.

BPDs seem to persist because they are in denial, and what they're doing seems "right" or "natural" for them, in their warped non-sensical way. If they experience hell, it is a hell of their own creation. I can have empathy for someone who is really, truly, actively working on themselves and changed, but having been the target of someone with BPD, having supported them only to be further abused by them, I could not care less.

Anonymous wrote:Am not sure why a lot of PPs are insisting BPD occurs only in individuals who are abused. This is not correct, although there is significant overlap.

It is a disorder of emotional dysregulation, and there is evidence via PET scans that there are abnormalities in the function of the amygdala, thought to be the seat of the emotions.

In addition, BPD individuals tend to have a highly refined ability to read faces and, thus, pick up the slightest hint of negative emotion, which they take to heart. One way of thinking of BPD individuals is that they are at the extreme end of the emotionally thin skinned.

Yes, they are very difficult to deal with, but they also suffer greatly from their emotional neediness and often seek solace in drugs and alcohol. When they become overwhelmed by all the emotional input they are constantly taking in they often contemplate suicide. Their life is hell.

Well put, PP. Perhaps this can help others to have some empathy for people with BPD.

Anonymous wrote:21:35 here. I do have what I guess would be called abandonment issues. I've always, always had a problem with people leaving even after a visit. (Cousins, grandparents) No idea where that comes from.

PP who mentioned her child being diagnosed with "just anxiety". I'm not sure how you meant that. (No big deal, or not something as wide ranging as BPD..?) Stay on it with him though as it can be debilitating in itself. It's tough to be the parent, too. I have one with what has been some pretty strong anxiety, it took a lot out of us to try and keep him on an even keel.

PP who said just anxiety. The "just" was because anxiety is so much more common than borderline. But I hear you about how bad anxiety can be--same true for my child, which is why at one point borderline was tossed about. Have had to deal with anxiety attacks that elicited paranoia and hallucinations. Also once had to restrain child from jumping out of a second story window. It was not suicidal, but rather an extreme anxiety driven flight response.

Am not sure why a lot of PPs are insisting BPD occurs only in individuals who are abused. This is not correct, although there is significant overlap.

It is a disorder of emotional dysregulation, and there is evidence via PET scans that there are abnormalities in the function of the amygdala, thought to be the seat of the emotions.

In addition, BPD individuals tend to have a highly refined ability to read faces and, thus, pick up the slightest hint of negative emotion, which they take to heart. One way of thinking of BPD individuals is that they are at the extreme end of the emotionally thin skinned.

Yes, they are very difficult to deal with, but they also suffer greatly from their emotional neediness and often seek solace in drugs and alcohol. When they become overwhelmed by all the emotional input they are constantly taking in they often contemplate suicide. Their life is hell.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The essence of a personality disorder is that the patient doesn't believe there's anything wrong with him/her.

The part I don't understand is how do they think other people do it? Do they really think they've been dealt a crap hand and everyone in their life is a horrible human out to get them? Do they not realize that most people are not estranged from all their family members and long-time friends?

That's the deal with the borderline in my life and I just don't understand how she doesn't see that there's a problem.

Yes they do think that. And if you come from an abusive family, you know that more abuse is coming if you let them get close. It is a vicious cycle. I am over 45 years old and my family just reached out with some more abuse after many years away from them. NEVER again.

It is a cycle of abuse with drug/alcohol addiction mixed with mental illness in many cases. It comes down through the family -- one member has mental illness, self medicates and forgets all the stuff they did to their kids. (Like lock them in the close and forget about it) Then the kid grows up and does the same. It is very destructive. And yes, many of them are in great mental pain and are suicidal. Hopefully, intervention will help over time.
But even a mental patient does not love the diagnosis BPD -- it is demeaning and insulting. So you have a difficult, possibly insolvable problem, and an insulting name. There is also Oppositional Personality Disorder. I am sure we all know a few of those!

I was diagnosed with BPD at 26. I am not sure if it was correct. But, it was treated with therapy...to stop the suicidal stuff. I was very volatile. If people did not do what I wanted, I would lose it. At the same time, 90% of the time, I seemed fine.

It came to a head with me one day, and I had a choice...therapy or jail.

But, the real change occurred in 2002 when I started on the SSRI's. I felt the stress just melt away from the body. I am thinking my BPD was really reaction to high anxiety. The fight or flight reaction triggered the outbursts -- fight. And, based on my readings since then, I am not sure if I was BPD.

But, the question of how did I not know it...my reactions were the only reality I knew. I did not know what it was like not to feel volatile. I did not like it, but did not know any better. Now I do.

Anonymous wrote:The essence of a personality disorder is that the patient doesn't believe there's anything wrong with him/her.

The part I don't understand is how do they think other people do it? Do they really think they've been dealt a crap hand and everyone in their life is a horrible human out to get them? Do they not realize that most people are not estranged from all their family members and long-time friends?

That's the deal with the borderline in my life and I just don't understand how she doesn't see that there's a problem.

The essence of a personality disorder is that the patient doesn't believe there's anything wrong with him/her.

Anonymous wrote:I would be really curious to hear from someone who has had a BPD diagnosis, and also agrees with the diagnosis as fitting. But it seems like people with BPD have such a difficult time managing it, that it's either downplayed, or they are defensively angry. It doesn't seem like something that people ever have solid perspective of their personality disorder and how it affects and harms others.

Psych nurse here: One of the hardest things about a personality disorder is that the people don't accept a diagnosis and don't want to change. (Even if they could which most that I have worked with cannot -- too severe in my patient group)